Judge Bans Use Of “Illegal” and “Aliens”

[Againsheila]

" I like to be in America. OK by me in America..industry boom in America...12 in a room in America......I like to get home to San Juan...I know a boat you can get on....everyone there will give big cheer...everyone there will have moved here."

(Memory of some lyrics in the song, 'America' in West Side Story by Leonard Bernstein).
The Official West Side Story Site -- Lyrics -- America

There ya go, confusing immigrants with illegals again. It's legal for anyone in Puerto Rico to emmigrate here.

 

[Againsheila]

I think that illegal alien is also incorrect. Crossing the border illegally is illegal. But once you're here you pretty much fall under the innocent until proven guilty system. No one is actually illegal until they go through their immigration hearing and are told to leave (unless they actually leave).

So then a bank robber isn't really a bankrobber unless he gets caught?

 

[sky dancer]

This is where you and the dancing in the sky hippie lose the argument. A person that "sneaks" into the country "illegally" is NOT migrating. They are breaking the law which first and foremost makes them a criminal, and second, they are an alien to this country. Therefore, there is NO other term that more accurately describes this person than ILLEGAL ALIEN.

Now you and the dancing in the sky hippie can split hairs and spew psychobabble 'till you're blue in the face here, but you will NOT take ANYTHING away from the term ILLEGAL ALIEN as being 100% accurate.

It's as simple as this, you two are playing a little game, a little liberal word game, trying to polish a turd, and it's not working.

Are you the same fellow that Agnapostate knows from Stormfront?

 

[sky dancer]

There ya go, confusing immigrants with illegals again. It's legal for anyone in Puerto Rico to emmigrate here.

They are both immigrants--undocumented or illegal immigrants and legal immigrants.

They are not 'illegals'. Illegal is an adjective--immigrant is a noun. A noun is a part of speech that names personhood. Immigrants are persons. No one's personhood is illegal. Someone's immigration status can be legal or illegal.

Calling immigrants 'illegals' is a dehumanizing term and it works to whip up animosity and hatred.

 

[Againsheila]

They are both immigrants--undocumented or illegal immigrants and legal immigrants.

They are not 'illegals'. Illegal is an adjective--immigrant is a noun. A noun is a part of speech that names personhood. Immigrants are persons. No one's personhood is illegal. Someone's immigration status can be legal or illegal.

Calling immigrants 'illegals' is a dehumanizing term and it works to whip up animosity and hatred.

They are ILLEGAL ALIENS, here illegally, illegals is short for illegal alien. But of course, you want to call them immigrants which is an insult to all the real immigrants in our country, not to mention the millions of people who have been denied entry and didn't come here illegally.

 

[Murf76]

I'm not an attorney in Arizona, or anywhere else for that matter. But.. if I were, I would most definitely be sure to flout the court's preference. That way, if I lost my case... I could appeal on the basis of court bias against my use of non-preferred, albeit adequately descriptive, language.

Oh the tangled webs we weave when we attempt to be PC.

 

[Againsheila]

This thread is a great example of how we can argue all day about essentially nothing.

Arizona courts are agreed to use the term 'undocumented immigrant' instead of 'illegal aliens' in order that they not appear to be judicially biased. Good for them.

I prefer to use whatever term a minority group thinks is more respectful. Hispanic Journalists have requested that mainstream media use the term 'undocumented immigrants or illegal immigrants' rather than the terms 'illegals' or 'aliens'. I have no problem with using a more respectful term. I don't have much anger toward Mexican immigrants whether they are legal or illegally in the US.

Language does define the rhetoric in the political camps one side or the other.

Hard line nativists prefer to use the term 'illegals' and any other nasty words they can get away with. They use alot of the same arguments about 'illegals' as they call them that the Nazi's used to describe the Jews.

People who don't have strongly negative feelings toward Mexican immigrants be they legal or illegal will use the term 'undocumented migrant or immigrant". Whatever is convenient is what most of us prefer to use. It takes a little more work to use 'undocumented'. Some will use it and some will not.

Calling an illegal alien and undocumented immigrant is like calling a burglar an uninvited houseguest.

 

[Murf76]

This is where you and the dancing in the sky hippie lose the argument. A person that "sneaks" into the country "illegally" is NOT migrating. They are breaking the law which first and foremost makes them a criminal, and second, they are an alien to this country. Therefore, there is NO other term that more accurately describes this person than ILLEGAL ALIEN.

Now you and the dancing in the sky hippie can split hairs and spew psychobabble 'till you're blue in the face here, but you will NOT take ANYTHING away from the term ILLEGAL ALIEN as being 100% accurate.

It's as simple as this, you two are playing a little game, a little liberal word game, trying to polish a turd, and it's not working.

Great post. "Trying to polish a turd" ....both priceless and accurate. I'd offer a rep point if I could.

