Have you been 'Trumped'?

[Rumpole]

Ahh, Rumpole resorts to namecalling.

and do you issue that comment to all the name callers on this forum? You'd be mighty busy if you did.

 

[Bob Blaylock]

Well, at least you admit being a bigot.
No, it's not a good quality.
Perverts, you mean like your buddies, Trump, Thomas and Kavanaugh? all perverts,.
Human beings, how pathetic.
Most of your posts seem to be anti-Trans and pro gun,. You are one fucked up dude.

 

[kaz]

considering the defendant is a former US President, no prosecutor is going to indict such a large target, not to mention the first time in history, unless there is a TON of DIRECT evidence.

So, yes, in a court of law he is alleged. But, in the face of TONS of evidence, we, in the COURT of PUBLIC OPINION, are allowed to hold opinions, based on these and available facts .

In my opinion, Trump is GUILTY AS HELL.

This is just Democrat spin. It's nothing but lies. The cases are weak and are just what they accuse Trump of, election interference.

A lot of Democrats need to go to jail. And now, thanks you you, we can prosecute them all ... in Texas !!!

Something I never said before, go Longhorns! First up, Joe Biden, see ya in a Texas prison!

 

[MaryL]

Okay, Trump fans, if you read the GA indictment, it chronicles all of the false statements regarding election fraud, just about every claim of election fraud is listed in that indictment. The lies are 'acts in furtherance of a conspiracy to overthrow Biden's legitimate election'.

Now, the first amendment doesn't protect speech done in the furtherance of a criminal conspiracy, so, it seems to me, the only defense for Trump, et al, will be to prove that all of the false statements in the indictment alleged to be false, his defense will be to prove that they are actually true.

If he can prove his false statements as fact, there is no crime. All of this will come out in trial, and we shall find out if he was lying. I know that he was lying, because no proof of any kind has been produced. I've seen it all. Irregularities, isolated instances, sure, they exist in all elections, but a vast conspiracy to steal the election? No way. It's not even logistically possible, if you would take the time to scrutinize exactly what you are alleging.

See. what I think you Trump fans don't realize is that Trump, what he did was, first he planted the idea into the minds of his base by declaring, months before the first ballot was cast 'the only way Democrats can win is if they rig the election', and when the election came, given that all elections have irregularities, he exploited those irregularities, the kind of which occur in every election, the kind of which are not made a big stink about in past elections, but, alas, Trump could 'trump them up' so to speak, make them seem like the 'fraud' he was talking about when he first told the big lie.

And then the scheme (the conspiracy listed in the GA indictment) unfolded to bolster the lie.

Don't you see what Trump has done? You've been a victim of his treachery, all along, and you don't even know it.

Everything about Trump, his defrauding thousands out of millions for a fake university, his fake charity he was fined $2 million for 'illegal activities', I mean, his paying hush money to a porn star, I could go on and on about his crimes, frauds, all the folks in his entourage indicted, convicted, the man is rife with criminality, it oozes from every pore of his being, he poisons everyone he comes into contact with, and they wind up being indicted, convicted and now 6 more of his lawyer's are being indicted, all of the folks who tried to help in in GA, are being indicted, and trying to steal an election, while accusing dems of doing it, is consistent with who Trump is.

And who is Trump?

It's really simple.

He's the biggest criminal, con man America has ever experienced, and you've been Trumped.

Vote for someone else, Chris Christy, or someone like that, you know, someone who IS NOT A CRIMINAL. I mean, after the crimes of NIxon, Agnew, Reagan, you'd think you guys would have learned your lesson by now, but, I guess not . Oh, I know you think his popularity is rising, yes, with his hard core base. But, when the trials begin, your boy is going to be sitting in court, day after day, revelations, details of his crimes will come to light, the scheme will be front and center, that Biden actually won and that Trump is, indeed, who the prosecution claims him to be, the biggest con man criminal this country has ever seen in the White House and we shall see if his numbers hold during the general elections.

What? Nonsense. You have been Bidenized.

 

[Rigby5]

considering the defendant is a former US President, no prosecutor is going to indict such a large target, not to mention the first time in history, unless there is a TON of DIRECT evidence.

