Minimum Wage Increase: They Never Talks About the SALES

[paulitician]

Fact is, since the Minimum Wage has existed, more Millionaires & Billionaires have been created in this country than ever before in history. Businesses have not only survived, they've thrived. So there is no evidence whatsoever that the Minimum Wage causes any perceptible negative impact on the Economy. All the gloom & doom 'Sky is Falling' predictions really are B.S. They've always been proven to be B.S. And this time will be no different.

The Wage will go up, and Businesses will be fine. In my own personal opinion, i think the Minimum Wage should be somewhere between $10-$12. $15 may be a bit much. I think $10-$12 is a survivable wage. But even at that, it will still be a struggle. So don't count on Minimum Wage for your survival. Get educated and skilled. That's the best way to go.

Before you produce data to support your obviously wrong assertions, make sure it is corrected for the effects of counter-inflation and counter-unemployment policies in place at the same time. Good luck.

Minimum wage laws cannot create jobs, they can ONLY outlaw them. Minimum wage laws demand that workers willing to accept wages less than the minimum wage are barred from such contracts. It is compulsory unemployment. Statutory minimum wage ALWAYS contributes to unemployment.

There is no escape from the objective fact of economic reality that minimum wage laws devalue wages. You simply cannot avoid devaluing wages when you make $1/hr work cost the same as $15/hr work. It's just not possible.

Adding new dollars to the economy by increasing the minimum wage beyond what the work is worth is not the same thing as creating new wealth. Minimum wage laws ALWAYS result in inflation. They necessarily must.

These realities are inescapable, and it is why minimum wage ponzi schemes ALWAYS fail.

If they were not always failures--if they did not always result in unemployment and inflation--minimum wage proponents would not always be demanding that the minimum wage be increased... yet again!

Rather have em working and being productive Citizens, than permanently mooching Entitlements. They'll pay some taxes and put some money back into the economy. You may have to pay em a little more, but it'll be worth it in the end.

And like i said, Minimum Wage has never caused any perceptible negative impact on the economy. We have more Millionaires & Billionaires in this country than ever before in our history. Paying Minimum Wage has very little, to no impact. It is what it is.

 

[airplanemechanic]

If you wouldn't go out and buy a car for more than its asking price, why do you expect businesses to pay their workers more than they're worth?

Would you arbitrarily let the gov't put a minimum asking price on all vehicles of 25,000? Who would pay 25K for a Kia Rio? Nobody, so why arbitrarily value labor if you're not going to arbitrarily value goods? Some people's labor is only worth a Kia Rio, some a Bentley.

 

[LOki]

Fact is, since the Minimum Wage has existed, more Millionaires & Billionaires have been created in this country than ever before in history. Businesses have not only survived, they've thrived. So there is no evidence whatsoever that the Minimum Wage causes any perceptible negative impact on the Economy. All the gloom & doom 'Sky is Falling' predictions really are B.S. They've always been proven to be B.S. And this time will be no different.

The Wage will go up, and Businesses will be fine. In my own personal opinion, i think the Minimum Wage should be somewhere between $10-$12. $15 may be a bit much. I think $10-$12 is a survivable wage. But even at that, it will still be a struggle. So don't count on Minimum Wage for your survival. Get educated and skilled. That's the best way to go.

Before you produce data to support your obviously wrong assertions, make sure it is corrected for the effects of counter-inflation and counter-unemployment policies in place at the same time. Good luck.

Minimum wage laws cannot create jobs, they can ONLY outlaw them. Minimum wage laws demand that workers willing to accept wages less than the minimum wage are barred from such contracts. It is compulsory unemployment. Statutory minimum wage ALWAYS contributes to unemployment.

There is no escape from the objective fact of economic reality that minimum wage laws devalue wages. You simply cannot avoid devaluing wages when you make $1/hr work cost the same as $15/hr work. It's just not possible.

Adding new dollars to the economy by increasing the minimum wage beyond what the work is worth is not the same thing as creating new wealth. Minimum wage laws ALWAYS result in inflation. They necessarily must.

These realities are inescapable, and it is why minimum wage ponzi schemes ALWAYS fail.

If they were not always failures--if they did not always result in unemployment and inflation--minimum wage proponents would not always be demanding that the minimum wage be increased... yet again!

Rather have em working and being productive Citizens, than permanently mooching Entitlements. They'll pay some taxes and put some money back into the economy. You may have to pay em a little more, but it'll be worth it in the end.

Nonsense. It hasn't been worth it yet... not only has the cost of entitlements grown, so also has the cost of minimum wage.

If statutory minimum wage did not always fail--if it did not always result in unemployment and inflation--minimum wage proponents would not always be demanding that the statutory minimum wage be increased... yet again!

And like i said, Minimum Wage has never caused any perceptible negative impact on the economy.

Obvious nonsense.

We have more Millionaires & Billionaires in this country than ever before in our history.

Paying Minimum Wage has very little, to no impact. It is what it is.

Fine. It's well established that you refuse to accept the necessarily destructive economic realities appurtenant to statutory minimum wage.

So tell us, what exactly is your objection to simply basing a worker's wages upon the what that worker's work is worth?

 

[paulitician]

Fact is, since the Minimum Wage has existed, more Millionaires & Billionaires have been created in this country than ever before in history. Businesses have not only survived, they've thrived. So there is no evidence whatsoever that the Minimum Wage causes any perceptible negative impact on the Economy. All the gloom & doom 'Sky is Falling' predictions really are B.S. They've always been proven to be B.S. And this time will be no different.

The Wage will go up, and Businesses will be fine. In my own personal opinion, i think the Minimum Wage should be somewhere between $10-$12. $15 may be a bit much. I think $10-$12 is a survivable wage. But even at that, it will still be a struggle. So don't count on Minimum Wage for your survival. Get educated and skilled. That's the best way to go.

