Independents Will Decide the Election

[Toro]

And of all the Republican candidates, they favor Romney.

More Americans now call themselves independents than Democrats or Republicans, ... our best estimate is that the share of independents nationally has grown to 42% from 35% over the past three years. That 7% of the electorate is big enough to have changed the outcome of any of the last five presidential elections—and this is not necessarily good news for the GOP.

Barack Obama carried independents by an eight-point margin in the 2008 exit poll—and Republicans carried them by a 19-point margin in the 2010 midterms. Thus GOP candidates may be tempted to believe the independents' disaffection with the president that cost Democrats control of the House will lead inexorably to a Republican presidential victory this year.

Not so fast. In the first place, Republicans benefited from a low Democratic midterm turnout. According to exit polls, there were about equal numbers of Democratic and Republican voters in the midterm, unlike 2008 when Democratic voters outnumbered Republicans by seven percentage points (39% to 32%). Republicans can't count on a low Democratic turnout in 2012 and there are still more registered Democrats than Republicans. To win in 2012, it's good enough for Democrats to split the independent vote. Republicans need to carry a clear majority. And there are significant policy disagreements between independents and the Republican base.

Take, for example, a YouGov survey conducted on Dec. 22. After the economy (which all voters said was their No. 1 concern), the next most important issues for Democrats are Social Security, Medicare and the environment. For each, their preference is for the federal government to do more. For Republicans, the next most important issues are the budget deficit, taxes and immigration and, for the first two, they want the federal government to do less.

Independents, on the other hand, say that health care and education are more important. They tend to worry about what the federal government does in each area, but unlike the Republican base they are not opposed in principle to federal action.

On ObamaCare, for example, independents oppose repeal 40%-33% while Republicans favor 62%-23% and Democrats oppose 46%-27%, according to a Nov. 12 YouGov survey. And in an Oct. 29 YouGov survey, independents opposed cutting federal education spending 56%-20% while Republicans favored reductions 39%-29%. Democrats opposed cutting spending 67%-8%.

Independents are usually closer to Republicans than Democrats on the general issue of the size of government and government spending. In a Nov. 22 YouGov poll, 76% of independents favored decreasing federal spending and almost half would include entitlements within these cuts.

On the other hand, they are closer to Democrats on raising taxes: 36% of independents favored increasing taxes across the board versus 43% of Democrats and 7% of Republicans.

Moreover, a Sept. 27 YouGov poll revealed overwhelming support for raising taxes on the wealthy: 55% of independents favored raising taxes on families earning over $250,000 (versus 43% of Democrats and 7% of Republicans), and 72% of independents favored raising taxes on families earning more than $1 million (versus 88% of Democrats and 46% of Republicans).

Among the leading Republican presidential candidates Mitt Romney has consistently done the best among independents nationally. He normally splits the independent vote with President Obama (38% to 38% in the Dec. 22 YouGov poll), while Newt Gringrich trails among independents by 13 points. But to win, Mr. Romney would have to do better than split the independent vote. ...

David Brady: Will Independents Vote GOP In 2012? - WSJ.com

 

[PredFan]

I blame the independants for screwing up this country. They gave us Bush and Obama.

 

[California Girl]

Interestingly, on my way back from the US over the weekend, I stayed overnight in London. Went out with some friends and met an American woman living in London. We got to talking politics. She said "you know that joke about voting for Obama in '08 to prove you're not racist, and not voting for him in '12 to prove you're not stupid?"

"Yea", I said "I've heard that joke".

"Well, that's me" she said.

Independents absolutely will decide the outcome of '12. And, God willing, they'll remember that joke.

 

[truthsaga]

I believe if you look at latest polling and the election results from Iowa, it may be a toss up between Romney and Paul. Paul's support has grown the Republican base as well in Iowa he won the independent vote 3 to 1.

 

[VaYank5150]

I believe if you look at latest polling and the election results from Iowa, it may be a toss up between Romney and Paul. Paul's support has grown the Republican base as well in Iowa he won the independent vote 3 to 1.

