Health Care Should Be FREE! (In the U.S.)

[OnePercenter]

Somebody around here probably already did a thread like this. And there was that documentary done about it called "Sicko." But I got quite a few objections out of people with my thread, "College should be free. (for Americans)" I wonder what they will have to say about me saying that health care should be free too. And the worse that may be for insurance companies, the better I like it!

Such a wish is born of extreme ignorance about the most basic facts of economics.

It is not possible for college nor medical care to be free.

It costs money—lots of money—to offer these services. Facilities must be built and maintained, equipment and materials must be provided,and staff must be employed. “Free” does not negate this basic fact; if someone receives these services for “free”, all it really means is that someone else, who is not receiving these services, is being compelled to pay for them.

Such a wish is born of extreme ignorance about the most basic facts of economics.

It is not possible for college nor medical care to be free.

It costs money—lots of money—to offer these services. Facilities must be built and maintained, equipment and materials must be provided,and staff must be employed. “Free” does not negate this basic fact; if someone receives these services for “free”, all it really means is that someone else, who is not receiving these services, is being compelled to pay for them.

You think our current system is better? The majority of for-profit hospitals and Doctors clinics in the US are owned by insurance companies who derive profit from both ends.

 

[Arianrhod]

Somebody around here probably already did a thread like this. And there was that documentary done about it called "Sicko." But I got quite a few objections out of people with my thread, "College should be free. (for Americans)" I wonder what they will have to say about me saying that health care should be free too. And the worse that may be for insurance companies, the better I like it!

Such a wish is born of extreme ignorance about the most basic facts of economics.

It is not possible for college nor medical care to be free.

It costs money—lots of money—to offer these services. Facilities must be built and maintained, equipment and materials must be provided,and staff must be employed. “Free” does not negate this basic fact; if someone receives these services for “free”, all it really means is that someone else, who is not receiving these services, is being compelled to pay for them.

Such a wish is born of extreme ignorance about the most basic facts of economics.

It is not possible for college nor medical care to be free.

It costs money—lots of money—to offer these services. Facilities must be built and maintained, equipment and materials must be provided,and staff must be employed. “Free” does not negate this basic fact; if someone receives these services for “free”, all it really means is that someone else, who is not receiving these services, is being compelled to pay for them.

You think our current system is better? The majority of for-profit hospitals and Doctors clinics in the US are owned by insurance companies who derive profit from both ends.

The best sources I've read indicate that currency was invented 5,000 ago. I wonder how anyone ever got anything done without it?

 

[dblack]

Somebody around here probably already did a thread like this. And there was that documentary done about it called "Sicko." But I got quite a few objections out of people with my thread, "College should be free. (for Americans)" I wonder what they will have to say about me saying that health care should be free too. And the worse that may be for insurance companies, the better I like it!

Such a wish is born of extreme ignorance about the most basic facts of economics.

It is not possible for college nor medical care to be free.

It costs money—lots of money—to offer these services. Facilities must be built and maintained, equipment and materials must be provided,and staff must be employed. “Free” does not negate this basic fact; if someone receives these services for “free”, all it really means is that someone else, who is not receiving these services, is being compelled to pay for them.

Such a wish is born of extreme ignorance about the most basic facts of economics.

It is not possible for college nor medical care to be free.

It costs money—lots of money—to offer these services. Facilities must be built and maintained, equipment and materials must be provided,and staff must be employed. “Free” does not negate this basic fact; if someone receives these services for “free”, all it really means is that someone else, who is not receiving these services, is being compelled to pay for them.

You think our current system is better? The majority of for-profit hospitals and Doctors clinics in the US are owned by insurance companies who derive profit from both ends.

The best sources I've read indicate that currency was invented 5,000 ago. I wonder how anyone ever got anything done without it?

Voluntary, mutual exchange of goods and services (aka 'free trade'). Money just made it easier.

 

[krypto]

The math works in other countries where they have universal health care. Also, fuck asking the doctors. Ask ANYBODY if they think they are getting paid enough.

Check the medical and pharmaceutical innovations coming from those "other Countries" You won't find any. Maybe you will except lousy healthcare but many Americans will not especially when the costs go up again in October. And you say fuck the doctors opinion? that is retarded. They are the people you will be relying on one day to save your free boating life. Hope he is up to speed on the latest drugs and treatments. Hope he isn't over worked and under staffed.

Believe it or not, there ARE pharmaceutical companies in other European countries. And no doubt in places like Japan. Where they also have universities. If you are going to tell me that they too haven't come up with new drugs, I'm just not going to believe you. As to your talk about lousy health care, I would be interested to know what insurance company you work for. Or are you just a lobbyist for the industry. Or maybe you are so involved in the medical establishment. Who like the way things are now. Just overflowing with income.

Next, I didn't say "fuck the doctors opinion." (And I certainly wouldn't do so in medical matters) What I said basically was fuck asking "JUST" the doctors. I said to ask anybody if they thought they were getting paid enough. Because chances are, they would tell you that they aren't getting paid enough. Next, if we actually PAID students to go to college. And paid them more if they did well, any overworking or understaffing would be a thing of the past.

