Hillary says NRA needs a "rival" organization of responsible gun owners

[Kondor3]

The left hates the second and guns.

If they invested on TENTH the energy on fighting the ghetto and gangsta mindsets that put so little value on human life, that they do in trying to fight the Second and scores of millions of law-abiding firearms-owning loyal Americans...

They could clear up ninety percent of gun-crime without registering a single gun or licensing a single user or vetting a single app...

But that would require honest and critical self-assessment and admission of great culpability...

"The left" is nothing more than a pejorative used by the ignorant who disdain those who challenge everything they have been told to believe.

The claim 90 percent of gun-crime emanates from the ghetto is covert racism and hyperbole.

No evidence supports the conclusion that licensing and registration cannot reduce gun violence in America, violence which far exceeds the gun violence in every other western style democracy.

We (or somebody else who actually gives a flying phukk) can debate your protestations about the label "The Left" some other time, in some other context...

As to the rest, until Blacks convince THEMSELVES that Black LIves Matter, they will continue killing themselves in overwhelming disproportion to their numbers.

It is not hyperbole, although it is, indeed, 'racist', insofar as it acknowleges a difference in behavior between the races in this country.

It is you (The Left's) inability to deal with this Reality that is more responsible than any other factor, for failing to actually address the issue and to begin solving the problem.

When you (The Left) become more honest with yourselves about Black and Latino inner-city violence, you will have discovered the Road to Self-Rescue - the only path that is going to take you where you need to go.

 

[Wry Catcher]

...IT'S THE LAW!

BAD laws are resisted and ignored all the time, are they not?

So are good laws, and those who ignore and resist them are criminals.

 

[whitehall]

You almost gotta laugh, all of a sudden the left is shocked by "lobbyists". Everybody is a freaking lobbyist from the Sierra club to the Automobile industry to the freaking atheists who lobby judges to tear down Christian symbols to the NRA. My nephew received a drone kit for Christmas and lo and wouldn't you know there is a lobbyist group to advocate drone rights.

 

[Care4all]

27.7% of guns used in crimes were sold by legally licensed FFL's....

I don't see how ANYONE can not view this as a REAL and JUSTIFIED problem?

Crazy PEOPLE are the problem. Not guns.

i agree Dillo, in the cases of mass murders, but the other 8000 murdered a year, not so much...

FFL's are trafficking their guns to the black market....27.7% of the guns used in crimes that were confiscated, traced directly back to LEGAL FFL Gun sellers... that's a problem that needs to be addressed.

 

[Kondor3]

...IT'S THE LAW!

BAD laws are resisted and ignored all the time, are they not?

So are good laws, and those who ignore and resist them are criminals.

I wonder if Hermann Goering could have used that defense at Nuremburg?

 

[the_human_being]

I cannot fathom why Hillary even opened her mouth. Doesn't she realize that many of the Democrat party are NRA members and avid hunters? I also cannot fathom why Obama, who is supposed to be the leader of the Democrat Party, opted to use executive order to infuriate a whole bunch of voters. He could easily have simply done nothing and eased on out of office. His action will cause some who were sitting on the fence to vote against Hillary especially since she has decided to enter the fray as well. There are an awful lot of Democrats and Independents who are heavily into guns. To me, it's a stupid political move on both Obama's and Hillary's part.

It's a principled move and every Democrat understands that there are many Americans who are single issue voters. But not every gun owner who heard what with The President or HRC said consider their remarks are unreasonable or irrational.

You claim hunters will lose their rights to own a hunting rifle, that claim is not substantiated by anything said by Obama or Clinton!

So someone gets more rights than me because they got there first?

Again, I don't trust any more gun control legislation while my rights in NYC continue to be infringed.

Why should it take me 3-6 months and $1000 to get a handgun permit for my own home?

Why? Because it's the law. Move to Texas if this upsets you so. There you can parade around the streets with your beloved gun on your hip & be free from the law you oppose.

Why should I have to move to exercise my rights?

Segregation was "the law" as well, I guess MLK just should have deferred to the government and let them get away with it......

You haven't answered the question either, why should I have to wait 3-6 months and pay $1000 to get a pistol permit?

OK, so be like MLK and start making speeches and get thousands of others who believe as do you to march on DC. A million gun owners at the mall singing we will overcome, and you making an I have a dream speech where one day my little children can bring an AR-15 to second grade show and tell.

Go for it, be a leader!

