Make College Free! (For Americans)

[hellraiser]

If college were free here like it is in some other countries, I would have probably went. Instead, I looked at the possibility of affording a college education about the same as the possibility that I might ever fly to the moon. Most people believe that a college education is good for society in general. If that is the case, wouldn't it be best to improve society in general? Also, as things are, those who aren't wealthy have to go into a deep onerous debt to get a college education. But having a college education is no guarantee of finding a job. After all, from what I hear, China is awash with hordes of unemployed engineers. So anybody going into debt to get a college education here would be taking quite a risk. People here shouldn't have to take such a risk. Especially when the outcome could very likely be inproving society in general.

If college is "free," then retards will go to college and the leftists will demand standards be lowered because it isn't fair that that the dumb people don't succeed. Soon college will be utterly worthless.

BTW, very few in Europe are allowed to attend college, free or not.

If you go to college, you should expect to adhere to a certain academic level. If you don't do so, you go. End of story. There would be no lowering of standards. Also, in terms of the yearly value of exports, Germany kicks our country's ass all to hell. I doubt if they do so by not allowing people to go to college. Another thing is that I think it was in the documentary "Sicko" that I found out that people in France don't have to pay for college. There was no mention of anybody not being allowed to go to college. I would be shocked of any country disallowed anybody to go to college who wanted to.

The French system has some MAJOR drawbacks. First of all, students start making career decisions on education at about age 15 and it's not completely up to the individual. Their principal has the final say in which area they will study. There there are a battery of exams that must be passed and you can't change courses without a lot of obstacles and problems. So you see, your FREEDOMS are limited in the French system.

Additionally, the French have a "higher echelon" of education similar to our Ivy League. (grandes écoles) These are extremely difficult to get into and not entirely free. Acceptance rates are under 10% and virtually no one who isn't wealthy can go.. but here is the kicker... 84% of the top executive jobs in France are held by these graduates-- contrast with about 10% of the exec jobs in the US by Ivy League grads. So your chances of success in France are limited unless you get into the higher echelon academies.

And this is almost always the case with liberal Utopian pie-in-the-sky genuflection toward "other countries" ...you fail to realize they don't have the FREEDOM we have in America. Their choices are limited and restricted in every possible way. So it all boils down to whether you want an authoritarian central government dictating your life, what you will be, where you will go, what you will do... OR... do you want FREEDOM to make those decisions on your own?

"Freedom" is a word that is used to quell the gullible. I am reminded of a lyric from a Kansas song. "Your freedoms a joke. You don't know the difference as you put on the yoke." Next, why in the hell would there need to be the most intelligent in some executive position. Their talents would be put to better use in scientific reaserch or some such thing. As to what I want, if only this forum would allow me to tell you. But my "freedom" to do so here is just as limited as any of our other "freedoms" that you may care to mention.

Exactly how is your freedom to tell what you want being limited? Anything short of bestiality, and advocating murder is pretty much open to discussion.

So you think. But you are WRONG! WRONG WRONG WRONG WRONG!

 

[BuckToothMoron]

If college were free here like it is in some other countries, I would have probably went. Instead, I looked at the possibility of affording a college education about the same as the possibility that I might ever fly to the moon. Most people believe that a college education is good for society in general. If that is the case, wouldn't it be best to improve society in general? Also, as things are, those who aren't wealthy have to go into a deep onerous debt to get a college education. But having a college education is no guarantee of finding a job. After all, from what I hear, China is awash with hordes of unemployed engineers. So anybody going into debt to get a college education here would be taking quite a risk. People here shouldn't have to take such a risk. Especially when the outcome could very likely be inproving society in general.

There is no country in the world where college is free. Buildings, professors, infrastructure have a cost, and the cost will be paid. Shouldn't you at least acknowledge that?

I think what you want is for some government at some level to pay for it, instead of the person receiving the college education. Is there any truth to the saying- people value more what they pay for over that which is free?