It would be a good homework assignment to search for medical innovations around the world. I'm sure other countries have produced great results in medicine, but I just can't remember any right off the top of my head but I will search. Free things are never better than things one pays for that is the basic rules of societal nature. I will make you a great breakfast if you pay me what I need to charge to make money from it. But I will toss you scraps if you want to eat for free. Get it?

I'm not saying that if you pay more, you can't get more. If you don't have much money and want an egg, you can probably get an egg. But if you have enough money and want an egg, you could probably get a Faberge egg. Or at least a whole chicken farm. But the thing is that if you have smart people hanging around just being smart, it doesn't take a whole hell of a lot of incentive for them to do smart things. Government can provide plenty of financial incentive. If they choose to.

One day very soon you will begin to hear suggestions for changes in Obamacare...it will not work as it is put together now. We will either need to change it or go back to a total ins/work based system. Some will shout we need to make it free... a single payer system but it won't fly.

Admittedly, with all the useless latinos and negroes in this country, it is difficult to make universal health care a reality. But it can be done. Hell, we could probably make universal health care for pets a reality too. I wonder how many Veterinarians would be opposed to that.

 

[krypto]

If we can use government to make something free, why are any of us paying for anything? We should make everything free, right?

Most, if not all, the governments out there are a combination of socialist and capitalist. So it isn't likely that you could form a society where everything was free. Even though, ants, termites and bees do it. And they are just bugs. But all of the most important things should be free. Like health care. Though as for college, I would go beyond free and actually pay students to attend. And the better they do, the more they get paid. Such as the difference between working a job at McDonalds or getting twice that salary.

This is an odd conversation for me, because usually I'll point out that - despite the altruistic pitch - these kinds of ambitions are essentially fascist in nature.

But it sounds like you're ok with that.

You should check out my thread "Freedom Sucks." I am a National Socialist. Also, take for instance the fascist government under Mussolini. Do you know who some of his most staunch opponents were? The Mafia! Why? Because organized crime doesn't operate very well under a fascist form of government. All types of criminals prefer to have "freedoms" and a "Constitution" and a "Bill of Rights" to hide behind. Granted, a National Socialist form of government isn't my preferred form of government. But it is something that we have to pass through to clear away all the filth before moving on to something better.

 

[krypto]

Somebody around here probably already did a thread like this. And there was that documentary done about it called "Sicko." But I got quite a few objections out of people with my thread, "College should be free. (for Americans)" I wonder what they will have to say about me saying that health care should be free too. And the worse that may be for insurance companies, the better I like it!

Such a wish is born of extreme ignorance about the most basic facts of economics.

It is not possible for college nor medical care to be free.

It costs money—lots of money—to offer these services. Facilities must be built and maintained, equipment and materials must be provided,and staff must be employed. “Free” does not negate this basic fact; if someone receives these services for “free”, all it really means is that someone else, who is not receiving these services, is being compelled to pay for them.

Such a wish is born of extreme ignorance about the most basic facts of economics.

It is not possible for college nor medical care to be free.

It costs money—lots of money—to offer these services. Facilities must be built and maintained, equipment and materials must be provided,and staff must be employed. “Free” does not negate this basic fact; if someone receives these services for “free”, all it really means is that someone else, who is not receiving these services, is being compelled to pay for them.

You think our current system is better? The majority of for-profit hospitals and Doctors clinics in the US are owned by insurance companies who derive profit from both ends.

The best sources I've read indicate that currency was invented 5,000 ago. I wonder how anyone ever got anything done without it?

The same way they did with money. Those in authority said, "you do this, and you do that."

 

[dblack]

If we can use government to make something free, why are any of us paying for anything? We should make everything free, right?

Most, if not all, the governments out there are a combination of socialist and capitalist. So it isn't likely that you could form a society where everything was free. Even though, ants, termites and bees do it. And they are just bugs. But all of the most important things should be free. Like health care. Though as for college, I would go beyond free and actually pay students to attend. And the better they do, the more they get paid. Such as the difference between working a job at McDonalds or getting twice that salary.

This is an odd conversation for me, because usually I'll point out that - despite the altruistic pitch - these kinds of ambitions are essentially fascist in nature.

But it sounds like you're ok with that.

You should check out my thread "Freedom Sucks." I am a National Socialist. Also, take for instance the fascist government under Mussolini. Do you know who some of his most staunch opponents were? The Mafia! Why? Because organized crime doesn't operate very well under a fascist form of government. All types of criminals prefer to have "freedoms" and a "Constitution" and a "Bill of Rights" to hide behind. Granted, a National Socialist form of government isn't my preferred form of government. But it is something that we have to pass through to clear away all the filth before moving on to something better.

Do tell ...

 

[krypto]

Somebody around here probably already did a thread like this. And there was that documentary done about it called "Sicko." But I got quite a few objections out of people with my thread, "College should be free. (for Americans)" I wonder what they will have to say about me saying that health care should be free too. And the worse that may be for insurance companies, the better I like it!

Such a wish is born of extreme ignorance about the most basic facts of economics.

It is not possible for college nor medical care to be free.

It costs money—lots of money—to offer these services. Facilities must be built and maintained, equipment and materials must be provided,and staff must be employed. “Free” does not negate this basic fact; if someone receives these services for “free”, all it really means is that someone else, who is not receiving these services, is being compelled to pay for them.