So, yes, in a court of law he is alleged. But, in the face of TONS of evidence, we, in the COURT of PUBLIC OPINION, are allowed to hold opinions, based on these and available facts .

In my opinion, Trump is GUILTY AS HELL.

Nonsense.
Clearly one would not normally charge a president, even when guilty like Bush was for lying about Iraqi WMD.
The fact they ARE prosecuting Trump on 91 charges is such ridiculous "piling on", that it is proof there is NO evidence or validity to the charges.

The first charges were over classified docs, and clearly the laws totally exempt president, and therefore ex-presidents, from any possible classified doc prosecution.

The latest one are about an old bank loan, long repaid, that the bank was happy with, so no fraud is remotely possible.
The law is clear, that banks always have to do their own independent appraisal, so the claim of fraud is itself fraudulent.

I have not been following the Georgia case much, but since alternate electors are always picked ahead of time and well known to the legislators, as well as how they have to vote, no elector fraud is remotely possible.

Anyone calling Jan 6 an "insurrection" obviously is lying.

 

[TheGreatSatan]

Nonsense.
Clearly one would not normally charge a president, even when guilty like Bush was for lying about Iraqi WMD.
The fact they ARE prosecuting Trump on 91 charges is such ridiculous "piling on", that it is proof there is NO evidence or validity to the charges.

The first charges were over classified docs, and clearly the laws totally exempt president, and therefore ex-presidents, from any possible classified doc prosecution.

The latest one are about an old bank loan, long repaid, that the bank was happy with, so no fraud is remotely possible.
The law is clear, that banks always have to do their own independent appraisal, so the claim of fraud is itself fraudulent.

I have not been following the Georgia case much, but since alternate electors are always picked ahead of time and well known to the legislators, as well as how they have to vote, no elector fraud is remotely possible.

Anyone calling Jan 6 an "insurrection" obviously is lying.

Democrats literally believe viking hat guy almost became Supreme Leader.

 

[kyzr]

Democrats literally believe viking hat guy almost became Supreme Leader.

This Shaman dude?

 

[TheGreatSatan]

This Shaman dude?

View attachment 849975

Worst insurrection ever.

 

[Winco]

Worst insurrection ever.

Failed Insurrection Attempt.

They tried, not very well, but they tried.
And guess what........
Many are getting Participation Prizes.

LOLLOLLL

 

[Leo123]

Nonsense.
Clearly one would not normally charge a president, even when guilty like Bush was for lying about Iraqi WMD.
The fact they ARE prosecuting Trump on 91 charges is such ridiculous "piling on", that it is proof there is NO evidence or validity to the charges.

The first charges were over classified docs, and clearly the laws totally exempt president, and therefore ex-presidents, from any possible classified doc prosecution.

The latest one are about an old bank loan, long repaid, that the bank was happy with, so no fraud is remotely possible.
The law is clear, that banks always have to do their own independent appraisal, so the claim of fraud is itself fraudulent.

I have not been following the Georgia case much, but since alternate electors are always picked ahead of time and well known to the legislators, as well as how they have to vote, no elector fraud is remotely possible.

Anyone calling Jan 6 an "insurrection" obviously is lying.

The charges are going down one at a time. You don't hear them spouting shit about 'classified docs' anymore and the bank loan charges turned out to be a fiasco. Now they are pounding on the 'fake elector' lie. This is nothing but election interference by the radical element of the Democrat Party. They are the ones who need to be charged with crimes of using lawfare to skew an election.

 

[TheGreatSatan]

Failed Insurrection Attempt.

They tried, not very well, but they tried.
And guess what........
Many are getting Participation Prizes.

LOLLOLLL

The only people who take Jan 6 seriously are WEF shillbots. Most Americans don't even know what it is.

 

[Rumpole]

Nonsense.
Clearly one would not normally charge a president, even when guilty like Bush was for lying about Iraqi WMD.
The fact they ARE prosecuting Trump on 91 charges is such ridiculous "piling on", that it is proof there is NO evidence or validity to the charges.

