Great day in the mornin'! Ryan's back!

[Erand7899]

Paul Ryan has retreated even further into fantasy land. The mystery is, what are his motivations?

Good article.

The Ryan budget is about ideology, not finances | Jay Bookman

Again, let’s be clear: The Ryan budget is not a response to our fiscal situation. It uses that situation as an excuse to continue a philosophical debate reaching back at least 80 years in this country, back to the founding of Social Security. The Republican Party fought Social Security back then, and since then it has tried repeatedly to kill the program, most recently with President Bush’s effort to privatize it.

“Never in the history of the world has any measure been brought here so insidiously designed as to prevent business recovery, to enslave workers and to prevent any possibility of the employers providing work for the people,” one GOP congressman said in 1935, referring to Social Security. The party’s basic message and rhetoric — government enslavement, economic ruin, etc., — hasn’t changed much since.

Why should the message change? It is just as true today as it was back then. The difference is that we are much closer to the results predicted so long ago. Our leaders just continue to ignore economic reality.

American taxpayers are not only on the hook for the $1.7 trillion owed to the social security trust fund, but also for the $20.5 trillion in unfunded liability in the social security system. That is the current amount obligated to be paid out to present and future social security retirees above projected social security revenue.

In total, our unfunded obligation for all of these programs, including Medicare and Medicaid is around $86.8 trillion. Most of that will become due over the next 40 years.

Cox and Archer: Why $16 Trillion Only Hints at the True U.S. Debt - WSJ.com

 

[Avorysuds]

National Taxpayers Union - History of Federal Individual Income Bottom and Top Bracket Rates




Historical Income Tax Rates & Brackets








0

please never make a long ass post like that again, learn to use a computer.

 

[Truthmatters]

those were good years for theis country even with war

 

[DiamondDave]

Ryan has put a plan on the table which has drastic changes to entitlements. Changes the Democrats do not want.

This will force the Democrats to put a plan on the table which has entitlement reforms of a different nature in it.

And that is the goal. To finally get entitlement reform front and center. Something needs to be done, and it is time to stop dicking around.

Ryan is putting the Democrats' feet to the fire, and has set the tone instead of them.

They are changes the electorate rejected. His plan still turns medicare to vouchers while keeping Obama cuts to medicare, and cuts student tuition aid. His plan is about social structure and the role of the federal govt as much as spending and taxing. And he lost an election on that.

The question is why is he trotting out tired and unloved Rafalca again. It's true that the dems have not credibly put forth a plan to reign in entitlement spending. Obama says limiting medicare provider rates, and moving more people into govt sponsored insurance where these rates govern, will lower the increase in medical costs. But, he may also have a bridge in Brooklyn.

I certainly don't want to see it personally, but there's got to be some pain here. Something like taxing soc sec benefits at a higher rate when a person stays fully employed working past 66. Raising medicare copays on people at a highter income level. And long term exteding the age for benefits. I'm not advocating those specifics.

But the pt is Ryan is trotting out an unpopular idea, but an idea that has RW support, and none of the pain for the RW. That's really no different from what the dems have done to this pt.

it should be MORE about getting rid of government freebies... some to phase out, some that eliminate immediately that should never have been there in the first place (the tuition loans and assistance should never be there and is one of the biggest pieces of government bullshit ever put thru)

This ain't about popular... it is about living within means and living within the very restricted powers given to the fed by the constitution.. when we started getting away from the constitution is when it all started going downhill

 

[Remodeling Maidiac]

Putting out partisan fantasy budgets is his job?

What ever happened to working with the other side of the aisle?

That flew out the window when Obama proclaimed I WON during a metting with congressional leaders.

And in order to work with the opposite side you need a counterpart with a functioning brain that puts the country first.

It not me....Its THEM

Why nothing gets done in Congress

Wrong

Nothing gets done in Congress because

HARRY REID DOESNT EVEN TRY

 

[Truthmatters]

why does the right deny the FACTS our own history shows us?

 

[Avorysuds]

from 1932 to 1981 the top tax rate was over 60 % in this country

Yes TM, you win!!! People everywhere were paying over 60% taxes!!! Good debate! Now go away intelligent people are trying t beat up mindless Obama supporters... or wait, I guess that means you can stay!

 

[Truthmatters]

sthat is why you people cling to historically failed ideas.

YOU refuse the real facts of the world

 

[OlderOwl]

He also said right on TV that the tax cuts made his budget easier to balence.

The right is dumb as a box of rocks

You misspelled "jocks"

 

[g5000]

Ryan has put a plan on the table which has drastic changes to entitlements. Changes the Democrats do not want.

This will force the Democrats to put a plan on the table which has entitlement reforms of a different nature in it.

And that is the goal. To finally get entitlement reform front and center. Something needs to be done, and it is time to stop dicking around.

Ryan is putting the Democrats' feet to the fire, and has set the tone instead of them.

They are changes the electorate rejected. His plan still turns medicare to vouchers while keeping Obama cuts to medicare, and cuts student tuition aid. His plan is about social structure and the role of the federal govt as much as spending and taxing. And he lost an election on that.

The question is why is he trotting out tired and unloved Rafalca again. It's true that the dems have not credibly put forth a plan to reign in entitlement spending. Obama says limiting medicare provider rates, and moving more people into govt sponsored insurance where these rates govern, will lower the increase in medical costs. But, he may also have a bridge in Brooklyn.