Such a wish is born of extreme ignorance about the most basic facts of economics.

It is not possible for college nor medical care to be free.

It costs money—lots of money—to offer these services. Facilities must be built and maintained, equipment and materials must be provided,and staff must be employed. “Free” does not negate this basic fact; if someone receives these services for “free”, all it really means is that someone else, who is not receiving these services, is being compelled to pay for them.

You think our current system is better? The majority of for-profit hospitals and Doctors clinics in the US are owned by insurance companies who derive profit from both ends.

Screw your bullshit "facts of economics." I suppose next you'll be telling me that human caused global warming isn't real. Get this. Pharaohs were able to have pyrmids built basically at no cost. Being god-kings, all they had to do was tell their people to do it. And it was done. Paying students to go to college AND having universal health care is nothing, ABSOLUTELY NOTHING compared to that.

 

[Rambunctious]

Check the medical and pharmaceutical innovations coming from those "other Countries" You won't find any. Maybe you will except lousy healthcare but many Americans will not especially when the costs go up again in October. And you say fuck the doctors opinion? that is retarded. They are the people you will be relying on one day to save your free boating life. Hope he is up to speed on the latest drugs and treatments. Hope he isn't over worked and under staffed.

Believe it or not, there ARE pharmaceutical companies in other European countries. And no doubt in places like Japan. Where they also have universities. If you are going to tell me that they too haven't come up with new drugs, I'm just not going to believe you. As to your talk about lousy health care, I would be interested to know what insurance company you work for. Or are you just a lobbyist for the industry. Or maybe you are so involved in the medical establishment. Who like the way things are now. Just overflowing with income.

Next, I didn't say "fuck the doctors opinion." (And I certainly wouldn't do so in medical matters) What I said basically was fuck asking "JUST" the doctors. I said to ask anybody if they thought they were getting paid enough. Because chances are, they would tell you that they aren't getting paid enough. Next, if we actually PAID students to go to college. And paid them more if they did well, any overworking or understaffing would be a thing of the past.

It would be a good homework assignment to search for medical innovations around the world. I'm sure other countries have produced great results in medicine, but I just can't remember any right off the top of my head but I will search. Free things are never better than things one pays for that is the basic rules of societal nature. I will make you a great breakfast if you pay me what I need to charge to make money from it. But I will toss you scraps if you want to eat for free. Get it?

I'm not saying that if you pay more, you can't get more. If you don't have much money and want an egg, you can probably get an egg. But if you have enough money and want an egg, you could probably get a Faberge egg. Or at least a whole chicken farm. But the thing is that if you have smart people hanging around just being smart, it doesn't take a whole hell of a lot of incentive for them to do smart things. Government can provide plenty of financial incentive. If they choose to.

One day very soon you will begin to hear suggestions for changes in Obamacare...it will not work as it is put together now. We will either need to change it or go back to a total ins/work based system. Some will shout we need to make it free... a single payer system but it won't fly.

Admittedly, with all the useless latinos and negroes in this country, it is difficult to make universal health care a reality. But it can be done. Hell, we could probably make universal health care for pets a reality too. I wonder how many Veterinarians would be opposed to that.

 

[JBond]

The best sources I've read indicate that currency was invented 5,000 ago. I wonder how anyone ever got anything done without it?

Feel free to use the education and medical systems available to you 5000 years ago. Good luck with that.

 

[Sun Devil 92]

Somebody around here probably already did a thread like this. And there was that documentary done about it called "Sicko." But I got quite a few objections out of people with my thread, "College should be free. (for Americans)" I wonder what they will have to say about me saying that health care should be free too. And the worse that may be for insurance companies, the better I like it!

Such a wish is born of extreme ignorance about the most basic facts of economics.

It is not possible for college nor medical care to be free.

It costs money—lots of money—to offer these services. Facilities must be built and maintained, equipment and materials must be provided,and staff must be employed. “Free” does not negate this basic fact; if someone receives these services for “free”, all it really means is that someone else, who is not receiving these services, is being compelled to pay for them.

Such a wish is born of extreme ignorance about the most basic facts of economics.

It is not possible for college nor medical care to be free.

It costs money—lots of money—to offer these services. Facilities must be built and maintained, equipment and materials must be provided,and staff must be employed. “Free” does not negate this basic fact; if someone receives these services for “free”, all it really means is that someone else, who is not receiving these services, is being compelled to pay for them.

You think our current system is better? The majority of for-profit hospitals and Doctors clinics in the US are owned by insurance companies who derive profit from both ends.

Screw your bullshit "facts of economics." I suppose next you'll be telling me that human caused global warming isn't real. Get this. Pharaohs were able to have pyrmids built basically at no cost. Being god-kings, all they had to do was tell their people to do it. And it was done. Paying students to go to college AND having universal health care is nothing, ABSOLUTELY NOTHING compared to that.

This is hysterical......

I'll bet those conquered slaves got finished with one pyramid and said "Oh man...that was great. Let's build another one".

Or was it the lashes, spears and swords that kept them going.

I'll be they had universal health care too.

Can you be any more foolish ?