Before you produce data to support your obviously wrong assertions, make sure it is corrected for the effects of counter-inflation and counter-unemployment policies in place at the same time. Good luck.

Minimum wage laws cannot create jobs, they can ONLY outlaw them. Minimum wage laws demand that workers willing to accept wages less than the minimum wage are barred from such contracts. It is compulsory unemployment. Statutory minimum wage ALWAYS contributes to unemployment.

There is no escape from the objective fact of economic reality that minimum wage laws devalue wages. You simply cannot avoid devaluing wages when you make $1/hr work cost the same as $15/hr work. It's just not possible.

Adding new dollars to the economy by increasing the minimum wage beyond what the work is worth is not the same thing as creating new wealth. Minimum wage laws ALWAYS result in inflation. They necessarily must.

These realities are inescapable, and it is why minimum wage ponzi schemes ALWAYS fail.

If they were not always failures--if they did not always result in unemployment and inflation--minimum wage proponents would not always be demanding that the minimum wage be increased... yet again!

Rather have em working and being productive Citizens, than permanently mooching Entitlements. They'll pay some taxes and put some money back into the economy. You may have to pay em a little more, but it'll be worth it in the end.

Nonsense. It hasn't been worth it yet... not only has the cost of entitlements grown, so also has the cost of minimum wage.

If statutory minimum wage did not always fail--if it did not always result in unemployment and inflation--minimum wage proponents would not always be demanding that the statutory minimum wage be increased... yet again!

And like i said, Minimum Wage has never caused any perceptible negative impact on the economy.

Obvious nonsense.

We have more Millionaires & Billionaires in this country than ever before in our history.

Paying Minimum Wage has very little, to no impact. It is what it is.

Fine. It's well established that you refuse to accept the necessarily destructive economic realities appurtenant to statutory minimum wage.

So tell us, what exactly is your objection to simply basing a worker's wages upon the what that worker's work is worth?

Like i said, i'd rather em working and being productive Citizens. Pay em a decent wage, they'll pay some taxes and spend more money back into the economy. Minimum Wage has a minimum, if any impact at all on the economy. Except for when it's too low. In that case, more Citizens turn to Entitlements for survival.

 

[SwimExpert]

Fact is, since the Minimum Wage has existed, more Millionaires & Billionaires have been created in this country than ever before in history. Businesses have not only survived, they've thrived. So there is no evidence whatsoever that the Minimum Wage causes any perceptible negative impact on the Economy.

That is an interesting argument. Most proponents of raising the minimum wage would argue that the ballooning of wealth amongst some at the higher end of the spectrum, in conjunction with the stagnation of the remaining majority, is a negative impact on the economy. Personally, I would agree with them. That we have more millionaires and billionaires, yet the majority of Americans have less wealth and stagnant (in fact, reduced) income, is precisely evidence at the ills of our economy, not it's health and vitality.

The mind-boggling ballooning of wealth by the few is a lead cause of the inflation that causes the remaining majority to be earning less in real value today than in times past. The minimum wage has become precisely a vehicle for that ballooning. The most wealthy gain and hold onto their wealth by staying ahead of, and taking advantage of, inflation. In today's economy, raising the minimum wage is precisely the kind of thing that will ultimately play into their hands. If Mr. Widget wants to increase his wealth by 10% he's going to need to increase his prices. But how is he going to do that without making people mad and/or losing sales due to peole being unable or unwilling to keep buying? Well, if a minimum wage hike comes along he now has the perfect excuse to raise his prices by 15% and pocket a bigger profit margin. Sure, he might pay a little extra to his workers. But he's going to recoup that, plus some, by raising his prices. And even if he loses a few customers, he'll gain new ones too, because there are now people who can afford his new prices because they just got a raise.

The minimum wage was a good idea when it was dreamed up. It probably was effective and was at least part of the success of golden age America. But those days are long gone. It's now dated, and the big businesses have found ways around it. They've figured out how to maintain their margins, even increase their margins, despite whatever arbitrary number is set for the minimum wage. A whole new thinking is needed. At this point, trying to raise the minimum wage is like putting butter on a burn. Sure, it feels good at first, but it causes more damage in the long run. Using even more, just because it momentarily felt like relief, isn't going to treat your problem, but there's a good chance it could make it worse.

 

[paulitician]

Fact is, since the Minimum Wage has existed, more Millionaires & Billionaires have been created in this country than ever before in history. Businesses have not only survived, they've thrived. So there is no evidence whatsoever that the Minimum Wage causes any perceptible negative impact on the Economy.

That is an interesting argument. Most proponents of raising the minimum wage would argue that the ballooning of wealth amongst some at the higher end of the spectrum, in conjunction with the stagnation of the remaining majority, is a negative impact on the economy. Personally, I would agree with them. That we have more millionaires and billionaires, yet the majority of Americans have less wealth and stagnant (in fact, reduced) income, is precisely evidence at the ills of our economy, not it's health and vitality.

The mind-boggling ballooning of wealth by the few is a lead cause of the inflation that causes the remaining majority to be earning less in real value today than in times past. The minimum wage has become precisely a vehicle for that ballooning. The most wealthy gain and hold onto their wealth by staying ahead of, and taking advantage of, inflation. In today's economy, raising the minimum wage is precisely the kind of thing that will ultimately play into their hands. If Mr. Widget wants to increase his wealth by 10% he's going to need to increase his prices. But how is he going to do that without making people mad and/or losing sales due to peole being unable or unwilling to keep buying? Well, if a minimum wage hike comes along he now has the perfect excuse to raise his prices by 15% and pocket a bigger profit margin. Sure, he might pay a little extra to his workers. But he's going to recoup that, plus some, by raising his prices. And even if he loses a few customers, he'll gain new ones too, because there are now people who can afford his new prices because they just got a raise.

