Israel’s right or not to exist – The facts and truth

[Jos]

On Monday 12 October, Prime Minister Netanyahu opened the Knesset’s winter session by blasting the Goldstone Report that accuses Israel of committing war crimes and vowing that he would never allow Israelis be tried for them. But that was not his main message. It was an appeal, delivered I thought with a measure of desperation, to the “Palestinian leadership”, presumably the leadership of “President” Abbas and his Fatah cronies, leaders who are regarded by very many if not most Palestinians as American-and-Israeli stooges at best and traitors at worst.

Netanyahu again called on this leadership to agree to recognise Israel as a Jewish state, saying this was, and remains, the key to peace. And he went on and on and on about it.

“For 62 years the Palestinians have been saying ‘No’ to the Jewish state. I am once again calling upon our Palestinian neighbours – say ‘Yes’ to the Jewish state. Without recognition of the Israel as the state of the Jews we shall not be able to attain peace… Such recognition is a step which requires courage and the Palestinian leadership should tell its people the truth – that without this recognition there can be no peace… There is no alternative to Palestinian leaders showing courage by recognising the Jewish state. This has been and remains the true key to peace.”

As Ha’aretz noted in its report, Netanyahu’s demand for Palestinian acceptance of Israel as a Jewish state is for him “a way on ensuring recognition of Israel’s right to exist as opposed to merely recognising Israel” (my emphasis). This, as Ha’aretz added, is the recognition which Netanyahu and many other Israelis see as the real core of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict.

In the name of pragmatism, willingness to “merely to recognise” Israel – meaning to accept and live in peace with an Israel inside its pre-June ’67 borders – has long been the formal Palestinian and all-Arab position. Why does it stop short of recognising Israel’s “right to exist”, and why, really, does it matter so much to Zionism that Palestinians recognise this right?

Israel?s right or not to exist ? The facts and truth « Aletho News

 

[irosie91]

On Monday 12 October, Prime Minister Netanyahu opened the Knesset’s winter session by blasting the Goldstone Report that accuses Israel of committing war crimes and vowing that he would never allow Israelis be tried for them. But that was not his main message. It was an appeal, delivered I thought with a measure of desperation, to the “Palestinian leadership”, presumably the leadership of “President” Abbas and his Fatah cronies, leaders who are regarded by very many if not most Palestinians as American-and-Israeli stooges at best and traitors at worst.

Netanyahu again called on this leadership to agree to recognise Israel as a Jewish state, saying this was, and remains, the key to peace. And he went on and on and on about it.

“For 62 years the Palestinians have been saying ‘No’ to the Jewish state. I am once again calling upon our Palestinian neighbours – say ‘Yes’ to the Jewish state. Without recognition of the Israel as the state of the Jews we shall not be able to attain peace… Such recognition is a step which requires courage and the Palestinian leadership should tell its people the truth – that without this recognition there can be no peace… There is no alternative to Palestinian leaders showing courage by recognising the Jewish state. This has been and remains the true key to peace.”

As Ha’aretz noted in its report, Netanyahu’s demand for Palestinian acceptance of Israel as a Jewish state is for him “a way on ensuring recognition of Israel’s right to exist as opposed to merely recognising Israel” (my emphasis). This, as Ha’aretz added, is the recognition which Netanyahu and many other Israelis see as the real core of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict.

In the name of pragmatism, willingness to “merely to recognise” Israel – meaning to accept and live in peace with an Israel inside its pre-June ’67 borders – has long been the formal Palestinian and all-Arab position. Why does it stop short of recognising Israel’s “right to exist”, and why, really, does it matter so much to Zionism that Palestinians recognise this right?

