Does Paula Deen Really Have To Go On An Apology Tour?

[Wake]

For something she done over 30 years ago? Would people feel better if she said as a white woman raised in the south she never even thought about the word ******?

No, I don't think so. Her losing her contract seems like a punishment that doesn't fit the supposed crime, either. She was honest enough to admit she did so, and I think all of this fake, manufactured outrage is shameful at best, dishonest at worst.

Using the N-word is silly. However, it's silly and stupid when ANYONE uses it. I don't believe in making unfair exceptions. This includes black people who use the very word they go crazy about when non-blacks use it.

If there's anything to actually be upset about with Paula Deen, it's her annoying drawl and her unsafe affinity for butter. Butter this, butter that. Butter isn't exactly healthy, but it's not nearly as bad as margarine and hydrogenated oils. Ugh, I've got a roommate who uses a stick of butter in everything he cooks. Butter's nice in moderation, but when you have the compulsion to use it in everything...? Urgh.

I don't like her. Not at all. BUT...she has no need to apologize for using a term used by blacks themselves. When ALL people stop using that word, THEN if someone uses it it can be cause for indignant huff n puffs.

Frankly, I am fed up with the crying and wringing of hands about it by whites AND blacks while blacks sing about it and call each other the same word. Double standards. Fed up with double standards.

This I agree with 100%.

 

[mudwhistle]

If they can forgive Obama for his admitted racism in his books I figure they can forgive anyone......except Bush.....or other Republicans running for President.

 

[S.J.]

If they can forgive Obama for his admitted racism in his books I figure they can forgive anyone......except Bush.....or other Republicans running for President.

Or any other white person, except liberals.

 

[mudwhistle]

If they can forgive Obama for his admitted racism in his books I figure they can forgive anyone......except Bush.....or other Republicans running for President.

Or any other white person, except liberals.

Or whistleblowers....

 

[Foxfyre]

If they can forgive Obama for his admitted racism in his books I figure they can forgive anyone......except Bush.....or other Republicans running for President.

Or any other white person, except liberals.

Or whistleblowers....

Or conservative women or minorities. Or anybody who won't agree with them on who are victims, who are oppressed, and who are the villains.

 

[Sunshine]

Well I'm sorry that you see me as looking through the lenses of an uneducated, non professional woman who has had her accomplishment diminished. Who knew I was all that? Ah well. . . . .

I won't even get into the science that men and women are different and that the difference is okay. Are women less capable? As NFL quarterbacks, as a rule yes they are. In the many male-dominated occupations I have been privileged to engage in, no we were not. While professional men certainly take pride in their appearance and make sure it is appropriate for their respective career settings, they are more likely to solicit compliments for their sports cars, elephant guns, and golf swings. Women, on the other hand spend billions to be as attractive and yes, perceived as beautiful, as they can be. And to go through all that trouble for the $100 perm, manicure, expensive makeup, false eyelashes, and color coordinated sexy outfit, she is supposed to be offended if somebody pays her a compliment on her appearance????? Let's get real.

I am as emancipated as any woman you will find on the planet. But I long ago set aside insecurities that men and women have to be seen exactly alike, treated exactly alike, before women can be 'equals'. Why should we demand that we be exactly like them? To me, that is not what liberation is. Why not demand that the world treat them like us? It would make just as much sense.

You miss the point entirely. The person Obama made the comment about is an educated attorney. Female attorneys are not less capable than male attorneys, and adding looks to the mix as a credential is just wrong. He SHOULD have apologized.

But I can tell you this, your prejudice toward women is merely part of the mass self loathing women have been taught. I see it every day in my practice as an NP. Woman are taught to be dependent on men, then 20 years in when the man dies and they can't support themselves and go into an emotional crisis they have 'dependent personality disorder.' I refused to diagnose that. I don't think they have a diagnosis. I think they are victims of people like you who loathe women and think women need to stay in their 'place- - the kitchen, and out of the schools.

I can also tell you that women are still discriminated against in medical and law schools. At Vanderbilt the school most often cited for sexual harassment is the medical school. Not sure if it is anywhere online, but I get the papers from there. There was a study done a while ago. And my own experience in law school was not one of sexual harassment in terms of sexual favors, but they were harder on the women in terms of their 'pimping' which even doctors say law schools have raised to an art even beyond medical schools, and the male students were overtly hostile to us. (Pimping in this context means humiliating you in front of your peers.)