A 4 year degree at a typical university can easily exceed $50k or much more. A person truly motivated, but without parents who will pay for their college can find a much cheaper way to the degree, Online classes, community college, work study, etc.

If someone else pays for your education shouldn't they have a say on what you study? If you want to get a degree in Women's Study that will cost $50k, shouldn't you have a plan to pay it back? And if the degree does not provide a reasonable path to enable you to repay the cost, is the degree worth the investment?

There is no right given to citizens in the USA which guarantees a college degree? You don't sound like you were at all motivated to get a degree, but rather would go to college if someone offered to pay. I pay for my kids college. It will cost me over $175k to graduate both of them. They were motivated to go, and my wife and I were very specific on the type of degree we would buy them.

It appears to me we have inflated the cost of a degree by the government loaning money to any 18 year old kid willing to borrow thousands of dollars to attend college. University can charge more because more people want to buy it, many with somebody else's money.

My engineering degree cost less than $17k thirty years ago. My starting salary upon graduating was $21,500 in 1985. The government should not invest tax payer dollars into degrees that don't merit the cost.

 

[BULLDOG]

If college is "free," then retards will go to college and the leftists will demand standards be lowered because it isn't fair that that the dumb people don't succeed. Soon college will be utterly worthless.

BTW, very few in Europe are allowed to attend college, free or not.

If you go to college, you should expect to adhere to a certain academic level. If you don't do so, you go. End of story. There would be no lowering of standards. Also, in terms of the yearly value of exports, Germany kicks our country's ass all to hell. I doubt if they do so by not allowing people to go to college. Another thing is that I think it was in the documentary "Sicko" that I found out that people in France don't have to pay for college. There was no mention of anybody not being allowed to go to college. I would be shocked of any country disallowed anybody to go to college who wanted to.

The French system has some MAJOR drawbacks. First of all, students start making career decisions on education at about age 15 and it's not completely up to the individual. Their principal has the final say in which area they will study. There there are a battery of exams that must be passed and you can't change courses without a lot of obstacles and problems. So you see, your FREEDOMS are limited in the French system.

Additionally, the French have a "higher echelon" of education similar to our Ivy League. (grandes écoles) These are extremely difficult to get into and not entirely free. Acceptance rates are under 10% and virtually no one who isn't wealthy can go.. but here is the kicker... 84% of the top executive jobs in France are held by these graduates-- contrast with about 10% of the exec jobs in the US by Ivy League grads. So your chances of success in France are limited unless you get into the higher echelon academies.

And this is almost always the case with liberal Utopian pie-in-the-sky genuflection toward "other countries" ...you fail to realize they don't have the FREEDOM we have in America. Their choices are limited and restricted in every possible way. So it all boils down to whether you want an authoritarian central government dictating your life, what you will be, where you will go, what you will do... OR... do you want FREEDOM to make those decisions on your own?

"Freedom" is a word that is used to quell the gullible. I am reminded of a lyric from a Kansas song. "Your freedoms a joke. You don't know the difference as you put on the yoke." Next, why in the hell would there need to be the most intelligent in some executive position. Their talents would be put to better use in scientific reaserch or some such thing. As to what I want, if only this forum would allow me to tell you. But my "freedom" to do so here is just as limited as any of our other "freedoms" that you may care to mention.

Exactly how is your freedom to tell what you want being limited? Anything short of bestiality, and advocating murder is pretty much open to discussion.

So you think. But you are WRONG! WRONG WRONG WRONG WRONG!

So what is it you are being prevented from saying? We don't even get a hint?

 

[hellraiser]

A whole lot of us got our education this way:

View attachment 72066

Oh. I see. Just because you were a sucker, you think that everybody else should be suckers too.

No. I say if one really wants a college education he/she can certainly obtain one without sitting on his ass and waiting on someone else to give him one. I wasn't a sucker either. I was drafted into military service. Military service is an honorable thing in spite of your own opinion of it.