Israel?s right or not to exist ? The facts and truth « Aletho News[/QUOTE



the "right to exist" issue is important for a reason----- ---sluts and whores are very
impressionable------and when they have been told that putting bombs on their stinking whore asses in order to murder zionists is a GOOD thing that will get them a place in Jannah----they are impressionable enough to believe-----and since such a large percentage of the ummah is 'sluts and whores-----there has to be some effort to alter that MINDSET] Like a kind of offically recognized change in the policy of shariah shit holes

 

[Jos]

* In the first place the UN without the consent of the majority of the people of Palestine did not have the right to decide to partition Palestine or assign any part of its territory to a minority of alien immigrants in order for them to establish a state of their own.
* Despite that, by the narrowest of margins, and only after a rigged vote, the UN General Assembly did pass a resolution to partition Palestine and create two states, one Arab, one Jewish, with Jerusalem not part of either. But the General Assembly resolution was only a proposal – meaning that it could have no effect, would not become policy, unless approved by the Security Council.
* The truth is that the General Assembly’s partition proposal never went to the Security Council for consideration. Why not? Because the U.S. knew that, if approved, it could only be implemented by force given the extent of Arab and other Muslim opposition to it; and President Truman was not prepared to use force to partition Palestine.
* So the partition plan was vitiated (became invalid) and the question of what the hell to do about Palestine – after Britain had made a mess of it and walked away, effectively surrendering to Zionist terrorism – was taken back to the General Assembly for more discussion. The option favoured and proposed by the U.S. was temporary UN Trusteeship. It was while the General Assembly was debating what do that Israel unilaterally declared itself to be in existence – actually in defiance of the will of the organised international community, including the Truman administration.

The truth of the time was that the Zionist state, which came into being mainly as a consequence of pre-planned ethnic cleansing, had no right to exist and, more to the point, could have no right to exist UNLESS … Unless it was recognized and legitimized by those who were dispossessed of their land and their rights during the creation of the Zionist state. In international law only the Palestinians could give Israel the legitimacy it craved.

And that legitimacy was the only thing the Zionists could not and cannot take from the Palestinians by force.

No wonder Prime Minister Netanyahu is more than a little concerned on this account.

Israel’s leaders have always known the truth summarized above. It’s time for the rest of the world to know it.
Israel?s right or not to exist ? The facts and truth « Aletho News

 

[Roudy]

Take that Iranian Mullah dick out of your mouth and face the reality that Israel exists, like it or not, who gives a fuck.

 

[Jos]

Israel does Not have a right to exist, it only exists

 

[Jos]

The phrase “right to exist” entered my consciousness in the 1990s just as the concept of the two-state solution became part of our collective lexicon. In any debate at university, when a Zionist was out of arguments, those three magic words were invoked to shut down the conversation with an outraged, “are you saying Israel doesn’t have the right to exist??”

Of course you couldn’t challenge Israel’s right to exist – that was like saying you were negating a fundamental Jewish right to have… rights, with all manner of Holocaust guilt thrown in for effect.

Except of course the Holocaust is not my fault – or that of Palestinians. The cold-blooded program of ethnically cleansing Europe of its Jewish population has been so callously and opportunistically utilized to justify the ethnic cleansing of the Palestinian Arab nation, that it leaves me utterly unmoved. I have even caught myself – shock – rolling my eyes when I hear Holocaust and Israel in the same sentence.

What moves me instead in this post-two-state era, is the sheer audacity of Israel even existing.

What a fantastical idea, this notion that a bunch of rank outsiders from another continent could appropriate an existing, populated nation for themselves – and convince the “global community” that it was the moral thing to do. I’d laugh at the chutzpah if this wasn’t so serious.

Even more brazen is the mass ethnic cleansing of the indigenous Palestinian population by persecuted Jews, newly arrived from their own experience of being ethnically cleansed.

But what is truly frightening is the psychological manipulation of the masses into believing that Palestinians are somehow dangerous – “terrorists” intent on “driving Jews into the sea.” As someone who makes a living through words, I find the use of language in creating perceptions to be intriguing. This practice – often termed “public diplomacy” has become an essential tool in the world of geopolitics. Words, after all, are the building blocks of our psychology.

Take, for example, the way we have come to view the Palestinian-Israeli “dispute” and any resolution of this enduring conflict. And here I borrow liberally from a previous article of mine…

The United States and Israel have created the global discourse on this issue, setting stringent parameters that grow increasingly narrow regarding the content and direction of this debate. Anything discussed outside the set parameters has, until recently, widely been viewed as unrealistic, unproductive and even subversive.

