Pax Americana

[Avatar4321]

And then Rome imploded. So go on and finish the narrative of comparison and how it ends, Frank.

The problem is it ends in the Dark ages.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Mossadeq is a perfect example of why we must act to protect our interests. He was a Socialist who nationalized the oil industry and the CIA coup against him failed

So how has letting the Islamist run Iran been working for us?

1) Socialism is against U.S interests? If Romney gets elected, someone might want to tell him to bomb Europe, a chunk of South America, among others.

2) The CIA coup failed? What history book have you been reading?

I'm seriously beginning to believe you're a liberal posing as a conservative to make the right look stupid(er).

Socialism is anathema to the USA. It's destroying the EU and it's destroying what's left of us.

Yes, the actual coup failed. You might want to check a source besides Wikipedia or Rdean

 

[TakeAStepBack]

And then Rome imploded. So go on and finish the narrative of comparison and how it ends, Frank.

Yes, Rome imploded; after lasting how long? How many centuries did Rome last as the most powerful nation on the planet?

27 BC–476 AD

In a time when it took several days to walk or horseback ride to destinations. When the govenment ran as autocratic, leading to a dictator.

In other words, it took them that long to implode because physical movement was much, much slower in pace. There was no global economy built on fiat paper money. There was no one to formally challenge the roman authority.

if we're built off from a roman system, we're doomed to implode the same way Rome imploded and we'll do it in less than half the time. I would say far less than half. in fact, i see our empire already imploding.

 

[G.T.]

If you watch current events the ME is spiraling out of control. Nothing good comes letting the Islamists see us disrespect our only ally in the region.

It's been spiraling out of cntrol for how long? Or, are you using selective partisan memory?

It's actually been relatively under control since 1967 when our allies, with our help, destroyed the military forces of three separate countries.

There's nothing partisan about that.

It started getting out of control after 1993 when there were no real consequences to trying to kill 30,000 of us by toppling the WTC

No real consequence?

heh.

Okay, are you saying we should blow them all to hell, is that it?

Because it looks like we've been blowing plenty of them to hell over the last 11 years...........has that helped make them start being fearful of us, thus peaceful towards us? No, no it hasn't.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

After much consideration over the latter part of my adult life, I am now a firm believer that it in is the best interest of the USA to exercise some degree of control and influence over any part of the world that is of interest to us. To ignore an area, to let them to their own devices is the height of foolishness and downright dangerous to us.

Our government was modeled Rome, so should our military strategy. I was taught that is was inappropriate for us to flex our power, that George Washington warned us about foreign intervention. We were a weak sister then and were better off not tangling with France or England. Today, France and England both rest comfortably knowing that the firepower aboard a single US Aircraft Carrier can destroy the entire armored strength of the USSR without resorting to nuclear weapons.

Rome never had any qualms about letting its neighbors know who had the big stick. When an area became of interest and importance, the Legions were dispatched. Once subdued and under Roman rule, they prospered from trade and protection. The Germanic Barbarians in the North were never subdued and they lived worse than pigs. The civilized world knew true peace because the leader was not afraid to let the world know it was a safe and dependable leader, it should be no different today.

World domination only ends one way............BADLY

You are suggesting to deprive others of their liberty, for your safety.

Really dude??????

It actually was a pretty good deal for about 500 years.

Our allies have all the Liberty they can tolerate, everyone else that matters gets Liberty but not state sponsorship or control of the state.

Depriving others of the Liberty to attack us should be understandable and acceptable

 

[CrusaderFrank]

And then Rome imploded. So go on and finish the narrative of comparison and how it ends, Frank.

Yes, Rome imploded; after lasting how long? How many centuries did Rome last as the most powerful nation on the planet?

27 BC–476 AD

In a time when it took several days to walk or horseback ride to destinations. When the govenment ran as autocratic, leading to a dictator.

