Gingrich: Palestinians an ‘invented’ people

[LadyGunSlinger]

What benefit to the rest of the world would a Palestinian state bring?

simple human dignity. They've been living in the equivalent of a Warsaw ghetto for generations. Why? They're just people. THEY didn't do anything wrong.

They were offered everything they sought when Bill Clinton was President and turned it down. Enough with the crocodile tears and pure PROPAGANDA. To the victor go the spoils of war. Israel won her land just like any other conquering nation. They have treated the "Trans-Jordanians" with more respect than any other nation in the region. Tell me again why Egypt or Syria, or Saudi Arabia, Jordan will not take in and make a homeland for THEIR own people? I must have missed that tiny detail.

 

[Big Black Dog]

I like President-elect Newt.

 

[SwingVoter]

Israel and Jews.

need to stop pussing out

Netanyahu should just get up and tell the world Obama's a big pussy and wants him to negotiate with Iranian-financed dictators. But he won't because he himself is a pussy who wants us to keep giving him cash, so he allows Obama to humiliate him.

 

[LadyGunSlinger]

The Seattle Times: Opinion: The Democratic Party's anti-Semitism problem


The Democratic Party's anti-Semitism problem

This is a great read and very indicative of the Left's insane hatred toward to the tiny nation of Israel.

 

[skookerasbil]

huh?

"Republican presidential contender Newt Gingrich said in a cable TV interview that Palestinians are an “invented” people with no apparent right to their own state, a rejection of a decade of bipartisan U.S. foreign policy.

Gingrich calls Palestinians an "invented"; people - The Washington Post

Oh lawdy lawdy lawdy...

^^^^ a sentiment typical of the hordes of the hopelessly duped PC zombies.


Newt wants to retain the votes Obama has permanently lost amongst American Jews.

 

[georgephillip]

Vanishing the Palestinians » Counterpunch: Tells the Facts, Names the Names

Origin of the Name Palestine | Palestine Facts

Another Arab perspective on Palestine:

"Each year, the U.S. Army War College in Carlysle Barracks, Pennsylvania, invites foreign military personnel to partake in war games scenarios and seek solutions to problems and potential problems around the globe. Saudi Arabia’s Lieutenant Colonel Mohammed F. Abo-Sak participated in the USAWC Class of 1997 where he developed a strategy research project he entitled 'US Involvement in the Israeli-Palestinian Conflict: Solution or Complication?'"

"Palestinians have continuously resided in Palestine since four thousand years before Christ, Abo-Sak pointed out.

"Their ancestors built the cities of Jerusalem, Nablus, Jericho, Beisan, Acca and Jaffa.

"The Hebrews arrived in the land between 1400-1200 B.C., and only maintained control over it during the lifetimes of King David and his son King Solomon – a period of about 80 years.

"The land then came under Greek and Roman rule, and was then conquered by Islam in the year 637 A.D. under the second Caliph, Omar. By that time, the Jews had already left Jerusalem, and Christianity was the dominant religion. The Caliph granted full security to all Christians, including personal safety, and protection of property, religion and churches.

"The Muslims declared Jerusalem the capital of Palestine, and the city remained under Islamic rule until the end of the Ottoman Empire in 1918, except for a brief time of Christian rule under the Crusaders.

"In this century, the eastern Mediterranean became subject to British and French occupation as a result of the First World War, and Palestine came under British military occupation. The British encouraged the Arabs to gain their independence from the Ottoman Empire and promised them support if they stood on the side of the allies during the First World War.

"However the British reneged on the promise, and British Foreign Minister Arthur James Balfour promised the International Zionists a homeland for the Jews in Palestine. At the time, the population of Palestine was comprised of 95% Arabs (both Christians and Muslims), 4% Palestinian Jews, and 1% expatriates.

"The Jews owned only 2% of the land.

"Israel occupied the Palestinian lands in 1948 when it announced its independence.

"It captured the rest of Palestine in 1967..."

US Involvement in the Israeli-Palestinian Conflict: Solution or Complication? by Lt. Col. Mohammed F. Abo-Sak

Many of the devout racists on this board can't accept the fact that Jews are NOT the chosen people.
Just ask the Canaanites.(If you can find one)

 

[Ravi]

I wonder how the folks in Kansas, for example, would take to the UN coming and declaring Topeka and suburbs as the new American Indian homeland.

Sorry guys, you gotta move.