That the prosecutors knowing how high the stakes are (and that it is the first time in history) when prosecuting a former US President when the spotlight of the world is burning their backsides, all the anticipated threats they, and their families, will receive from some of Trump's hard core and rather crazy believers, that because of this fact they will go at length to make darn sure there is an over abundance of evidence. Rest assured, there is more than enough evidence because to believe the prosecutors would prosecute willy nilly defies logic

The first charges were over classified docs, and clearly the laws totally exempt president, and therefore ex-presidents, from any possible classified doc prosecution.

Clearly they do not. He's been charged with Espionage, a federal crime which does not depend on any classification regime. Such will be considered, but much more weight will be given to DNI damage assessments, noting that item #19 on the FBI inventory list was a nuke doc, which, that alone, will get you 10 years.

The latest one are about an old bank loan, long repaid, that the bank was happy with, so no fraud is remotely possible.

Giving an X value on a bank loan, and a Y value, which which is egregiously inconsistent with X value, on a tax document, is a fraud violation of NY State laws.

The law is clear, that banks always have to do their own independent appraisal, so the claim of fraud is itself fraudulent.

Actually, the bank's appraisals do not vanquish Trump's fraudulent applications being inconsistent on same properties comparing those documents to documents submitted to the IRS.

I have not been following the Georgia case much, but since alternate electors are always picked ahead of time and well known to the legislators, as well as how they have to vote, no elector fraud is remotely possible.

Forged certificates of ascertainment were sent to the Government, which is a violation of federal law. They weren't authentic because they weren't signed by a governor.

Anyone calling Jan 6 an "insurrection" obviously is lying.

doesn't matter, Trump isn't being charged with an insurrection.

 

[Rigby5]

That the prosecutors knowing how high the stakes are (and that it is the first time in history) when prosecuting a former US President when the spotlight of the world is burning their backsides, all the anticipated threats they, and their families, will receive from some of Trump's hard core and rather crazy believers, that because of this fact they will go at length to make darn sure there is an over abundance of evidence. Rest assured, there is more than enough evidence because to believe the prosecutors would prosecute willy nilly defies logic

Clearly they do not. He's been charged with Espionage, a federal crime which does not depend on any classification regime. Such will be considered, but much more weight will be given to DNI damage assessments, noting that item #19 on the FBI inventory list was a nuke doc, which, that alone, will get you 10 years.

Giving an X value on a bank loan, and a Y value, which which is egregiously inconsistent with X value, on a tax document, is a fraud violation of NY State laws.

Actually, the bank's appraisals do not vanquish Trump's fraudulent applications being inconsistent on same properties comparing those documents to documents submitted to the IRS.

Forged certificates of ascertainment were sent to the Government, which is a violation of federal law. They weren't authentic because they weren't signed by a governor.

doesn't matter, Trump isn't being charged with an insurrection.

I am far left, but that is the stupidest and lying post I have ever seen.

First you use circular logic fallacy, where you claim no one would have prosecuted unless there was real guilt, and clearly the goal is to prevent Trump from campaigning. And since campaigns cost billions, their motive is obvious and incontrovertible.

Second is the Espionage DOES totally depend on the "classified doc laws".
Nuke docs clearly are legally given by president to whomever they want to give them to.

There is no law at all that pertains to bank loan application, everyone always puffs, and it can never be illegal.
That is because there are several federal laws preventing banks from not doing their own independent appraisal.
The law being used against Trump was intended for securities exchanges only.
It is obviously illegal to apply that law to a bank loan that has already been repaid and the bank happy.

The claim "forged certificates" were ever sent is a lie.
Here is the actual procedure:
{...
Each state is free to choose the appearance and layout of the certificate. Staff from the Office of the Federal Register ensure that each certificate contains all legally required information.[13] States are required to produce either seven original certificates with two certified copies, or nine original certificates; of these, one original and either two more originals or two copies, are sent to the Archivist via registered mail or a commercial carrier. Both the House and the Senate receive one of the copies.[13]

