Let's talk about the National Debt

[Manonthestreet]

record revenue continues to roll in and yet its never enough.....I know lets create more bureaucracy to manage more programs handing out money to god knows who or why and then bitch

 

[Derideo_Te]

Excellent idea! Let's cut spending back to 2007 levels.
Then we'll look at tax hikes.

They tried that failed Libertarian dogma in Kansas and it is ruining their economy.

Tax increases at the top are essential if you want to keep the economy growing while you cut spending.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Excellent idea! Let's cut spending back to 2007 levels.
Then we'll look at tax hikes.

That tried that failed Libertarian dogma in Kansas and it is ruining their economy.

Tax increases at the top are essential if you want to keep the economy growing while you cut spending.

That tried that failed Libertarian dogma in Kansas and it is ruining their economy.

They cut spending to 2007 levels? Link?

Tax increases at the top are essential

Obama already did that. Why do you want more?

if you want to keep the economy growing while you cut spending.

Why can't spending be cut to 2007 levels?
Obama fixed the Bush economy and ended the wars.
He should be able to cut to much less than 2007.

 

[Derideo_Te]

The best way to eliminate the National Debt is to tie it directly to the topmost tax rate.

It works like this;

All income in excess of $1,000,000 pa from whatever source is taxed at 95% as long as the National Debt is greater than zero.

If the National Debt is zero that rate does not apply.

Great incentive for the 1% to stop sucking all the money out of the taxpayer trough because they are only going to receive 5 cents on the dollar returns.

And while we are at it we could put another one in place at 99.99% for all earnings over $5 million again tied to the National Debt.

Yes, the Libertarians will screech that the wealthy will run away and take their money with them. But reality tells us that never happens because life is just too good here for them to leave.

Instead they will try to "offshore" their money and the remedy for that is hard time behind bars if they want to live in the USA while evading paying their taxes by moving it offshore.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Obama a genius! Nothing is ever his fault!

 

[Derideo_Te]

Why can't spending be cut to 2007 levels?
Obama fixed the Bush economy and ended the wars.
He should be able to cut to much less than 2007.

Why don't you look at the facts first?

Government Spending Chart United States 2007-2017 - Federal State Local Data

Spending is already cut back to 2007 levels.

Time to raise taxes according to your own dogma.

And yes, I do want taxes raised to pay down the national debt.

Why don't you want to pay off the ND?

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Why can't spending be cut to 2007 levels?
Obama fixed the Bush economy and ended the wars.
He should be able to cut to much less than 2007.

Why don't you look at the facts first?

Government Spending Chart United States 2007-2017 - Federal State Local Data

View attachment 43348

Spending is already cut back to 2007 levels.

Time to raise taxes according to your own dogma.

And yes, I do want taxes raised to pay down the national debt.

Why don't you want to pay off the ND?

Spending is already cut back to 2007 levels.

Federal spending in 2007 was $2.7 trillion. Last year, $3.5 trillion.
We're about $800 billion too high.

 

[Derideo_Te]

Why can't spending be cut to 2007 levels?
Obama fixed the Bush economy and ended the wars.
He should be able to cut to much less than 2007.

Why don't you look at the facts first?

Government Spending Chart United States 2007-2017 - Federal State Local Data

View attachment 43348

Spending is already cut back to 2007 levels.

Time to raise taxes according to your own dogma.

And yes, I do want taxes raised to pay down the national debt.

Why don't you want to pay off the ND?

Spending is already cut back to 2007 levels.

Federal spending in 2007 was $2.7 trillion. Last year, $3.5 trillion.
We're about $800 billion too high.

Total spending in 2007 was just over $3 trillion.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Why can't spending be cut to 2007 levels?
Obama fixed the Bush economy and ended the wars.
He should be able to cut to much less than 2007.

Why don't you look at the facts first?

Government Spending Chart United States 2007-2017 - Federal State Local Data

View attachment 43348

Spending is already cut back to 2007 levels.

Time to raise taxes according to your own dogma.

And yes, I do want taxes raised to pay down the national debt.

Why don't you want to pay off the ND?

Republican Congress cut spending with the Brutal Sequester that Obama was against

 

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

The debt will come down, once we elect a fiscally responsible Congress. Note, fiscal conservatism and austerity are not solutions, they are political talking points. Raising taxes and cutting unnecessary spending is the solution!