Oh good. Now I am uneducated, nonprofessional, woman who has had her accomplished diminished AND I am prejudiced against women and am self loathing.

My goodness you do have a low opinion of me don't you? And you have no clue who I am, what I have done, what I have accomplished, but you feel competent to judge me?

Well I'm sorry, I feel I've held my own in a man's world pretty damn well as well as having successfully worked for and with women over the years and having been the employer of women, including as many as 70 at one time, I will kindly reject your highly presumptious judgment of me. I happen to like men and I happen to like women and enjoy both equally well. I prefer to prove my worth and earn respect through what I can accomplish rather than get on my high horse, despise, accuse, look for any opening to be offended, and feel victimized by the guys I have also worked with, been employee of, and have had as employees over the years. I've earned my professional credentials. Nobody gave them to me, though I am grateful to both the men and women who gave me the opportunity to get them.

I won't play the victim card, therefore you think less of me. So be it. Just like minorities have had to do, women have had to fight for their own place in society. Both of those wars have been won. It is time to stop fighting them and start benefitting from the victory.

I recommend that for everybody.

Women have been TAUGHT self loathing, yet they seldom recognize it. And only by working in psychiatry can one see the depths to which it goes. Any man would be expect to be recognized for his education, experience, and accomplishments without being patronized. But when a woman has the same expectations, she is 'hypersensitive.' Yep. That is self loathing. Projected. Until and unless a person has paid the dues to get the education, then he/she can't even begin to comprehend the price of it in terms of time, money, and the derision that a female going to law school has to face every single time she darkens the door. No woman who has is willing to settle.

 

[daveman]

Does Paula Deen Really Have To Go On An Apology Tour?

Why? You would think Republicans would embrace her for being so honest.

Republicans value honesty.

You don't. You're a liar.

 

[Sunshine]

Does Paula Deen Really Have To Go On An Apology Tour?

Why? You would think Republicans would embrace her for being so honest.

Republicans value honesty.

You don't. You're a liar.

I thought he was a lair.

 

[Gracie]

Too many Deen threads. Can't they all be combined in to ONE? The new folks with the Jodi Arias thread...at least they stick to ONE.

 

[daveman]

If they can forgive Obama for his admitted racism in his books I figure they can forgive anyone......except Bush.....or other Republicans running for President.

Or any other white person, except liberals.

There's nothing to forgive. It's impossible for liberals to be racist.

Right, USMB lefties?

 

[Foxfyre]

You miss the point entirely. The person Obama made the comment about is an educated attorney. Female attorneys are not less capable than male attorneys, and adding looks to the mix as a credential is just wrong. He SHOULD have apologized.

But I can tell you this, your prejudice toward women is merely part of the mass self loathing women have been taught. I see it every day in my practice as an NP. Woman are taught to be dependent on men, then 20 years in when the man dies and they can't support themselves and go into an emotional crisis they have 'dependent personality disorder.' I refused to diagnose that. I don't think they have a diagnosis. I think they are victims of people like you who loathe women and think women need to stay in their 'place- - the kitchen, and out of the schools.

I can also tell you that women are still discriminated against in medical and law schools. At Vanderbilt the school most often cited for sexual harassment is the medical school. Not sure if it is anywhere online, but I get the papers from there. There was a study done a while ago. And my own experience in law school was not one of sexual harassment in terms of sexual favors, but they were harder on the women in terms of their 'pimping' which even doctors say law schools have raised to an art even beyond medical schools, and the male students were overtly hostile to us. (Pimping in this context means humiliating you in front of your peers.)

Oh good. Now I am uneducated, nonprofessional, woman who has had her accomplished diminished AND I am prejudiced against women and am self loathing.

My goodness you do have a low opinion of me don't you? And you have no clue who I am, what I have done, what I have accomplished, but you feel competent to judge me?

Well I'm sorry, I feel I've held my own in a man's world pretty damn well as well as having successfully worked for and with women over the years and having been the employer of women, including as many as 70 at one time, I will kindly reject your highly presumptious judgment of me. I happen to like men and I happen to like women and enjoy both equally well. I prefer to prove my worth and earn respect through what I can accomplish rather than get on my high horse, despise, accuse, look for any opening to be offended, and feel victimized by the guys I have also worked with, been employee of, and have had as employees over the years. I've earned my professional credentials. Nobody gave them to me, though I am grateful to both the men and women who gave me the opportunity to get them.