You condemn yourself out of your own mouth. If you think that fighting for a country that would draft you doesn't make you a sucker, you ARE a sucker. Also, I have a more realistic opinion of what it was like to be sitting on a curb with my possessions sitting on the curb next to me. Because I experienced it. There is not a goddamn thing that is honorable for fighting for a country that lets things like that happen. Here's a message to you from reality land. "Poor people aren't the problem. Lack of work is."

 

[hellraiser]

[

The government picks up the tab. Just as they do with health care. And there is a limit as to what administrators and college professors are paid. Part of their compensation comes from living in a more fair sociery. Aparently there, politicians think their job is to look after the people. What politicians do here mostly is shaking babies and kissing hands.

So the working people of France pay for it.

Hence college isn't "free." You simply want to leach off of others. You're greedy and want things without having to pay for them.

A Bernie supporter, IOW.


Requirements to go to University in Germany;

- high school diploma (GPA > 3.0)

- AP Calculus AB or BC

- AP Biology or AP Chemistry or two half AP Physics C

- one of AP French / Spanish / Latin / German / English Literature / English Language and Composition

- one other AP

Hochschulkompass.de: Studying in Germany - Prerequisites for studying - Citizenship

About 11% of Germans are accepted.

I'm not talking about who DOES pay for it. I'm talking about who DOESN'T pay for it. The students. Also, look at the free health care they have in those countries. Nobody becomes homeless because they can't afford medical treatment. But a LOT of people in the U.S. do. Also, one time across the street from where I live, some tea bagger fuckfaces were holding a demonstration against free health care. At the end of the line and sitting on the back bumper of an open SUV, there were a couple of people who had a sign that supported free health care.

Not being afraid of any stench, I went to talk to them. They used to work for the insurance industry. Their job used to be to dig up reasons for insurance companies to deny coverage to those who had insurance. Health care, college education, it's all pretty much the same thing.

There is also no such thing as free health care, dope.

Please quit replying to me. You are too stupid.

 

[Unkotare]

[

The government picks up the tab. Just as they do with health care. And there is a limit as to what administrators and college professors are paid. Part of their compensation comes from living in a more fair sociery. Aparently there, politicians think their job is to look after the people. What politicians do here mostly is shaking babies and kissing hands.

So the working people of France pay for it.

Hence college isn't "free." You simply want to leach off of others. You're greedy and want things without having to pay for them.

A Bernie supporter, IOW.


Requirements to go to University in Germany;

- high school diploma (GPA > 3.0)

- AP Calculus AB or BC

- AP Biology or AP Chemistry or two half AP Physics C

- one of AP French / Spanish / Latin / German / English Literature / English Language and Composition

- one other AP

Hochschulkompass.de: Studying in Germany - Prerequisites for studying - Citizenship

About 11% of Germans are accepted.

I'm not talking about who DOES pay for it. I'm talking about who DOESN'T pay for it. The students. Also, look at the free health care they have in those countries. Nobody becomes homeless because they can't afford medical treatment. But a LOT of people in the U.S. do. Also, one time across the street from where I live, some tea bagger fuckfaces were holding a demonstration against free health care. At the end of the line and sitting on the back bumper of an open SUV, there were a couple of people who had a sign that supported free health care.

Not being afraid of any stench, I went to talk to them. They used to work for the insurance industry. Their job used to be to dig up reasons for insurance companies to deny coverage to those who had insurance. Health care, college education, it's all pretty much the same thing.

There is also no such thing as free health care, dope.

Please quit replying to me. You are too stupid.

Given your posts on this thread, this is really not the place for you to be saying that to anyone else, dope.

 

[Unkotare]

A whole lot of us got our education this way:

View attachment 72066

Oh. I see. Just because you were a sucker, you think that everybody else should be suckers too.

No. I say if one really wants a college education he/she can certainly obtain one without sitting on his ass and waiting on someone else to give him one. I wasn't a sucker either. I was drafted into military service. Military service is an honorable thing in spite of your own opinion of it.