I cannot fathom why Hillary even opened her mouth. Doesn't she realize that many of the Democrat party are NRA members and avid hunters? I also cannot fathom why Obama, who is supposed to be the leader of the Democrat Party, opted to use executive order to infuriate a whole bunch of voters. He could easily have simply done nothing and eased on out of office. His action will cause some who were sitting on the fence to vote against Hillary especially since she has decided to enter the fray as well. There are an awful lot of Democrats and Independents who are heavily into guns. To me, it's a stupid political move on both Obama's and Hillary's part.

It's a principled move and every Democrat understands that there are many Americans who are single issue voters. But not every gun owner who heard what with The President or HRC said consider their remarks are unreasonable or irrational.

You claim hunters will lose their rights to own a hunting rifle, that claim is not substantiated by anything said by Obama or Clinton!

So someone gets more rights than me because they got there first?

Again, I don't trust any more gun control legislation while my rights in NYC continue to be infringed.

Why should it take me 3-6 months and $1000 to get a handgun permit for my own home?

Why? Because it's the law. Move to Texas if this upsets you so. There you can parade around the streets with your beloved gun on your hip & be free from the law you oppose.

Why should I have to move to exercise my rights?

Segregation was "the law" as well, I guess MLK just should have deferred to the government and let them get away with it......

You haven't answered the question either, why should I have to wait 3-6 months and pay $1000 to get a pistol permit?

OK, so be like MLK and start making speeches and get thousands of others who believe as do you to march on DC. A million gun owners at the mall singing we will overcome, and you making an I have a dream speech where one day my little children can bring an AR-15 to second grade show and tell.

Go for it, be a leader!

Apparently you can't read. Nowhere did I state that hunters would lose any rights. Do you have these spells of dementia often?

Post 118, "I cannot fathom why Hillary even opened her mouth. Doesn't she realize that many of the Democrat party are NRA members and avid hunters?"

The implication being that hunter's are effected by the EO. Why would you include them if it were not an effort to pass on propaganda?

No. I simply stated a fact. You can't accept the fact that many Democrats are gun owners? I hate to break it to you but they really are. Now, since you brought it up and I didn't, many hunters do sell a firearm or two every now and again. A hunter, Democrat or Republican, might own a .243 and is not happy with it and wants to sell it to another hunter, Democrat or Republican, so he can then purchase a .270 or another rifle. It happens. Get real.

 

[jon_berzerk]

...IT'S THE LAW!

BAD laws are resisted and ignored all the time, are they not?

So are good laws, and those who ignore and resist them are criminals.

I wonder if Hermann Goering could have used that defense at Nuremburg?

they tried that

 

[dilloduck]

27.7% of guns used in crimes were sold by legally licensed FFL's....

I don't see how ANYONE can not view this as a REAL and JUSTIFIED problem?

Crazy PEOPLE are the problem. Not guns.

i agree Dillo, in the cases of mass murders, but the other 8000 murdered a year, not so much...

FFL's are trafficking their guns to the black market....27.7% of the guns used in crimes that were confiscated, traced directly back to LEGAL FFL Gun sellers... that's a problem that needs to be addressed.

and 100% can be traced back to the manufacturer. Individuals must be held responsible for what they do with a gun and anything else for that matter.

 

[LordBrownTrout]

The left hates the second and guns.

If they invested on TENTH the energy on fighting the ghetto and gangsta mindsets that put so little value on human life, that they do in trying to fight the Second and scores of millions of law-abiding firearms-owning loyal Americans...

They could clear up ninety percent of gun-crime without registering a single gun or licensing a single user or vetting a single app...

But that would require honest and critical self-assessment and admission of great culpability...

"The left" is nothing more than a pejorative used by the ignorant who disdain those who challenge everything they have been told to believe.

The claim 90 percent of gun-crime emanates from the ghetto is covert racism and hyperbole.

No evidence supports the conclusion that licensing and registration cannot reduce gun violence in America, violence which far exceeds the gun violence in every other western style democracy.

The overwhelming majority of gun violence occurs in inner cities, ghettos, low living housing areas. To deny this is simply being ignorant and wishful thinking.

 

[Wry Catcher]

The left hates the second and guns.

If they invested on TENTH the energy on fighting the ghetto and gangsta mindsets that put so little value on human life, that they do in trying to fight the Second and scores of millions of law-abiding firearms-owning loyal Americans...

They could clear up ninety percent of gun-crime without registering a single gun or licensing a single user or vetting a single app...

But that would require honest and critical self-assessment and admission of great culpability...

"The left" is nothing more than a pejorative used by the ignorant who disdain those who challenge everything they have been told to believe.

