CDZ Hate speech leads to hate killings

[Tommy Tainant]

Man found guilty of homophobic murder of gay New York ice cream seller

Repeated abuse of Gay people leads to a situation whereby they are seen as less than human and this is then the outcome.

I have seen some shocking anti gay sentiments on this board and have also seen politicians and "preachers" use phrases that are disgusting.

I really dont know why some sections of the community are virulently anti gay, they actually seem to revel in their hate.

Anyway it all ends up with a poor ice cream seller being murdered for the "crime" of being as God made him.

We all have a responsibility to treat others as we would wish to be treated.

Hate is the product of fear and ignorance; and most often this hate manifest among conservatives – social conservatives in particular.

Most on the right are ignorant as to who gay Americans actually are, most on the right fear the diversity, dissent, and expression of individual liberty that gay Americans represent – and as a consequence of this ignorance and fear most on the right will seek to disadvantage gay Americans through force of law, and sadly, in some cases, acts of criminal violence.

It's actually very easy to understand, it's as old as the human race itself.

I am not sure that it is political rather than generational. Kids today are generally more diverse in their opinions than they were back in the day.

 

[Tommy Tainant]

The OP is not the topic of this thread. If you can't discuss the subject matter then leave.

Its not rocket science is it ?

Be cool if it were, we'd be rocket scientists!

Arent you a rocket scientist ?

 

[Lucy Hamilton]

The OP is not the topic of this thread. If you can't discuss the subject matter then leave.

Its not rocket science is it ?

Be cool if it were, we'd be rocket scientists!

To me you're already a rocket scientist

 

[saveliberty]

all MURDERS are done in HATE. we just didn't know we had " special" classes of citizens in the country. you people need to wake up to what is being done to you

This is as ignorant as it is moronic and wrong – typical of most on the right.

You see a lot of murders done out of love or righteous motivation?

 

[saveliberty]

Arent you a rocket scientist ?

One of those no, but I stayed at a Holiday Inn things.

That was funny by the way. Thanks I appreciate it.

Oh, and congratulations on being a rocket scientist.

 

[Tommy Tainant]

Arent you a rocket scientist ?

One of those no, but I stayed at a Holiday Inn things.

That was funny by the way. Thanks I appreciate it.

You obviously have patience of a Saint, to stick with this thread for 11 pages is simply incredibly!

Have you got any comment to make on the thread subject ?

 

[Tommy Tainant]

Arent you a rocket scientist ?

One of those no, but I stayed at a Holiday Inn things.

That was funny by the way. Thanks I appreciate it.

Oh, and congratulations on being a rocket scientist.

You can call yourself anything you want. You can get a diploma to back it up as well. Doesnt cost much.

 

[saveliberty]

Most people try to better themselves, some do it at the expense of others. Reducing hate is good, doing it at the expense of the Constitution which tries to create freedom to pursue a better life is not good.

 

[saveliberty]

You can call yourself anything you want. You can get a diploma to back it up as well. Doesnt cost much.

No thanks, the cat gig works great for me.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

Man found guilty of homophobic murder of gay New York ice cream seller

Repeated abuse of Gay people leads to a situation whereby they are seen as less than human and this is then the outcome.

I have seen some shocking anti gay sentiments on this board and have also seen politicians and "preachers" use phrases that are disgusting.

I really dont know why some sections of the community are virulently anti gay, they actually seem to revel in their hate.

Anyway it all ends up with a poor ice cream seller being murdered for the "crime" of being as God made him.

We all have a responsibility to treat others as we would wish to be treated.

Hate is the product of fear and ignorance; and most often this hate manifest among conservatives – social conservatives in particular.

Most on the right are ignorant as to who gay Americans actually are, most on the right fear the diversity, dissent, and expression of individual liberty that gay Americans represent – and as a consequence of this ignorance and fear most on the right will seek to disadvantage gay Americans through force of law, and sadly, in some cases, acts of criminal violence.

It's actually very easy to understand, it's as old as the human race itself.

I am not sure that it is political rather than generational. Kids today are generally more diverse in their opinions than they were back in the day.

It's political.

Conservatism is inherently reactionary – fearful of change, diversity and dissent, seeking to return to an idealized past that never actually existed to begin with.

In the United States we see this in the various 'militia movements.'

In Europe this manifests on the far-right and among neo-fascists.

And in both Europe and the United States, sadly, young people make up a significant number of those on the extreme, intolerant right.

 

[saveliberty]

It's political.

Conservatism is inherently reactionary – fearful of change, diversity and dissent, seeking to return to an idealized past that never actually existed to begin with.

In the United States we see this in the various 'militia movements.'

In Europe this manifests on the far-right and among neo-fascists.

And in both Europe and the United States, sadly, young people make up a significant number of those on the extreme, intolerant right.

Current Liberalism is reactionary, seeking progress where the end result is not improvement. Why are the youth rebelling? Could it be progress has not benefited them? That liberals have high jacked their future through government debt?