You condemn yourself out of your own mouth. If you think that fighting for a country that would draft you doesn't make you a sucker, you ARE a sucker. Also, I have a more realistic opinion of what it was like to be sitting on a curb with my possessions sitting on the curb next to me. Because I experienced it. There is not a goddamn thing that is honorable for fighting for a country that lets things like that happen. Here's a message to you from reality land. "Poor people aren't the problem. Lack of work is."

You don't deserve to live in the US. GTFO, dope.

 

[Unkotare]

If college is "free," then retards will go to college and the leftists will demand standards be lowered because it isn't fair that that the dumb people don't succeed. Soon college will be utterly worthless.

BTW, very few in Europe are allowed to attend college, free or not.

If you go to college, you should expect to adhere to a certain academic level. If you don't do so, you go. End of story. There would be no lowering of standards. Also, in terms of the yearly value of exports, Germany kicks our country's ass all to hell. I doubt if they do so by not allowing people to go to college. Another thing is that I think it was in the documentary "Sicko" that I found out that people in France don't have to pay for college. There was no mention of anybody not being allowed to go to college. I would be shocked of any country disallowed anybody to go to college who wanted to.

The French system has some MAJOR drawbacks. First of all, students start making career decisions on education at about age 15 and it's not completely up to the individual. Their principal has the final say in which area they will study. There there are a battery of exams that must be passed and you can't change courses without a lot of obstacles and problems. So you see, your FREEDOMS are limited in the French system.

Additionally, the French have a "higher echelon" of education similar to our Ivy League. (grandes écoles) These are extremely difficult to get into and not entirely free. Acceptance rates are under 10% and virtually no one who isn't wealthy can go.. but here is the kicker... 84% of the top executive jobs in France are held by these graduates-- contrast with about 10% of the exec jobs in the US by Ivy League grads. So your chances of success in France are limited unless you get into the higher echelon academies.

And this is almost always the case with liberal Utopian pie-in-the-sky genuflection toward "other countries" ...you fail to realize they don't have the FREEDOM we have in America. Their choices are limited and restricted in every possible way. So it all boils down to whether you want an authoritarian central government dictating your life, what you will be, where you will go, what you will do... OR... do you want FREEDOM to make those decisions on your own?

"Freedom" is a word that is used to quell the gullible. I am reminded of a lyric from a Kansas song. "Your freedoms a joke. You don't know the difference as you put on the yoke." Next, why in the hell would there need to be the most intelligent in some executive position. Their talents would be put to better use in scientific reaserch or some such thing. As to what I want, if only this forum would allow me to tell you. But my "freedom" to do so here is just as limited as any of our other "freedoms" that you may care to mention.

Exactly how is your freedom to tell what you want being limited? Anything short of bestiality, and advocating murder is pretty much open to discussion.

So you think. But you are WRONG! WRONG WRONG WRONG WRONG!

Take your meds. MEDS! MEDS! MEDS! MEDS!

 

[hellraiser]

If college were free here like it is in some other countries, I would have probably went. Instead, I looked at the possibility of affording a college education about the same as the possibility that I might ever fly to the moon. Most people believe that a college education is good for society in general. If that is the case, wouldn't it be best to improve society in general? Also, as things are, those who aren't wealthy have to go into a deep onerous debt to get a college education. But having a college education is no guarantee of finding a job. After all, from what I hear, China is awash with hordes of unemployed engineers. So anybody going into debt to get a college education here would be taking quite a risk. People here shouldn't have to take such a risk. Especially when the outcome could very likely be inproving society in general.

There is no country in the world where college is free. Buildings, professors, infrastructure have a cost, and the cost will be paid. Shouldn't you at least acknowledge that?

I think what you want is for some government at some level to pay for it, instead of the person receiving the college education. Is there any truth to the saying- people value more what they pay for over that which is free?

A 4 year degree at a typical university can easily exceed $50k or much more. A person truly motivated, but without parents who will pay for their college can find a much cheaper way to the degree, Online classes, community college, work study, etc.