The claim 90 percent of gun-crime emanates from the ghetto is covert racism and hyperbole.

No evidence supports the conclusion that licensing and registration cannot reduce gun violence in America, violence which far exceeds the gun violence in every other western style democracy.

We (or somebody else who actually gives a flying phukk) can debate your protestations about the label "The Left" some other time, in some other context...

As to the rest, until Blacks convince THEMSELVES that Black LIves Matter, they will continue killing themselves in overwhelming disproportion to their numbers.

It is not hyperbole, although it is, indeed, 'racist', insofar as it acknowleges a difference in behavior between the races in this country.

It is you (The Left's) inability to deal with this Reality that is more responsible than any other factor, in actually addressing the issue and beginning to solve the crisis.

When you (The Left) become more honest with yourselves about Blackand Latino inner-city violence, you will have discovered the Road to Self-Rescue - the only path that is going to take you where you need to go.

I worked my way through college working with inner-city kids of a variety of ethnicity, coaching baseball, basketball, soccer, flag football and even ran chess and ping pong tournaments. I also coached CYO Basketball, LL Baseball and Pony League Baseball for 25 years during the time I worked as a deputy, supervisor and manager with a LE Agency.

What's your experience?

 

[Bruce_T_Laney]

Hillary Clinton urges moderate gun owners to take on the NRA

Hillary Clinton urges moderate gun owners to take on the NRA

Are there any moderate gun owners, are all they all Texas rednecks?

It strikes me all gun owners are right wing madmen

Hmmm, I am a right wing mad man?

No, I live in Texas and own two shotguns, and I am a responsible gun owner. One Shotgun is for hunting Duck, Boar, and wild game and the other is for land protection.

My one shotgun is in a locked closet and come out during hunting season while the other is on a rack where i can grab it quickly.

My shotguns are never loaded but both have a sleeve to hold shells that can be loaded quickly.

So what part of what I have is not reasonable to you?

Do you believe someone like me should not be allow to hunt?

How about protecting my land against wild dogs?

I find it strange that those like you believe there is no reasonable gun owners and believe everyone that own a gun is some lunatic...

Of course they believe that. If they didn't they wouldn't be lefty loons who know what's best for everyone.

I'm a responsible gun owner as well. My shotgun is for self defense. I will have no problem using it.

Most people are responsible owners. The few that aren't paint everyone with a gun as a nut job.

Never forget. The gun is the tool. The one using it is the weapon.

Guns don't kill people. People kill people.

People kill people daily and that is the truth.

Too bad many do not understand that fact!

 

[Care4all]

27.7% of guns used in crimes were sold by legally licensed FFL's....

I don't see how ANYONE can not view this as a REAL and JUSTIFIED problem?

Crazy PEOPLE are the problem. Not guns.

i agree Dillo, in the cases of mass murders, but the other 8000 murdered a year, not so much...

FFL's are trafficking their guns to the black market....27.7% of the guns used in crimes that were confiscated, traced directly back to LEGAL FFL Gun sellers... that's a problem that needs to be addressed.

and 100% can be traced back to the manufacturer. Individuals must be held responsible for what they do with a gun and anything else for that matter.

and individuals should be held responsible...

AND the FFL's who intentionally sell to gun traffickers need to be held responsible as well...

 

[Wry Catcher]

...IT'S THE LAW!

BAD laws are resisted and ignored all the time, are they not?

So are good laws, and those who ignore and resist them are criminals.

I wonder if Hermann Goering could have used that defense at Nuremburg?

Example of ^^^ Godwin's law

BTW, What is your experience? [see post #150]

 

[Bruce_T_Laney]

Guns don't kill people. People kill people.

But they kill a lot more people when they have guns.

They also kill a lot more people when they have bombs and planes or automobiles...

Remove one weapon of choice and there is still millions of ways to kill someone and do a mass killing without even firing one bullet!

 

[Bruce_T_Laney]

Take away terrorists and liberals doing mass shootings and what's left? Not very damn much, it wouldn't even be an issue.

Most are right wing US extremist groups or right wing lone wolf idiots, or gun collector Timothy McVeigh ...oh he was an extremist right wing American as well.

McVeigh did not use a gun to carry our his acts of terrorism and you just made my case you do not need a gun to kill innocent people!

 

[dilloduck]

27.7% of guns used in crimes were sold by legally licensed FFL's....

I don't see how ANYONE can not view this as a REAL and JUSTIFIED problem?

Crazy PEOPLE are the problem. Not guns.

i agree Dillo, in the cases of mass murders, but the other 8000 murdered a year, not so much...