Ron Paul is not electable. Most of us Independents already know this. If the GOP had not been so scared of Obama, they would have let their good candidates run in 2012, rather than shelving them for 2016. Instead, we are stuck with the dreadful field you see in front of you. Independents WILL decide this election, just as we typically have decided every other one. As with the GOP's stupid decision to pair McCain with Palin because they thought Independent voters were too stupid to see through their ploy, the GOP's stupid decision to hold their best back from the 2012 election will help to deliver their defeat from the jaws of victory.

 

[CaughtInTheMid]

Independents decide most Presidential elections. But the parties give them the sorry choices.

 

[truthsaga]

I believe if you look at latest polling and the election results from Iowa, it may be a toss up between Romney and Paul. Paul's support has grown the Republican base as well in Iowa he won the independent vote 3 to 1.

Ron Paul is not electable. Most of us Independents already know this. If the GOP had not been so scared of Obama, they would have let their good candidates run in 2012, rather than shelving them for 2016. Instead, we are stuck with the dreadful field you see in front of you. Independents WILL decide this election, just as we typically have decided every other one. As with the GOP's stupid decision to pair McCain with Palin because they thought Independent voters were to stupid to see through their ploy, the GOP's stupid decision to hold their best back from the 2012 election will deliver their defeat from the jaws of victory.

Ron Paul / Mitt Romney do best against Obama
Poll: Among GOP hopefuls, Romney fares best against Obama - Political Hotsheet - CBS News

Ron Paul is unelectable because you believe the opinion molders. He challenges the big business policies of both political parties. It is disgusting to see how the political process is being undermined by the media on both sides of the spectrum. If you feel he is unelectable why do they not even report on his polling numbers when he is tied in first or second?

Why does he need to be shunned and never reported fairly upon?

You may disagree with Ron Paul and that's fine, but do you think it is fair to the process that he does not receive fair media coverage or even have his polling / fundraising results displayed?

He raises more money from the military then all other GOP candidates combined and it doesn't get reported.

In NH, he is polling second, but many news channels just took him out of the reporting and displayed the 3rd place Huntsman as second place.

MASSIVE Manipulation of Headlines To Affect NH Vote - non-Event to spur fake momentum

 

[VaYank5150]

I believe if you look at latest polling and the election results from Iowa, it may be a toss up between Romney and Paul. Paul's support has grown the Republican base as well in Iowa he won the independent vote 3 to 1.

Ron Paul is not electable. Most of us Independents already know this. If the GOP had not been so scared of Obama, they would have let their good candidates run in 2012, rather than shelving them for 2016. Instead, we are stuck with the dreadful field you see in front of you. Independents WILL decide this election, just as we typically have decided every other one. As with the GOP's stupid decision to pair McCain with Palin because they thought Independent voters were to stupid to see through their ploy, the GOP's stupid decision to hold their best back from the 2012 election will deliver their defeat from the jaws of victory.

Ron Paul / Mitt Romney do best against Obama
Poll: Among GOP hopefuls, Romney fares best against Obama - Political Hotsheet - CBS News

Ron Paul is unelectable because you believe the opinion molders. He challenges the big business policies of both political parties. It is disgusting to see how the political process is being undermined by the media on both sides of the spectrum. If you feel he is unelectable why do they not even report on his polling numbers when he is tied in first or second?

Why does he need to be shunned and never reported fairly upon?

You may disagree with Ron Paul and that's fine, but do you think it is fair to the process that he does not receive fair media coverage or even have his polling / fundraising results displayed?

He raises more money from the military then all other GOP candidates combined and it doesn't get reported.

In NH, he is polling second, but many news channels just took him out of the reporting and displayed the 3rd place Huntsman as second place.

