It's NOT just about Khashoggi...Trump should be ashamed

[WaitingFor2020]

This crappy Middle East policy is not new at all. If the US INSISTS on choosing allies in a bad neighborhood, then we are gonna look bad. ALL THE WAY back to 1970s. When Carter decided to remove the Shah of Iran.

This is just the blowback from our constant meddling and insistence on exerting our will on countries that don't share our values or process. We apparently never learn. Where where you when Arab Spring turned into Arab Apocalypse? Where were you when MILLIONS of refugees were fleeing Syria and we didn't have a coherent policy for stabilizing the situation?

This is just more partisan hypocrisy. If you're not willing to sit back and watch the normal amount of carnage and instability in the Arab world --- you're gonna have to choose some sides. And the choices are not very good.

BenDog just laid that out.

So -- what's YOUR solution 2020? Oh -- that's right. YOU DONT DO SOLUTIONS. You just badger and whine and get tied up in your constant partisan hypocrisy... No conversation here if YOU don't have the list of policies that we should apply to the Mid East..

All this time I thought it was the Iranian people who exiled the Shah --- now we definitely had a hand in putting him in power back in '53 --- but those were good old days, when we could pick and choose who we wanted to be leaders of other countries.

Actually, Jimmy Carter was the 1st US prez to take a state visit to Iran. Toasted to the monumental reforms that the Shah was making on "secularizing" the social policies and strengthening the economy. That was enough to piss off the religious nuts and within a couple years -- civil conflict broke out. All the support that the Shah had from US vanished because Brezinsky and Vance were split over support of the Shah or trying to reason with what THEY THOUGHT were liberals in the revolt. Carter didn't act or decide or take a side. And by our WITHDRAWAL of support, and lip service to the revolution and mixed messages, we ENCOURAGED the revolt.

If not that the rumors are correct and the CIA sided with Vance to support the insurrection..

We're involved when we interfere and tilt the natural preferences in that region. We can't "win" anything without supporting "bad guys". So there's some choices to make that don't involve finger-pointing and hypocritical partisan taunting.

Make them. Don't argue over political points.

Then Reagan came in, took credit for the hostage release and sold weapons to Iran, yea yea, we remember.

Speaking of the American hostages in Iran.... My cousin was one of them. He was a military attache'. So he got beat up pretty badly and on a regular basis.
He and the other 52 hostages settled with the feds a couple of years ago. He received something like $4M+
He's putting everybody's kid in his neighborhood through college.
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[WaitingFor2020]

It's not just about Khasshoggi, and Trump knows it.

Saudi Arabia Accused of Torturing Women Activists in Widening Crackdown on Dissent

"
Saudi security officers have tortured jailed women’s-rights activists as part of a government campaign to squelch criticism of Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman that began before last month’s killing of dissident journalist Jamal Khashoggi, according to people familiar with the situation,

At least eight of the 18 women’s-rights activists detained by Saudi authorities this year have been tortured, including at least four who were subjected to electric shocks and lashings, according to two advisers to the Saudi royal family,..."""

OH WAIT....TRUMP DOESN'T GIVE A SHIT ABOUT WOMEN.
SORRY, NEVER MIND.
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Gaslight.

Gaslight?
Facts are really getting harder for you to deal with, aren't they?
As the Trump cult order consumes the last few cells of your already shrunken brain.
This article isn't from Alex Jones, it's the Wall Street Journal.
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Your gaslighting is getting older than Trump.

You have nothing to add to this thread except personal attacks.
Reported for trolling, troll.

Enough with your extended gaslight. I’ve added the most important part which is your gaslighting on this subject. Can’t handle the truth I get it.

I'm just referring some facts to stupid fucks like you, directly from the Wall Street Journal.
It's above your reading level, obviously.
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[peach174]

This shit has been going on with the Saudis for decades.. geeze.

Yeah since FDR in 1933.

 

[B. Kidd]

This crappy Middle East policy is not new at all. If the US INSISTS on choosing allies in a bad neighborhood, then we are gonna look bad. ALL THE WAY back to 1970s. When Carter decided to remove the Shah of Iran.

This is just the blowback from our constant meddling and insistence on exerting our will on countries that don't share our values or process. We apparently never learn. Where where you when Arab Spring turned into Arab Apocalypse? Where were you when MILLIONS of refugees were fleeing Syria and we didn't have a coherent policy for stabilizing the situation?

This is just more partisan hypocrisy. If you're not willing to sit back and watch the normal amount of carnage and instability in the Arab world --- you're gonna have to choose some sides. And the choices are not very good.

BenDog just laid that out.

