CDZ Kids rights v Parents rights

[Billy_Kinetta]

Child Protective Services comes in. My adopted children came from a family homeless due to addiction and domestic violence. Parents do NOT have the right to fuck up a child's life by breaking the law.

What if the law is obeisance to the Dear Leader?

 

[Disir]

31 Care and Supervision
(1)On the application of any local authority or authorised person, the court may make an order—

(a)placing the child with respect to whom the application is made in the care of a designated local authority; or

(b)putting him under the supervision of a designated local authority F285. . ..

(2)A court may only make a care order or supervision order if it is satisfied—

(a)that the child concerned is suffering, or is likely to suffer, significant harm; and

(b)that the harm, or likelihood of harm, is attributable to—

(i)the care given to the child, or likely to be given to him if the order were not made, not being what it would be reasonable to expect a parent to give to him; or

(ii)the child’s being beyond parental control.

(3)No care order or supervision order may be made with respect to a child who has reached the age of seventeen (or sixteen, in the case of a child who is married).

[F286(3A)No care order may be made with respect to a child until the court has considered a section 31A plan.]

(4)An application under this section may be made on its own or in any other family proceedings.

(5)The court may—

(a)on an application for a care order, make a supervision order;

(b)on an application for a supervision order, make a care order.

(6)Where an authorised person proposes to make an application under this section he shall—

(a)if it is reasonably practicable to do so; and

(b)before making the application,

consult the local authority appearing to him to be the authority in whose area the child concerned is ordinarily resident.

(7)An application made by an authorised person shall not be entertained by the court if, at the time when it is made, the child concerned is—

(a)the subject of an earlier application for a care order, or supervision order, which has not been disposed of; or

(b)subject to—

(i)a care order or supervision order;

[F287(ii)a youth rehabilitation order within the meaning of Part 1 of the Criminal Justice and Immigration Act 2008; or]

(iii)a supervision requirement within the meaning of [F288Part II of the Children (Scotland) Act 1995].

(8)The local authority designated in a care order must be—

(a)the authority within whose area the child is ordinarily resident; or

(b)where the child does not reside in the area of a local authority, the authority within whose area any circumstances arose in consequence of which the order is being made.

(9)In this section—

• “authorised person” means—
  
  (a)
  the National Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Children and any of its officers; and
  
  (b)
  any person authorised by order of the Secretary of State to bring proceedings under this section and any officer of a body which is so authorised;
  
  
• “harm” means ill-treatment or the impairment of health or development [F289including, for example, impairment suffered from seeing or hearing the ill-treatment of another];
  
  
• “development” means physical, intellectual, emotional, social or behavioural development;
  
  
• “health” means physical or mental health; and
  
  
• “ill-treatment” includes sexual abuse and forms of ill-treatment which are not physical.

(10)Where the question of whether harm suffered by a child is significant turns on the child’s health or development, his health or development shall be compared with that which could reasonably be expected of a similar child.

(11)In this Act—

• “a care order” means (subject to section 105(1)) an order under subsection (1)(a) and (except where express provision to the contrary is made) includes an interim care order made under section 38; and
  
  
• “a supervision order” means an order under subsection (1)(b) and (except where express provision to the contrary is made) includes an interim supervision order made under section 38.
  ________________________________________________________

My how things have changed since the 17th century when they were just shipped over here....... I kid, I kid.

Here is where they have arrested adults:
Part I Prevention of Cruelty and Exposure to Moral and Physical Danger
Offences
1 Cruelty to persons under sixteen.
(1)If any person who has attained the age of sixteen years and [F1has responsibility for] any child or young person under that age, wilfully assaults, ill-treats, neglects, abandons, or exposes him, or causes or procures him to be assaulted, ill-treated, neglected, abandoned, or exposed, in a manner likely to cause him unnecessary suffering or injury to health (including injury to or loss of sight, or hearing, or limb, or organ of the body, and any mental derangement), that person shall be guilty of a misdemeanor, and shall be liable—

(a)on conviction on indictment, to a fine . . . F2 or alternatively, . . . F3, or in addition thereto, to imprisonment for any term not exceeding [F4ten] years;

(b)on summary conviction, to a fine not exceeding [F5£400] pounds, or alternatively, . . . F3, or in addition thereto, to imprisonment for any term not exceeding six months.