Participation in the debate is limited only to those who prescribe to its main tenets: the acceptance of Israel, its regional hegemony and its qualitative military edge; acceptance of the shaky logic upon which the Jewish state’s claim to Palestine is based; and acceptance of the inclusion and exclusion of certain regional parties, movements and governments in any solution to the conflict.[/QUOTE
Excuse Me, But Israel Has No Right To Exist « Aletho News

 

[RoccoR]

Jos, et al,

This is nothing but a restatement of the standard argument put forth by all pro-Palestinian broadcasters. There is absolutely nothing new here.

* In the first place the UN without the consent of the majority of the people of Palestine did not have the right to decide to partition Palestine or assign any part of its territory to a minority of alien immigrants in order for them to establish a state of their own.
* Despite that, by the narrowest of margins, and only after a rigged vote, the UN General Assembly did pass a resolution to partition Palestine and create two states, one Arab, one Jewish, with Jerusalem not part of either. But the General Assembly resolution was only a proposal – meaning that it could have no effect, would not become policy, unless approved by the Security Council.
* The truth is that the General Assembly’s partition proposal never went to the Security Council for consideration. Why not? Because the U.S. knew that, if approved, it could only be implemented by force given the extent of Arab and other Muslim opposition to it; and President Truman was not prepared to use force to partition Palestine.
* So the partition plan was vitiated (became invalid) and the question of what the hell to do about Palestine – after Britain had made a mess of it and walked away, effectively surrendering to Zionist terrorism – was taken back to the General Assembly for more discussion. The option favoured and proposed by the U.S. was temporary UN Trusteeship. It was while the General Assembly was debating what do that Israel unilaterally declared itself to be in existence – actually in defiance of the will of the organised international community, including the Truman administration.

The truth of the time was that the Zionist state, which came into being mainly as a consequence of pre-planned ethnic cleansing, had no right to exist and, more to the point, could have no right to exist UNLESS … Unless it was recognized and legitimized by those who were dispossessed of their land and their rights during the creation of the Zionist state. In international law only the Palestinians could give Israel the legitimacy it craved.

And that legitimacy was the only thing the Zionists could not and cannot take from the Palestinians by force.

No wonder Prime Minister Netanyahu is more than a little concerned on this account.

Israel’s leaders have always known the truth summarized above. It’s time for the rest of the world to know it.
Israel?s right or not to exist ? The facts and truth « Aletho News

(COMMENT)

At the end of the war, the Allied Command decided who's in charge.

The Palestinians say its illegal - and - the UN says it's not.

It was done the way the UN decided at the time. They made the laws, and they defined what they mean and what they can do. There was no country of Palestine. An alternative was offered, and the Palestinians declined. It is as simple as that.

Israel did not decline. The applied and was granted membership.

This is a dispute that will never end until either the Palestinians want peace, or they're all dead. The Palestinians in one corner playing the permanent victim and the Israelis in the other corner swatting at the flies.

But the argument really doesn't change much.

Also, Remember that Aletho News is an anti-Jewish/anti-AIPAC; and Gilad Atzmon, who wrote the book Jewish Identity Politics, assigns himself the label of Proud "Self Hating Jew." Now, I will give you a link to better understand their philosophy. Everyone, pro and con, should view the videos. LINK: http://thepassionateattachment.com/2013/01/01/gilad-atzmon-on-jewish-identity-politics/

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[Lipush]

Israel exists and no one has the right to tell us it is NOT our right to exist. Case closed. Anyone saying we have NO right to exist is the worst kind of Nazi.

 

[Jos]

Israel exists and no one has the right to tell us it is NOT our right to exist. Case closed. Anyone saying we have NO right to exist is the worst kind of Nazi.

Oh and an anti-semenite bad person, get real

Words like dove, hawk, militant, extremist, moderates, terrorists, Islamo-fascists, rejectionists, existential threat, holocaust-denier, mad mullah determine the participation of solution partners — and are capable of instantly excluding others.