The minimum wage was a good idea when it was dreamed up. It probably was effective and was at least part of the success of golden age America. But those days are long gone. It's now dated, and the big businesses have found ways around it. They've figured out how to maintain their margins, even increase their margins, despite whatever arbitrary number is set for the minimum wage. A whole new thinking is needed. At this point, trying to raise the minimum wage is like putting butter on a burn. Sure, it feels good at first, but it causes more damage in the long run. Using even more, just because it momentarily felt like relief, isn't going to treat your problem, but there's a good chance it could make it worse.

You make some valid points. But i'd rather em working and being productive Citizens, than permanently mooching Entitlements. Pay em a decent wage, they'll pay some taxes and spend some money back into the economy. It'll work out.

I truly believe if you do a right and good thing, it will come back around to you. Give em a little more cash, it'll come back around to benefit us all.

 

[dblack]

Fact is, since the Minimum Wage has existed, more Millionaires & Billionaires have been created in this country than ever before in history. Businesses have not only survived, they've thrived. ...

Hmmm... coincidence?

 

[Billy000]

Just now, I saw another report about the topic of minimum wage increase. This one was on CNN, hosted by Julie Banderas. She was talking to Scott Gamm, of HelpSaveMyDollars.com, a financial website focused on helping consumers save and learn about money. They were talking about the recent 14-1 vote by the city of Los Angeles to raise the minimum wage to $15 by 2020.

Scott might be well versed on various aspects pertaining to consumer finances but, on the minimum wage raise, he is waaay off the mark. He said three things about the minimum wage raise topic. And he was WRONG on all three. Gamm merely recited the 3 most commonly heard (and programmed) descriptions about minimum wage raises.

1. He said it would cause jobs to be lost. FALSE! Employers function with a number of employees that bring them the most income/profit. They CANNOT reduce staff. Any more or less employees results in SALES and income reduction. Layoffs result in losses, not gains.

2. He (and Banderas too) said prices would be raised (or fees created) to compensate for the wage losses, and these losses would just be "passed on" to the customers. More FALSE! scare talk. Businesses CANNOT raise prices because they are already fixed at a market price, related to maximization of sales/income. Any change in price (up or down) results in reduction of SALES and income.

3. He said businesses will move away from LA. FALSE! (in most cases). Does Gamm think that closing down a business and moving to another location can be done scott (no pun intended) free ? Depending on the business, moving costs can vary from just barely economical, to completely UNeconomical, and the latter is much more often the case. Imagine a machine shop with over 100 large production machines, having to pack then all up and move miles away. Some businesses could do it. Not many.

So here's the real crux of all this. As in 1000 other media reports I've seen on minimum wage increases, the most important aspect of this is NEVER MENTIONED. Not a word. That is the increase in DISPOSABLE INCOME resulting in INCREASES SALES$$$. All businesses get this, and generally it far outweighs labor increases, since the number of wage raised consumers (not just those at the minimum wage) by far outnumbers any one employer's workers who are getting wage increases.

Then there's also the fact that many business, while receiving this big SALES boost, do NOT have any wage loss at all. These are businesses who are mom & pop and have no employees, those whose workers are all working just on sales commission (car lots, furniture, real estate, insurance, etc), and third, those with skilled workers (ex. machine shops) whose workers all already get well over $15 hour, or whatever the MW would be raised to.

I think back to when I owned a business. I paid my commission salespeople $350/hour (in 2015 dollars), and they still were only receiving 15% of the sale. In all, I made fine profits and expanded the business. Biggest downer ? All the people who called in and said > "Sorry. I can't afford it." Of course they can't. Not one somebody out there is paying them a low minimum wage. To be successful in business, you have a lot fo things to do. But you can't do anything, if the public around you doesn't have money in their pockets to buy what you're trying to sell.

This is why Conservatives who support raising the MW nationwide, outnumber Conservatives who don't, 54% to 44%.

the most important aspect of this is NEVER MENTIONED. Not a word. That is the increase in DISPOSABLE INCOME resulting in INCREASES SALES$$$.

If I pay my employees another $500,000 a year, are my sales supposed to increase by $500,000?
Is that supposed to be an even trade?

I don't understand how you can be so dense. The economic benefits of raising the minimum wage would occur because the change would happen in the entire economy. Overall, a good portion of the economy would have more disposable income, so yeah, business in general would see an increase in demand.

And as prices rise as they must all those people making above the proposed MW will see their buying power decrease.

It ain't rocket science

Um no. The price increase would be pennies on the dollar.

 

[SwimExpert]

You make some valid points. But i'd rather em working and being productive Citizens, than permanently mooching Entitlements. Pay em a decent wage, they'll pay some taxes and spend some money back into the economy. It'll work out.

I truly believe if you do a right and good thing, it will come back around to you. Give em a little more cash, it'll come back around to benefit us all.

I agree that I'd rather see people working too. Seems where we disagree is whether doing the "right" thing will pay dividends. The power players in today's economy have no interest in doing the "right" thing, and will simply find a way to turn it on its head so that at best it's a "break even." But even a break even is a loss for us in the long run, because of the inflation.

Though we are looking at different avenues, we find ourselves in the atypical position of wanting the same outcome in middle ground territory. The politicians will never let this stand.

 

[Skull Pilot]

Just now, I saw another report about the topic of minimum wage increase. This one was on CNN, hosted by Julie Banderas. She was talking to Scott Gamm, of HelpSaveMyDollars.com, a financial website focused on helping consumers save and learn about money. They were talking about the recent 14-1 vote by the city of Los Angeles to raise the minimum wage to $15 by 2020.