If someone else pays for your education shouldn't they have a say on what you study? If you want to get a degree in Women's Study that will cost $50k, shouldn't you have a plan to pay it back? And if the degree does not provide a reasonable path to enable you to repay the cost, is the degree worth the investment?

There is no right given to citizens in the USA which guarantees a college degree? You don't sound like you were at all motivated to get a degree, but rather would go to college if someone offered to pay. I pay for my kids college. It will cost me over $175k to graduate both of them. They were motivated to go, and my wife and I were very specific on the type of degree we would buy them.

It appears to me we have inflated the cost of a degree by the government loaning money to any 18 year old kid willing to borrow thousands of dollars to attend college. University can charge more because more people want to buy it, many with somebody else's money.

My engineering degree cost less than $17k thirty years ago. My starting salary upon graduating was $21,500 in 1985. The government should not invest tax payer dollars into degrees that don't merit the cost.

What I am saying is that students don't have to pay. What part of that don't you understand. Next, there is something more important at stake than your opinion as to how important sombebody valuing something should be. Which in this case is the difference between having a college education and not having one. After that, you flutter off into dreamland. First, online classes are a joke. Next, survival IS a JOB! If anybody told me that I had to work to survive and at the same time work to get an education, I would tell them to fuck off and die.

Next, as long as what you are trying to get a degree in is of a benifit to society in general, why in the hell would anybody care what you study. After all, how many parents who pay for their childrens education tell them what field they have to go into. Apparently you care. But you don't represent all parents. Next, those who formed the constitution weren't gods. And things can change. If you have the sense that having educated people is a benefit to society in general, then getting a college education if you want one should be a new right.

Next, that is one of the problems with our capitalist society in general. People will tend to take all they can get even if it means screwing other people over to get it. In countries where they have free college education, what teachers and the like are paid is regulated. Some people are just more competient than others and deserve to get a little more. But this is just a tradeoff that you have to accept if you want to maintain a stable, sustainable system. Next, it would appear that your degree merited the cost.

 

[the_human_being]

A whole lot of us got our education this way:

View attachment 72066

Oh. I see. Just because you were a sucker, you think that everybody else should be suckers too.

No. I say if one really wants a college education he/she can certainly obtain one without sitting on his ass and waiting on someone else to give him one. I wasn't a sucker either. I was drafted into military service. Military service is an honorable thing in spite of your own opinion of it.

You condemn yourself out of your own mouth. If you think that fighting for a country that would draft you doesn't make you a sucker, you ARE a sucker. Also, I have a more realistic opinion of what it was like to be sitting on a curb with my possessions sitting on the curb next to me. Because I experienced it. There is not a goddamn thing that is honorable for fighting for a country that lets things like that happen. Here's a message to you from reality land. "Poor people aren't the problem. Lack of work is."

And lazy ass "victims" who sit on their asses and piss and moan woe is me" and expect someone else to pay their way from the cradle to the grave and proclaim they are too smart to serve is what is really pathetically wrong with you entitlement babies.

 

[the_human_being]

If college were free here like it is in some other countries, I would have probably went. Instead, I looked at the possibility of affording a college education about the same as the possibility that I might ever fly to the moon. Most people believe that a college education is good for society in general. If that is the case, wouldn't it be best to improve society in general? Also, as things are, those who aren't wealthy have to go into a deep onerous debt to get a college education. But having a college education is no guarantee of finding a job. After all, from what I hear, China is awash with hordes of unemployed engineers. So anybody going into debt to get a college education here would be taking quite a risk. People here shouldn't have to take such a risk. Especially when the outcome could very likely be inproving society in general.

There is no country in the world where college is free. Buildings, professors, infrastructure have a cost, and the cost will be paid. Shouldn't you at least acknowledge that?

I think what you want is for some government at some level to pay for it, instead of the person receiving the college education. Is there any truth to the saying- people value more what they pay for over that which is free?

A 4 year degree at a typical university can easily exceed $50k or much more. A person truly motivated, but without parents who will pay for their college can find a much cheaper way to the degree, Online classes, community college, work study, etc.