Then there is the language that preserves “Israel’s Right To Exist” unquestioningly: anything that invokes the Holocaust, anti-Semitism and the myths about historic Jewish rights to the land bequeathed to them by the Almighty – as though God was in the real-estate business. This language seeks not only to ensure that a Jewish connection to Palestine remains unquestioned, but importantly, seeks to punish and marginalize those who tackle the legitimacy of this modern colonial-settler experiment.

But this group-think has led us nowhere. It has obfuscated, distracted, deflected, ducked, and diminished, and we are no closer to a satisfactory conclusion… because the premise is wrong.

There is no fixing this problem. This is the kind of crisis in which you cut your losses, realize the error of your ways and reverse course. Israel is the problem. It is the last modern-day colonial-settler experiment, conducted at a time when these projects were being unraveled globally.

There is no “Palestinian-Israeli conflict” – that suggests some sort of equality in power, suffering, and negotiable tangibles, and there is no symmetry whatsoever in this equation. Israel is the Occupier and Oppressor; Palestinians are the Occupied and Oppressed. What is there to negotiate? Israel holds all the chips. They can give back some land, property, rights, but even that is an absurdity – what about everything else? What about ALL the land, property and rights? Why do they get to keep anything – how is the appropriation of land and property prior to 1948 fundamentally different from the appropriation of land and property on this arbitrary 1967 date?

Why are the colonial-settlers prior to 1948 any different from those who colonized and settled after 1967?

Let me correct myself. Palestinians do hold one chip that Israel salivates over – the one big demand at the negotiating table that seems to hold up everything else. Israel craves recognition of its “right to exist.”

But you do exist – don’t you, Israel?

Israel fears “delegitimization” more than anything else. Behind the velvet curtain lies a state built on myths and narratives, protected only by a military behemoth, billions of dollars in US assistance and a lone UN Security Council veto. Nothing else stands between the state and its dismantlement. Without these three things, Israelis would not live in an entity that has come to be known as the “least safe place for Jews in the world.”

Strip away the spin and the gloss, and you quickly realize that Israel doesn’t even have the basics of a normal state. After 64 years, it doesn’t have borders. After six decades, it has never been more isolated. Over half a century later, and it needs a gargantuan military just to stop Palestinians from walking home.

Israel is a failed experiment. It is on life-support – pull those three plugs and it is a cadaver, living only in the minds of some seriously deluded foreigners who thought they could pull off the heist of the century.

The most important thing we can do as we hover on the horizon of One State is to shed the old language rapidly. None of it was real anyway – it was just the parlance of that particular “game.” Grow a new vocabulary of possibilities – the new state will be the dawn of humanity’s great reconciliation. Muslims, Christians and Jews living together in Palestine as they once did.

Naysayers can take a hike. Our patience is wearing thinner than the walls of the hovels that Palestinian refugees have called “home” for three generations in their purgatory camps.

These universally exploited refugees are entitled to the nice apartments – the ones that have pools downstairs and a grove of palm trees outside the lobby. Because the kind of compensation owed for this failed western experiment will never be enough.

And no, nobody hates Jews. That is the fallback argument screeched in our ears – the one “firewall” remaining to protect this Israeli Frankenstein. I don’t even care enough to insert the caveats that are supposed to prove I don’t hate Jews. It is not a provable point, and frankly, it is a straw man of an argument. If Jews who didn’t live through the Holocaust still feel the pain of it, then take that up with the Germans. Demand a sizable plot of land in Germany – and good luck to you.

For anti-Semites salivating over an article that slams Israel, ply your trade elsewhere – you are part of the reason this problem exists.

Israelis who don’t want to share Palestine as equal citizens with the indigenous Palestinian population – the ones who don’t want to relinquish that which they demanded Palestinians relinquish 64 years ago – can take their second passports and go back home. Those remaining had better find a positive attitude – Palestinians have shown themselves to be a forgiving lot. The amount of carnage they have experienced at the hands of their oppressors – without proportional response – shows remarkable restraint and faith.