MASSIVE Manipulation of Headlines To Affect NH Vote - non-Event to spur fake momentum

No....the reason Ron Paul is unelectable is because he says stupid things, and we Independent voters actually LISTEN:

"The people that want big fences and guns, sure, we could secure the border. A barbed wire fence with machine guns, that would do the trick. I don't believe that is what America is all about ... Every time you think about the fence, think about the fences being used against us, keeping us in." –arguing that a border fence could be used against Americans, September 2011

"You want to get rid of drug crime in this country? Fine, let's just get rid of all the drug laws." -2011 CNN Republican presidential debate

"How about getting rid of the Department of Education and Department of Agriculture. Just go down the list. Get rid of it. Cut the budget in half. Everything that's not constitutional. That's a good place to start." –MSNBC interview, 2009

"Given the inefficiencies of what D.C. laughingly calls the `criminal justice system,' I think we can safely assume that 95 percent of the black males in that city are semi-criminal or entirely criminal." -1992 newsletter

"I miss the closet. Homosexuals, not to speak of the rest of society, were far better off when social pressure forced them to hide their activities. They could also not be as promiscuous. Is it any wonder the AIDS epidemic started after they 'came out of the closet,' and started hyper-promiscuous sodomy?" -1990 newsletter

"An ex-cop I know advises that if you have to use a gun on a youth, you should leave the scene immediately, disposing of the wiped off gun as soon as possible. Such a gun cannot, of course, be registered to you, but one bought privately (through the classifieds, for example)." -1992 newsletter

"Welfaria," "Zooville," "Rapetown," "Dirtburg," "Lazyopolis." –suggestions for renaming New York city

"[Martin Luther King, Jr.], the FBI files reveal, was not only a world-class adulterer, he also seduced underage girls and boys…And we are supposed to honor this 'Christian minister' and lying socialist satyr with a holiday that puts him on par with George Washington?" -1990 newsletter

"Order was only restored in L.A. when it came time for the blacks to pick up their welfare checks." –1992 newsletter on the Los Angeles riots following the Rodney King verdict

"Boy, it sure burns me to have a national holiday for that pro-communist philanderer, Martin Luther King. I voted against this outrage time and time again as a Congressmen [sic]. What an infamy that Ronald Reagan approved it! We can thank him for our annual Hate Whitey Day." –newsletter, date unknown

"We don't think a child of 13 should be held responsible as a man of 23. That's true for most people, but black males age 13 who have been raised on the streets and who have joined criminal gangs are as big, strong, tough, scary and culpable as any adult and should be treated as such." - 1992 newsletter

"Whether [the 1993 World Trade Center bombing] was a setup by the Israeli Mossad, as a Jewish friend of mine suspects, or was truly a retaliation by the Islamic fundamentalists, matters little." -1993 newsletter

"If you have ever been robbed by a black teen-aged male, you know how unbelievably fleet-footed they can be." -1992 newsletter

"[AIDS sufferers] enjoy the attention and pity that comes with being sick."

"[It is the] destruction of civilization." –on the end of apartheid in South Africa

"When the New Money is imposed, every American family must have a Survival Kit of highly liquid, small-denomination silver and gold coins for hand-to-hand use. The Ron Paul Survival Kit — now an industry standard — comes in an official World War II US Army ammo holder." -ad for 'The Original Famous Ron Paul Survival Kit,' undated

Interviewer: "In the last interview we did with a Libertarian candidate for President, he said you that would abolish the CIA, the FBI, and the IRS. Do you hold those same positions?"
Ron Paul: "Yes, I do -- because you know, most of our history, we didn't have those institutions"

"After years of trying to work through the Republican Party both in and out of government, I have reluctantly concluded that my efforts must be carried on outside the Republican Party......I therefore resign my membership in the Republican Party and enclose my membership card." -in 1987

 

[truthsaga]

Ron Paul is not electable. Most of us Independents already know this. If the GOP had not been so scared of Obama, they would have let their good candidates run in 2012, rather than shelving them for 2016. Instead, we are stuck with the dreadful field you see in front of you. Independents WILL decide this election, just as we typically have decided every other one. As with the GOP's stupid decision to pair McCain with Palin because they thought Independent voters were to stupid to see through their ploy, the GOP's stupid decision to hold their best back from the 2012 election will deliver their defeat from the jaws of victory.