Scott might be well versed on various aspects pertaining to consumer finances but, on the minimum wage raise, he is waaay off the mark. He said three things about the minimum wage raise topic. And he was WRONG on all three. Gamm merely recited the 3 most commonly heard (and programmed) descriptions about minimum wage raises.

1. He said it would cause jobs to be lost. FALSE! Employers function with a number of employees that bring them the most income/profit. They CANNOT reduce staff. Any more or less employees results in SALES and income reduction. Layoffs result in losses, not gains.

2. He (and Banderas too) said prices would be raised (or fees created) to compensate for the wage losses, and these losses would just be "passed on" to the customers. More FALSE! scare talk. Businesses CANNOT raise prices because they are already fixed at a market price, related to maximization of sales/income. Any change in price (up or down) results in reduction of SALES and income.

3. He said businesses will move away from LA. FALSE! (in most cases). Does Gamm think that closing down a business and moving to another location can be done scott (no pun intended) free ? Depending on the business, moving costs can vary from just barely economical, to completely UNeconomical, and the latter is much more often the case. Imagine a machine shop with over 100 large production machines, having to pack then all up and move miles away. Some businesses could do it. Not many.

So here's the real crux of all this. As in 1000 other media reports I've seen on minimum wage increases, the most important aspect of this is NEVER MENTIONED. Not a word. That is the increase in DISPOSABLE INCOME resulting in INCREASES SALES$$$. All businesses get this, and generally it far outweighs labor increases, since the number of wage raised consumers (not just those at the minimum wage) by far outnumbers any one employer's workers who are getting wage increases.

Then there's also the fact that many business, while receiving this big SALES boost, do NOT have any wage loss at all. These are businesses who are mom & pop and have no employees, those whose workers are all working just on sales commission (car lots, furniture, real estate, insurance, etc), and third, those with skilled workers (ex. machine shops) whose workers all already get well over $15 hour, or whatever the MW would be raised to.

I think back to when I owned a business. I paid my commission salespeople $350/hour (in 2015 dollars), and they still were only receiving 15% of the sale. In all, I made fine profits and expanded the business. Biggest downer ? All the people who called in and said > "Sorry. I can't afford it." Of course they can't. Not one somebody out there is paying them a low minimum wage. To be successful in business, you have a lot fo things to do. But you can't do anything, if the public around you doesn't have money in their pockets to buy what you're trying to sell.

This is why Conservatives who support raising the MW nationwide, outnumber Conservatives who don't, 54% to 44%.

the most important aspect of this is NEVER MENTIONED. Not a word. That is the increase in DISPOSABLE INCOME resulting in INCREASES SALES$$$.

If I pay my employees another $500,000 a year, are my sales supposed to increase by $500,000?
Is that supposed to be an even trade?

I don't understand how you can be so dense. The economic benefits of raising the minimum wage would occur because the change would happen in the entire economy. Overall, a good portion of the economy would have more disposable income, so yeah, business in general would see an increase in demand.

And as prices rise as they must all those people making above the proposed MW will see their buying power decrease.

It ain't rocket science

Um no. The price increase would be pennies on the dollar.

Pennies add up to dollars Idiot.

The price of everything would rise

Everything from apples to zucchini would cost more

All your utilities will cost more

Everything you do for entertainment would cost more

Anyone with any common sense knows that

And you think a 7.50 an hour raise only costs the employer 7.50 don't you?

News flash it doesn't. Employers will have to pay higher payroll taxes, higher state and federal unemployment taxes, higher workman's comp premiums (taxes) etc

so like I said all those pennies add up to a lot of dollars

 

[Billy000]

Just now, I saw another report about the topic of minimum wage increase. This one was on CNN, hosted by Julie Banderas. She was talking to Scott Gamm, of HelpSaveMyDollars.com, a financial website focused on helping consumers save and learn about money. They were talking about the recent 14-1 vote by the city of Los Angeles to raise the minimum wage to $15 by 2020.

Scott might be well versed on various aspects pertaining to consumer finances but, on the minimum wage raise, he is waaay off the mark. He said three things about the minimum wage raise topic. And he was WRONG on all three. Gamm merely recited the 3 most commonly heard (and programmed) descriptions about minimum wage raises.

1. He said it would cause jobs to be lost. FALSE! Employers function with a number of employees that bring them the most income/profit. They CANNOT reduce staff. Any more or less employees results in SALES and income reduction. Layoffs result in losses, not gains.

2. He (and Banderas too) said prices would be raised (or fees created) to compensate for the wage losses, and these losses would just be "passed on" to the customers. More FALSE! scare talk. Businesses CANNOT raise prices because they are already fixed at a market price, related to maximization of sales/income. Any change in price (up or down) results in reduction of SALES and income.

3. He said businesses will move away from LA. FALSE! (in most cases). Does Gamm think that closing down a business and moving to another location can be done scott (no pun intended) free ? Depending on the business, moving costs can vary from just barely economical, to completely UNeconomical, and the latter is much more often the case. Imagine a machine shop with over 100 large production machines, having to pack then all up and move miles away. Some businesses could do it. Not many.

So here's the real crux of all this. As in 1000 other media reports I've seen on minimum wage increases, the most important aspect of this is NEVER MENTIONED. Not a word. That is the increase in DISPOSABLE INCOME resulting in INCREASES SALES$$$. All businesses get this, and generally it far outweighs labor increases, since the number of wage raised consumers (not just those at the minimum wage) by far outnumbers any one employer's workers who are getting wage increases.

Then there's also the fact that many business, while receiving this big SALES boost, do NOT have any wage loss at all. These are businesses who are mom & pop and have no employees, those whose workers are all working just on sales commission (car lots, furniture, real estate, insurance, etc), and third, those with skilled workers (ex. machine shops) whose workers all already get well over $15 hour, or whatever the MW would be raised to.