I certainly don't want to see it personally, but there's got to be some pain here. Something like taxing soc sec benefits at a higher rate when a person stays fully employed working past 66. Raising medicare copays on people at a highter income level. And long term exteding the age for benefits. I'm not advocating those specifics.

But the pt is Ryan is trotting out an unpopular idea, but an idea that has RW support, and none of the pain for the RW. That's really no different from what the dems have done to this pt.

One of the key reasons ObamaCare passed is because Democrats put a health care reform plan on the table, and the Republicans were caught flatfooted. The conversation then became all about the Democratic plan, and whatever plan the Republicans eventually came up with was dismissed out of hand, and many people today even believe the GOP never came up with a plan.

Ryan is turning the tables.

And now the Democrats are the ones caught flatfooted.

Now the Republicans can say the Democrats want to "keep the status quo" that is bankrupting us.

Here is the liberal logic used to pass ObamaCare that can now be turned back on them:

1. We must do something.

2. This (Ryan's plan) is something.

3. We must do this.

 

[DiamondDave]

Love how bitch TDM conveniently forgets what was able to be deducted, what was counted as income, etc during those 90 and 60% rates...

Love how she still calls for rates like that.. well, as long as it is not on her or those who keep voting for more spending on social programs....

 

[Avorysuds]

why does the right deny the FACTS our own history shows us?

Dear idiot...

That is all.

 

[Truthmatters]

from 1932 to 1981 the top tax rate was over 60 % in this country

Yes TM, you win!!! People everywhere were paying over 60% taxes!!! Good debate! Now go away intelligent people are trying t beat up mindless Obama supporters... or wait, I guess that means you can stay!

Dear lie addled idiot.

You just lied about the facts I produced

 

[Truthmatters]

The top tax bracket was over 60% for decades in this country.


Things ran FINE

 

[Avorysuds]

sthat is why you people cling to historically failed ideas.

YOU refuse the real facts of the world

It's happening, TM is gonna pop here soon!

=D =D =D

 

[Truthmatters]

This country does JUST FINE with high top tax rates.

YOU have to lie or buy into lies to pretend otherwise

 

[bendog]

Paul Ryan has retreated even further into fantasy land. The mystery is, what are his motivations?

Good article.

The Ryan budget is about ideology, not finances | Jay Bookman

Again, let’s be clear: The Ryan budget is not a response to our fiscal situation. It uses that situation as an excuse to continue a philosophical debate reaching back at least 80 years in this country, back to the founding of Social Security. The Republican Party fought Social Security back then, and since then it has tried repeatedly to kill the program, most recently with President Bush’s effort to privatize it.

“Never in the history of the world has any measure been brought here so insidiously designed as to prevent business recovery, to enslave workers and to prevent any possibility of the employers providing work for the people,” one GOP congressman said in 1935, referring to Social Security. The party’s basic message and rhetoric — government enslavement, economic ruin, etc., — hasn’t changed much since.

Why should the message change? It is just as true today as it was back then. The difference is that we are much closer to the results predicted so long ago. Our leaders just continue to ignore economic reality.

American taxpayers are not only on the hook for the $1.7 trillion owed to the social security trust fund, but also for the $20.5 trillion in unfunded liability in the social security system. That is the current amount obligated to be paid out to present and future social security retirees above projected social security revenue.

In total, our unfunded obligation for all of these programs, including Medicare and Medicaid is around $86.8 trillion. Most of that will become due over the next 40 years.

Cox and Archer: Why $16 Trillion Only Hints at the True U.S. Debt - WSJ.com

The message has to change if you have any intent of improving the situation. You don't have the votes to end soc sec and medicare. You can't win on ideology. The only solution is to increase revenue while slowing the rate of program growth as the boomers die off.

Long term, raise the ages, and next time there's a surplus, don't do a tax cut unless the money goes directly into privitized (and govt sponsored) accounts.

 

[g5000]

from 1932 to 1981 the top tax rate was over 60 % in this country

Yes TM, you win!!! People everywhere were paying over 60% taxes!!! Good debate! Now go away intelligent people are trying t beat up mindless Obama supporters... or wait, I guess that means you can stay!

Dear lie addled idiot.

You just lied about the facts I produced

Ronald Reagan used to stop working once his tax rate hit 90 percent. He would make a few movies, and then stop. Because any movie he made after that point, he was working for the goverment. 90 percent of his paycheck was going to the government, and so it was pointless to work.


The more you tax something, the less of it you get.

That is why taxes on production are destructive. Taxes on consumption are better.

 

[Avorysuds]

from 1932 to 1981 the top tax rate was over 60 % in this country

Yes TM, you win!!! People everywhere were paying over 60% taxes!!! Good debate! Now go away intelligent people are trying t beat up mindless Obama supporters... or wait, I guess that means you can stay!

Dear lie addled idiot.

You just lied about the facts I produced

Wait, what did I lie about?

 

[Mr. Shaman]

Get back to us when you have some thoughtful analysis. Bottom line, this current business as usual of tax and spend isn't sustainable except in the mind of the terminally stupid.

March 12, 2013

Ryan: YEAH, WHAT BARACK SAID!​

"The 10-year spending plan released Tuesday by Rep. Paul Ryan is virtually identical to last year’s GOP budget: It would defund President Obama’s health-care initiative, end guaranteed Medicare coverage for future retirees and sharply restrain spending on the poor, college students and federal workers.

The one big new development: Ryan’s latest blueprint would balance the budget, producing a small surplus in 2023 — a goal achieved not primarily through deeper spending cuts, but by the addition of more than $3.2 trillion in new tax revenue."