Ron Paul / Mitt Romney do best against Obama
Poll: Among GOP hopefuls, Romney fares best against Obama - Political Hotsheet - CBS News

Ron Paul is unelectable because you believe the opinion molders. He challenges the big business policies of both political parties. It is disgusting to see how the political process is being undermined by the media on both sides of the spectrum. If you feel he is unelectable why do they not even report on his polling numbers when he is tied in first or second?

Why does he need to be shunned and never reported fairly upon?

You may disagree with Ron Paul and that's fine, but do you think it is fair to the process that he does not receive fair media coverage or even have his polling / fundraising results displayed?

He raises more money from the military then all other GOP candidates combined and it doesn't get reported.

In NH, he is polling second, but many news channels just took him out of the reporting and displayed the 3rd place Huntsman as second place.

MASSIVE Manipulation of Headlines To Affect NH Vote - non-Event to spur fake momentum

No....the reason Ron Paul is unelectable is because he says stupid things, and we Independent voters actually LISTEN:

"The people that want big fences and guns, sure, we could secure the border. A barbed wire fence with machine guns, that would do the trick. I don't believe that is what America is all about ... Every time you think about the fence, think about the fences being used against us, keeping us in." –arguing that a border fence could be used against Americans, September 2011

"You want to get rid of drug crime in this country? Fine, let's just get rid of all the drug laws." -2011 CNN Republican presidential debate

"How about getting rid of the Department of Education and Department of Agriculture. Just go down the list. Get rid of it. Cut the budget in half. Everything that's not constitutional. That's a good place to start." –MSNBC interview, 2009

"Given the inefficiencies of what D.C. laughingly calls the `criminal justice system,' I think we can safely assume that 95 percent of the black males in that city are semi-criminal or entirely criminal." -1992 newsletter

"I miss the closet. Homosexuals, not to speak of the rest of society, were far better off when social pressure forced them to hide their activities. They could also not be as promiscuous. Is it any wonder the AIDS epidemic started after they 'came out of the closet,' and started hyper-promiscuous sodomy?" -1990 newsletter

"An ex-cop I know advises that if you have to use a gun on a youth, you should leave the scene immediately, disposing of the wiped off gun as soon as possible. Such a gun cannot, of course, be registered to you, but one bought privately (through the classifieds, for example)." -1992 newsletter

"Welfaria," "Zooville," "Rapetown," "Dirtburg," "Lazyopolis." –suggestions for renaming New York city

"[Martin Luther King, Jr.], the FBI files reveal, was not only a world-class adulterer, he also seduced underage girls and boys…And we are supposed to honor this 'Christian minister' and lying socialist satyr with a holiday that puts him on par with George Washington?" -1990 newsletter

"Order was only restored in L.A. when it came time for the blacks to pick up their welfare checks." –1992 newsletter on the Los Angeles riots following the Rodney King verdict

"Boy, it sure burns me to have a national holiday for that pro-communist philanderer, Martin Luther King. I voted against this outrage time and time again as a Congressmen [sic]. What an infamy that Ronald Reagan approved it! We can thank him for our annual Hate Whitey Day." –newsletter, date unknown

"We don't think a child of 13 should be held responsible as a man of 23. That's true for most people, but black males age 13 who have been raised on the streets and who have joined criminal gangs are as big, strong, tough, scary and culpable as any adult and should be treated as such." - 1992 newsletter

"Whether [the 1993 World Trade Center bombing] was a setup by the Israeli Mossad, as a Jewish friend of mine suspects, or was truly a retaliation by the Islamic fundamentalists, matters little." -1993 newsletter

"If you have ever been robbed by a black teen-aged male, you know how unbelievably fleet-footed they can be." -1992 newsletter

"[AIDS sufferers] enjoy the attention and pity that comes with being sick."