I won't play the victim card, therefore you think less of me. So be it. Just like minorities have had to do, women have had to fight for their own place in society. Both of those wars have been won. It is time to stop fighting them and start benefitting from the victory.

I recommend that for everybody.

Women have been TAUGHT self loathing, yet they seldom recognize it. And only by working in psychiatry can one see the depths to which it goes. Any man would be expect to be recognized for his education, experience, and accomplishments without being patronized. But when a woman has the same expectations, she is 'hypersensitive.' Yep. That is self loathing. Projected. Until and unless a person has paid the dues to get the education, then he/she can't even begin to comprehend the price of it in terms of time, money, and the derision that a female going to law school has to face every single time she darkens the door. No woman who has is willing to settle.

Sorry Sunshine. You don't get to dictate to me what is self-loathing no matter how much you choose to insultingly mischaracterize me or accuse me of who and what I am and what I do. I accept that you see yourself as a victim and I am sorry for you if you were or if you see yourself that way now. I haven't criticized you for your point of view about that--I have not walked in your shoes--but I won't allow you to demand that I be like you.

I won't apologize that I choose not to see myself that way. You draw too far too many assumptions about what I have experienced or what I have gone through to get to where I am and who I am. I am choosing not to insult you in turn. But I don't have to agree with you either.

You see we could just as easily be discussing Paula Deen and her being criticized and condemned and/or her employer being intimidated when she didn't see things the way the PC crowd demands that she see them or when she explained herself in terms the PC crowd doesn't allow. I won't in my lifetime ever agree with the PC crowd on that issue either. What makes the PC crowd any different than how you demand that I see the victimization of women?

 

[Unkotare]

You miss the point entirely. The person Obama made the comment about is an educated attorney. Female attorneys are not less capable than male attorneys, and adding looks to the mix as a credential is just wrong. He SHOULD have apologized.

But I can tell you this, your prejudice toward women is merely part of the mass self loathing women have been taught. I see it every day in my practice as an NP. Woman are taught to be dependent on men, then 20 years in when the man dies and they can't support themselves and go into an emotional crisis they have 'dependent personality disorder.' I refused to diagnose that. I don't think they have a diagnosis. I think they are victims of people like you who loathe women and think women need to stay in their 'place- - the kitchen, and out of the schools.

I can also tell you that women are still discriminated against in medical and law schools. At Vanderbilt the school most often cited for sexual harassment is the medical school. Not sure if it is anywhere online, but I get the papers from there. There was a study done a while ago. And my own experience in law school was not one of sexual harassment in terms of sexual favors, but they were harder on the women in terms of their 'pimping' which even doctors say law schools have raised to an art even beyond medical schools, and the male students were overtly hostile to us. (Pimping in this context means humiliating you in front of your peers.)

Oh good. Now I am uneducated, nonprofessional, woman who has had her accomplished diminished AND I am prejudiced against women and am self loathing.

My goodness you do have a low opinion of me don't you? And you have no clue who I am, what I have done, what I have accomplished, but you feel competent to judge me?

Well I'm sorry, I feel I've held my own in a man's world pretty damn well as well as having successfully worked for and with women over the years and having been the employer of women, including as many as 70 at one time, I will kindly reject your highly presumptious judgment of me. I happen to like men and I happen to like women and enjoy both equally well. I prefer to prove my worth and earn respect through what I can accomplish rather than get on my high horse, despise, accuse, look for any opening to be offended, and feel victimized by the guys I have also worked with, been employee of, and have had as employees over the years. I've earned my professional credentials. Nobody gave them to me, though I am grateful to both the men and women who gave me the opportunity to get them.

I won't play the victim card, therefore you think less of me. So be it. Just like minorities have had to do, women have had to fight for their own place in society. Both of those wars have been won. It is time to stop fighting them and start benefitting from the victory.

I recommend that for everybody.

Women have been TAUGHT self loathing, yet they seldom recognize it. And only by working in psychiatry can one see the depths to which it goes. Any man would be expect to be recognized for his education, experience, and accomplishments without being patronized. But when a woman has the same expectations, she is 'hypersensitive.' Yep. That is self loathing. Projected. Until and unless a person has paid the dues to get the education, then he/she can't even begin to comprehend the price of it in terms of time, money, and the derision that a female going to law school has to face every single time she darkens the door. No woman who has is willing to settle.

That would be an excellent point if you had posted it 30 years ago.

 

[Synthaholic]

Does Paula Deen Really Have To Go On An Apology Tour?

No. She can just quietly go away.