(2)For the purposes of this section—

(a)a parent or other person legally liable to maintain a child or young person [F6, or the legal guardian of a child or young person,] shall be deemed to have neglected him in a manner likely to cause injury to his health if he has failed to provide adequate food, clothing, medical aid or lodging for him, or if, having been unable otherwise to provide such food, clothing, medical aid or lodging, he has failed to take steps to procure it to be provided under [F7the enactments applicable in that behalf];

(b)where it is proved that the death of an infant under three years of age was caused by suffocation (not being suffocation caused by disease or the presence of any foreign body in the throat or air passages of the infant) while the infant was in bed with some other person who has attained the age of sixteen years, that other person shall, if he was, when he went to bed, under the influence of drink, be deemed to have neglected the infant in a manner likely to cause injury to its health.

(3)A person may be convicted of an offence under this section—

(a)notwithstanding that actual suffering or injury to health, or the likelihood of actual suffering or injury to health, was obviated by the action of another person;

(b)notwithstanding the death of the child or young person in question.
Children and Young Persons Act 1933
So, now you gotta prove that it was willful and had nothing to do with genetics or socioeconomic status and the kid is not sneaking food.

Then you gotta prove no attempts were made to change the outcome and the unwillingness was there and the kid is facing severe health problems. Are there even services available in that local area? Then you gotta show how much better or healthier that kid is going to be in foster care. Just reading over UK stories, you're looking at extreme cases and those are few and far between.

 

[Tommy Tainant]

31 Care and Supervision
(1)On the application of any local authority or authorised person, the court may make an order—

(a)placing the child with respect to whom the application is made in the care of a designated local authority; or

(b)putting him under the supervision of a designated local authority F285. . ..

(2)A court may only make a care order or supervision order if it is satisfied—

(a)that the child concerned is suffering, or is likely to suffer, significant harm; and

(b)that the harm, or likelihood of harm, is attributable to—

(i)the care given to the child, or likely to be given to him if the order were not made, not being what it would be reasonable to expect a parent to give to him; or

(ii)the child’s being beyond parental control.

(3)No care order or supervision order may be made with respect to a child who has reached the age of seventeen (or sixteen, in the case of a child who is married).

[F286(3A)No care order may be made with respect to a child until the court has considered a section 31A plan.]

(4)An application under this section may be made on its own or in any other family proceedings.

(5)The court may—

(a)on an application for a care order, make a supervision order;

(b)on an application for a supervision order, make a care order.

(6)Where an authorised person proposes to make an application under this section he shall—

(a)if it is reasonably practicable to do so; and

(b)before making the application,

consult the local authority appearing to him to be the authority in whose area the child concerned is ordinarily resident.

(7)An application made by an authorised person shall not be entertained by the court if, at the time when it is made, the child concerned is—

(a)the subject of an earlier application for a care order, or supervision order, which has not been disposed of; or

(b)subject to—

(i)a care order or supervision order;

[F287(ii)a youth rehabilitation order within the meaning of Part 1 of the Criminal Justice and Immigration Act 2008; or]

(iii)a supervision requirement within the meaning of [F288Part II of the Children (Scotland) Act 1995].

(8)The local authority designated in a care order must be—

(a)the authority within whose area the child is ordinarily resident; or

(b)where the child does not reside in the area of a local authority, the authority within whose area any circumstances arose in consequence of which the order is being made.

(9)In this section—

• “authorised person” means—
  
  (a)
  the National Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Children and any of its officers; and
  
  (b)
  any person authorised by order of the Secretary of State to bring proceedings under this section and any officer of a body which is so authorised;
  
  
• “harm” means ill-treatment or the impairment of health or development [F289including, for example, impairment suffered from seeing or hearing the ill-treatment of another];
  
  
• “development” means physical, intellectual, emotional, social or behavioural development;
  
  
• “health” means physical or mental health; and
  
  
• “ill-treatment” includes sexual abuse and forms of ill-treatment which are not physical.

(10)Where the question of whether harm suffered by a child is significant turns on the child’s health or development, his health or development shall be compared with that which could reasonably be expected of a similar child.

(11)In this Act—

• “a care order” means (subject to section 105(1)) an order under subsection (1)(a) and (except where express provision to the contrary is made) includes an interim care order made under section 38; and
  
  
• “a supervision order” means an order under subsection (1)(b) and (except where express provision to the contrary is made) includes an interim supervision order made under section 38.
  ________________________________________________________

My how things have changed since the 17th century when they were just shipped over here....... I kid, I kid.