So -- what's YOUR solution 2020? Oh -- that's right. YOU DONT DO SOLUTIONS. You just badger and whine and get tied up in your constant partisan hypocrisy... No conversation here if YOU don't have the list of policies that we should apply to the Mid East..

All this time I thought it was the Iranian people who exiled the Shah --- now we definitely had a hand in putting him in power back in '53 --- but those were good old days, when we could pick and choose who we wanted to be leaders of other countries.

Actually, Jimmy Carter was the 1st US prez to take a state visit to Iran. Toasted to the monumental reforms that the Shah was making on "secularizing" the social policies and strengthening the economy. That was enough to piss off the religious nuts and within a couple years -- civil conflict broke out. All the support that the Shah had from US vanished because Brezinsky and Vance were split over support of the Shah or trying to reason with what THEY THOUGHT were liberals in the revolt. Carter didn't act or decide or take a side. And by our WITHDRAWAL of support, and lip service to the revolution and mixed messages, we ENCOURAGED the revolt.

If not that the rumors are correct and the CIA sided with Vance to support the insurrection..

We're involved when we interfere and tilt the natural preferences in that region. We can't "win" anything without supporting "bad guys". So there's some choices to make that don't involve finger-pointing and hypocritical partisan taunting.

Make them. Don't argue over political points.

Then Reagan came in, took credit for the hostage release and sold weapons to Iran, yea yea, we remember.

Speaking of the American hostages in Iran.... My cousin was one of them. He was a military attache'. So he got beat up pretty badly and on a regular basis.
He and the other 52 hostages settled with the feds a couple of years ago. He received something like $4M+
He's putting everybody's kid in his neighborhood through college.
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I call bullshit!

You're either on hallucinogens or saying any old shit on the interwebz, under a non de plume.

Only stupid assholes would fall for your crap, and I ain't one of them!

 

[flacaltenn]

This crappy Middle East policy is not new at all. If the US INSISTS on choosing allies in a bad neighborhood, then we are gonna look bad. ALL THE WAY back to 1970s. When Carter decided to remove the Shah of Iran.

This is just the blowback from our constant meddling and insistence on exerting our will on countries that don't share our values or process. We apparently never learn. Where where you when Arab Spring turned into Arab Apocalypse? Where were you when MILLIONS of refugees were fleeing Syria and we didn't have a coherent policy for stabilizing the situation?

This is just more partisan hypocrisy. If you're not willing to sit back and watch the normal amount of carnage and instability in the Arab world --- you're gonna have to choose some sides. And the choices are not very good.

BenDog just laid that out.

So -- what's YOUR solution 2020? Oh -- that's right. YOU DONT DO SOLUTIONS. You just badger and whine and get tied up in your constant partisan hypocrisy... No conversation here if YOU don't have the list of policies that we should apply to the Mid East..

Hey asshole,
My solution is we don't need money from people who murder and torture in the name of their sheik.
Trump says this country's economy is better than it's ever been before. Remember? Forget that already?
So why do we need blood on our hands?

Trump says he's a nationalist.
Globalism bad. Nationalism good.
Now he's ready to bend over and take blood money from one of the worst human-rights abusers on the planet.
That is the point of my post, in case you fucking can't read simple words.


His hypocrisy and self-serving bullshit just goes right over the point on the top of your fat head.
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You're confused. Globalism vs Nationalism is not the issue here. It's our US foreign policy with regards to the Middle East. You can be either a Globalist or a Nationalist and STILL you need a Foreign Policy.

So air head -- your solution is to ditch every dictatorial or brutal regime in the Middle East and punish them? Or cut off all relations with them? Just say so.. It's kinda the way I feel about it. But then there's no whining when Syria falls or Iran takes possession of 1/3 of Iraq or the ultimate Arab Caliphate finally forms with a domination of either Shia over Sunni or vice versa.

But your team hasn't had a real Mid East policy either in my lifetime. Wanted to depose dictators ONLY when the Blue Team was in power. Which you DID in Libya and TRIED to do in Syria because you turned on Assad like Carter turned on the Shah.

So WHAT IS your Mid East policy? Or can't you get out of cranial rectal insertion over Trump to even spend 3 minutes doing your OWN critical thinking on it?

 

[Remodeling Maidiac]

This crappy Middle East policy is not new at all. If the US INSISTS on choosing allies in a bad neighborhood, then we are gonna look bad. ALL THE WAY back to 1970s. When Carter decided to remove the Shah of Iran.

This is just the blowback from our constant meddling and insistence on exerting our will on countries that don't share our values or process. We apparently never learn. Where where you when Arab Spring turned into Arab Apocalypse? Where were you when MILLIONS of refugees were fleeing Syria and we didn't have a coherent policy for stabilizing the situation?