If someone else pays for your education shouldn't they have a say on what you study? If you want to get a degree in Women's Study that will cost $50k, shouldn't you have a plan to pay it back? And if the degree does not provide a reasonable path to enable you to repay the cost, is the degree worth the investment?

There is no right given to citizens in the USA which guarantees a college degree? You don't sound like you were at all motivated to get a degree, but rather would go to college if someone offered to pay. I pay for my kids college. It will cost me over $175k to graduate both of them. They were motivated to go, and my wife and I were very specific on the type of degree we would buy them.

It appears to me we have inflated the cost of a degree by the government loaning money to any 18 year old kid willing to borrow thousands of dollars to attend college. University can charge more because more people want to buy it, many with somebody else's money.

My engineering degree cost less than $17k thirty years ago. My starting salary upon graduating was $21,500 in 1985. The government should not invest tax payer dollars into degrees that don't merit the cost.

What I am saying is that students don't have to pay. What part of that don't you understand. Next, there is something more important at stake than your opinion as to how important sombebody valuing something should be. Which in this case is the difference between having a college education and not having one. After that, you flutter off into dreamland. First, online classes are a joke. Next, survival IS a JOB! If anybody told me that I had to work to survive and at the same time work to get an education, I would tell them to fuck off and die.

Next, as long as what you are trying to get a degree in is of a benifit to society in general, why in the hell would anybody care what you study. After all, how many parents who pay for their childrens education tell them what field they have to go into. Apparently you care. But you don't represent all parents. Next, those who formed the constitution weren't gods. And things can change. If you have the sense that having educated people is a benefit to society in general, then getting a college education if you want one should be a new right.

Next, that is one of the problems with our capitalist society in general. People will tend to take all they can get even if it means screwing other people over to get it. In countries where they have free college education, what teachers and the like are paid is regulated. Some people are just more competient than others and deserve to get a little more. But this is just a tradeoff that you have to accept if you want to maintain a stable, sustainable system. Next, it would appear that your degree merited the cost.

In spite of your pissing and moaning, the truth is no one is responsible for you. Get over it and get off your lazy ass and take care of yourself.

 

[Unkotare]

The OP is a slack-ass little idiot.

 

[Boss]

"Freedom" is a word that is used to quell the gullible. I am reminded of a lyric from a Kansas song. "Your freedoms a joke. You don't know the difference as you put on the yoke." Next, why in the hell would there need to be the most intelligent in some executive position. Their talents would be put to better use in scientific reaserch or some such thing. As to what I want, if only this forum would allow me to tell you. But my "freedom" to do so here is just as limited as any of our other "freedoms" that you may care to mention.

So we've identified the problem here... you don't believe in freedom.

Don't ask me why 84% of the executive jobs in France go to the educated elite... they just do. And you reveal exactly what kind of world you envision with the line about "scientific research." You want a government in charge of people so they can pick winners and losers. Unfortunately, under such a system, you would be the perennial loser because you're really incredibly dumb.

 

[Boss]

You are so full of shit your eyes are brown. I see that I am talking to the medical version of a human caused global warming denier. Where is flacern. He should be getting in on some of this horseshit. Have you ever SEEN the documentary "Sicko?" In it they went with a rid along with a DOCTOR who was making house calls. The V.A. doesn't do that. Also, in that documentary they SHOWED people who became homeless because they couldn't afford their medical bills.

Next, I can't say how long people in Canada have to wait for an MRI or kidney transplant. But considering some of your other lies, I would be willing to bet that it isn't as dire as you make out. Next, if you can pay to get anything done in a timely manner here in the U.S. It could still be done in a timely manner. No matter where the paycheck comes from. You can't dismiss "timliness" down to greed. It could make a little difference, but not a major one. Also, if college was for free, there would be more qualified people around to do whatever.

Next, bureaucrat who works for the government is ultimately answerable to the voters. Because they are part of the government. Those in the private sector aren't answerable to anybody. Of course, this isn't always the case. Because you can't sue anybody in the V.A. for malpractice. Also, one of the major problems with the costs of our current medical system is that most of the money for treatment goes towards supporting the bureaucracy.