How do you suppose that would play out?

a more apt analogy would be.. .you live in kansas city. the land is shared by two tribes of native americans and they're told they have to live together peacefully. one tribe says... heck no, and starts war after war against the other tribe and keeps losing.

now.... carry on.

people win and lose land in war ALL the time. the U.N. divvied up a lot of countries after WWII.... most of them are run by Arabs.,,,, including Iraq, the UAR and Jordan... it's only the one little patch of land that ended up run by jews in the sea of arab countries that seems to stick in the craw of certain people..... who should really look into their own conscience and figure out why that would be.

now let's get to reality... they lost. there have to be two countries. it's really that simple. and if the pals' actual goal was a country, and not the destruction of iisrael, they'd have had one a long time ago.

This.

 

[georgephillip]

I wonder how the folks in Kansas, for example, would take to the UN coming and declaring Topeka and suburbs as the new American Indian homeland.

Sorry guys, you gotta move.

How do you suppose that would play out?

About the same way that Brown v Board of Education of Topeka played out in Little Rock?

"In 1957, Arkansas Governor Orval Faubus called out his state's National Guard to block black students' entry to Little Rock Central High School. President Dwight Eisenhower responded by deploying elements of the 101st Airborne Division from Fort Campbell, Kentucky, to Arkansas and by federalizing Faubus' National Guard."

Brown v. Board of Education - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[JoeB131]

Here's the politics of this. Even though Obama would probably sell out Israel in a heartbeat, he'll still get 78% of the Jewish vote, just like he did last time.

Why?

Because if you are American Jew, you don't really care that much about Israel. You live in AMerica, where you can practice your religion as much or as little as you want to. So Israel is a nice place to visit, but you wouldn't really want to live there.

And frankly, for a lot of American Jews, Israel's behavior towards the Palestinians is a bit embarrassing. It's really a form of Apartheid, when you get down to it.

Now, that all said, Newt's position is great politics for a different reason. Seeing growing indifference to Israel by American Jews, the Zionists have repitched the whole thing. "We are the only thing protecthing the HOly Land from the Infidel Muslims!" And if you are a Fundie who thinks we need to have Israel so Jesus can come back and even all the scores for you, you buy into this.

So while Obama says, "Hey, you'd better make some comprimises for your own good", Newt tells them we will back their play, no matter what.

Which policy is better is if you really think that the Palestinians can be negotiated with in good faith. But the thing is, they take a long view. It took them 200 years to drive the Crusaders out, but they did it. They've only been whittling away at Israel for 60 or so years.

 

[LadyGunSlinger]

Here's the politics of this. Even though Obama would probably sell out Israel in a heartbeat, he'll still get 78% of the Jewish vote, just like he did last time.

Why?

Because if you are American Jew, you don't really care that much about Israel. You live in AMerica, where you can practice your religion as much or as little as you want to. So Israel is a nice place to visit, but you wouldn't really want to live there.

And frankly, for a lot of American Jews, Israel's behavior towards the Palestinians is a bit embarrassing. It's really a form of Apartheid, when you get down to it.

Now, that all said, Newt's position is great politics for a different reason. Seeing growing indifference to Israel by American Jews, the Zionists have repitched the whole thing. "We are the only thing protecthing the HOly Land from the Infidel Muslims!" And if you are a Fundie who thinks we need to have Israel so Jesus can come back and even all the scores for you, you buy into this.

So while Obama says, "Hey, you'd better make some comprimises for your own good", Newt tells them we will back their play, no matter what.

Which policy is better is if you really think that the Palestinians can be negotiated with in good faith. But the thing is, they take a long view. It took them 200 years to drive the Crusaders out, but they did it. They've only been whittling away at Israel for 60 or so years.

My last boyfriend was Jewish. He lives in Manhattan, very well known family with a lot of influence. He is a liberal..(Don't hate me.. I said FORMER boyfriend lol) He and his father frequently visit Israel and care deeply about the Israeli state. I went to the Hamptons with him and saw for myself that there is LARGE contingency within Jewish population that do indeed care about Israel so I don't agree at all with your opinion. It's well thought out but on its face wrong.

 

[JoeB131]

We can agree to disagree.

I will make this as a prediction, though. Obama will still get 78% of the Jewish vote in 2012.

 

[LadyGunSlinger]

We can agree to disagree.

I will make this as a prediction, though. Obama will still get 78% of the Jewish vote in 2012.