Raising taxes while cutting spending can be considered fiscally conservative policy. Furthermore, austerity absolutely should be part of the plan. There is a shit ton of waste in government.

 

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

Republican Congress cut spending with the Brutal Sequester that Obama was against

After they ran up the bulk of our debt. The Republican Party has no credibility to claim they are a fiscally responsible party.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Why can't spending be cut to 2007 levels?
Obama fixed the Bush economy and ended the wars.
He should be able to cut to much less than 2007.

Why don't you look at the facts first?

Government Spending Chart United States 2007-2017 - Federal State Local Data

View attachment 43348

Spending is already cut back to 2007 levels.

Time to raise taxes according to your own dogma.

And yes, I do want taxes raised to pay down the national debt.

Why don't you want to pay off the ND?

Spending is already cut back to 2007 levels.

Federal spending in 2007 was $2.7 trillion. Last year, $3.5 trillion.
We're about $800 billion too high.

Total spending in 2007 was just over $3 trillion.

Why are you involving state and local spending in a discussion about Federal spending?

 

[Wry Catcher]

Top Federal Income Tax Rate Was Once Over 90 Percent Tax Foundation

Economists Say We Should Tax The Rich At 90 Percent

Reagan pushed through sweeping tax cuts, slashing the top rate from 70.1 percent to 28.4 percent, and the lowest rate from 14 percent to 11 percent.

Read more here: The end of voodoo GOP changes Reagan approach to tax cuts The Sacramento Bee

I concede that corporate tax rates weren't 90%, it was income tax rates that were 90%.
But Raygun did cut income tax rates from 70% down to 28% for the rich. And because of it, he tripled the national debt in eight years.

But we all know that corporations have all the money. And it's corporations that own the politicians too. With all the loop holes corporations get, most pay NO TAXES AT ALL.

Less revenue, bigger deficits.

The poor didn't run up the national debt, the rich did. There are no poor in congress.

I concede that corporate tax rates weren't 90%

Excellent! You've probably been pushing that error for decades.

But Raygun did cut income tax rates from 70% down to 28% for the rich.

It's true, he cut income tax rates for everybody.

And because of it, he tripled the national debt in eight years.

The rate cuts didn't reduce government revenues.

With all the loop holes corporations get, most pay NO TAXES AT ALL.

It's true, friends of Obama get reduced taxes. Those "Green Energy" loopholes are very lucrative for Obama's donors.

The poor didn't run up the national debt, the rich did.

I know, those rich big spenders in Congress are awful!

But Raygun did cut income tax rates from 70% down to 28% for the rich.

It's true, he cut income tax rates for everybody.

That tax rate was "for the rich" and it's still over half.

And because of it, he tripled the national debt in eight years.

The rate cuts didn't reduce government revenues.

You've probably been telling that lie since Raygun.

With all the loop holes corporations get, most pay NO TAXES AT ALL.

It's true, friends of Obama get reduced taxes. Those "Green Energy" loopholes are very lucrative for Obama's donors.

You trying to tell us big oil and war machine contractors don't do that?

The poor didn't run up the national debt, the rich did.

I know, those rich big spenders in Congress are awful!

Yeah, those GOP war mongers wasted $3 trillion on Iraq and Afghanistan. But their buddies Halliburton got a trillion of it. And think of all the kickbacks those cons get from big oil from lobbyists and campaign contributions.

The rate cuts didn't reduce government revenues.

You've probably been telling that lie since Raygun.

1980 517,112
1981 599,272
1982 617,766
1983 600,562
1984 666,438
1985 734,037
1986 769,155
1987 854,287
1988 909,238
1989 991,104
Total revenues went from $517 billion in 1980, to $991 billion in 1989.
.
You trying to tell us big oil and war machine contractors don't do that?

They get loopholes from Obama? Bastards!

Congress has the purse strings, not Obama. Congress makes the loopholes, not Obama.

1980 517,112
1981 599,272
1982 617,766
1983 600,562
1984 666,438
1985 734,037
1986 769,155
1987 854,287
1988 909,238
1989 991,104
Total revenues went from $517 billion in 1980, to $991 billion in 1989.

Two bills passed in 1982 and 1984 together"constituted the biggest tax increase ever enacted during peacetime,"

more asset sales became taxable and tax-advantaged contributions and benefits under pension plans were further limited.
There were other notable tax increases under Reagan.

