If a fetus is not a viable human life ..

[occupied]

Mac is right. Self control, self respect, self denial, self discipline, respect for others should be the standard...protective devices should be available for those who don't want to maintain the standard...thus avoiding even further weakening of the human fabric. Let's move away from "man as animal"...and raise our standards of human conduct.

The old saying that a stiff dick has no conscience is as true in conservative communities as anywhere. A look at the stats is enough to show that a bible and a christian upbringing is no protection against unplanned teen pregnancies and STDs.

The difference is that conservatives may not always meet the standard...but they are not out there calling for lowering the standard...which is a hallmark of lib philosophy.

What standard? If you are speaking of Christian dogma or prudish Victorian attitudes about sex then you are speaking of something that never existed in reality. The reality is that people are going to fuck each other no matter what and arming them with misinformation and threats of everlasting damnation is not going to change a thing and result in a lot of surprise fatherless babies as has always been the case.

 

[BlindBoo]

if it is not a viable life how can it be born addicted to the same drugs it's mother used during pregnancy ??how can it be born premature and addicted to the drugs it's mother used ?? Do liberals think it's ok to do meth or cocaine while pregnant ?? after all according to many on the left a fetus is just a fetus not a human being.

If the fetus has developed enough to survive out of the womb then it is viable. It's health depends on it's mother so whatever the mother takes the baby gets. Do you believe that viable life begins at conception?

 

[BlindBoo]

Multiple part answer:

First, I think that a civilization has to make tough choices, and abortion and war are the two toughest among them. While I hate abortion, I can't help but look at the effects on the mother and a child brought into a home that does not want it. Not to mention adding that child to other unwanted siblings, and/or abject poverty.

Second, I think we as a society could do a better job of providing options for young pregnant women in terms of adoption. This is also a cultural issue, in which I'd love to see both ends of this debate lend their considerable passion to decreasing the REAL problem here, which is demand.

Finally, I'd like to see an honest (ha ha) debate about limiting abortions to a certain time frame, such as first trimester or first half.

This is a lousy, horrible topic, which is why it would be helpful if the two sides could work together on SOMETHING.

Thanks for the civil question!

.

That is pretty much my opinion in nutshell, and there is a simple solution that has worked in every developed country in the world including ours, good frank sex education starting from the average age of fertility and cheap, easily obtainable contraception. Of course the same people that want to ban abortion freak the fuck out just as much about that.

I'm with you here.

Anyone else?

Yep.

 

[Jackson]

Why don't any of you pro-birth assholes ever give any consideration to the woman carrying the fetus? Do any of you give a shit about her mental/physical/financial welfare? I never see any pro-birth protesters saying or holding signs stating GIVE ME YOUR BABY or LET ME HELP YOU. No, they just harass.

Did the woman carrying the fetus give any consideration to blocking the possibility of becoming pregnant? She could have been on the pill, used an IUD, demanded a condom be used. Where is HER responsibility?

Does this woman give a shit about the mental or physical welfare of the child she is nurturing in her womb when considering an abortion? She is about to have it's limbs removed from its body and decapitated for Christ's sake! Her mental anguish and pot belly compared to that?!!

Maybe there would guilt associated with giving a child you birthed up for adoption but for the life of me how can that compare to the guilt of murdering an unborn child? Afreaid the child may someday come looking for you? Buck up and tell them you could not provide for them what a solid family could. And, you so loved them, you wanted them to have what she couldn't provide.. IOW, being responsible.

 

[alanbmx123]

Why don't any of you pro-birth assholes ever give any consideration to the woman carrying the fetus? Do any of you give a shit about her mental/physical/financial welfare? I never see any pro-birth protesters saying or holding signs stating GIVE ME YOUR BABY or LET ME HELP YOU. No, they just harass.

Financial welfare??? cannot afford a kid, kill it! sounds reasonable

 

[Mac1958]

The fact that irresponsible sexual intercourse carries with it potentially dire repercussions is part of any sex ed curriculum but that cannot be entire message as it tends to be in some of the more conservative school districts. You talk of balance? It is non-existent when Christians are allowed to control the dialog.

Sex Ed classes are one thing, that's fine. But I'm talking about this as a cultural issue as well, and that's a clear difference. Education and culture are mutually exclusive.

Both sides have to give and take on this for it to work, both sides (as usual) have to stop pointing the finger at only the other. Both sides have responsibilities. Both sides have to get over themselves. Both sides have to be willing to change their behavior to become more accepting of the other.

Which I do not expect from either side.

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There should only be one side here, the youth of America. They should have access to all information and all forms of contraception and be allowed to make their own choices as they are in some of the European countries where abortion rates are really low. Trying to shape their behavior through scare tactics, omission and outright lies about human sexuality to satisfy the religious right is not effective, never has been.

I don't know what you think I'm saying, but I suspect this conversation will go nowhere.

.

 

[LoneLaugher]

Sex Ed classes are one thing, that's fine. But I'm talking about this as a cultural issue as well, and that's a clear difference. Education and culture are mutually exclusive.

Both sides have to give and take on this for it to work, both sides (as usual) have to stop pointing the finger at only the other. Both sides have responsibilities. Both sides have to get over themselves. Both sides have to be willing to change their behavior to become more accepting of the other.

Which I do not expect from either side.

.

There should only be one side here, the youth of America. They should have access to all information and all forms of contraception and be allowed to make their own choices as they are in some of the European countries where abortion rates are really low. Trying to shape their behavior through scare tactics, omission and outright lies about human sexuality to satisfy the religious right is not effective, never has been.

I don't know what you think I'm saying, but I suspect this conversation will go nowhere.

.

And.....there it is. The Mac-out. It's like a cop out. If you don't argue with Mac as he predicts you will....he's out. And the reason is your inability to grasp his lofty concepts.

Earmuffs.

 

[Delta4Embassy]

if it is not a viable life how can it be born addicted to the same drugs it's mother used during pregnancy ??how can it be born premature and addicted to the drugs it's mother used ?? Do liberals think it's ok to do meth or cocaine while pregnant ?? after all according to many on the left a fetus is just a fetus not a human being.

Methamphetamine and cocaine are both illegal. It's not then okay to do either pregnant or not.

Is it okay for pregnant women to smoke and rink alcohol is the better question. What about other risky behaviours like extreme sports (skydiving, bungee jumping, etc..) What about Scuba diving (pressure concerns, wildlife attack?) What about vigorous sex when pregnant?

Lots of risky stuff pregnant women might do. But making laws doesn't prevent the behavours any more than new gun laws prevent new gun violence. Best we can do is inform people on the risks and hope they make a decision erring on the side of caution.

 

[NoTeaPartyPleez]

Look at all those imaginary 'fetus is not a life' ppl flocking, just flocking to your thread!

A fetus is not an autonomous human, that's why it's called a fetus.

Based on the O/P then maybe the pregnant woman should also be required to register her unborn fetus to vote and be eligible for jury duty.

Now, going for the finish line....would you morons have more compassion for the kids coming to our border if they were still fetuses?

 

[The2ndAmendment]

The Dehumanization Echo Chamber came quickly to this thread, they were all chanting "Hail Satan" as they circle-jerked each other.

Go to time = 0:28

 

[yidnar]

The Dehumanization Echo Chamber came quickly to this thread, they were all chanting "Hail Satan" as they circle-jerked each other.

Go to time = 0:28

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1OApEt72GGM

the only religion that endorses the liberal lifestyle is Satanism.