This is just more partisan hypocrisy. If you're not willing to sit back and watch the normal amount of carnage and instability in the Arab world --- you're gonna have to choose some sides. And the choices are not very good.

BenDog just laid that out.

So -- what's YOUR solution 2020? Oh -- that's right. YOU DONT DO SOLUTIONS. You just badger and whine and get tied up in your constant partisan hypocrisy... No conversation here if YOU don't have the list of policies that we should apply to the Mid East..

Hey asshole,
My solution is we don't need money from people who murder and torture in the name of their sheik.
Trump says this country's economy is better than it's ever been before. Remember? Forget that already?
So why do we need blood on our hands?

Trump says he's a nationalist.
Globalism bad. Nationalism good.
Now he's ready to bend over and take blood money from one of the worst human-rights abusers on the planet.
That is the point of my post, in case you fucking can't read simple words.


His hypocrisy and self-serving bullshit just goes right over the point on the top of your fat head.
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.
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You know what's hilarious? You really do think you know what you're talking about. You actually believe the tripe you are posting.

This shit with the muslims is DECADES OLD and even your precious leftist presidents were in bed with these barbarians just as deep. The muslims killed hundreds of thousands in the last decade. Some even Americans but not so much as a peep from the left. Hell Obama's idea of dealing with it was just hashtagging it away. Drew red lines in the sand and did nothing. Gave Iranians plane loads of cash. On and on it goes...

And this is the moment you choose to take a stand? For a single foreigner murdered on foreign soil...

You are a hack pure and simple. You have ZERO credibility on this issue

 

[flacaltenn]

This crappy Middle East policy is not new at all. If the US INSISTS on choosing allies in a bad neighborhood, then we are gonna look bad. ALL THE WAY back to 1970s. When Carter decided to remove the Shah of Iran.

This is just the blowback from our constant meddling and insistence on exerting our will on countries that don't share our values or process. We apparently never learn. Where where you when Arab Spring turned into Arab Apocalypse? Where were you when MILLIONS of refugees were fleeing Syria and we didn't have a coherent policy for stabilizing the situation?

This is just more partisan hypocrisy. If you're not willing to sit back and watch the normal amount of carnage and instability in the Arab world --- you're gonna have to choose some sides. And the choices are not very good.

BenDog just laid that out.

So -- what's YOUR solution 2020? Oh -- that's right. YOU DONT DO SOLUTIONS. You just badger and whine and get tied up in your constant partisan hypocrisy... No conversation here if YOU don't have the list of policies that we should apply to the Mid East..

All this time I thought it was the Iranian people who exiled the Shah --- now we definitely had a hand in putting him in power back in '53 --- but those were good old days, when we could pick and choose who we wanted to be leaders of other countries.

Actually, Jimmy Carter was the 1st US prez to take a state visit to Iran. Toasted to the monumental reforms that the Shah was making on "secularizing" the social policies and strengthening the economy. That was enough to piss off the religious nuts and within a couple years -- civil conflict broke out. All the support that the Shah had from US vanished because Brezinsky and Vance were split over support of the Shah or trying to reason with what THEY THOUGHT were liberals in the revolt. Carter didn't act or decide or take a side. And by our WITHDRAWAL of support, and lip service to the revolution and mixed messages, we ENCOURAGED the revolt.

If not that the rumors are correct and the CIA sided with Vance to support the insurrection..

We're involved when we interfere and tilt the natural preferences in that region. We can't "win" anything without supporting "bad guys". So there's some choices to make that don't involve finger-pointing and hypocritical partisan taunting.

Make them. Don't argue over political points.

Then Reagan came in, took credit for the hostage release and sold weapons to Iran, yea yea, we remember.

This tit for tat won't work with me. I started out by stating that Mid East foreign policy from EITHER tribe has sucked wads since I've been aware of the world. EVERY admin during that time has failed miserably to bring "democracy and enlightenment" to the region.

Because we never learned that the Arab world REQUIRES ruthless, shotgun waving maniacs as leaders to keep the killing down in the nation states that Western Imperialism IMPOSED on them after WW1... Those states don't represent the ethnic, sectarian, tribal, familial boundaries upon which Arabs PREFER to organize.

We created a monster that can't be controlled. Modern nation boundaries in the Mid East ARE the problem. And the Arabs are bound and determined to set new boundaries ---- one way or the other...

You want IN on that? Want to pick the winners and losers? I don't... But watching the realignments and constant destruction aint gonna be an option for an American people that think they can CONTROL those forces. We can't and we shouldn't..

 

[BasicHumanUnit]

When I see thread after thread at this forum, started by people like the OP of this one....I can't help but wonder where all the intelligent people have gone.
It's also painfully evident these lost souls have absolutely no life. So sad.