 

[Sun Devil 92]

Somebody around here probably already did a thread like this. And there was that documentary done about it called "Sicko." But I got quite a few objections out of people with my thread, "College should be free. (for Americans)" I wonder what they will have to say about me saying that health care should be free too. And the worse that may be for insurance companies, the better I like it!

Such a wish is born of extreme ignorance about the most basic facts of economics.

It is not possible for college nor medical care to be free.

It costs money—lots of money—to offer these services. Facilities must be built and maintained, equipment and materials must be provided,and staff must be employed. “Free” does not negate this basic fact; if someone receives these services for “free”, all it really means is that someone else, who is not receiving these services, is being compelled to pay for them.

Such a wish is born of extreme ignorance about the most basic facts of economics.

It is not possible for college nor medical care to be free.

It costs money—lots of money—to offer these services. Facilities must be built and maintained, equipment and materials must be provided,and staff must be employed. “Free” does not negate this basic fact; if someone receives these services for “free”, all it really means is that someone else, who is not receiving these services, is being compelled to pay for them.

You think our current system is better? The majority of for-profit hospitals and Doctors clinics in the US are owned by insurance companies who derive profit from both ends.

You are correct that Obama and Co have propped up the insurance industry to incredible levels and are making them fatter than ever.

Our technical health care system is still the best in the world.

 

[JBond]

Somebody around here probably already did a thread like this. And there was that documentary done about it called "Sicko." But I got quite a few objections out of people with my thread, "College should be free. (for Americans)" I wonder what they will have to say about me saying that health care should be free too. And the worse that may be for insurance companies, the better I like it!

Such a wish is born of extreme ignorance about the most basic facts of economics.

It is not possible for college nor medical care to be free.

It costs money—lots of money—to offer these services. Facilities must be built and maintained, equipment and materials must be provided,and staff must be employed. “Free” does not negate this basic fact; if someone receives these services for “free”, all it really means is that someone else, who is not receiving these services, is being compelled to pay for them.

Such a wish is born of extreme ignorance about the most basic facts of economics.

It is not possible for college nor medical care to be free.

It costs money—lots of money—to offer these services. Facilities must be built and maintained, equipment and materials must be provided,and staff must be employed. “Free” does not negate this basic fact; if someone receives these services for “free”, all it really means is that someone else, who is not receiving these services, is being compelled to pay for them.

You think our current system is better? The majority of for-profit hospitals and Doctors clinics in the US are owned by insurance companies who derive profit from both ends.

Screw your bullshit "facts of economics." I suppose next you'll be telling me that human caused global warming isn't real. Get this. Pharaohs were able to have pyrmids built basically at no cost. Being god-kings, all they had to do was tell their people to do it. And it was done. Paying students to go to college AND having universal health care is nothing, ABSOLUTELY NOTHING compared to that.

This is hysterical......

I'll bet those conquered slaves got finished with one pyramid and said "Oh man...that was great. Let's build another one".

Or was it the lashes, spears and swords that kept them going.

I'll be they had universal health care too.

Can you be any more foolish ?

Krypto is just a silly kid, but apparently he is a fan a slavery. Comparing the building of the pyramids to forcing citizen to fund his asinine ideas are related, but not the way he thinks they are.

 

[Sun Devil 92]

Somebody around here probably already did a thread like this. And there was that documentary done about it called "Sicko." But I got quite a few objections out of people with my thread, "College should be free. (for Americans)" I wonder what they will have to say about me saying that health care should be free too. And the worse that may be for insurance companies, the better I like it!

Such a wish is born of extreme ignorance about the most basic facts of economics.

It is not possible for college nor medical care to be free.

It costs money—lots of money—to offer these services. Facilities must be built and maintained, equipment and materials must be provided,and staff must be employed. “Free” does not negate this basic fact; if someone receives these services for “free”, all it really means is that someone else, who is not receiving these services, is being compelled to pay for them.

Such a wish is born of extreme ignorance about the most basic facts of economics.

It is not possible for college nor medical care to be free.

It costs money—lots of money—to offer these services. Facilities must be built and maintained, equipment and materials must be provided,and staff must be employed. “Free” does not negate this basic fact; if someone receives these services for “free”, all it really means is that someone else, who is not receiving these services, is being compelled to pay for them.

You think our current system is better? The majority of for-profit hospitals and Doctors clinics in the US are owned by insurance companies who derive profit from both ends.

Screw your bullshit "facts of economics." I suppose next you'll be telling me that human caused global warming isn't real. Get this. Pharaohs were able to have pyrmids built basically at no cost. Being god-kings, all they had to do was tell their people to do it. And it was done. Paying students to go to college AND having universal health care is nothing, ABSOLUTELY NOTHING compared to that.

This is hysterical......

I'll bet those conquered slaves got finished with one pyramid and said "Oh man...that was great. Let's build another one".

Or was it the lashes, spears and swords that kept them going.

I'll be they had universal health care too.

Can you be any more foolish ?

Krypto is just a silly kid, but apparently he is a fan a slavery. Comparing the building of the pyramids to forcing citizen to fund his asinine ideas are related, but not the way he thinks they are.

Given what I've read, she suffers from class envy.