In 1983, for example, he signed off on Social Security reform legislation that, among other things, accelerated an increase in the payroll tax rate, required that higher-income beneficiaries pay income tax on part of their benefits, and required the self-employed to pay the full payroll tax rate, rather than just the portion normally paid by employees.

The tax reform of 1986, meanwhile, wasn't designed to increase federal tax revenue. But that didn't mean that no one's taxes went up. Because the reform bill eliminated or reduced many tax breaks and shelters, high-income tax filers who previously paid little ended up with bigger tax bills.

All told, the tax increases Reagan approved ended up canceling out much of the reduction in tax revenue that resulted from his 1981 legislation.
Taxes What people forget about Reagan - Sep. 8 2010
In straight language, it means Raygun cut taxes on the rich and raised them on everybody else.

In straight language, it means Raygun cut taxes on the rich and raised them on everybody else.

LOL!

Congress has the purse strings, not Obama. Congress makes the loopholes, not Obama.

Obama didn't sign those "Green Energy" loopholes into law?
Are you sure?

POTUS signs the bill, the buck stops there!

 

[hangover]

Congress has the purse strings, not Obama. Congress makes the loopholes, not Obama.

1980 517,112
1981 599,272
1982 617,766
1983 600,562
1984 666,438
1985 734,037
1986 769,155
1987 854,287
1988 909,238
1989 991,104
Total revenues went from $517 billion in 1980, to $991 billion in 1989.

Two bills passed in 1982 and 1984 together"constituted the biggest tax increase ever enacted during peacetime,"

more asset sales became taxable and tax-advantaged contributions and benefits under pension plans were further limited.
There were other notable tax increases under Reagan.

In 1983, for example, he signed off on Social Security reform legislation that, among other things, accelerated an increase in the payroll tax rate, required that higher-income beneficiaries pay income tax on part of their benefits, and required the self-employed to pay the full payroll tax rate, rather than just the portion normally paid by employees.

The tax reform of 1986, meanwhile, wasn't designed to increase federal tax revenue. But that didn't mean that no one's taxes went up. Because the reform bill eliminated or reduced many tax breaks and shelters, high-income tax filers who previously paid little ended up with bigger tax bills.

All told, the tax increases Reagan approved ended up canceling out much of the reduction in tax revenue that resulted from his 1981 legislation.
Taxes What people forget about Reagan - Sep. 8 2010
In straight language, it means Raygun cut taxes on the rich and raised them on everybody else.

In straight language, it means Raygun cut taxes on the rich and raised them on everybody else.

LOL!

Congress has the purse strings, not Obama. Congress makes the loopholes, not Obama.

Obama didn't sign those "Green Energy" loopholes into law?
Are you sure?

In straight language, it means Raygun cut taxes on the rich and raised them on everybody else.

LOL!

Cons always laugh wen the GOP fucks Americans.
Congress has the purse strings, not Obama. Congress makes the loopholes, not Obama.

Obama didn't sign those "Green Energy" loopholes into law?
Are you sure

He can only sign them when congress puts the bill on his desk. But nice deflection of big oil and war machine corporations.

Cons always laugh wen the GOP fucks Americans.

I alway laugh at idiot libs.

He can only sign them when congress puts the bill on his desk.

He signed them? Is he in the pocket of big oil and big war? Bastard!

Cons always laugh wen the GOP fucks Americans.

I alway laugh at idiot libs.
Mentally challenged cons calling libs idiots, always happens every time they lose on an issue that they're on the wrong side of, healthcare, confederate flag, equal rights, just this week alone.
He can only sign them when congress puts the bill on his desk.

He signed them? Is he in the pocket of big oil and big war? Bastard!
^^^^Mentally challenged tries to pretend big oil and war was created by Obama because the reality of Iraq is to shameful for him to own up to. You're so lame, if you were a horse they'd have to shoot you.

You're the idiot who said we should raise corporate tax rates to 90%.
You're the idiot who said they used to be 90%.

I didn't say anything about big oil and war being created by Obama.
If you don't like the loopholes Obama put into effect for corporations like GE,
you should just come right out and say it.

You're the idiot that likes corporations running up the national debt and then getting a free ride on paying it off. You're the idiot that is too fucking stupid to realize that corporations have all the money. And you're the moron that thinks the poor are going to pay off the national debt. If you look up idiot in the dictionary, it's a picture of you.