 

[sky dancer]

They are ILLEGAL ALIENS, here illegally, illegals is short for illegal alien. But of course, you want to call them immigrants which is an insult to all the real immigrants in our country, not to mention the millions of people who have been denied entry and didn't come here illegally.

I agree that they are illegal immigrants. The term alien is technically correct as well. Note that the word illegal is an adjective. It is not a noun. It is not correctly used as 'illegals'. 'Illegals' is not short for illegal immigrants. It's improper english. Whats the point of demanding that all American citizens speak english when we aren't willing to use correct english ourselves?

Perhaps some of the people who were denied entry and didn't come here illegally had other choices. Good for them.

They are all immigrants. Some are legal immigrants and some are illegal immigrants.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Oh, I know, we'll call them "citizens of other countries, invading ours".

Can't. I believe he also banned any reference to "invasion", as well.

As a resident - legal - of Arizona, I can assure you that there are groups now looking into ways to have this boob impeached.

Hello to everyone, by the way. Nice to meet you all.

 

[Againsheila]

I agree that they are illegal immigrants. The term alien is technically correct as well. Note that the word illegal is an adjective. It is not a noun. It is not correctly used as 'illegals'. 'Illegals' is not short for illegal immigrants. It's improper english. Whats the point of demanding that all American citizens speak english when we aren't willing to use correct english ourselves?

Perhaps some of the people who were denied entry and didn't come here illegally had other choices. Good for them.

They are all immigrants. Some are legal immigrants and some are illegal immigrants.

No, they're not. I don't care how much you try to swing it, you got it wrong. Illegal aliens are not Immigrants, to call them such is an insult to the real immigrants in our country and to the millions of people who were not allowed to immigrate here, including friends of my family that fled Hungary when the communists took over. It didn't matter that my father was career Air Force, he couldn't get them into this country. They lived out their lives in Canada. You insult them when you call an illegal alien an immigrant, it's a slap in the face to my sister in law and brother in law and many of my friends and other relatives. be careful, or they're gonna start slapping back.

 

[Ravi]

So then a bank robber isn't really a bankrobber unless he gets caught?

Convicted.

 

[Shogun]

thats bullshit and you know it, ravikins.. if I rape you in the ass I would still be a rapist regardless of my conviction. You and I both know this.

 

[Ravi]

thats bullshit and you know it, ravikins.. if I rape you in the ass I would still be a rapist regardless of my conviction. You and I both know this.

Not legally. Everyone is innocent until proven guilty simply because that's the way our court system works. But you'd be dead, so it wouldn't matter.

 

[Murf76]

Can't. I believe he also banned any reference to "invasion", as well.

As a resident - legal - of Arizona, I can assure you that there are groups now looking into ways to have this boob impeached.

Hello to everyone, by the way. Nice to meet you all.

Good for Arizonans. I can't imagine your courts don't have better things to worry about than kissing the asses of illegal immigration apologists.

Welcome to the forum, btw.

 

[sky dancer]

Can't. I believe he also banned any reference to "invasion", as well.

As a resident - legal - of Arizona, I can assure you that there are groups now looking into ways to have this boob impeached.

Hello to everyone, by the way. Nice to meet you all.

Nice to meet you. I hope this judge stays for a long time.

 

[sky dancer]

Calling an illegal alien and undocumented immigrant is like calling a burglar an uninvited houseguest.

I call them poor people who want to work.

 

[sky dancer]

No, they're not. I don't care how much you try to swing it, you got it wrong. Illegal aliens are not Immigrants, to call them such is an insult to the real immigrants in our country and to the millions of people who were not allowed to immigrate here, including friends of my family that fled Hungary when the communists took over. It didn't matter that my father was career Air Force, he couldn't get them into this country. They lived out their lives in Canada. You insult them when you call an illegal alien an immigrant, it's a slap in the face to my sister in law and brother in law and many of my friends and other relatives. be careful, or they're gonna start slapping back.

I don't know your family and I wouldn't and haven't slapped anyone in the face. Technically, I think you are right and I am wrong. I just looked up the definition of the word immigrant and it implies legal residence.

I stand corrected. The definition of 'immigrant' is someone who has become a lawful permanent resident. I checked and there is more than one dictionary definition. Here is another:
immigrant n. A person who leaves one country to settle permanently in another. With this definition, my reference to illegal or undocumented immigrants fits.

Please keep your relatives civil.

 

[Cecilie1200]

I call them poor people who want to work.

Of course you do. They aren't shutting down YOUR community hospitals and draining YOUR state budget.

 

[catzmeow]

I prefer to use whatever term a minority group thinks is more respectful.

I don't really care what term a group that disrespects the laws of my country by violating them with impunity cares is respectful. I'm going to use the term that accurately describes their presence here, which is ILLEGAL.