 

[Conservative65]

Dear krypto
OKAY if you believe in this, start a company that raises money for scholarships, internships
and student loans and grants. Feature students you think deserve funding.
You could have a million dollar site, combining gofundme and those audition contest / shark tank shows.

Get universities behind you. Grant foundations.
Big companies looking to hire rising stars. Go for it!

I can't even afford to eat very well. And after a few weeks, I am usually broke. Also, I often have to ride a bus if I need to go anywhere. Why don't you just suggest to me that I wave a magic fucking wand. After all, doesn't that work for everybody?

I didn't wave a magic wand. I went out and did something to earn what I have. You, on the other hand, demand someone else go out and earn so it can be taken in order to provide to you.

No one, and I mean no one, owes you a damn thing.

I suggest you get off your ass and spend half as much time doing something to better yourself as you do demanding someone else provide to you.

Oh. You mean what you "earned" in the absence of any other single human on the planet? You're a joke. Next, moron, what is it you don't get. If medical coverage and college were free, "everybody" would benifit. In the documentary "Sicko," the people they talked to, the "working" ones, were horrified at the thought of doing without their free medical coverage. And you are horrified at the thought of it? How interesting. Also, I have something to suggest to you too. But I don't feel like getting banned.

Dear krypto OK so if the benefits are going to pay off,
are you willing to fund this yourself if you believe it so much?
I give donations to Doctors without Borders because their
cost effectiveness ensures the most people will benefit.

There's nothing wrong with CHOOSING to give charity.

But krypto if you are going to MANDATE charity,
who has the right to DICTATE WHICH CHARITIES
to give to? Why isn't this left to people to decide
to give to Harvard medical school to expand public health internships
and outreach. Or give to UTMB in Galveston.

If this is mandated through govt isn't that dangerous?
What if rightwing could get in control and MANDATE
that our taxes go to PROLIFE groups and anyone
who wants to give to PROCHOICE options, too bad,
you still get FINED and your MONEY goes to the PROLIFE programs anyway.

krypto if you are going to have FEDERAL GOVT
dictate which health care groups to fund, who gets
to decide the rules and regulations.

I'm sorry you don't get this.
Someone you assume that once this power get
into the hands of govt then "magically the govt
will direct the money as you want in your mind"

Good luck with that krypto from experience
the ONLY way I know to ensure the money goes
where YOU think it should go is for YOU to direct
the money there YOURSELF. This is what
conservatives means by running social programs
through the PRIVATE sector where YOU control
the money and where it goes because it's your money you are responsible for.

krypto I will believe you when you try to set up a program
like Doctors without Borders, Pace Universal or AmeriCares.
Go ahead, see how much work it takes to manage health
care resources and services and get them from point A to point B.
You'll quickly find you don't want govt involved and interfering
with the operations it takes to run such a program effectively.

Remember krypto when you run a program as a private
individual or organization, you can make all the decisions yourself.
When you RUN THINGS THROUGH FEDERAL GOVT
that means you have to vote and pass things that represent
ALL OTHER PEOPLE AND STATES represented by GOVT.

So all the people you are arguing with HERE
they would have to AGREE where and how to fund
which policy or program to make it work and represent everyone.

If you want to run things YOUR way, then you do it privately.
You fund and manage it yourself, through your own organization,
and then you retain full freedom to decide how to do it.

I think you and other liberals have gotten in the bad habit of
expecting to run things through govt and think it will come out
how YOU want it. But YOU aren't the entire nation paying it
and owed equal representation for anytihng passed and enforced by govt.

You seem to think that "once the money is in the hands of govt
you have the right to spend it any way you see fit"

WHY do you think you have the right to bypass the consent
of other taxpayers who are paying in also?

WHY do you think your idea is so much better you can
impose and dictate on everyone else?

I'd really like to know why and where you get this idea.
If any other group took public tax dollars and voted to give it
some charity you didn't agree to fund, you'd yell too.
Why can't you see that people deserve equal freedom
to make that choice where to fund social programs that not everyone agrees on?

Where's the inclusion of diversity?
Where does this come from that you think you can dictate for the rest of the nation?

Blah blah blah. I'm not talking about charity. I'm talking about society. And your talk of me personally funding free health care, or paying students to go to college, is ludicrous. Also, your argument about pro-life is pretty far off the mark. No matter how those pro-life morons slice it, it is always going to be the better argument that it is the woman's body so it should be her choice. Another thing is that, like it or not, other countries make universal health care work. If Americans can't, it doesn't mean that there is something wrong with universal health care. It means that there is something wrong with America. Which there is. Many things.

If it's the woman's choices because it's her body, why are the rest of us forced to support what SHE chooses to have when she can't afford the choice SHE made? If she makes the choice, shouldn't she be the one to pay for that choice whatever the choice may be?

 

[Conservative65]

Somebody around here probably already did a thread like this. And there was that documentary done about it called "Sicko." But I got quite a few objections out of people with my thread, "College should be free. (for Americans)" I wonder what they will have to say about me saying that health care should be free too. And the worse that may be for insurance companies, the better I like it!

Such a wish is born of extreme ignorance about the most basic facts of economics.

It is not possible for college nor medical care to be free.