 

[hangover]

I concede that corporate tax rates weren't 90%

Excellent! You've probably been pushing that error for decades.

But Raygun did cut income tax rates from 70% down to 28% for the rich.

It's true, he cut income tax rates for everybody.

And because of it, he tripled the national debt in eight years.

The rate cuts didn't reduce government revenues.

With all the loop holes corporations get, most pay NO TAXES AT ALL.

It's true, friends of Obama get reduced taxes. Those "Green Energy" loopholes are very lucrative for Obama's donors.

The poor didn't run up the national debt, the rich did.

I know, those rich big spenders in Congress are awful!

But Raygun did cut income tax rates from 70% down to 28% for the rich.

It's true, he cut income tax rates for everybody.

That tax rate was "for the rich" and it's still over half.

And because of it, he tripled the national debt in eight years.

The rate cuts didn't reduce government revenues.

You've probably been telling that lie since Raygun.

With all the loop holes corporations get, most pay NO TAXES AT ALL.

It's true, friends of Obama get reduced taxes. Those "Green Energy" loopholes are very lucrative for Obama's donors.

You trying to tell us big oil and war machine contractors don't do that?

The poor didn't run up the national debt, the rich did.

I know, those rich big spenders in Congress are awful!

Yeah, those GOP war mongers wasted $3 trillion on Iraq and Afghanistan. But their buddies Halliburton got a trillion of it. And think of all the kickbacks those cons get from big oil from lobbyists and campaign contributions.

The rate cuts didn't reduce government revenues.

You've probably been telling that lie since Raygun.

1980 517,112
1981 599,272
1982 617,766
1983 600,562
1984 666,438
1985 734,037
1986 769,155
1987 854,287
1988 909,238
1989 991,104
Total revenues went from $517 billion in 1980, to $991 billion in 1989.
.
You trying to tell us big oil and war machine contractors don't do that?

They get loopholes from Obama? Bastards!

Congress has the purse strings, not Obama. Congress makes the loopholes, not Obama.

1980 517,112
1981 599,272
1982 617,766
1983 600,562
1984 666,438
1985 734,037
1986 769,155
1987 854,287
1988 909,238
1989 991,104
Total revenues went from $517 billion in 1980, to $991 billion in 1989.

Two bills passed in 1982 and 1984 together"constituted the biggest tax increase ever enacted during peacetime,"

more asset sales became taxable and tax-advantaged contributions and benefits under pension plans were further limited.
There were other notable tax increases under Reagan.

In 1983, for example, he signed off on Social Security reform legislation that, among other things, accelerated an increase in the payroll tax rate, required that higher-income beneficiaries pay income tax on part of their benefits, and required the self-employed to pay the full payroll tax rate, rather than just the portion normally paid by employees.

The tax reform of 1986, meanwhile, wasn't designed to increase federal tax revenue. But that didn't mean that no one's taxes went up. Because the reform bill eliminated or reduced many tax breaks and shelters, high-income tax filers who previously paid little ended up with bigger tax bills.

All told, the tax increases Reagan approved ended up canceling out much of the reduction in tax revenue that resulted from his 1981 legislation.
Taxes What people forget about Reagan - Sep. 8 2010
In straight language, it means Raygun cut taxes on the rich and raised them on everybody else.

In straight language, it means Raygun cut taxes on the rich and raised them on everybody else.

LOL!

Congress has the purse strings, not Obama. Congress makes the loopholes, not Obama.

Obama didn't sign those "Green Energy" loopholes into law?
Are you sure?

POTUS signs the bill, the buck stops there!

Only if it's a dem. When a con POTUS gets caught in a crime, like Nixon, and Raygun(Iran/Contra), and Shrub daddy(out of the loop), and Shrub Jr.(yellow cake lies) and signing deregulation bills that destroy the economy, then the buck never comes to them. Raygun tripled the national debt, Shrub daddy doubled it again in only four years, and Shrub Jr. doubled the debt yet again adding more than all presidents added together. And cons still claim to be the fiscally responsible party. The last three con presidents own $12 trillion of the national debt. Actually Shrub owns what Obama added, because that asshole caused the economic collapse that Obama has had to clean up. Cons are just chickenshit lying cowards that never own up to their fuck ups.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

In straight language, it means Raygun cut taxes on the rich and raised them on everybody else.