In other words, it took them that long to implode because physical movement was much, much slower in pace. There was no global economy built on fiat paper money. There was no one to formally challenge the roman authority.

if we're built off from a roman system, we're doomed to implode the same way Rome imploded and we'll do it in less than half the time. I would say far less than half. in fact, i see our empire already imploding.

No disagreement from me on that. We're already headed to some sort of break up we're only accelerating the pace

 

[Avatar4321]

We werent built on Roman ideals. We were built on a unique idea. One that all men were created equally and endowed by their Creator with certian unalieable rights.

Our Founders took ideas from the Roman government. They also looked at the governments of ancient Greece. They looked at the government of their native Great Britain. To the Netherlands. And they also looked to the government of ancient Israel, before the time of the Kings.

If we are to be an empire, it will not be an empire based on what the Romans did. There empire failed. if we wish to succeed, we need to be build upon the principles that built this nation. Those principles are found in the Declaration and the Constitution which stand as a sign of our covenant with God as a people. If we are to continue what our Founders began, we must start by learning to the principles they lived. Namely self government. They learned to live virtuous and godly lives. They entered into a covenant with themselves and with God and promised to be virtuous and uphold the responsibilities they have to themselves, their families, to God, and their communities.

Unless we live the principles our Founders did, we don't deserve the blessings they left us. If they could not establish a Republic without relying on the Hand of Divine Providence, how can we hope to preserve it or Restore it?

 

[CrusaderFrank]

It's been spiraling out of cntrol for how long? Or, are you using selective partisan memory?

It's actually been relatively under control since 1967 when our allies, with our help, destroyed the military forces of three separate countries.

There's nothing partisan about that.

It started getting out of control after 1993 when there were no real consequences to trying to kill 30,000 of us by toppling the WTC

No real consequence?

heh.

Okay, are you saying we should blow them all to hell, is that it?

Because it looks like we've been blowing plenty of them to hell over the last 11 years...........has that helped make them start being fearful of us, thus peaceful towards us? No, no it hasn't.

Iraq is a billion times better off than it was before we got there.

Handing Egypt and Libya to the Islamists has been a complete and total disaster and the exact opposite of what a great civilization should have done.

 

[G.T.]

It's actually been relatively under control since 1967 when our allies, with our help, destroyed the military forces of three separate countries.

There's nothing partisan about that.

It started getting out of control after 1993 when there were no real consequences to trying to kill 30,000 of us by toppling the WTC

No real consequence?

heh.

Okay, are you saying we should blow them all to hell, is that it?

Because it looks like we've been blowing plenty of them to hell over the last 11 years...........has that helped make them start being fearful of us, thus peaceful towards us? No, no it hasn't.

Iraq is a billion times better off than it was before we got there.

Handing Egypt and Libya to the Islamists has been a complete and total disaster and the exact opposite of what a great civilization should have done.

In your opinion.

It's the antithesis of Freedom. It's tyranny.

 

[GoneBezerk]

The US should remain a superpower military with a big stick, but start telling our allies to build up their own militaries as we drawdown and drawback certain forces from Europe and Asia.

We put limits on the Japanese military because of WWII but with a growing Chinese threat, we should let the Japanese get stronger and bigger allowing us to pull back some of our military from Japan.

As for Europe, it needs to be a collective effort of each NATO country to maintain a strong force for their country to prevent the Russians from trying an invasion of their country. NATO as a whole needs to be stronger than Russia, but with a smaller US force in Europe than before.

As for the middle east, we are slowly building the Arab military coaltion in the Gulf States to counter Iran. We are going to draw down in Afghanistan but we should never pull all the troops out, leave certain Spec Ops and aircraft to carry out kill missions now they we've realized the training mission is and has been a waste of time like I have been saying for years.

Our newest ally, India is our key partner against Pakistan and China. India with nukes and a billion people can fight our enemies in that part of the world if we need help someday. The irony is we supported Pakistan against India in the Cold War.