"[It is the] destruction of civilization." –on the end of apartheid in South Africa

"When the New Money is imposed, every American family must have a Survival Kit of highly liquid, small-denomination silver and gold coins for hand-to-hand use. The Ron Paul Survival Kit — now an industry standard — comes in an official World War II US Army ammo holder." -ad for 'The Original Famous Ron Paul Survival Kit,' undated

Interviewer: "In the last interview we did with a Libertarian candidate for President, he said you that would abolish the CIA, the FBI, and the IRS. Do you hold those same positions?"
Ron Paul: "Yes, I do -- because you know, most of our history, we didn't have those institutions"

"After years of trying to work through the Republican Party both in and out of government, I have reluctantly concluded that my efforts must be carried on outside the Republican Party......I therefore resign my membership in the Republican Party and enclose my membership card." -in 1987

He speaks about intellectual ideas that take more than a brochure or talking point guide to register. That is why trying to hope that no one will look into the substance of what he is saying, because if they did they know he is speaking the truth.

This is in 2002, take 5 minutes. His ideas come from wisdom, sound principles, and an understanding of what made the American experiment what it is today. These are not stupid things.

Ron Paul - Predictions in Due Time (Original) - YouTube

That's why his support is solid. This is why the attacks and blackouts against Ron Paul are not working.

I am an independent voter and I support Ron Paul.

 

[Vel]

I believe if you look at latest polling and the election results from Iowa, it may be a toss up between Romney and Paul. Paul's support has grown the Republican base as well in Iowa he won the independent vote 3 to 1.

Ron Paul is not electable. Most of us Independents already know this. If the GOP had not been so scared of Obama, they would have let their good candidates run in 2012, rather than shelving them for 2016. Instead, we are stuck with the dreadful field you see in front of you. Independents WILL decide this election, just as we typically have decided every other one. As with the GOP's stupid decision to pair McCain with Palin because they thought Independent voters were too stupid to see through their ploy, the GOP's stupid decision to hold their best back from the 2012 election will help to deliver their defeat from the jaws of victory.

^ Independent?

 

[Avatar4321]

Yeah Independent.. hahaha.

 

[Wiseacre]

Everybody is in favor of raising someone else's taxes and cutting someone else's spending. Always been that way, always will be until we go over the economic cliff. And maybe after that if we don't learn to live within our means both privately and publicly. Right now there is no willingness on either side to give up something, so in the end it may not make much difference who wins. It's just a matter of time, that's all.

 

[truthsaga]

Everybody is in favor of raising someone else's taxes and cutting someone else's spending. Always been that way, always will be until we go over the economic cliff. And maybe after that if we don't learn to live within our means both privately and publicly. Right now there is no willingness on either side to give up something, so in the end it may not make much difference who wins. It's just a matter of time, that's all.

The commander and chief can repeal regulations and undo executive orders of previous administrations as well as bring the troops homes. Their is billions if not a trillion dollars in savings to help here at home, while our economy has the real recession (liquidation of bad debt) and resets moving forward.

 

[Dot Com]

Hear that extreme righties? That means no Newt, Santorum, Perry, etc.... IF you want a fighting chance of getting a conservative in the WH.

 

[Wiseacre]

I for one do not want an extreme righty in the WH, any more than I want the extreme lefty that's in there now.

 

[Avatar4321]

Hear that extreme righties? That means no Newt, Santorum, Perry, etc.... IF you want a fighting chance of getting a conservative in the WH.

Newt is hardly a strong conservative. He is probably the most progressive candidate in the race.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Obama is radioactive to all my Jewish relatives, many of whom voted for the peckerhead in '08

 

[bripat9643]

And of all the Republican candidates, they favor Romney.

It doesn't matter which Republican the independents favor. They don't vote in Republican primaries.

Most Republicans don't like Romney because he's a RINO.

 

[rightwinger]

Independents and moderates will select Romney, just like they selected McCain

As usual, the far right will whine and force Romney into an unwinable platform

 

[DaGoose]

And of all the Republican candidates, they favor Romney.

It doesn't matter which Republican the independents favor. They don't vote in Republican primaries.

Most Republicans don't like Romney because he's a RINO.

Since when? It depends on whether your state has an open primary or not.