This is less the death of a Jewish state than it is the demise of the last remnants of modern-day colonialism. It is a rite of passage – we will get through it just fine. At this particular precipice in the 21st century, we are all, universally, Palestinian – undoing this wrong is a test of our collective humanity, and nobody has the right to sit this one out.

Israel has no right to exist. Break that mental barrier and just say it: “Israel has no right to exist.” Roll it around your tongue, tweet it, post it as your Facebook status update – do it before you think twice. Delegitimization is here – have no fear. Palestine will be less painful than Israel ever was.

Excuse Me, But Israel Has No Right To Exist « Aletho News

 

[Lipush]

Excuse me, but we don't give a #$%^ of what haters think or not. We exist. Sucks for you. Case closed.

 

[MHunterB]

Poor Jossy! Can't tell a blog from a legitimate news source!

And this particular one is chock-full of anti-American propaganda - including an 'article' blasting the US for laying the blame for the Syrian university blast on Assad's bully boys.

So one is led to suppose that Jossy is also a supporter of Baby Assad. Interesting. I think Assad's murdered more Syrians already than Israel has killed Arabs in all the wars it's had to fight.

 

[Jos]

Its about israel maggie

 

[Meathead]

Israel does Not have a right to exist, it only exists

The concept of a "right to exist" is the irrational fodder of fools. Existence, by its very essence makes that so.

 

[Jos]

Israel does Not have a right to exist, it only exists

The concept of a "right to exist" is the irrational fodder of fools. Existence, by its very essence makes that so.

Courts of law exist, whether you chose to submit to them depends on you, why would israel demand you respect their right to exit?

 

[toastman]

What a stupid thread , with absolutely NO NEW information here.

Palestine doesn't have the right to exist. Oh wait, they already don't exist, sorry

 

[Meathead]

Israel does Not have a right to exist, it only exists

The concept of a "right to exist" is the irrational fodder of fools. Existence, by its very essence makes that so.

Courts of law exist, whether you chose to submit to them depends on you, why would israel demand you respect their right to exit?

Existence is not subject to government or court.. The question and its premise is, once again, the fodder of fools.

 

[irosie91]

The concept of a "right to exist" is the irrational fodder of fools. Existence, by its very essence makes that so.

Courts of law exist, whether you chose to submit to them depends on you, why would israel demand you respect their right to exit?

Existence is not subject to government or court.. The question and its premise is, once again, the fodder of fools.

According to ISLAMIC LAW--- According to islamic THEOLOGY----Israel has no right
to exist It is a TEACHING not much different from the DEICIDE MYTH that
galvanized murders of millions of jews and was finally albeit incompletely
ameliorated by
Pope John XIII... Jews have extensive experience the genocidal teachings of both
some christian ideologies and ---also ISLAM. A recognition of the FACT and
REPUDIATION thereof is just as important for jews as is a repudiation of an
erstwhile belief that blacks were born to be slaves ---or a repudiation of the
caste system of hinduism. I support a repudiation of a system that,
historically has resulted in the decimation of jewish populations in MANY
countries afflicted with islam and has encouraged young muslims to
sneak into the homes of jews and slit the throats of infants ---and even
shoot jews down on the streets of cities outside of Israel ----as an
act of PIETY

 

[Book of Jeremiah]

Israel exists and no one has the right to tell us it is NOT our right to exist. Case closed. Anyone saying we have NO right to exist is the worst kind of Nazi.

I agree!

- Jeremiah

 

[irosie91]

a theoretical would it be ok if some -- "group" ---- decided to teach its children
that a good way to go to PARADISE and to get extra money for one's family is
by slitting the throat of a muslim infant?

 

[sealadaigh]

Israel exists and no one has the right to tell us it is NOT our right to exist. Case closed. Anyone saying we have NO right to exist is the worst kind of Nazi.

out there in whatever cowtown you and jerimiah are from, you may not have free speech, but do not try to tell me, or any other american, to give up their first amendment rights.

the worst kind of NAZI is the one who tries, as hitler did, to prohibit the exercise of free speech.