How "Renewable Energy" is destroying Germany

Discussion in 'Energy' started by polarbear, Jul 17, 2012.

  1. polarbear
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    polarbear I eat morons

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    Well maybe not the cities, but the last remaining wild life habitats in Germany. Especially so the famous Black Forest.
    I just finished compiling & uploading this video:

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P2H38UpdQhM"]How Climate Science destroyed Germany.wmv - YouTube[/ame]

    I`m not too worried about Canada because we signed off the Kyoto Accord, keep our nuclear power, have huge hydro electric plants and have our own oil. But there are a few liberal Provinces, Ontario, Quebec & BC who got sucked in by the IPCC and Andrea Merkel, copied her "Energie Wandel" and now they are the basket cases of Canada. The rest the "Oil Provinces" have to subsidize these bankrupt Provinces with "Eqaulization Payments" just so have enough Money to pay their unionized & overpaid public sector "workers" which male up the bulk of their sorry economy.
     
  2. Mr. H.
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    Mr. H. Diamond Member

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    I watched the first 5 seconds. Didn't understand a word of it.
     
  3. tjvh
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    tjvh Senior Member

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    I think it is about how they damage the last refuges left for people to "get away from it all", such as this: [​IMG]
     
  4. whitehall
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    whitehall Gold Member

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    The Germans should remember from the last time they invaded Holland that windmills were obsolete.
     
  5. flacaltenn
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    flacaltenn USMB Mod Staff Member Gold Supporting Member

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    It's worth watching -- the translation is partial and sparse -- but the story gets thru..

    The eco-left in Germany is fierce. They would tear up the hills and drill thru mountains just to make "renewables" work. All attempts are failing because Germany is NOT a good site for solar as a FUNDAMENTAL source of power.

    Some of the ideas I've posted on these boards -- are in there. Like reserving wind/solar OFF grid to make hydrogen. And the ecological damage from water-pumped wind storage.
     
  6. chenchenPeter
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    chenchenPeter PeterChen

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    OK,I know it ....After I read your article...I aggre with you .
     
  7. polarbear
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    polarbear I eat morons

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    No matter if solar or wind, the problem most people don`t understand what "power on demand" is and that this is the only way a power grid can function.
    Most people equate their home brew solar or wind system to a power grid just because some of them are "grid tied". A power grid on a national scale is something entirely different and not just a simple home brew grid tie on a larger scale as the general public believes.

    This is how it does work:
    The main control panel in a power plant senses the instantaneous load demand. At a given setting...if it`s a hydro plant, that would be the "wicked gates" which control the water flow into the turbine and similar gating devices for steam in a thermal P.P. ,be that nuclear or coal,...if the load drops the gates are throttled down and if there is an increase modulated up...while at the same time the generator revs have to remain constant to remain in phase with the grid.
    If that process is not carefully controlled this is what happens:
    The Sayano-Shushenskaya dam accident - The Big Picture - Boston.com
    [​IMG]

    In the end the cause of the accident was a faulty setting at which rate the wicked gates were modulated up & down as the load demand changed.

    With wind power You cant` just modulate the blade pitch to respond to sudden load demand fluctuations. Coarser pitch ===> more torque but lower rpm and "finer" pitch ===> more rpm but lower torque and in either case the correction was futile because the power output would stay the same and the wind turbine did not respond and cannot as any "power on demand" generator system has to. Else it is entirely useless for a large scale power grid. Solar, ...same problem.
    All You can do is dump the extra power at any given wind speed if the demand load drops suddenly and hope for the best You don`t "brown out" if there is a sudden increase.
    A sudden demand drop can be compensated by the "exciter" coil current in a wind turbine, but when the demand spikes beyond what the turbine can deliver at the present wind speed then You are screwed. In any regular "power on demand" the control system simply opens up the wicked gates, end of problem!
    If the spike exceeds the total power plant output in its current configuration, the additional turbines are "phased in" and that has to occur at exactly the same time frame when the sine waves are overlapping and the other turbines have to be EXACTLY at the same speed (rpm`s)...else Your power plant looks like the one in the picture above!
    How would You do that with wind turbines, where one is in Texas and the other one in California?

    With a home system solar or wind, that`s not really a problem because we are not talking about Mega Watts but only a few Kilowatts, something a few 12 Volt Batteries and an inverter can easily handle.
    Now for these ideas to use solar or wind power to generate hydrogen as Joerg Mueller of Enertag suggests, please do the math.
    Considering just 1 single pump reservoir like the one at Eckberg.
    Here are the specs.
    Water flow through the turbine= 24 000 liters per second
    Head = 400 meters
    Reservoir Size = ~ 5 000 000 cubic meters
    can run for 57 hours in "generating mode" @ 94 Megawatt output.
    If You wanted to do that with storing Hydrogen gas then first of all You would have to have an electrolysis facility which can generate over 1700 liters of hydrogen gas per second and store 362 708 333 liters of Hydrogen gas just to duplicate what one single pond at Eckberg does.
    And they have 15 of these ponds just to run a power on demand system for the small region they supply.

    Germany has 81 Million people and the United States have 313 Million.
    Just how would Obama engineer a "green energy" system for 313 Million if to date this simply cant` be done for 81 Million in Germany.
    And by they way, each single of these Pump basins with the shaft costs 1 $ billion..!!! And in Germany they decided to go that way because they did the math and this is way cheaper than the "hydrogen" route
     
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  8. Old Rocks
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    Old Rocks Diamond Member

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    Well, we are not Germany, and are committed to a policy of all of the above until such time as the renewables, including nuclear, replaces fossil fuels.
     
  9. Old Rocks
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  10. flacaltenn
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    flacaltenn USMB Mod Staff Member Gold Supporting Member

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    Don't you remember telling us all how we should be MORE LIKE Germany just a week or so ago?

    You might need a "memory retention reservoir". So that what powers you by daylight can be used at used at a future date..
    :badgrin:
     

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