It costs money—lots of money—to offer these services. Facilities must be built and maintained, equipment and materials must be provided,and staff must be employed. “Free” does not negate this basic fact; if someone receives these services for “free”, all it really means is that someone else, who is not receiving these services, is being compelled to pay for them.

Such a wish is born of extreme ignorance about the most basic facts of economics.

It is not possible for college nor medical care to be free.

It costs money—lots of money—to offer these services. Facilities must be built and maintained, equipment and materials must be provided,and staff must be employed. “Free” does not negate this basic fact; if someone receives these services for “free”, all it really means is that someone else, who is not receiving these services, is being compelled to pay for them.

You think our current system is better? The majority of for-profit hospitals and Doctors clinics in the US are owned by insurance companies who derive profit from both ends.

Screw your bullshit "facts of economics." I suppose next you'll be telling me that human caused global warming isn't real. Get this. Pharaohs were able to have pyrmids built basically at no cost. Being god-kings, all they had to do was tell their people to do it. And it was done. Paying students to go to college AND having universal health care is nothing, ABSOLUTELY NOTHING compared to that.

This is hysterical......

I'll bet those conquered slaves got finished with one pyramid and said "Oh man...that was great. Let's build another one".

Or was it the lashes, spears and swords that kept them going.

I'll be they had universal health care too.

Can you be any more foolish ?

Krypto is just a silly kid, but apparently he is a fan a slavery. Comparing the building of the pyramids to forcing citizen to fund his asinine ideas are related, but not the way he thinks they are.

And he wonders why people don't think he's a good "investment" when it comes to funding college.

 

[JBond]

Everything should be free!

 

[emilynghiem]

I can't even afford to eat very well. And after a few weeks, I am usually broke. Also, I often have to ride a bus if I need to go anywhere. Why don't you just suggest to me that I wave a magic fucking wand. After all, doesn't that work for everybody?

I didn't wave a magic wand. I went out and did something to earn what I have. You, on the other hand, demand someone else go out and earn so it can be taken in order to provide to you.

No one, and I mean no one, owes you a damn thing.

I suggest you get off your ass and spend half as much time doing something to better yourself as you do demanding someone else provide to you.

Oh. You mean what you "earned" in the absence of any other single human on the planet? You're a joke. Next, moron, what is it you don't get. If medical coverage and college were free, "everybody" would benifit. In the documentary "Sicko," the people they talked to, the "working" ones, were horrified at the thought of doing without their free medical coverage. And you are horrified at the thought of it? How interesting. Also, I have something to suggest to you too. But I don't feel like getting banned.

Dear krypto OK so if the benefits are going to pay off,
are you willing to fund this yourself if you believe it so much?
I give donations to Doctors without Borders because their
cost effectiveness ensures the most people will benefit.

There's nothing wrong with CHOOSING to give charity.

But krypto if you are going to MANDATE charity,
who has the right to DICTATE WHICH CHARITIES
to give to? Why isn't this left to people to decide
to give to Harvard medical school to expand public health internships
and outreach. Or give to UTMB in Galveston.

If this is mandated through govt isn't that dangerous?
What if rightwing could get in control and MANDATE
that our taxes go to PROLIFE groups and anyone
who wants to give to PROCHOICE options, too bad,
you still get FINED and your MONEY goes to the PROLIFE programs anyway.

krypto if you are going to have FEDERAL GOVT
dictate which health care groups to fund, who gets
to decide the rules and regulations.

I'm sorry you don't get this.
Someone you assume that once this power get
into the hands of govt then "magically the govt
will direct the money as you want in your mind"

Good luck with that krypto from experience
the ONLY way I know to ensure the money goes
where YOU think it should go is for YOU to direct
the money there YOURSELF. This is what
conservatives means by running social programs
through the PRIVATE sector where YOU control
the money and where it goes because it's your money you are responsible for.

krypto I will believe you when you try to set up a program
like Doctors without Borders, Pace Universal or AmeriCares.
Go ahead, see how much work it takes to manage health
care resources and services and get them from point A to point B.
You'll quickly find you don't want govt involved and interfering
with the operations it takes to run such a program effectively.

Remember krypto when you run a program as a private
individual or organization, you can make all the decisions yourself.
When you RUN THINGS THROUGH FEDERAL GOVT
that means you have to vote and pass things that represent
ALL OTHER PEOPLE AND STATES represented by GOVT.

So all the people you are arguing with HERE
they would have to AGREE where and how to fund
which policy or program to make it work and represent everyone.

If you want to run things YOUR way, then you do it privately.
You fund and manage it yourself, through your own organization,
and then you retain full freedom to decide how to do it.

I think you and other liberals have gotten in the bad habit of
expecting to run things through govt and think it will come out
how YOU want it. But YOU aren't the entire nation paying it
and owed equal representation for anytihng passed and enforced by govt.

You seem to think that "once the money is in the hands of govt
you have the right to spend it any way you see fit"

WHY do you think you have the right to bypass the consent
of other taxpayers who are paying in also?

WHY do you think your idea is so much better you can
impose and dictate on everyone else?

I'd really like to know why and where you get this idea.
If any other group took public tax dollars and voted to give it
some charity you didn't agree to fund, you'd yell too.
Why can't you see that people deserve equal freedom
to make that choice where to fund social programs that not everyone agrees on?