And I'm not talking about this 'scandal', I'm talking about how annoying she is, and how unhealthy her food is.

 

[Sunshine]

Oh good. Now I am uneducated, nonprofessional, woman who has had her accomplished diminished AND I am prejudiced against women and am self loathing.

My goodness you do have a low opinion of me don't you? And you have no clue who I am, what I have done, what I have accomplished, but you feel competent to judge me?

Well I'm sorry, I feel I've held my own in a man's world pretty damn well as well as having successfully worked for and with women over the years and having been the employer of women, including as many as 70 at one time, I will kindly reject your highly presumptious judgment of me. I happen to like men and I happen to like women and enjoy both equally well. I prefer to prove my worth and earn respect through what I can accomplish rather than get on my high horse, despise, accuse, look for any opening to be offended, and feel victimized by the guys I have also worked with, been employee of, and have had as employees over the years. I've earned my professional credentials. Nobody gave them to me, though I am grateful to both the men and women who gave me the opportunity to get them.

I won't play the victim card, therefore you think less of me. So be it. Just like minorities have had to do, women have had to fight for their own place in society. Both of those wars have been won. It is time to stop fighting them and start benefitting from the victory.

I recommend that for everybody.

Women have been TAUGHT self loathing, yet they seldom recognize it. And only by working in psychiatry can one see the depths to which it goes. Any man would be expect to be recognized for his education, experience, and accomplishments without being patronized. But when a woman has the same expectations, she is 'hypersensitive.' Yep. That is self loathing. Projected. Until and unless a person has paid the dues to get the education, then he/she can't even begin to comprehend the price of it in terms of time, money, and the derision that a female going to law school has to face every single time she darkens the door. No woman who has is willing to settle.

That would be an excellent point if you had posted it 30 years ago.

Still happens today. When I was teaching my entire class was 40 something, mostly women who drank the cool aid and found a good man. Only he wasn't. We've still got a LOOONG way to go.

 

[Unkotare]

Women have been TAUGHT self loathing, yet they seldom recognize it. And only by working in psychiatry can one see the depths to which it goes. Any man would be expect to be recognized for his education, experience, and accomplishments without being patronized. But when a woman has the same expectations, she is 'hypersensitive.' Yep. That is self loathing. Projected. Until and unless a person has paid the dues to get the education, then he/she can't even begin to comprehend the price of it in terms of time, money, and the derision that a female going to law school has to face every single time she darkens the door. No woman who has is willing to settle.

That would be an excellent point if you had posted it 30 years ago.

Still happens today. When I was teaching my entire class was 40 something, mostly women who drank the cool aid and found a good man. Only he wasn't. We've still got a LOOONG way to go.

So every time a marriage ends - and women have the legal, political, social, and economic independence to do so at any time - that is somehow proof that they are brainwashed victims? Women overtaking men in enrollment and graduation from universities, earning more and more CEO and upper management positions as well as private business ownership is "paying the price"?

You're looking backward, baby. Women still have a number of legitimate concerns in today's society, but YOU are about ten miles off the mark.

 

[Sunshine]

That would be an excellent point if you had posted it 30 years ago.

Still happens today. When I was teaching my entire class was 40 something, mostly women who drank the cool aid and found a good man. Only he wasn't. We've still got a LOOONG way to go.

So every time a marriage ends - and women have the legal, political, social, and economic independence to do so at any time - that is somehow proof that they are brainwashed victims? Women overtaking men in enrollment and graduation from universities, earning more and more CEO and upper management positions as well as private business ownership is "paying the price"?

You're looking backward, baby. Women still have a number of legitimate concerns in today's society, but YOU are about ten miles off the mark.

I am not talking 'stats' here. I am talking having seen what I've seen working in psychiatry in two southern states, KY and TN. A woman who leaves a marriage and has children simply can't make it if the ex is a bum and/or has nothing to pay her in support. And I will qualify that by saying IF she is adverse to accepting public assistance. And IF she is not, having to accept public assistance is like death. I have a lawyer friend who divorced her husband after her children were grown, and she has struggled for 5 years. She never 'qualified' for any 'help' beyond getting a forbearance on her student loans.Everyone thinks lawyers are rich, but that's not always the case and the reason I didn't decide to become a 'baby lawyer' at 58.

Many women stay with an abusive husband 'for the sake of the children.' Some simply refuse to 'see' that the loser is sexually abusing one or all of the children because if she did she would have to leave the marriage. Sometimes it's because she loves the perp, but usually, it's about money. In those cases, I have had to report the situation to the state because the woman will not.