I think back to when I owned a business. I paid my commission salespeople $350/hour (in 2015 dollars), and they still were only receiving 15% of the sale. In all, I made fine profits and expanded the business. Biggest downer ? All the people who called in and said > "Sorry. I can't afford it." Of course they can't. Not one somebody out there is paying them a low minimum wage. To be successful in business, you have a lot fo things to do. But you can't do anything, if the public around you doesn't have money in their pockets to buy what you're trying to sell.

This is why Conservatives who support raising the MW nationwide, outnumber Conservatives who don't, 54% to 44%.

the most important aspect of this is NEVER MENTIONED. Not a word. That is the increase in DISPOSABLE INCOME resulting in INCREASES SALES$$$.

If I pay my employees another $500,000 a year, are my sales supposed to increase by $500,000?
Is that supposed to be an even trade?

I don't understand how you can be so dense. The economic benefits of raising the minimum wage would occur because the change would happen in the entire economy. Overall, a good portion of the economy would have more disposable income, so yeah, business in general would see an increase in demand.

And as prices rise as they must all those people making above the proposed MW will see their buying power decrease.

It ain't rocket science

Um no. The price increase would be pennies on the dollar.

Pennies add up to dollars Idiot.

The price of everything would rise

Everything from apples to zucchini would cost more

All your utilities will cost more

Everything you do for entertainment would cost more

Anyone with any common sense knows that

And you think a 7.50 an hour raise only costs the employer 7.50 don't you?

News flash it doesn't. Employers will have to pay higher payroll taxes, higher state and federal unemployment taxes, higher workman's comp premiums (taxes) etc

so like I said all those pennies add up to a lot of dollars

Lol you are so dumb. Pennies on the dollar would rise while millions of people would make an couple extra hundred dollars a month. And no, not every price would rise. Not even close. Tell me, if you think it's so catastrophic, why did we raise the min wage so many times in the past with no problem.

 

[dblack]

the most important aspect of this is NEVER MENTIONED. Not a word. That is the increase in DISPOSABLE INCOME resulting in INCREASES SALES$$$.

If I pay my employees another $500,000 a year, are my sales supposed to increase by $500,000?
Is that supposed to be an even trade?

I don't understand how you can be so dense. The economic benefits of raising the minimum wage would occur because the change would happen in the entire economy. Overall, a good portion of the economy would have more disposable income, so yeah, business in general would see an increase in demand.

And as prices rise as they must all those people making above the proposed MW will see their buying power decrease.

It ain't rocket science

Um no. The price increase would be pennies on the dollar.

Pennies add up to dollars Idiot.

The price of everything would rise

Everything from apples to zucchini would cost more

All your utilities will cost more

Everything you do for entertainment would cost more

Anyone with any common sense knows that

And you think a 7.50 an hour raise only costs the employer 7.50 don't you?

News flash it doesn't. Employers will have to pay higher payroll taxes, higher state and federal unemployment taxes, higher workman's comp premiums (taxes) etc

so like I said all those pennies add up to a lot of dollars

Lol you are so dumb. Pennies on the dollar would rise while millions of people would make an couple extra hundred dollars a month. And no, not every price would rise. Not even close. Tell me, if you think it's so catastrophic, why did we raise the min wage so many times in the past with no problem.

We never did. In real value the minimum wage has gone down.

 

[LOki]

the most important aspect of this is NEVER MENTIONED. Not a word. That is the increase in DISPOSABLE INCOME resulting in INCREASES SALES$$$.

If I pay my employees another $500,000 a year, are my sales supposed to increase by $500,000?
Is that supposed to be an even trade?

I don't understand how you can be so dense. The economic benefits of raising the minimum wage would occur because the change would happen in the entire economy. Overall, a good portion of the economy would have more disposable income, so yeah, business in general would see an increase in demand.

And as prices rise as they must all those people making above the proposed MW will see their buying power decrease.

It ain't rocket science

Um no. The price increase would be pennies on the dollar.

Pennies add up to dollars Idiot.

The price of everything would rise

Everything from apples to zucchini would cost more

All your utilities will cost more

Everything you do for entertainment would cost more

Anyone with any common sense knows that

And you think a 7.50 an hour raise only costs the employer 7.50 don't you?

News flash it doesn't. Employers will have to pay higher payroll taxes, higher state and federal unemployment taxes, higher workman's comp premiums (taxes) etc

so like I said all those pennies add up to a lot of dollars

Lol you are so dumb. Pennies on the dollar would rise while millions of people would make an couple extra hundred dollars a month. And no, not every price would rise. Not even close. Tell me, if you think it's so catastrophic, why did we raise the min wage so many times in the past with no problem.

Because statutory minimum wage ALWAYS fails to deliver.

Minimum wage laws cannot create jobs, they can ONLY outlaw them. Minimum wage laws demand that workers willing to accept wages less than the statutory minimum wage are barred from such contracts. It is compulsory unemployment. Statutory minimum wage ALWAYS contributes to unemployment.

There is no escape from the objective fact of economic reality that minimum wage laws devalue wages. You simply cannot avoid devaluing wages when you make $1/hr work cost the same as $15/hr work. It's just not possible.

Adding new dollars to the economy by increasing the minimum wage beyond what the work is worth is not the same thing as creating new wealth. Statutory minimum wage ALWAYS results in inflation. It necessarily must.

These realities are inescapable, and it is why minimum wage ponzi schemes ALWAYS fail.

If statutory minimum wage did not ALWAYS fail--if it did not always result in unemployment and inflation--minimum wage proponents would not ALWAYS be demanding that the statutory minimum wage be increased... yet again!

 

[Billy000]

I don't understand how you can be so dense. The economic benefits of raising the minimum wage would occur because the change would happen in the entire economy. Overall, a good portion of the economy would have more disposable income, so yeah, business in general would see an increase in demand.