FFL's are trafficking their guns to the black market....27.7% of the guns used in crimes that were confiscated, traced directly back to LEGAL FFL Gun sellers... that's a problem that needs to be addressed.

and 100% can be traced back to the manufacturer. Individuals must be held responsible for what they do with a gun and anything else for that matter.

and individuals should be held responsible...

AND the FFL's who intentionally sell to gun traffickers need to be held responsible as well...

Owning or selling a gun is not the problem. What is it going to take for liberals to see that ?

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

27.7% of guns used in crimes were sold by legally licensed FFL's....

I don't see how ANYONE can not view this as a REAL and JUSTIFIED problem?

Because it isn't... it's hysteria and unjustified pants shitting by the same low information crowd as usual.

 

[the_human_being]

27.7% of guns used in crimes were sold by legally licensed FFL's....

I don't see how ANYONE can not view this as a REAL and JUSTIFIED problem?

Crazy PEOPLE are the problem. Not guns.

i agree Dillo, in the cases of mass murders, but the other 8000 murdered a year, not so much...

FFL's are trafficking their guns to the black market....27.7% of the guns used in crimes that were confiscated, traced directly back to LEGAL FFL Gun sellers... that's a problem that needs to be addressed.

and 100% can be traced back to the manufacturer. Individuals must be held responsible for what they do with a gun and anything else for that matter.

and individuals should be held responsible...

AND the FFL's who intentionally sell to gun traffickers need to be held responsible as well...

What about a President who sells guns to Mexican drug cartels? Should he be held responsible too?

 

[dilloduck]

27.7% of guns used in crimes were sold by legally licensed FFL's....

I don't see how ANYONE can not view this as a REAL and JUSTIFIED problem?

Crazy PEOPLE are the problem. Not guns.

i agree Dillo, in the cases of mass murders, but the other 8000 murdered a year, not so much...

FFL's are trafficking their guns to the black market....27.7% of the guns used in crimes that were confiscated, traced directly back to LEGAL FFL Gun sellers... that's a problem that needs to be addressed.

and 100% can be traced back to the manufacturer. Individuals must be held responsible for what they do with a gun and anything else for that matter.

and individuals should be held responsible...

AND the FFL's who intentionally sell to gun traffickers need to be held responsible as well...

What about a President who sells guns to Mexican drug cartels? Should he be held responsible too?

^^^ confront the pres with that fact and watch his tears dry up quickly.

 

[Bruce_T_Laney]

Hillary Clinton urges moderate gun owners to take on the NRA

Hillary Clinton urges moderate gun owners to take on the NRA

Are there any moderate gun owners, are all they all Texas rednecks?

It strikes me all gun owners are right wing madmen

Hmmm, I am a right wing mad man?

No, I live in Texas and own two shotguns, and I am a responsible gun owner. One Shotgun is for hunting Duck, Boar, and wild game and the other is for land protection.

My one shotgun is in a locked closet and come out during hunting season while the other is on a rack where i can grab it quickly.

My shotguns are never loaded but both have a sleeve to hold shells that can be loaded quickly.

So what part of what I have is not reasonable to you?

Do you believe someone like me should not be allow to hunt?

How about protecting my land against wild dogs?

I find it strange that those like you believe there is no reasonable gun owners and believe everyone that own a gun is some lunatic...

Most of us who support gun control measures do not see gun owners as you self report to be the problem. And most of us responsible supporters of rational gun laws do not support the repeal of the 2nd A. We want people properly vetted.

I for one want to see all gun owners licensed and all guns registered on a State by State basis. Let Texas do what they want, and allow California citizens to vote to license and register or not.

In fact I'd grandfather in all current gun owners and not require that they be licensed or register their guns, the only restriction being they could only sell their gun to a licensed person or dealer, and could only buy an additional gun or guns if they became licensed and registered their new gun along with those already owned by them.

So someone gets more rights than me because they got there first?

Again, I don't trust any more gun control legislation while my rights in NYC continue to be infringed.

Why should it take me 3-6 months and $1000 to get a handgun permit for my own home?

Why? Because it's the law. Move to Texas if this upsets you so. There you can parade around the streets with your beloved gun on your hip & be free from the law you oppose.

You are incorrect!

You should first read the actual open and carry law, and understand a business also has the right to deny open and carry.

Also Texas is not the only state to allow open and carry and you have to be license to open and carry.

You should actually read the law first before making wild claims because I can not parade around with my shotgun and would not anyway!

Open Carry : Texas Concealed Handgun License