Generally, you are right, but there are still a lot of bad situations out there and a woman who has never had to support herself often finds herself emotionally immobilized when she is faced with it. I had worked for years right out of high school, but not at anything that paid, and I didn't get to go to college. When my husband was diagnosed with cancer, I have never experienced such terror in my life. I was a wreck. I alternated between the sorrow of losing my husband and high school sweetheart and debilitating fear. I had started back to school the year before because the children were in school, we had the money, and that was a gift from my husband. He spent many of his dying days telling me that, yes, I COULD raise the children on my own without him, giving me permission to remarry, move away, do whatever it would take to ensure the success of our little family. How horribly unfair that was to him. And yes, that was 30 years ago, but I have seen women over almost the entire 30 years in my practice who were in the very same spot. That kind of fear is universal.

I will have to say this, though, I have come to more fully respect the honorable men who try to live up to society's expectations. I do see why the cop outs cop out. (Not that I excuse it because I don't.) It's just fucking HARD!

 

[Foxfyre]

Whether male or female, single parents have a tough go of it. Some marriages don't work, spouses die or leave, it is critical for some to leave because of domestic violence--I helped found and get a Domestic Violence Association up and running and we have taken refugee women and children into our own home before we completed a shelter for them, so I know something about that--and also chemical substance abuse--I have some expertise in that field too and know how it can rip families apart . . .and

. . . The wealthy can afford to hire nannys and other services for their children to replace a husband or wife. Those male and female of more limited means will equally struggle with what to do when the kids are sick, taking time away from work to attend parent teacher conferences and other activities, etc. and making do with much more limited financial resources. Talking with single parents, some think society is less tolerant of the dual role played by a single dad; others think it is less tolerant of the dual role played by a single mom. There are so many fewer single dads than moms, probably a good comparison is hard to make, but I suspect difficulty of the job is pretty much a wash when gender is factored in.

Some single parents handle that tough job better than others. Some do a great job, some not so much. And yes, all traditional families aren't perfect either. But even though single parents, whether by choice or by circumstance, can and do a great job of raising their kids, children were intended to have a loving mother and father in the home. Because they have those role models and because two people will be less stressed and more there for their kids than a working single parent can provide, study after study has shown that on average, children benefit greatly from the loving two-parent home.

And while nobody knows more than I do the different cultural expectations for men and women--and women are just as guilty as men for perpetuating some of those--I also know that women who choose to be are now just as free as the men to pursue whatever their goals might be, and our cultural expectations now allow them to do so without question. (Actually back when we were still fighting the war, I was the rebel who refused to accept it, and did my own thing anyway.) But like I said, that war has now been won, and it is time for us to stop fighting it and rather focus on what we need to do to prepare and equip ourselves to benefit from the victory.

The war against racial discrimination and prejudice has also been won and it is time to stop fighting that too. To continue to insert toxic responses and speculation into everything whether it is sexism or racism only emphasizes differences, creates resentments and a toxic environment where none should exist, and keeps both issues going when they should be allowed to die.

One person's circumstances and experience are not a blueprint for how it is with everybody.

I still say Paula Deen is being beaten over the head with the PC club for something that happened 30 years ago and for an innocuous interview in which she was not strictly politically correct. It is unfortunate that the more viscious judges of people use that PC club to destroy her and that her employer and/or advertisers are so afraid of the PC police that they unceremoniously dump her.

 

[proudveteran06]

The trouble is that those products who endorsed her had to drop her for their own financial interests . What I don't know is why is she being sued and how did the use of that word even come up? Blacks will defend the use of that word saying it has a different meaning when they say it

 

[Foxfyre]

The trouble is that those products who endorsed her had to drop her for their own financial interests . What I don't know is why is she being sued and how did the use of that word even come up? Blacks will defend the use of that word saying it has a different meaning when they say it

That is the cruelest and most indefensible aspect of political correctness and what makes a vile cancer in our society. We have given the PC judges and police license to destroy anybody who doesn't toe the PC line. Employers and advertisers are so paranoid about being targeted that they create far greater injustices than anything somebody who is un-PC could ever do.

And making it worse is that they don't apply it equitably to everybody. If you are one of THEM....one of the militant left....you can be forgiven anything. But woe to the neutral or right centered folks. They will be targets every single time.

 

[Wake]

I dislike the Word Police, as they're now called.