 

[Tommy Tainant]

and Trump doing more talk this morning on FOX . VIDEO !! --- Trump: 'I Think Islam Hates Us' --- good to see Trump exercising his Free Speech RIGHTS Tommy !!

People will get stirred up and innocent folk will die.
Thats probably not on his radar but it will happen.

------------------------------------ yeah well , muslims should stay where the belong Tommy !!

Several million of them are American.

 

[Tommy Tainant]

Man found guilty of homophobic murder of gay New York ice cream seller

Repeated abuse of Gay people leads to a situation whereby they are seen as less than human and this is then the outcome.

I have seen some shocking anti gay sentiments on this board and have also seen politicians and "preachers" use phrases that are disgusting.

I really dont know why some sections of the community are virulently anti gay, they actually seem to revel in their hate.

Anyway it all ends up with a poor ice cream seller being murdered for the "crime" of being as God made him.

We all have a responsibility to treat others as we would wish to be treated.

Hate is the product of fear and ignorance; and most often this hate manifest among conservatives – social conservatives in particular.

Most on the right are ignorant as to who gay Americans actually are, most on the right fear the diversity, dissent, and expression of individual liberty that gay Americans represent – and as a consequence of this ignorance and fear most on the right will seek to disadvantage gay Americans through force of law, and sadly, in some cases, acts of criminal violence.

It's actually very easy to understand, it's as old as the human race itself.

I am not sure that it is political rather than generational. Kids today are generally more diverse in their opinions than they were back in the day.

It's political.

Conservatism is inherently reactionary – fearful of change, diversity and dissent, seeking to return to an idealized past that never actually existed to begin with.

In the United States we see this in the various 'militia movements.'

In Europe this manifests on the far-right and among neo-fascists.

And in both Europe and the United States, sadly, young people make up a significant number of those on the extreme, intolerant right.

The youngsters are generally drawn from a low education underclass.

 

[Coyote]

What the hell guys...are some of you forgetting this is the Clean Debate Zone???? Even after warnings and deletions? Come on - discuss the topic.

 

[saveliberty]

Respectfully Coyote, this is a free speech versus hate speech thread. If we can't show hate speech sources and exercise free speech, it really should not be in the CDZ. The fact things can be deleted or warnings given speak directly to why free speech must win over the hate speech censors. I humbly beg your pardon for myself and other free speech supporters here gathered. Admittedly I pushed the boundaries of the CDZ for the express purpose of showing what censoring creates. The blame should rest with me and not the others.

At this point I do not anticipate any revealing or revolutionary additions to the debate.

Sincerest respect for your position,

save

 

[Coyote]

Respectfully Coyote, this is a free speech versus hate speech thread. If we can't show hate speech sources and exercise free speech, it really should not be in the CDZ. The fact things can be deleted or warnings given speak directly to why free speech must win over the hate speech censors. I humbly beg your pardon for myself and other free speech supporters here gathered. Admittedly I pushed the boundaries of the CDZ for the express purpose of showing what censoring creates. The blame should rest with me and not the others.

At this point I do not anticipate any revealing or revolutionary additions to the debate.

Sincerest respect for your position,

save

Saveliberty, the problem is this is a thread that is in the CDZ, and that has certain rules associated with it. You can show hate speech sources but do it with out insulting, putting down or flaming other members. That is the key strategy to CDZ that encourages a civil debate. You didn't push the boundaries as far as some others did, and in the end - we're each responsible for our own actions - you are not responsible for that of others.

Hate speech is a complicated topic because it does intersect with the right of free speech.

 

[saveliberty]

Civil debate about hate, going to have to think on that a while. Sounds like doing laundry in the middle of a mud bog.

 

[saveliberty]

Kudos for all mods trying to make the CDZ workable.

 

[Coyote]

To address the topic: Hate speech leads to hate killings.

Tough tough subject because it implies that something should therefore be done to "manage" hate speech.

In an open society, where the right of free speech has a very high value....how can you define, curb and criminalize hate speech?

I'm saying you can't. And I'm saying hate speech does not necessarily lead to killings any more than guns or religion do. Hate speech might provide the excuse, but that person was likely going to do something anyway where millions of other people didn't.

Free speech has limits and those limits are usually associated with public safety or slander/libel. If hate speech is fomenting a riot or calling for public violence, then that would be reason to curb it.

But beyond that - who determines what hate speech is? When it should be curbed? When it should be criminalized?

What's more - criminalizing it forces it underground where it can flourish unrefuted, in it's own vacuum chambers. Hate speech needs to be out in the open so it can be combated out in the open. Criminalizing it leads it's advocates to claim persecution and it gives their hate a certain "legitimacy" (see - they're trying to shut us down).

 

[Elvis Obama]

The man deserves to be in jail for rest of his life. That being said, I find hate crime laws to be redundant and unnecessary.

The value of such laws is that local communities can violate the values of the larger community. Not all areas of the country can be trusted to administer the law neutrally.