Where's the inclusion of diversity?
Where does this come from that you think you can dictate for the rest of the nation?

Blah blah blah. I'm not talking about charity. I'm talking about society. And your talk of me personally funding free health care, or paying students to go to college, is ludicrous. Also, your argument about pro-life is pretty far off the mark. No matter how those pro-life morons slice it, it is always going to be the better argument that it is the woman's body so it should be her choice. Another thing is that, like it or not, other countries make universal health care work. If Americans can't, it doesn't mean that there is something wrong with universal health care. It means that there is something wrong with America. Which there is. Many things.

If it's the woman's choices because it's her body, why are the rest of us forced to support what SHE chooses to have when she can't afford the choice SHE made? If she makes the choice, shouldn't she be the one to pay for that choice whatever the choice may be?

Conservative65 Maybe if we started holding the MEN accountable
for the costs they helped to create, we'd get an answer to your questions!

 

[JBond]

I didn't wave a magic wand. I went out and did something to earn what I have. You, on the other hand, demand someone else go out and earn so it can be taken in order to provide to you.

No one, and I mean no one, owes you a damn thing.

I suggest you get off your ass and spend half as much time doing something to better yourself as you do demanding someone else provide to you.

Oh. You mean what you "earned" in the absence of any other single human on the planet? You're a joke. Next, moron, what is it you don't get. If medical coverage and college were free, "everybody" would benifit. In the documentary "Sicko," the people they talked to, the "working" ones, were horrified at the thought of doing without their free medical coverage. And you are horrified at the thought of it? How interesting. Also, I have something to suggest to you too. But I don't feel like getting banned.

Dear krypto OK so if the benefits are going to pay off,
are you willing to fund this yourself if you believe it so much?
I give donations to Doctors without Borders because their
cost effectiveness ensures the most people will benefit.

There's nothing wrong with CHOOSING to give charity.

But krypto if you are going to MANDATE charity,
who has the right to DICTATE WHICH CHARITIES
to give to? Why isn't this left to people to decide
to give to Harvard medical school to expand public health internships
and outreach. Or give to UTMB in Galveston.

If this is mandated through govt isn't that dangerous?
What if rightwing could get in control and MANDATE
that our taxes go to PROLIFE groups and anyone
who wants to give to PROCHOICE options, too bad,
you still get FINED and your MONEY goes to the PROLIFE programs anyway.

krypto if you are going to have FEDERAL GOVT
dictate which health care groups to fund, who gets
to decide the rules and regulations.

I'm sorry you don't get this.
Someone you assume that once this power get
into the hands of govt then "magically the govt
will direct the money as you want in your mind"

Good luck with that krypto from experience
the ONLY way I know to ensure the money goes
where YOU think it should go is for YOU to direct
the money there YOURSELF. This is what
conservatives means by running social programs
through the PRIVATE sector where YOU control
the money and where it goes because it's your money you are responsible for.

krypto I will believe you when you try to set up a program
like Doctors without Borders, Pace Universal or AmeriCares.
Go ahead, see how much work it takes to manage health
care resources and services and get them from point A to point B.
You'll quickly find you don't want govt involved and interfering
with the operations it takes to run such a program effectively.

Remember krypto when you run a program as a private
individual or organization, you can make all the decisions yourself.
When you RUN THINGS THROUGH FEDERAL GOVT
that means you have to vote and pass things that represent
ALL OTHER PEOPLE AND STATES represented by GOVT.

So all the people you are arguing with HERE
they would have to AGREE where and how to fund
which policy or program to make it work and represent everyone.

If you want to run things YOUR way, then you do it privately.
You fund and manage it yourself, through your own organization,
and then you retain full freedom to decide how to do it.

I think you and other liberals have gotten in the bad habit of
expecting to run things through govt and think it will come out
how YOU want it. But YOU aren't the entire nation paying it
and owed equal representation for anytihng passed and enforced by govt.

You seem to think that "once the money is in the hands of govt
you have the right to spend it any way you see fit"

WHY do you think you have the right to bypass the consent
of other taxpayers who are paying in also?

WHY do you think your idea is so much better you can
impose and dictate on everyone else?

I'd really like to know why and where you get this idea.
If any other group took public tax dollars and voted to give it
some charity you didn't agree to fund, you'd yell too.
Why can't you see that people deserve equal freedom
to make that choice where to fund social programs that not everyone agrees on?

Where's the inclusion of diversity?
Where does this come from that you think you can dictate for the rest of the nation?

Blah blah blah. I'm not talking about charity. I'm talking about society. And your talk of me personally funding free health care, or paying students to go to college, is ludicrous. Also, your argument about pro-life is pretty far off the mark. No matter how those pro-life morons slice it, it is always going to be the better argument that it is the woman's body so it should be her choice. Another thing is that, like it or not, other countries make universal health care work. If Americans can't, it doesn't mean that there is something wrong with universal health care. It means that there is something wrong with America. Which there is. Many things.

If it's the woman's choices because it's her body, why are the rest of us forced to support what SHE chooses to have when she can't afford the choice SHE made? If she makes the choice, shouldn't she be the one to pay for that choice whatever the choice may be?

