Oil/Gas Question

Discussion in 'Energy' started by Cain, Mar 9, 2011.

  1. Cain
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    Cain Air Force DEP

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    I am asking the forum members to help me out in a question I have.

    What happens when gas/oil becomes too expensive for people to use? I mean, I live 20+ miles from the closest city [closest town is about 10-12] and we live on a farm in the middle of nowhere, we can't exactly bike/walk too town, even though I know I could probably bike 20 miles, I do not believe it would be a option for school lol, although who knows. Thank the lord I am getting out of here in 3 months.

    I have already closed the idea of getting a truck, seeing as how the Jeep I like just as much gets 23-29mpg average, a lot better then 14-20; now I am wondering, are vehicles really all that important? I have no problem riding a horse to work, although I'd prefer a mule or donkey, less issues and have more sense. (Have raised members of all the families, horse/donkey/mule/cow/emu/llama)

    I am just wondering cause I personally have no idea, I mean, the only thing I can think is riots/mobs in the streets trying to figure out how their going to survive.
     
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  2. Two Thumbs
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    Two Thumbs Platinum Member

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    During the fuel shortage under Carter I don't recall any riots.

    You live on a farm, so if riots did happen, you can watch the cities burn. B/c that's the only place that will have problems b/c people will lack the space to grow enough food to feed themselves, even fewer will have the knowledge and fewer still the skill/talent.

    for me, if it gets to high, I'll take the bus, if the bus jacks the price up, I'll either walk or put in to work from home.

    I had a garden in paint buckets last year with poor to fair results, so when food prices go up, more, I'm going to be pressed to feed my kids.
     
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  3. Foxfyre
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    Foxfyre Eternal optimist Gold Supporting Member Supporting Member

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    I don't believe it has ever happened that an essential product became cost prohibitive for more than a very few. High gasoline prices will almost certainly force many people to plan better--set out routes to maximize efficiency in shopping etc. when we do drive our cars/trucks. There will probably be more carpooling. More working from home. Fewer or closer in vacations. Trips to Grandma's spaced out longer. Etc. Those of you out on the farm might invest in a larger freezer, canning supplies, and schedule fewer shopping trips to town. Higher school costs to run busses could likely result in cutting non essential classes, sports, etc. In other words, people will generally find ways to manage. This is not the first time American ingenuity went into high gear to deal with high prices and shortages.

    The more serious problem are shortages making Petroleum unavailable for some or for some purposes. At least spring is coming on so folks are less likely to freeze, but if some processes and products that require petroleum are not able to get all they need, that will show up in higher costs for those products and services and will likely result in more unemployment. Already trucking companies are cutting back to save on fuel so it may take longer to get products to market and some smaller markets may be cut off entirely.

    Look on the bright side. Maybe this oil crisis will prompt our fearless leaders to pull their heads out of the sand, relax non essential regulations and restrictions so we can start revving up domestic production again.

    I'm not holding my breath however.
     
  4. Toronado3800
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    Toronado3800 VIP Member

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    First step is to ditch my MarkVIII and buy something that uses its technology to get 50mpg. Driving my 280hp 24mpg car around is a pure luxury. 100hp will get a family of four down the road just fine.
     
  5. Care4all
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    Care4all Warrior Princess Supporting Member

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    cain

    higher oil/gas prices will hurt us all around...because food and the cost of producing it, will rise....so, 2 necessities....transportation to and fro work will be higher AND food and clothes will be higher in price as well...

    if wages continue to stay stagnant, this will be a major burden on MOST of middle America....the middle class.

    although i am not necessarily against drilling more in some of the nationally restricted areas of the usa, i disagree with Foxfyre....increased drilling in the US will NOT lower the prices of oil and the oil drilled here, is sold on the global market and not held here in the usa....for only our use.

    i do agree with Foxfyre that we will use our ingenuity, to get by.

    And we will eventually find another energy source, to fuel our needs....it won't be easy....a lot of hardships to come....for certain!
     
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  6. KissMy
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    KissMy Free Breast Exam

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    Rather than go overboard with drastic measures it makes more energy sense to stop shopping as much at stores & have goods delivered to your home. Live close to work, carpool & combine trips as much as possible. Stock-up to reduce trips to stores.

    A Chinese worker lives in a dorm at their work place. The average China worker consumes less than 2 barrels of oil per year to live & make products for Americans. The average American consumes over 20 barrels of oil per year to live & make products. It is much, much, much more fuel efficient to make products in China & ship them to American homes than it is for Americans to go to work to make & buy their own goods.

    A ocean cargo ship gets over 1,100 net freight ton miles per gallon.
    A barge gets 575 net freight ton miles per gallon.
    A train gets 425 net freight ton miles per gallon.
    A semi truck gets 170 net freight ton miles per gallon.
    A UPS delivery truck gets 15 net freight ton miles per gallon.
    A Jet plane gets 7 net freight ton miles per gallon.
    A 1/2 ton pick-up truck completly filled both ways gets 9 net freight ton miles per gallon. One way 4.5 net freight ton miles per gallon.
    An average 20-lbs of goods per car trip to the store empty one way gets 0.125 net freight ton miles per gallon.

    FYI - CNBC just did a story (Supermarkets Inc.) on grocery stores. The average American spends $35 per trip to the supermarket & goes shopping 3.5 times per week. You can't even buy 20-lbs worth of groceries for $35. So the average net freight ton miles per gallon for grocery shopping is likely lower than the 0.125 I quoted above. If we would just combine trips, buy more per trip, carpool, take a neighbor shopping with us or do their shopping for them or order online & have things delivered we could more than double our mileage & cut our transportation fuel consumption by more than 50%.
     
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  7. boedicca
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    boedicca Uppity Water Nymph Supporting Member

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    We are already seeing what will happen:

    - Energy and food prices are not counted by the government in core inflation, so they will ignore the issue and actually claim economic growth as consumers pay more for less goods.

    - The economy will meander at a moribund pace, causing more people to drop out of the labor force. The government will use this shrinkage to claim improvements in unemployment.

    - The moribund economy will cause tax receipts to be lower than projected while the permanent Big Government Establishment refuses to cut 2% of spending. The deficts will be bigger than expected.

    - The larger deficits will increase the governments need for borrowing; foreign buyers of debt will demand higher interest payments. Higher interest payments will increase the deficit. Return to the above point and repeat.

    - The disconnect between the official Administration Spin and the reality of stagflation for the vast majority of Americans will be The Issue in 2012.

    - Obama will lose; and if we are smart and lucky, we will elect someone who will quickly undo the Obamanation of his ignorant fiscal and economic policies before we reach the point of no return.
     
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  8. editec
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    editec Mr. Forgot-it-All

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    In the 50s and 60s gas was cheap and people with jobs moved to the burbs and the poor remained behind.

    As gas gets dear, people are moving back into the cities, and the poor are getting displaced.

    People will adapt to changing condition if the changes aren't so rapid that they cannot change in time.
     
  9. Mr. H.
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    Mr. H. Diamond Member

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    Cain, aren't you more worried about the high cost of oil/gas affecting your farm's input costs?
     
  10. Two Thumbs
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    Two Thumbs Platinum Member

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    You got a link that shows more poor people are getting displaced? Or one that shows people to moving into cities? Where it is far more expensive to live.
     

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