Here is where they have arrested adults:
Part I Prevention of Cruelty and Exposure to Moral and Physical Danger
Offences
1 Cruelty to persons under sixteen.
(1)If any person who has attained the age of sixteen years and [F1has responsibility for] any child or young person under that age, wilfully assaults, ill-treats, neglects, abandons, or exposes him, or causes or procures him to be assaulted, ill-treated, neglected, abandoned, or exposed, in a manner likely to cause him unnecessary suffering or injury to health (including injury to or loss of sight, or hearing, or limb, or organ of the body, and any mental derangement), that person shall be guilty of a misdemeanor, and shall be liable—

(a)on conviction on indictment, to a fine . . . F2 or alternatively, . . . F3, or in addition thereto, to imprisonment for any term not exceeding [F4ten] years;

(b)on summary conviction, to a fine not exceeding [F5£400] pounds, or alternatively, . . . F3, or in addition thereto, to imprisonment for any term not exceeding six months.

(2)For the purposes of this section—

(a)a parent or other person legally liable to maintain a child or young person [F6, or the legal guardian of a child or young person,] shall be deemed to have neglected him in a manner likely to cause injury to his health if he has failed to provide adequate food, clothing, medical aid or lodging for him, or if, having been unable otherwise to provide such food, clothing, medical aid or lodging, he has failed to take steps to procure it to be provided under [F7the enactments applicable in that behalf];

(b)where it is proved that the death of an infant under three years of age was caused by suffocation (not being suffocation caused by disease or the presence of any foreign body in the throat or air passages of the infant) while the infant was in bed with some other person who has attained the age of sixteen years, that other person shall, if he was, when he went to bed, under the influence of drink, be deemed to have neglected the infant in a manner likely to cause injury to its health.

(3)A person may be convicted of an offence under this section—

(a)notwithstanding that actual suffering or injury to health, or the likelihood of actual suffering or injury to health, was obviated by the action of another person;

(b)notwithstanding the death of the child or young person in question.
Children and Young Persons Act 1933
So, now you gotta prove that it was willful and had nothing to do with genetics or socioeconomic status and the kid is not sneaking food.

Then you gotta prove no attempts were made to change the outcome and the unwillingness was there and the kid is facing severe health problems. Are there even services available in that local area? Then you gotta show how much better or healthier that kid is going to be in foster care. Just reading over UK stories, you're looking at extreme cases and those are few and far between.

The ball park moves whenever a child is killed. Every council has a Children Services department which is generally underfunded. The other thing is that social workers are hated by everybody. Too harsh or too lax they cannot win.
What we do know is that there a vast number of shit parents out there. You see it everywhere when you go out. I think we are lucky that there are so few damaged kids out there.

 

[Disir]

31 Care and Supervision
(1)On the application of any local authority or authorised person, the court may make an order—

(a)placing the child with respect to whom the application is made in the care of a designated local authority; or

(b)putting him under the supervision of a designated local authority F285. . ..

(2)A court may only make a care order or supervision order if it is satisfied—

(a)that the child concerned is suffering, or is likely to suffer, significant harm; and

(b)that the harm, or likelihood of harm, is attributable to—

(i)the care given to the child, or likely to be given to him if the order were not made, not being what it would be reasonable to expect a parent to give to him; or

(ii)the child’s being beyond parental control.

(3)No care order or supervision order may be made with respect to a child who has reached the age of seventeen (or sixteen, in the case of a child who is married).

[F286(3A)No care order may be made with respect to a child until the court has considered a section 31A plan.]

(4)An application under this section may be made on its own or in any other family proceedings.

(5)The court may—

(a)on an application for a care order, make a supervision order;

(b)on an application for a supervision order, make a care order.

(6)Where an authorised person proposes to make an application under this section he shall—

(a)if it is reasonably practicable to do so; and

(b)before making the application,

consult the local authority appearing to him to be the authority in whose area the child concerned is ordinarily resident.

(7)An application made by an authorised person shall not be entertained by the court if, at the time when it is made, the child concerned is—

(a)the subject of an earlier application for a care order, or supervision order, which has not been disposed of; or

(b)subject to—

(i)a care order or supervision order;

[F287(ii)a youth rehabilitation order within the meaning of Part 1 of the Criminal Justice and Immigration Act 2008; or]

(iii)a supervision requirement within the meaning of [F288Part II of the Children (Scotland) Act 1995].