And as prices rise as they must all those people making above the proposed MW will see their buying power decrease.

It ain't rocket science

Um no. The price increase would be pennies on the dollar.

Pennies add up to dollars Idiot.

The price of everything would rise

Everything from apples to zucchini would cost more

All your utilities will cost more

Everything you do for entertainment would cost more

Anyone with any common sense knows that

And you think a 7.50 an hour raise only costs the employer 7.50 don't you?

News flash it doesn't. Employers will have to pay higher payroll taxes, higher state and federal unemployment taxes, higher workman's comp premiums (taxes) etc

so like I said all those pennies add up to a lot of dollars

Lol you are so dumb. Pennies on the dollar would rise while millions of people would make an couple extra hundred dollars a month. And no, not every price would rise. Not even close. Tell me, if you think it's so catastrophic, why did we raise the min wage so many times in the past with no problem.

Because statutory minimum wage ALWAYS fails to deliver.

Minimum wage laws cannot create jobs, they can ONLY outlaw them. Minimum wage laws demand that workers willing to accept wages less than the statutory minimum wage are barred from such contracts. It is compulsory unemployment. Statutory minimum wage ALWAYS contributes to unemployment.

There is no escape from the objective fact of economic reality that minimum wage laws devalue wages. You simply cannot avoid devaluing wages when you make $1/hr work cost the same as $15/hr work. It's just not possible.

Adding new dollars to the economy by increasing the minimum wage beyond what the work is worth is not the same thing as creating new wealth. Statutory minimum wage ALWAYS results in inflation. It necessarily must.

These realities are inescapable, and it is why minimum wage ponzi schemes ALWAYS fail.

If statutory minimum wage did not ALWAYS fail--if it did not always result in unemployment and inflation--minimum wage proponents would not ALWAYS be demanding that the statutory minimum wage be increased... yet again!

Lol you conservative have this fantasy qualitative reasoning about wages that is so laughable. Ok so your premise is that $15/h work is undermined by a boost in $2 in wages. I'm sorry, but how exactly do you define worth in this context? What are the defining characteristics exactly? Why are you so convinced that the job is worth that much? Don't you think it's possible that the employer keeps the wages low for the sake of, you know, more profit? They make more money paying people less you know that right? With this logic, it's kind of ridiculous to assume an employer pays wages based on an objective metric of worth. That's just retarded.

Here is food for thought. I know you cons struggle with with thought so chew slow. In this country, productivity has grown 100% since the 30's yet wages have remained flat. Don't you think productivity should be taken into account when it comes to deciding wages? Corporations haven't. Here is more food for thought: the last time someone could comfortably live off 10/h was the 1960's. Don't you think inflation should be taken into account for deciding wages? Corporations don't.

 

[Wyatt earp]

And as prices rise as they must all those people making above the proposed MW will see their buying power decrease.

It ain't rocket science

Um no. The price increase would be pennies on the dollar.

Pennies add up to dollars Idiot.

The price of everything would rise

Everything from apples to zucchini would cost more

All your utilities will cost more

Everything you do for entertainment would cost more

Anyone with any common sense knows that

And you think a 7.50 an hour raise only costs the employer 7.50 don't you?

News flash it doesn't. Employers will have to pay higher payroll taxes, higher state and federal unemployment taxes, higher workman's comp premiums (taxes) etc

so like I said all those pennies add up to a lot of dollars

Lol you are so dumb. Pennies on the dollar would rise while millions of people would make an couple extra hundred dollars a month. And no, not every price would rise. Not even close. Tell me, if you think it's so catastrophic, why did we raise the min wage so many times in the past with no problem.

Because statutory minimum wage ALWAYS fails to deliver.

Minimum wage laws cannot create jobs, they can ONLY outlaw them. Minimum wage laws demand that workers willing to accept wages less than the statutory minimum wage are barred from such contracts. It is compulsory unemployment. Statutory minimum wage ALWAYS contributes to unemployment.

There is no escape from the objective fact of economic reality that minimum wage laws devalue wages. You simply cannot avoid devaluing wages when you make $1/hr work cost the same as $15/hr work. It's just not possible.

Adding new dollars to the economy by increasing the minimum wage beyond what the work is worth is not the same thing as creating new wealth. Statutory minimum wage ALWAYS results in inflation. It necessarily must.

These realities are inescapable, and it is why minimum wage ponzi schemes ALWAYS fail.

If statutory minimum wage did not ALWAYS fail--if it did not always result in unemployment and inflation--minimum wage proponents would not ALWAYS be demanding that the statutory minimum wage be increased... yet again!

Lol you conservative have this fantasy qualitative reasoning about wages that is so laughable. Ok so your premise is that $15/h work is undermined by a boost in $2 in wages. I'm sorry, but how exactly do you define worth in this context? What are the defining characteristics exactly? Why are you so convinced that the job is worth that much? Don't you think it's possible that the employer keeps the wages low for the sake of, you know, more profit? They make more money paying people less you know that right? With this logic, it's kind of ridiculous to assume an employer pays wages based on an objective metric of worth. That's just retarded.

Here is food for thought. I know you cons struggle with with thought so chew slow. In this country, productivity has grown 100% since the 30's yet wages have remained flat. Don't you think productivity should be taken into account when it comes to deciding wages? Corporations haven't. Here is more food for thought: the last time someone could comfortably live off 10/h was the 1960's. Don't you think inflation should be taken into account for deciding wages? Corporations don't.

live comfortably off $10 bucks an hour? They do in South Carolina it is like the equivalent to making $50 bucks an hour in New York City

 

[Billy000]

Um no. The price increase would be pennies on the dollar.

Pennies add up to dollars Idiot.