At the end of the day, the US military needs to remain strong with nukes and conventional forces. Downsizing the military to get more welfare goodies at home is dangerous and stupid. It doesn't matter if you are getting $1500 a month in welfare handouts if the US is attacked and destroyed by Russia, China or another rising power out there.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

No real consequence?

heh.

Okay, are you saying we should blow them all to hell, is that it?

Because it looks like we've been blowing plenty of them to hell over the last 11 years...........has that helped make them start being fearful of us, thus peaceful towards us? No, no it hasn't.

Iraq is a billion times better off than it was before we got there.

Handing Egypt and Libya to the Islamists has been a complete and total disaster and the exact opposite of what a great civilization should have done.

In your opinion.

It's the antithesis of Freedom. It's tyranny.

Handing countries over to our sworn enemies is not "freedom", it's insanity

 

[G.T.]

Iraq is a billion times better off than it was before we got there.

Handing Egypt and Libya to the Islamists has been a complete and total disaster and the exact opposite of what a great civilization should have done.

In your opinion.

It's the antithesis of Freedom. It's tyranny.

Handing countries over to our sworn enemies is not "freedom", it's insanity

We didnt hand over countries to anyone, we freely let them elect their own leaders. Interfering is what's insanity, it flies in the face of what you'd THINK you call an American principle.

 

[HUGGY]

After much consideration over the latter part of my adult life, I am now a firm believer that it in is the best interest of the USA to exercise some degree of control and influence over any part of the world that is of interest to us. To ignore an area, to let them to their own devices is the height of foolishness and downright dangerous to us.

Our government was modeled Rome, so should our military strategy. I was taught that is was inappropriate for us to flex our power, that George Washington warned us about foreign intervention. We were a weak sister then and were better off not tangling with France or England. Today, France and England both rest comfortably knowing that the firepower aboard a single US Aircraft Carrier can destroy the entire armored strength of the USSR without resorting to nuclear weapons.

Rome never had any qualms about letting its neighbors know who had the big stick. When an area became of interest and importance, the Legions were dispatched. Once subdued and under Roman rule, they prospered from trade and protection. The Germanic Barbarians in the North were never subdued and they lived worse than pigs. The civilized world knew true peace because the leader was not afraid to let the world know it was a safe and dependable leader, it should be no different today.

Good thinkin Frankie! A 2500 year old model. Ever wonder why the Roman empire fell?

Frankie...you are such a dufus!

 

[Liberal]

We werent built on Roman ideals. We were built on a unique idea. One that all men were created equally and endowed by their Creator with certian unalieable rights.

Our Founders took ideas from the Roman government. They also looked at the governments of ancient Greece. They looked at the government of their native Great Britain. To the Netherlands. And they also looked to the government of ancient Israel, before the time of the Kings.

If we are to be an empire, it will not be an empire based on what the Romans did. There empire failed. if we wish to succeed, we need to be build upon the principles that built this nation. Those principles are found in the Declaration and the Constitution which stand as a sign of our covenant with God as a people. If we are to continue what our Founders began, we must start by learning to the principles they lived. Namely self government. They learned to live virtuous and godly lives. They entered into a covenant with themselves and with God and promised to be virtuous and uphold the responsibilities they have to themselves, their families, to God, and their communities.

Unless we live the principles our Founders did, we don't deserve the blessings they left us. If they could not establish a Republic without relying on the Hand of Divine Providence, how can we hope to preserve it or Restore it?

It's good to see that Avatar can even spit up all over a bad thread with terrible religious extrapolations.

Give it a rest you zealot.

 

[Old Rocks]

And if things get out of hand, Frankie Boy will just toddle off to his hollow moon.

 

[Avatar4321]

Good thinkin Frankie! A 2500 year old model. Ever wonder why the Roman empire fell?

Frankie...you are such a dufus!

Same reason every other empire fell. Human nature.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

In your opinion.