When each state's electors meet to vote (on the first Monday after the second Wednesday of December),[3] they sign and record their vote on six "certificates of the vote",[9][11] which are then paired with the six remaining certificates of ascertainment. One pair of certificates is sent to the president of the Senate; two pairs are sent to the Archivist; two pairs are sent via registered mail to the state's secretary of state; and one pair is sent to the chief judge of the closest United States district court.[14][15] One of each of the two pairs sent to the Archivist and the secretary of state are designated for public inspection, while the others (and the chief judge's copy) are "held subject to the order of the President of the United States Senate".[13] The Archivist must receive the certificates by the fourth Wednesday in December,[11] and may take "extraordinary measures to retrieve duplicate originals" otherwise.[13]

The Vice President, as President of the Senate, opens the certificates in alphabetical order by state during a joint session of Congress in the House chamber on January 6 and gives them to one of four "tellers", two from the House and two from the Senate, who, seated at the clerks' desks, tally the vote.[15][16]
...}

So then obviously the actual legal procedure involved many duplicate copies.
And it is impossible to forge any, and they are all already known and easily authenticated.

 

[kaz]

Nonsense.
Clearly one would not normally charge a president, even when guilty like Bush was for lying about Iraqi WMD.
The fact they ARE prosecuting Trump on 91 charges is such ridiculous "piling on", that it is proof there is NO evidence or validity to the charges.

The first charges were over classified docs, and clearly the laws totally exempt president, and therefore ex-presidents, from any possible classified doc prosecution.

The latest one are about an old bank loan, long repaid, that the bank was happy with, so no fraud is remotely possible.
The law is clear, that banks always have to do their own independent appraisal, so the claim of fraud is itself fraudulent.

I have not been following the Georgia case much, but since alternate electors are always picked ahead of time and well known to the legislators, as well as how they have to vote, no elector fraud is remotely possible.

Anyone calling Jan 6 an "insurrection" obviously is lying.

Funny, Hillary, Gore, and a bunch of other Democrats said there were WMD's too and you don't mention how they lied.

W was a TERRIBLE President. It's not necessary to lie about him to make him sound worse than he actually was, Fido

 

[MagicMike]

Nonsense.
Clearly one would not normally charge a president, even when guilty like Bush was for lying about Iraqi WMD.
The fact they ARE prosecuting Trump on 91 charges is such ridiculous "piling on", that it is proof there is NO evidence or validity to the charges.

The first charges were over classified docs, and clearly the laws totally exempt president, and therefore ex-presidents, from any possible classified doc prosecution.

The latest one are about an old bank loan, long repaid, that the bank was happy with, so no fraud is remotely possible.
The law is clear, that banks always have to do their own independent appraisal, so the claim of fraud is itself fraudulent.

I have not been following the Georgia case much, but since alternate electors are always picked ahead of time and well known to the legislators, as well as how they have to vote, no elector fraud is remotely possible.

Anyone calling Jan 6 an "insurrection" obviously is lying.

Your TWS is working overtime.

 

[Rumpole]

I am far left, but that is the stupidest and lying post I have ever seen.

First you use circular logic fallacy, where you claim no one would have prosecuted unless there was real guilt,

I never made that claim. I claimed they won't prosecute without evidence. "guilt" is a determination by a jury. So, there can be no 'circular logic', which tells me right off the starting line you aren't interpreting the words in front of you, correctly. How are you going to do in the rest of your rebuttal? Let's take a look.

and clearly the goal is to prevent Trump from campaigning. And since campaigns cost billions, their motive is obvious and incontrovertible.

Trump has to qualify to be on the ballot. Given his relationship to 1/6, it's a fair proposition to take the matter of his qualification or disqualification pertinent to section 3 of the 14th amendment to the courts. If he isn't qualified, the matter of his being 'deprived of being on the ballot' is a moot point. Either you qualify, or you don't.

Second is the Espionage DOES totally depend on the "classified doc laws".

No, it doesn't. When the Espionage act was enacted, there was no classification regime.
Classification will be considered, but what is given far more weight are DNI damage assessments.

Nuke docs clearly are legally given by president to whomever they want to give them to.

Once classified, they cannot be given to anyone without proper clearance,. nor can the President declassify a once classified nuke doc without consent/cooperation/coordination with the issuing authority, per the AEA. One document was classified S/FRD, That's a one notch downgrade from S/RD. The 'F' is added merely to allow certain personel at the pentagon to view it, but it is still highly classified. That one will get you 10 years.