The price of everything would rise

Everything from apples to zucchini would cost more

All your utilities will cost more

Everything you do for entertainment would cost more

Anyone with any common sense knows that

And you think a 7.50 an hour raise only costs the employer 7.50 don't you?

News flash it doesn't. Employers will have to pay higher payroll taxes, higher state and federal unemployment taxes, higher workman's comp premiums (taxes) etc

so like I said all those pennies add up to a lot of dollars

Lol you are so dumb. Pennies on the dollar would rise while millions of people would make an couple extra hundred dollars a month. And no, not every price would rise. Not even close. Tell me, if you think it's so catastrophic, why did we raise the min wage so many times in the past with no problem.

Because statutory minimum wage ALWAYS fails to deliver.

Minimum wage laws cannot create jobs, they can ONLY outlaw them. Minimum wage laws demand that workers willing to accept wages less than the statutory minimum wage are barred from such contracts. It is compulsory unemployment. Statutory minimum wage ALWAYS contributes to unemployment.

There is no escape from the objective fact of economic reality that minimum wage laws devalue wages. You simply cannot avoid devaluing wages when you make $1/hr work cost the same as $15/hr work. It's just not possible.

Adding new dollars to the economy by increasing the minimum wage beyond what the work is worth is not the same thing as creating new wealth. Statutory minimum wage ALWAYS results in inflation. It necessarily must.

These realities are inescapable, and it is why minimum wage ponzi schemes ALWAYS fail.

If statutory minimum wage did not ALWAYS fail--if it did not always result in unemployment and inflation--minimum wage proponents would not ALWAYS be demanding that the statutory minimum wage be increased... yet again!

Lol you conservative have this fantasy qualitative reasoning about wages that is so laughable. Ok so your premise is that $15/h work is undermined by a boost in $2 in wages. I'm sorry, but how exactly do you define worth in this context? What are the defining characteristics exactly? Why are you so convinced that the job is worth that much? Don't you think it's possible that the employer keeps the wages low for the sake of, you know, more profit? They make more money paying people less you know that right? With this logic, it's kind of ridiculous to assume an employer pays wages based on an objective metric of worth. That's just retarded.

Here is food for thought. I know you cons struggle with with thought so chew slow. In this country, productivity has grown 100% since the 30's yet wages have remained flat. Don't you think productivity should be taken into account when it comes to deciding wages? Corporations haven't. Here is more food for thought: the last time someone could comfortably live off 10/h was the 1960's. Don't you think inflation should be taken into account for deciding wages? Corporations don't.

live comfortably off $10 bucks an hour? They do in South Carolina it is like the equivalent to making $50 bucks an hour in New York City

I seriously doubt that is true.

 

[Wyatt earp]

Pennies add up to dollars Idiot.

The price of everything would rise

Everything from apples to zucchini would cost more

All your utilities will cost more

Everything you do for entertainment would cost more

Anyone with any common sense knows that

And you think a 7.50 an hour raise only costs the employer 7.50 don't you?

News flash it doesn't. Employers will have to pay higher payroll taxes, higher state and federal unemployment taxes, higher workman's comp premiums (taxes) etc

so like I said all those pennies add up to a lot of dollars

Lol you are so dumb. Pennies on the dollar would rise while millions of people would make an couple extra hundred dollars a month. And no, not every price would rise. Not even close. Tell me, if you think it's so catastrophic, why did we raise the min wage so many times in the past with no problem.

Because statutory minimum wage ALWAYS fails to deliver.

Minimum wage laws cannot create jobs, they can ONLY outlaw them. Minimum wage laws demand that workers willing to accept wages less than the statutory minimum wage are barred from such contracts. It is compulsory unemployment. Statutory minimum wage ALWAYS contributes to unemployment.

There is no escape from the objective fact of economic reality that minimum wage laws devalue wages. You simply cannot avoid devaluing wages when you make $1/hr work cost the same as $15/hr work. It's just not possible.

Adding new dollars to the economy by increasing the minimum wage beyond what the work is worth is not the same thing as creating new wealth. Statutory minimum wage ALWAYS results in inflation. It necessarily must.

These realities are inescapable, and it is why minimum wage ponzi schemes ALWAYS fail.

If statutory minimum wage did not ALWAYS fail--if it did not always result in unemployment and inflation--minimum wage proponents would not ALWAYS be demanding that the statutory minimum wage be increased... yet again!

Lol you conservative have this fantasy qualitative reasoning about wages that is so laughable. Ok so your premise is that $15/h work is undermined by a boost in $2 in wages. I'm sorry, but how exactly do you define worth in this context? What are the defining characteristics exactly? Why are you so convinced that the job is worth that much? Don't you think it's possible that the employer keeps the wages low for the sake of, you know, more profit? They make more money paying people less you know that right? With this logic, it's kind of ridiculous to assume an employer pays wages based on an objective metric of worth. That's just retarded.

Here is food for thought. I know you cons struggle with with thought so chew slow. In this country, productivity has grown 100% since the 30's yet wages have remained flat. Don't you think productivity should be taken into account when it comes to deciding wages? Corporations haven't. Here is more food for thought: the last time someone could comfortably live off 10/h was the 1960's. Don't you think inflation should be taken into account for deciding wages? Corporations don't.

live comfortably off $10 bucks an hour? They do in South Carolina it is like the equivalent to making $50 bucks an hour in New York City

I seriously doubt that is true.

well considering I only pay $1.19 for a pack of smokes......

How much does it cost to rent a 3 bedroom house on 5 acres of land again in New York city?

$500 bucks down here...