It's the antithesis of Freedom. It's tyranny.

Handing countries over to our sworn enemies is not "freedom", it's insanity

We didnt hand over countries to anyone, we freely let them elect their own leaders. Interfering is what's insanity, it flies in the face of what you'd THINK you call an American principle.

We HANDED Egypt to the Muslim Brotherhood and remember "we came, we saw, he died"?

 

[CrusaderFrank]

After much consideration over the latter part of my adult life, I am now a firm believer that it in is the best interest of the USA to exercise some degree of control and influence over any part of the world that is of interest to us. To ignore an area, to let them to their own devices is the height of foolishness and downright dangerous to us.

Our government was modeled Rome, so should our military strategy. I was taught that is was inappropriate for us to flex our power, that George Washington warned us about foreign intervention. We were a weak sister then and were better off not tangling with France or England. Today, France and England both rest comfortably knowing that the firepower aboard a single US Aircraft Carrier can destroy the entire armored strength of the USSR without resorting to nuclear weapons.

Rome never had any qualms about letting its neighbors know who had the big stick. When an area became of interest and importance, the Legions were dispatched. Once subdued and under Roman rule, they prospered from trade and protection. The Germanic Barbarians in the North were never subdued and they lived worse than pigs. The civilized world knew true peace because the leader was not afraid to let the world know it was a safe and dependable leader, it should be no different today.

Good thinkin Frankie! A 2500 year old model. Ever wonder why the Roman empire fell?

Frankie...you are such a dufus!

Lead plumbing

If I thought you could locate Rome on a map I'd talk further

 

[Avatar4321]

We werent built on Roman ideals. We were built on a unique idea. One that all men were created equally and endowed by their Creator with certian unalieable rights.

Our Founders took ideas from the Roman government. They also looked at the governments of ancient Greece. They looked at the government of their native Great Britain. To the Netherlands. And they also looked to the government of ancient Israel, before the time of the Kings.

If we are to be an empire, it will not be an empire based on what the Romans did. There empire failed. if we wish to succeed, we need to be build upon the principles that built this nation. Those principles are found in the Declaration and the Constitution which stand as a sign of our covenant with God as a people. If we are to continue what our Founders began, we must start by learning to the principles they lived. Namely self government. They learned to live virtuous and godly lives. They entered into a covenant with themselves and with God and promised to be virtuous and uphold the responsibilities they have to themselves, their families, to God, and their communities.

Unless we live the principles our Founders did, we don't deserve the blessings they left us. If they could not establish a Republic without relying on the Hand of Divine Providence, how can we hope to preserve it or Restore it?

It's good to see that Avatar can even spit up all over a bad thread with terrible religious extrapolations.

Give it a rest you zealot.

Why would I rest in speaking the truth? I like the truth. The truth brings freedom and liberty. History shows the Founders realized that the Hand of Divine Providence was with them. They sought after the guidence of the Lord. They called days for the people humble themselves, repent of their sins through fasting and prayer. Washington encouraged His soldiers to keep the Sabbath Holy and to obey the commandments of the Lord. They offered up up thanks to the Lord for what the assistance they recieved. They acknowledged His assistance in winning the Revolutionary War and later when the Constitution was established.

Read what they said. Read what they taught and how they lived. These were, by majority, religious men. Some dreamed dreams. They all saw miracles during the war.

You can't look at the history of what they accomplished and what they strove and leave up the religious viewpoints they saw the world with. If you fail to look at them as they were, it will be impossible to understand what their purpose was or recreate it now.

 

[G.T.]

Handing countries over to our sworn enemies is not "freedom", it's insanity

We didnt hand over countries to anyone, we freely let them elect their own leaders. Interfering is what's insanity, it flies in the face of what you'd THINK you call an American principle.

We HANDED Egypt to the Muslim Brotherhood and remember "we came, we saw, he died"?

We HANDED Egypt nothing.