I hope you're wrong. I hope my Jewish friends see the writing on the wall and KNOW that the Democrat party is NO friend to Jews or Israel. He and I had that discussion MANY times. The stink of it is, Jews know that the GOP holds the best interest of Israel but they cannot bring themselves to vote republican. I will say that being a liberal is more important than matters of the Israeli State so on that front you're correct.. but they do still care deeply about what happens with Israel.

 

[Two Thumbs]

huh?

"Republican presidential contender Newt Gingrich said in a cable TV interview that Palestinians are an “invented” people with no apparent right to their own state, a rejection of a decade of bipartisan U.S. foreign policy.

Gingrich calls Palestinians an "invented"; people - The Washington Post

Oh lawdy lawdy lawdy...

They are Jordanians.

Isreal was taken from Jordan, not Palestine. They are little more than a tribe or sub culture of unwanted muslims. If they were wanted, Jordan would have kept them.

There never was a Pal country or land, there is not a Pal language. It's all bullshit.

 

[Seawytch]

Can we stop with the "anti Semite" bullshit already? Being opposed to the Israeli government's policies is no more "anti Semitic" than being opposed to the American government's policies is "anti American". (despite what the right wing told you during the Bush years).

Now if you say "I hate Jews and Arabs"...then you might be anti Semitic.

 

[paperview]

"Palestine in the time of Saul." From Atlas of the Historical Geography of the Holy Land. Smith, George Adam. London, 1915.

 

[Seawytch]

Remember, the evangelical wing of the GOP supports Israel because that's where Jesus is supposed to make his entrance for the Rapture...

 

[Vel]

What benefit to the rest of the world would a Palestinian state bring?

simple human dignity. They've been living in the equivalent of a Warsaw ghetto for generations. Why? They're just people. THEY didn't do anything wrong.

And if you turn that "Warsaw ghetto" into a nation. then what happens? Who runs the nation? How do they support themselves? If others leave them to their own devices, can they be self sufficient? Do they have a plan to provide for the citizens of their new nation? What kind of exports do you see coming from a nation of Palestine? Will they stop teaching their children the glory of martyrdom? I don't care at this point about attempting to fix the past. Let's concentrate on the future and see if those people that call themselves Palestinians have something to offer to the rest of the world because if the plan is for them to gain sovereignty and yet remain a ghetto that demands others provide for them, why should anyone that?
And before people start talking the money we send Israel, realize that we wouldn't have to send Israel money if it were not for having to try to repel the constant attacks from Arab neighbors.

 

[Katzndogz]

If the palestinians had not done anythinmg wrong, they would have had their state long ago.

 

[Trajan]

Elliott Abrams, former deputy national security adviser under Bush:
“There was no Jordan or Syria or Iraq, either, so perhaps he would say they are all invented people as well and also have no right to statehood. Whatever was true then, Palestinian nationalism has grown since 1948, and whether we like it or not, it exists.”

Yes I see your point. And yes the nations carved out in the smoke filled rooms of France and Britain after Britain’s ww1 and 20’s aborted attempt at a trans Mesopotamian ‘India light’ scenario created those nations.

Now its time to ponder why the pali’s as we have been trained to call them decided to allow themselves to become pawns over the decades to pan-arab resentment.

None of those nations you named allow palis full rights and in fact have created a pali ‘Diaspora’ amongst them, throwing them out and putting them down in turn. They only exist in pan arab eyes as tools.

At some point reality and pragmatism kicks in. After the 6 Day War it was obvious, Israel was going nowhere, that didn’t seem to matter.

They doubled down and tried again in 73. Basically, the same result.

Now what? If a 2 nation solution is the answer, the problem is there are no honest brokers. The arabs still don’t want them, still use them (Persians now too, ala Iran) and they won’t renounce violence. The back and forth across the north-south borders of Israel ala Hamas and Hezbollah are just part and parcel of the ongoing issue of the last 70 years.

Palis may ‘exist’, but frankly in those 70 years, nothing in essence has changed. Reality is shunted aside.

AND, with the apparent MB victory in Egypt, the only lasting peace of those 70’s may now become unwound. This does not bode well for the palis because, the MB will now ratchet it all back up again. *shrugs* they are their own worst enemy imho.

 

[Trajan]

Remember, the evangelical wing of the GOP supports Israel because that's where Jesus is supposed to make his entrance for the Rapture...

yea those evangelicals, they wound up their time machine and had harry truman make a statement of sppt. and formerly recognize Israel, they sure are crafty, those evangelicals....