LOL!

Congress has the purse strings, not Obama. Congress makes the loopholes, not Obama.

Obama didn't sign those "Green Energy" loopholes into law?
Are you sure?

In straight language, it means Raygun cut taxes on the rich and raised them on everybody else.

LOL!

Cons always laugh wen the GOP fucks Americans.
Congress has the purse strings, not Obama. Congress makes the loopholes, not Obama.

Obama didn't sign those "Green Energy" loopholes into law?
Are you sure

He can only sign them when congress puts the bill on his desk. But nice deflection of big oil and war machine corporations.

Cons always laugh wen the GOP fucks Americans.

I alway laugh at idiot libs.

He can only sign them when congress puts the bill on his desk.

He signed them? Is he in the pocket of big oil and big war? Bastard!

Cons always laugh wen the GOP fucks Americans.

I alway laugh at idiot libs.
Mentally challenged cons calling libs idiots, always happens every time they lose on an issue that they're on the wrong side of, healthcare, confederate flag, equal rights, just this week alone.
He can only sign them when congress puts the bill on his desk.

He signed them? Is he in the pocket of big oil and big war? Bastard!
^^^^Mentally challenged tries to pretend big oil and war was created by Obama because the reality of Iraq is to shameful for him to own up to. You're so lame, if you were a horse they'd have to shoot you.

You're the idiot who said we should raise corporate tax rates to 90%.
You're the idiot who said they used to be 90%.

I didn't say anything about big oil and war being created by Obama.
If you don't like the loopholes Obama put into effect for corporations like GE,
you should just come right out and say it.

You're the idiot that likes corporations running up the national debt and then getting a free ride on paying it off. You're the idiot that is too fucking stupid to realize that corporations have all the money. And you're the moron that thinks the poor are going to pay off the national debt. If you look up idiot in the dictionary, it's a picture of you.

You're the idiot that likes corporations running up the national debt

Did it hurt when you pulled that out of your ass?
Let me help you out, government spending runs up the debt, corporations do not.

and then getting a free ride on paying it off.

Hey, idiot, we have the highest corporate tax rate in the world.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Republican Congress cut spending with the Brutal Sequester that Obama was against

After they ran up the bulk of our debt. The Republican Party has no credibility to claim they are a fiscally responsible party.

Have you even seen a chart of spending vs party in charge of Congress?

 

[TyroneSlothrop]

 

[Wry Catcher]

First, the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq and our policy of foreign intervention has greatly contributed to the amount of money we owe; cutting taxes at a time of war and the Great Recession exacerbated a long term and growing issue.

The debt will come down, once we elect a fiscally responsible Congress. Note, fiscal conservatism and austerity are not solutions, they are political talking points. Raising taxes and cutting unnecessary spending is the solution!

Borrowing and the Federal Debt

Whining about the national debt is one more wedge issue, a talking point by the Republican Party (and callow posters who parrot the current meme) who contributed greatly to the problem and now want to point fingers at President Obama. That's one more BIG LIE by the Party of Grover Limbaugh.

Obama Fulffers motto: Obama had nothing to do with the debt, its all somebody else's fault

Even the failed stimulus wasn't his fault

You wonder why I believe you're not only a partisan hack but dumb as a box of rocks:

Google

Read it and then run away and hide.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

First, the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq and our policy of foreign intervention has greatly contributed to the amount of money we owe; cutting taxes at a time of war and the Great Recession exacerbated a long term and growing issue.

The debt will come down, once we elect a fiscally responsible Congress. Note, fiscal conservatism and austerity are not solutions, they are political talking points. Raising taxes and cutting unnecessary spending is the solution!

Borrowing and the Federal Debt

Whining about the national debt is one more wedge issue, a talking point by the Republican Party (and callow posters who parrot the current meme) who contributed greatly to the problem and now want to point fingers at President Obama. That's one more BIG LIE by the Party of Grover Limbaugh.

Obama Fulffers motto: Obama had nothing to do with the debt, its all somebody else's fault

Even the failed stimulus wasn't his fault

You wonder why I believe you're not only a partisan hack but dumb as a box of rocks:

Google

Read it and then run away and hide.

Obama. He's a Deity. Never did anything wrong. It's always somebody else fault. Surely a more perfect man never walked the Earth.

Freddo, you're turning into a characture of yourself.