There is no law at all that pertains to bank loan application, everyone always puffs, and it can never be illegal.

In NY, Trump is being sued under New York Executive Law § 63(12), which gives the AG broad authority to ferret out fraud in the state. Reporting X on a bank loan on property W, and reporting Y on an insurance application on property W, is fraud. The victim is "The People Of New York".

That is because there are several federal laws preventing banks from not doing their own independent appraisal.

Irrelevant, see above.

The law being used against Trump was intended for securities exchanges only.

That is not factually correct. New York Executive Law § 63(12) is broad in it's scope, designed to fight civil fraud, in general.

It is obviously illegal to apply that law to a bank loan that has already been repaid and the bank happy.

The victim is not the bank in the suit, the plaintiff is 'The People of NY". If you claim X value on W property, and Y value on same W property, you are gaming the system and if everyone did that prices of insurance and bank interest would rise, collectively to pay for the increased risks these institutions take on fraud, as a general principle. Just because one bank got lucky and was repaid doesn't alter the principle. This is not an anecdotal civil action, one party against another,. it's the state against a fraudster.

The claim "forged certificates" were ever sent is a lie.
Here is the actual procedure:

They were not 'duplicates of legit certs'. They were fake and you can't send fake documents for phony slates of electors to the government. If they were part of a scheme to defraud the electorate, they could be deemed 'forged' by a prosecutor and they definitely will be criminalized in the RICO indictment. And, before you mention it, yes, I'm aware of the original idea of the electors being 'standby', but most of the certs failed to put that disclaimer in the fake cert. Big honkin' ass boo boo. But it's a moot point anyway, because they pushed the fake elector scheme way past the lawsuit outcomes, none of which gave opportunity for standby electors to become legit, anyway. This is where what might have been considered an innocent maneuver pushed into the illegal zone. They wanted Pence to accept the certs, well passed the lawsuit outcomes. See what I mean?

{...
Each state is free to choose the appearance and layout of the certificate. Staff from the Office of the Federal Register ensure that each certificate contains all legally required information.[13] States are required to produce either seven original certificates with two certified copies, or nine original certificates; of these, one original and either two more originals or two copies, are sent to the Archivist via registered mail or a commercial carrier. Both the House and the Senate receive one of the copies.[13]

yes, we know the nuts and bolts of how it's done, but that doesn't refute the fact that the so-called 'certificates of ascertainment' were not fake. They were fake, not signed by any governor of any state nor certified by any legit certifying authority.

When each state's electors meet to vote (on the first Monday after the second Wednesday of December),[3] they sign and record their vote on six "certificates of the vote",[9][11] which are then paired with the six remaining certificates of ascertainment. One pair of certificates is sent to the president of the Senate; two pairs are sent to the Archivist; two pairs are sent via registered mail to the state's secretary of state; and one pair is sent to the chief judge of the closest United States district court.[14][15] One of each of the two pairs sent to the Archivist and the secretary of state are designated for public inspection, while the others (and the chief judge's copy) are "held subject to the order of the President of the United States Senate".[13] The Archivist must receive the certificates by the fourth Wednesday in December,[11] and may take "extraordinary measures to retrieve duplicate originals" otherwise.[13]

The Vice President, as President of the Senate, opens the certificates in alphabetical order by state during a joint session of Congress in the House chamber on January 6 and gives them to one of four "tellers", two from the House and two from the Senate, who, seated at the clerks' desks, tally the vote.[15][16]
...}

So then obviously the actual legal procedure involved many duplicate copies.
And it is impossible to forge any, and they are all already known and easily authenticated.

I think you have a confusion. The certificates were fake (forged, invalid, unofficial, not legit, pick your favorite term), and NOT 'duplicates of the official certs', which is why Pence's aid refused them. Kudos to team Pence, they knew their stuff. Yes, it's possible to make fake certs, which is precisely what Team Trump did.

You can't send fake certs of ascertainment to the government. I think it broke some laws, but in GA, it will be part of the RICO indictment, most certainly.