I don't really watch propaganda films which socialists like to call "documentaries." Most of the time, they are full of outright misinformation and lies. Best case scenario, they show only one side of the story. So no, I haven't watched your propaganda film and I don't plan to... but the VA is the government-run health care system you want for everybody.

As for what can be done in a timely manner, free market capitalism isn't something you understand... not surprising. You cannot provide free unlimited health care to 350 million people for every ache and pain and do it in a timely manner. Doctors and nurses don't work for free. Health care professionals aren't compelled to work unlimited hours to ensure everyone gets cared for. Someone has to pay for that and you want it to be the taxpayers, but the taxpayer can't pay for it either. So what typically happens in such a system is, the elite... the ruling class... the top echelon of society... they get treated first because they have the money to motivate people... they have the power to motivate people. The underclass suffer and have their care rationed... waiting times lengthened... treatments curtailed or restricted.

What your dumb ass apparently doesn't understand is, YOU are NEVER going to be a part of the upper echelon. YOU will NEVER be one of the ruling class elite. YOU are what is known as a "useful idiot" ...exploited for your stupidity so that people much smarter than you can live a better life.

 

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

No such thing as "free college," dope.

Tell that to the French. People there don't have to pay for college.

Guess that's your little secret, huh......

You don't seem much like college material, just sayin.....

 

[BuckToothMoron]

If college were free here like it is in some other countries, I would have probably went. Instead, I looked at the possibility of affording a college education about the same as the possibility that I might ever fly to the moon. Most people believe that a college education is good for society in general. If that is the case, wouldn't it be best to improve society in general? Also, as things are, those who aren't wealthy have to go into a deep onerous debt to get a college education. But having a college education is no guarantee of finding a job. After all, from what I hear, China is awash with hordes of unemployed engineers. So anybody going into debt to get a college education here would be taking quite a risk. People here shouldn't have to take such a risk. Especially when the outcome could very likely be inproving society in general.

There is no country in the world where college is free. Buildings, professors, infrastructure have a cost, and the cost will be paid. Shouldn't you at least acknowledge that?

I think what you want is for some government at some level to pay for it, instead of the person receiving the college education. Is there any truth to the saying- people value more what they pay for over that which is free?

A 4 year degree at a typical university can easily exceed $50k or much more. A person truly motivated, but without parents who will pay for their college can find a much cheaper way to the degree, Online classes, community college, work study, etc.

If someone else pays for your education shouldn't they have a say on what you study? If you want to get a degree in Women's Study that will cost $50k, shouldn't you have a plan to pay it back? And if the degree does not provide a reasonable path to enable you to repay the cost, is the degree worth the investment?

There is no right given to citizens in the USA which guarantees a college degree? You don't sound like you were at all motivated to get a degree, but rather would go to college if someone offered to pay. I pay for my kids college. It will cost me over $175k to graduate both of them. They were motivated to go, and my wife and I were very specific on the type of degree we would buy them.

It appears to me we have inflated the cost of a degree by the government loaning money to any 18 year old kid willing to borrow thousands of dollars to attend college. University can charge more because more people want to buy it, many with somebody else's money.

My engineering degree cost less than $17k thirty years ago. My starting salary upon graduating was $21,500 in 1985. The government should not invest tax payer dollars into degrees that don't merit the cost.

What I am saying is that students don't have to pay. What part of that don't you understand. Next, there is something more important at stake than your opinion as to how important sombebody valuing something should be. Which in this case is the difference between having a college education and not having one. After that, you flutter off into dreamland. First, online classes are a joke. Next, survival IS a JOB! If anybody told me that I had to work to survive and at the same time work to get an education, I would tell them to fuck off and die.

