Do We Need Religion?

[sidneyworld]

Faith as in belief in God? No, it doesn't require a religion, but it does require acculturation.

Acculturation is not unlike indoctrination. And it has the same succession of results from one culture to many cultures as it branches out. However "faith" and wisdom of divine spiritualism does not necessarily require acculturation. Only the practice of religion that carry a cache of man made obsticles in attempting to gain that wisdom.

Anne Marie

Humans possess a brain capable of very high abstract forms of thought. The ability to wonder, to speculate, to imagine are all products of that brain. Another product of that brain is the ability to imagine a creator of everything a human can perceive. Acculteration harnesses that mental ability by channelling it into the religious beliefs (assuming they exist) of the primary socialisation agents of the individual when he or she is born, the parents. Left alone, the individual might create their own personal mythology but that's not usually the case.

Yes, but in that case, so do many species of animals, including elephants. Elephants are highly evolved creatures who have their own set of what could be considered "spiritual" rituals. In San Diego Zoo, a herd of elephants were acting out after years of what appeared to be a peaceful existence. An expert was called in and asked if there was any event within that herd that might have disrupted them. After a thorough review in literally every aspect of daily routine, feeding, housing, weather, etc. that past month it was determined that they might be missing an older elephant who had died overnight and was taken away before the herd could make their own investigation. They were able to retrieve a part of the remains, mostly bones and tusks and left it in the middle of a common area. Within a half hour the entire herd was carressing and turning over the remains. It was left there overnight for them to observe and the very next, after it was taken away the herd was nearly back to normal. After a week they went back to their peaceful setting. Go figure!

Another quite remarkable experiment took place on "To tell the truth." That vintage game show with a celebrity panel and common contestants who had to fool the panel into what their career was. It might have been What's My Line but in any case they took electroids censors and hooked them up to a geranium plant. In the next room behind the door live shrimp were placed in a vask just about acid. The objective was to see if the geranium had any reaction to the shrimp being dumped into the acid, killing them instantly. Now these days, I would have objected to that, I'm beyond rabid about animal cruelty, but at that time I was completely fascinated at the outcome. When the shrimp were dropped in, the censors hooked up to the meter went off the chart. It was instantly. Animals can sense spirits and magnetic activity. They can mourn, they can sense upcoming danger. They have a far sharper intuition and it's only recently taken seriously by scientists.

There are countless species that have exhibited "human" characterists. That have the ability of abstract thought and cognition. We have only recently uncovered these traits that we believed were exclusive of human beings. It's hardly the case. And it also makes for a rationale that spirituality is a far more complex and viable study shared by all life, than previously considered.

I also believe that we have one common denominator. That we all came from one source and that no matter what form of life we are, we are all connect on that level of existence.
Anne Marie

 

[Diuretic]

Beware of anthropomorphism.

 

[sidneyworld]

Beware of anthropomorphism.

Many people including various religions condemn the notion that animals think at our level. Yet, many other people, millions of people, especially with pets can testify that there is far more going on in an animal's mind than simply acting out of instinct, physical necessity and repetition.

If you were to raise a child with animals, caged and treated quite in the same manner, they will not objectively reach a level of behavior which remotely resembles human behavior. So who is right here?

No matter how far science has come in attempting to assess the metaphysical nature of animals, it remains a viably compelling mystery and becomes quite a measure of applied logic in terms of their being a spiritual realm shared by both human and non-human species. It also begins to qualify the nature of God and our souls, and that of the potential existence of souls in animals.

Metaphysics and the Question of Animal Intelligence in the Thought of Descartes

Anne Marie

 

[Ceasaro]

My cat is more intelligent than a lot of humans I know. At least he doesn't negate rational thought and believe in a god.

 

[sidneyworld]

My cat is more intelligent than a lot of humans I know. At least he doesn't negate rational thought and believe in a god.

How do you know what a cat truly thinks? Cats know before there is any change in a household when the family is going on vacation without them. They know and understand when there is danger in the house. When there are spirits lurking or some type of metaphysical occurence. So do dogs and outside the domestic catagory, there are endless species of animals that have a supersense of things that transcend rational thought.

Animals have also been known to exercise vigils in certain areas of a house or outside a house where a loved one recently passed away. Those who don't cross over remain in a spirit form close to where the are either buried or where they have died. Children have also actually seen these entities of souls who have not crossed over.

I mean this stuff is as abundant in its research as is the theory of evolution. Except that we can actually witness these things instantly as opposed to the thousands of years and microscopic rate of evidence in the study of evolution.

Anne Marie

 

[JBeukema]

How do you know what a cat truly thinks? Cats know before there is any change in a household when the family is going on vacation without them.

How do you know what a cat truly thinks?

They know and understand when there is danger in the house

How do you know what a cat truly thinks?

. When there are spirits lurking or some type of metaphysical occurence.

How do you know what a cat truly thinks?

So do dogs and outside the domestic catagory, there are endless species of animals that have a supersense of things that transcend rational thought.