Conservative65 Maybe if we started holding the MEN accountable
for the costs they helped to create, we'd get an answer to your questions!

There is a legal system in place to address your concern. What else would you like?

 

[Conservative65]

I didn't wave a magic wand. I went out and did something to earn what I have. You, on the other hand, demand someone else go out and earn so it can be taken in order to provide to you.

No one, and I mean no one, owes you a damn thing.

I suggest you get off your ass and spend half as much time doing something to better yourself as you do demanding someone else provide to you.

Oh. You mean what you "earned" in the absence of any other single human on the planet? You're a joke. Next, moron, what is it you don't get. If medical coverage and college were free, "everybody" would benifit. In the documentary "Sicko," the people they talked to, the "working" ones, were horrified at the thought of doing without their free medical coverage. And you are horrified at the thought of it? How interesting. Also, I have something to suggest to you too. But I don't feel like getting banned.

Dear krypto OK so if the benefits are going to pay off,
are you willing to fund this yourself if you believe it so much?
I give donations to Doctors without Borders because their
cost effectiveness ensures the most people will benefit.

There's nothing wrong with CHOOSING to give charity.

But krypto if you are going to MANDATE charity,
who has the right to DICTATE WHICH CHARITIES
to give to? Why isn't this left to people to decide
to give to Harvard medical school to expand public health internships
and outreach. Or give to UTMB in Galveston.

If this is mandated through govt isn't that dangerous?
What if rightwing could get in control and MANDATE
that our taxes go to PROLIFE groups and anyone
who wants to give to PROCHOICE options, too bad,
you still get FINED and your MONEY goes to the PROLIFE programs anyway.

krypto if you are going to have FEDERAL GOVT
dictate which health care groups to fund, who gets
to decide the rules and regulations.

I'm sorry you don't get this.
Someone you assume that once this power get
into the hands of govt then "magically the govt
will direct the money as you want in your mind"

Good luck with that krypto from experience
the ONLY way I know to ensure the money goes
where YOU think it should go is for YOU to direct
the money there YOURSELF. This is what
conservatives means by running social programs
through the PRIVATE sector where YOU control
the money and where it goes because it's your money you are responsible for.

krypto I will believe you when you try to set up a program
like Doctors without Borders, Pace Universal or AmeriCares.
Go ahead, see how much work it takes to manage health
care resources and services and get them from point A to point B.
You'll quickly find you don't want govt involved and interfering
with the operations it takes to run such a program effectively.

Remember krypto when you run a program as a private
individual or organization, you can make all the decisions yourself.
When you RUN THINGS THROUGH FEDERAL GOVT
that means you have to vote and pass things that represent
ALL OTHER PEOPLE AND STATES represented by GOVT.

So all the people you are arguing with HERE
they would have to AGREE where and how to fund
which policy or program to make it work and represent everyone.

If you want to run things YOUR way, then you do it privately.
You fund and manage it yourself, through your own organization,
and then you retain full freedom to decide how to do it.

I think you and other liberals have gotten in the bad habit of
expecting to run things through govt and think it will come out
how YOU want it. But YOU aren't the entire nation paying it
and owed equal representation for anytihng passed and enforced by govt.

You seem to think that "once the money is in the hands of govt
you have the right to spend it any way you see fit"

WHY do you think you have the right to bypass the consent
of other taxpayers who are paying in also?

WHY do you think your idea is so much better you can
impose and dictate on everyone else?

I'd really like to know why and where you get this idea.
If any other group took public tax dollars and voted to give it
some charity you didn't agree to fund, you'd yell too.
Why can't you see that people deserve equal freedom
to make that choice where to fund social programs that not everyone agrees on?

Where's the inclusion of diversity?
Where does this come from that you think you can dictate for the rest of the nation?

Blah blah blah. I'm not talking about charity. I'm talking about society. And your talk of me personally funding free health care, or paying students to go to college, is ludicrous. Also, your argument about pro-life is pretty far off the mark. No matter how those pro-life morons slice it, it is always going to be the better argument that it is the woman's body so it should be her choice. Another thing is that, like it or not, other countries make universal health care work. If Americans can't, it doesn't mean that there is something wrong with universal health care. It means that there is something wrong with America. Which there is. Many things.

If it's the woman's choices because it's her body, why are the rest of us forced to support what SHE chooses to have when she can't afford the choice SHE made? If she makes the choice, shouldn't she be the one to pay for that choice whatever the choice may be?

Conservative65 Maybe if we started holding the MEN accountable
for the costs they helped to create, we'd get an answer to your questions!

I'm all for the sperm donor baby daddy doing just that. I'm also in favor that when/if he doesn't, the rest of us by default aren't held financially responsible for a choice we were told was none of our business. If a woman wants to have a dozen kids, that's her choice. I'm willing to let her do so. However, when she can't afford her choice and can't get the one(s) for whom she spread her legs to fund them, don't come looking to me as a money source.

I address those who say what a woman does with her body is none of my or the government's business. My problem is when the one telling me and the government to butt out of her choice comes looking for help and wants that same government she told to butt out to force those people she told to butt out to pay for it. I don't really give a shit if the sperm donor baby daddy helps her or not as long as the rest of us aren't forced to fund a choice we were told was none of our business.