Next, as long as what you are trying to get a degree in is of a benifit to society in general, why in the hell would anybody care what you study. After all, how many parents who pay for their childrens education tell them what field they have to go into. Apparently you care. But you don't represent all parents. Next, those who formed the constitution weren't gods. And things can change. If you have the sense that having educated people is a benefit to society in general, then getting a college education if you want one should be a new right.

Next, that is one of the problems with our capitalist society in general. People will tend to take all they can get even if it means screwing other people over to get it. In countries where they have free college education, what teachers and the like are paid is regulated. Some people are just more competient than others and deserve to get a little more. But this is just a tradeoff that you have to accept if you want to maintain a stable, sustainable system. Next, it would appear that your degree merited the cost.

Ok, I agree, you definitely need more education. May I suggest logic and debate for your first two classes. And you should definitely be the spokesperson to advance the cause.

 

[BuckToothMoron]

You are so full of shit your eyes are brown. I see that I am talking to the medical version of a human caused global warming denier. Where is flacern. He should be getting in on some of this horseshit. Have you ever SEEN the documentary "Sicko?" In it they went with a rid along with a DOCTOR who was making house calls. The V.A. doesn't do that. Also, in that documentary they SHOWED people who became homeless because they couldn't afford their medical bills.

Next, I can't say how long people in Canada have to wait for an MRI or kidney transplant. But considering some of your other lies, I would be willing to bet that it isn't as dire as you make out. Next, if you can pay to get anything done in a timely manner here in the U.S. It could still be done in a timely manner. No matter where the paycheck comes from. You can't dismiss "timliness" down to greed. It could make a little difference, but not a major one. Also, if college was for free, there would be more qualified people around to do whatever.

Next, bureaucrat who works for the government is ultimately answerable to the voters. Because they are part of the government. Those in the private sector aren't answerable to anybody. Of course, this isn't always the case. Because you can't sue anybody in the V.A. for malpractice. Also, one of the major problems with the costs of our current medical system is that most of the money for treatment goes towards supporting the bureaucracy.

I don't really watch propaganda films which socialists like to call "documentaries." Most of the time, they are full of outright misinformation and lies. Best case scenario, they show only one side of the story. So no, I haven't watched your propaganda film and I don't plan to... but the VA is the government-run health care system you want for everybody.

As for what can be done in a timely manner, free market capitalism isn't something you understand... not surprising. You cannot provide free unlimited health care to 350 million people for every ache and pain and do it in a timely manner. Doctors and nurses don't work for free. Health care professionals aren't compelled to work unlimited hours to ensure everyone gets cared for. Someone has to pay for that and you want it to be the taxpayers, but the taxpayer can't pay for it either. So what typically happens in such a system is, the elite... the ruling class... the top echelon of society... they get treated first because they have the money to motivate people... they have the power to motivate people. The underclass suffer and have their care rationed... waiting times lengthened... treatments curtailed or restricted.

What your dumb ass apparently doesn't understand is, YOU are NEVER going to be a part of the upper echelon. YOU will NEVER be one of the ruling class elite. YOU are what is known as a "useful idiot" ...exploited for your stupidity so that people much smarter than you can live a better life.

Hey Boss, I think that was mean, and the government should pay to send you to sensitivity training, so you can learn how offensive the truth can be to some people.

 

[BuckToothMoron]

Hey guys, we are being jobbed. Hellraiser is playing with us. Vacate!

 

[Wyatt earp]

Tell that to the French. People there don't have to pay for college.

Oh?

So the professors and administrators all donate their time? Text book authors and publishers ask for no compensation?

The government picks up the tab. Just as they do with health care. And there is a limit as to what administrators and college professors are paid. Part of their compensation comes from living in a more fair sociery. Aparently there, politicians think their job is to look after the people. What politicians do here mostly is shaking babies and kissing hands.

Yes we do raise a nation of fucking morons.




.

 

[Uncensored2008]

No such thing as free K-12 education either, but the expense is more than returned to our economy.

I would love to see you quantify that.

51% of the population are net contributors, 49% of our population is a drag on our economy, they consume more than they produce.

If our educational system is effective, I would expect a far different ratio.