Edit. Was just on CL New york

Damn prices are high, didn't know they were that high, $5,000 a month for a rinky dink 3 bedroom apartment? Lmao boy did you guys get screwed over by taxes and Unions

 

[Care4all]

Fact is, since the Minimum Wage has existed, more Millionaires & Billionaires have been created in this country than ever before in history. Businesses have not only survived, they've thrived. So there is no evidence whatsoever that the Minimum Wage causes any perceptible negative impact on the Economy. All the gloom & doom 'Sky is Falling' predictions really are B.S. They've always been proven to be B.S. And this time will be no different.

The Wage will go up, and Businesses will be fine. In my own personal opinion, i think the Minimum Wage should be somewhere between $10-$12. $15 may be a bit much. I think $10-$12 is a survivable wage. But even at that, it will still be a struggle. So don't count on Minimum Wage for your survival. Get educated and skilled. That's the best way to go.

Before you produce data to support your obviously wrong assertions, make sure it is corrected for the effects of counter-inflation and counter-unemployment policies in place at the same time. Good luck.

Minimum wage laws cannot create jobs, they can ONLY outlaw them. Minimum wage laws demand that workers willing to accept wages less than the minimum wage are barred from such contracts. It is compulsory unemployment. Statutory minimum wage ALWAYS contributes to unemployment.

There is no escape from the objective fact of economic reality that minimum wage laws devalue wages. You simply cannot avoid devaluing wages when you make $1/hr work cost the same as $15/hr work. It's just not possible.

Adding new dollars to the economy by increasing the minimum wage beyond what the work is worth is not the same thing as creating new wealth. Minimum wage laws ALWAYS result in inflation. They necessarily must.

These realities are inescapable, and it is why minimum wage ponzi schemes ALWAYS fail.

If they were not always failures--if they did not always result in unemployment and inflation--minimum wage proponents would not always be demanding that the minimum wage be increased... yet again!

Rather have em working and being productive Citizens, than permanently mooching Entitlements. They'll pay some taxes and put some money back into the economy. You may have to pay em a little more, but it'll be worth it in the end.

Nonsense. It hasn't been worth it yet... not only has the cost of entitlements grown, so also has the cost of minimum wage.

If statutory minimum wage did not always fail--if it did not always result in unemployment and inflation--minimum wage proponents would not always be demanding that the statutory minimum wage be increased... yet again!

And like i said, Minimum Wage has never caused any perceptible negative impact on the economy.

Obvious nonsense.

We have more Millionaires & Billionaires in this country than ever before in our history.

Paying Minimum Wage has very little, to no impact. It is what it is.

Fine. It's well established that you refuse to accept the necessarily destructive economic realities appurtenant to statutory minimum wage.

So tell us, what exactly is your objection to simply basing a worker's wages upon the what that worker's work is worth?

We will never agree on this because you're wrong in presuming the employer will always pay the employee what his work is worth...

You are also wrong because if the employer does not pay the employee what his work is worth, (yes, a bare minimum living wage for full time work) then we, the tax payers will subsidize the business's profits by giving his employee the difference out of our tax dollars, yours and mine.

 

[Wyatt earp]

the most important aspect of this is NEVER MENTIONED. Not a word. That is the increase in DISPOSABLE INCOME resulting in INCREASES SALES$$$.

If I pay my employees another $500,000 a year, are my sales supposed to increase by $500,000?
Is that supposed to be an even trade?

I don't understand how you can be so dense. The economic benefits of raising the minimum wage would occur because the change would happen in the entire economy. Overall, a good portion of the economy would have more disposable income, so yeah, business in general would see an increase in demand.

And as prices rise as they must all those people making above the proposed MW will see their buying power decrease.

It ain't rocket science

Um no. The price increase would be pennies on the dollar.

Pennies add up to dollars Idiot.

The price of everything would rise

Everything from apples to zucchini would cost more

All your utilities will cost more

Everything you do for entertainment would cost more

Anyone with any common sense knows that

And you think a 7.50 an hour raise only costs the employer 7.50 don't you?

News flash it doesn't. Employers will have to pay higher payroll taxes, higher state and federal unemployment taxes, higher workman's comp premiums (taxes) etc

so like I said all those pennies add up to a lot of dollars

Lol you are so dumb. Pennies on the dollar would rise while millions of people would make an couple extra hundred dollars a month. And no, not every price would rise. Not even close. Tell me, if you think it's so catastrophic, why did we raise the min wage so many times in the past with no problem.

pennies on the dollar? Like this resteraunt in Seattle?

Seattle Restaurant Data Demolishes Conservative Argument Against 15 Minimum Wage ThinkProgress

So far, at least one local restaurant has decided to handle the increase by raising wages to $15 an hour immediately – years ahead of when the law would require it – and do away with tips while raising menu prices significantly

 

[Mac1958]

If a Macdonald's has, say, 6 people on a shift, they need 6 people on a shift. THEY figured that out. If they claim that a raise in the minimum wage will force them to go to 5 people on a shift,

well, why aren't they at 5 people now? Why are they carrying the 6th employee that supposedly they can do without?

HA HA. I've been asking that question for 50 years. I haven't gotten a good answer yet.

I'll be happy to end your 50 years of wondering. The answer is in the question.

If they determine they need 6 people on a shift, that determination is based on providing a certain assumed quality level of service. They know that if they had just one person on the shift, for example, customers would have to wait a long time and they would ultimately lose customers. So, they employ the smallest possible number of staff for the level of speed and service they want to provide. What will ultimately happen, once all hard costs have been minimized to deal with the increase in wages, is business owners will have to consider decreasing service quality by decreasing hours and/or staff size. There will be other considerations as well, such as increasing prices and looking at automation.

All of the above is just a small part of the thought and planning process of running a business. Those who have actually started and run a business know this.

I'm not arguing against an increase in the minimum wage. Quite frankly, I don't really care. I'm just answering your question. Unfortunately though, this whole conversation is being polluted by people who simply don't know what they're talking about.

.