(8)The local authority designated in a care order must be—

(a)the authority within whose area the child is ordinarily resident; or

(b)where the child does not reside in the area of a local authority, the authority within whose area any circumstances arose in consequence of which the order is being made.

(9)In this section—

• “authorised person” means—
  
  (a)
  the National Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Children and any of its officers; and
  
  (b)
  any person authorised by order of the Secretary of State to bring proceedings under this section and any officer of a body which is so authorised;
  
  
• “harm” means ill-treatment or the impairment of health or development [F289including, for example, impairment suffered from seeing or hearing the ill-treatment of another];
  
  
• “development” means physical, intellectual, emotional, social or behavioural development;
  
  
• “health” means physical or mental health; and
  
  
• “ill-treatment” includes sexual abuse and forms of ill-treatment which are not physical.

(10)Where the question of whether harm suffered by a child is significant turns on the child’s health or development, his health or development shall be compared with that which could reasonably be expected of a similar child.

(11)In this Act—

• “a care order” means (subject to section 105(1)) an order under subsection (1)(a) and (except where express provision to the contrary is made) includes an interim care order made under section 38; and
  
  
• “a supervision order” means an order under subsection (1)(b) and (except where express provision to the contrary is made) includes an interim supervision order made under section 38.
  ________________________________________________________

My how things have changed since the 17th century when they were just shipped over here....... I kid, I kid.

Here is where they have arrested adults:
Part I Prevention of Cruelty and Exposure to Moral and Physical Danger
Offences
1 Cruelty to persons under sixteen.
(1)If any person who has attained the age of sixteen years and [F1has responsibility for] any child or young person under that age, wilfully assaults, ill-treats, neglects, abandons, or exposes him, or causes or procures him to be assaulted, ill-treated, neglected, abandoned, or exposed, in a manner likely to cause him unnecessary suffering or injury to health (including injury to or loss of sight, or hearing, or limb, or organ of the body, and any mental derangement), that person shall be guilty of a misdemeanor, and shall be liable—

(a)on conviction on indictment, to a fine . . . F2 or alternatively, . . . F3, or in addition thereto, to imprisonment for any term not exceeding [F4ten] years;

(b)on summary conviction, to a fine not exceeding [F5£400] pounds, or alternatively, . . . F3, or in addition thereto, to imprisonment for any term not exceeding six months.

(2)For the purposes of this section—

(a)a parent or other person legally liable to maintain a child or young person [F6, or the legal guardian of a child or young person,] shall be deemed to have neglected him in a manner likely to cause injury to his health if he has failed to provide adequate food, clothing, medical aid or lodging for him, or if, having been unable otherwise to provide such food, clothing, medical aid or lodging, he has failed to take steps to procure it to be provided under [F7the enactments applicable in that behalf];

(b)where it is proved that the death of an infant under three years of age was caused by suffocation (not being suffocation caused by disease or the presence of any foreign body in the throat or air passages of the infant) while the infant was in bed with some other person who has attained the age of sixteen years, that other person shall, if he was, when he went to bed, under the influence of drink, be deemed to have neglected the infant in a manner likely to cause injury to its health.

(3)A person may be convicted of an offence under this section—

(a)notwithstanding that actual suffering or injury to health, or the likelihood of actual suffering or injury to health, was obviated by the action of another person;

(b)notwithstanding the death of the child or young person in question.
Children and Young Persons Act 1933
So, now you gotta prove that it was willful and had nothing to do with genetics or socioeconomic status and the kid is not sneaking food.

Then you gotta prove no attempts were made to change the outcome and the unwillingness was there and the kid is facing severe health problems. Are there even services available in that local area? Then you gotta show how much better or healthier that kid is going to be in foster care. Just reading over UK stories, you're looking at extreme cases and those are few and far between.

The ball park moves whenever a child is killed. Every council has a Children Services department which is generally underfunded. The other thing is that social workers are hated by everybody. Too harsh or too lax they cannot win.
What we do know is that there a vast number of shit parents out there. You see it everywhere when you go out. I think we are lucky that there are so few damaged kids out there.

Kids that die and the knee jerk reaction that follows. Social workers aren't in charge of policy or law. They simply are the visible part of it. You can't just say people are shit parents, you have to be able to prove they are shit parents. Part of the problem with the system in the US and from what I can tell in the UK is that there is a huge amount of emotional crap rather than examining the policies themselves and sometimes the money influencing that policy.