Look, mr so-called lefty, if you are going to insult someone's intelligence, you are, conversely, alleging you are intelligent. I could comment about it, but I won't for now. Cheers, Rumpole.,

 

[Winco]

The only people who take Jan 6 seriously are WEF shillbots. Most Americans don't even know what it is.

Well you don't say.

The people Winning those Participation Trophies probably care now.
Those Participation Trophy Winners got Conned.
Who let them get Conned?

 

[bripat9643]

I never made that claim. I claimed they won't prosecute without evidence. "guilt" is a determination by a jury. So, there can be no 'circular logic', which tells me right off the starting line you aren't interpreting the words in front of you, correctly. How are you going to do in the rest of your rebuttal? Let's take a look.


Trump has to qualify to be on the ballot. Given his relationship to 1/6, it's a fair proposition to take the matter of his qualification or disqualification pertinent to section 3 of the 14th amendment to the courts. If he isn't qualified, the matter of his being 'deprived of being on the ballot' is a moot point. Either you qualify, or you don't.

No, it doesn't. When the Espionage act was enacted, there was no classification regime.
Classification will be considered, but what is given far more weight are DNI damage assessments.

Once classified, they cannot be given to anyone without proper clearance,. nor can the President declassify a once classified nuke doc without consent/cooperation/coordination with the issuing authority, per the AEA. One document was classified S/FRD, That's a one notch downgrade from S/RD. The 'F' is added merely to allow certain personel at the pentagon to view it, but it is still highly classified. That one will get you 10 years.

In NY, Trump is being sued under New York Executive Law § 63(12), which gives the AG broad authority to ferret out fraud in the state. Reporting X on a bank loan on property W, and reporting Y on an insurance application on property W, is fraud. The victim is "The People Of New York".

Irrelevant, see above.

That is not factually correct. New York Executive Law § 63(12) is broad in it's scope, designed to fight civil fraud, in general.

The victim is not the bank in the suit, the plaintiff is 'The People of NY". If you claim X value on W property, and Y value on same W property, you are gaming the system and if everyone did that prices of insurance and bank interest would rise, collectively to pay for the increased risks these institutions take on fraud, as a general principle. Just because one bank got lucky and was repaid doesn't alter the principle. This is not an anecdotal civil action, one party against another,. it's the state against a fraudster.

They were not 'duplicates of legit certs'. They were fake and you can't send fake documents for phony slates of electors to the government. If they were part of a scheme to defraud the electorate, they could be deemed 'forged' by a prosecutor and they definitely will be criminalized in the RICO indictment. And, before you mention it, yes, I'm aware of the original idea of the electors being 'standby', but most of the certs failed to put that disclaimer in the fake cert. Big honkin' ass boo boo. But it's a moot point anyway, because they pushed the fake elector scheme way past the lawsuit outcomes, none of which gave opportunity for standby electors to become legit, anyway. This is where what might have been considered an innocent maneuver pushed into the illegal zone. They wanted Pence to accept the certs, well passed the lawsuit outcomes. See what I mean?

yes, we know the nuts and bolts of how it's done, but that doesn't refute the fact that the so-called 'certificates of ascertainment' were not fake. They were fake, not signed by any governor of any state nor certified by any legit certifying authority.



I think you have a confusion. The certificates were fake (forged, invalid, unofficial, not legit, pick your favorite term), and NOT 'duplicates of the official certs', which is why Pence's aid refused them. Kudos to team Pence, they knew their stuff. Yes, it's possible to make fake certs, which is precisely what Team Trump did.

You can't send fake certs of ascertainment to the government. I think it broke some laws, but in GA, it will be part of the RICO indictment, most certainly.

Look, mr so-called lefty, if you are going to insult someone's intelligence, you are, conversely, alleging you are intelligent. I could comment about it, but I won't for now. Cheers, Rumpole.,

I've never seen such a huge load of horseshit in my life.

 

[MagicMike]

I came here only to see if DumpHole had learned anything, yet, about being concise.

He hasn’t.

intheButtAgain shut the fuck up you drooling MORON!

 

[BackAgain]

intheButtAgain shut the fuck up you drooling MORON!

Fuck yourself, MangledDick.