How do you know what an animal truly thinks?

 

[Anguille]

How do you know what a cat truly thinks? Cats know before there is any change in a household when the family is going on vacation without them.

How do you know what a cat truly thinks?

They know and understand when there is danger in the house

How do you know what a cat truly thinks?

. When there are spirits lurking or some type of metaphysical occurence.

How do you know what a cat truly thinks?

So do dogs and outside the domestic catagory, there are endless species of animals that have a supersense of things that transcend rational thought.

How do you know what an animal truly thinks?

A little birdy told her.

 

[Kalam]

When there are spirits lurking or some type of metaphysical occurence.

Your cat possesses the magical ability to detect the presence of ghosts?

 

[sealybobo]

Evangelist Alamo found guilty of kid-sex crimes
He calls himself 'prophet that went to jail for the Gospel'


Evangelist found guilty of kid-sex crimes - Crime & courts- msnbc.com

 

[BrokenAngel]

Evangelist Alamo found guilty of kid-sex crimes
He calls himself 'prophet that went to jail for the Gospel'


Evangelist found guilty of kid-sex crimes - Crime & courts- msnbc.com

So he is a nut job.. what is your point?

 

[sidneyworld]

When there are spirits lurking or some type of metaphysical occurence.

Your cat possesses the magical ability to detect the presence of ghosts?

Animals do. We lived in an apartment many years ago and had a cat and a dog and both of them out of nowhere used to run down the hall, my dog would stop look up at the ceiling and wag his tail and the cat used to meow at the same thing. And that's just the tip of the iceberg.

Anne Marie

 

[JBeukema]

When there are spirits lurking or some type of metaphysical occurence.

Your cat possesses the magical ability to detect the presence of ghosts?

Animals do.

How do you know what an animal knows or thinks? Answer your own fucking question before you make yourself look even more retarded.

We lived in an apartment many years ago and had a cat and a dog and both of them out of nowhere used to run down the hall, my dog would stop look up at the ceiling and wag his tail and the cat used to meow at the same thing. And that's just the tip of the iceberg.

And the only possible explanation is something supernatural?

 

[Anguille]

When there are spirits lurking or some type of metaphysical occurence.

Your cat possesses the magical ability to detect the presence of ghosts?

Animals do. We lived in an apartment many years ago and had a cat and a dog and both of them out of nowhere used to run down the hall, my dog would stop look up at the ceiling and wag his tail and the cat used to meow at the same thing. And that's just the tip of the iceberg.

Anne Marie

Anne Marie, you had mice in your ceiling.

 

[Diuretic]

Beware of anthropomorphism.

Many people including various religions condemn the notion that animals think at our level. Yet, many other people, millions of people, especially with pets can testify that there is far more going on in an animal's mind than simply acting out of instinct, physical necessity and repetition.

If you were to raise a child with animals, caged and treated quite in the same manner, they will not objectively reach a level of behavior which remotely resembles human behavior. So who is right here?

No matter how far science has come in attempting to assess the metaphysical nature of animals, it remains a viably compelling mystery and becomes quite a measure of applied logic in terms of their being a spiritual realm shared by both human and non-human species. It also begins to qualify the nature of God and our souls, and that of the potential existence of souls in animals.

Metaphysics and the Question of Animal Intelligence in the Thought of Descartes

Anne Marie

Going to your example of a child raised as an animal. Yes, the child, although human, would behave like the animals around it. That's because mammals, such as ourselves, initially learn by observation, modelling. The child would imitate the behaviour of those around him or her. But because the child has a human brain it has the potential to behave in a much more complex manner than those animals, but without the proper stimuli, which is provided by humans who nurture the child, the child won't develop.

 

[sidneyworld]

How do you know what a cat truly thinks? Cats know before there is any change in a household when the family is going on vacation without them.

How do you know what a cat truly thinks?

They know and understand when there is danger in the house

How do you know what a cat truly thinks?

. When there are spirits lurking or some type of metaphysical occurence.

How do you know what a cat truly thinks?

So do dogs and outside the domestic catagory, there are endless species of animals that have a supersense of things that transcend rational thought.

How do you know what an animal truly thinks?

How do I know that you have any amount of intelligence? There is absolutely no evidence of that.

Anne Marie

 

[sidneyworld]

Your cat possesses the magical ability to detect the presence of ghosts?

Animals do. We lived in an apartment many years ago and had a cat and a dog and both of them out of nowhere used to run down the hall, my dog would stop look up at the ceiling and wag his tail and the cat used to meow at the same thing. And that's just the tip of the iceberg.

Anne Marie

Anne Marie, you had mice in your ceiling.

lol

 

[Ceasaro]

More like mice in her brain.

 

[sidneyworld]

More like mice in her brain.

.... very intelligent mice, I might add!

Anne Marie

 

[sidneyworld]

[youtube]1375962

 

[sidneyworld]

This is a very interesting article, among so many on topic.

"Why do we need God ... or Religion? - Is not Science Enough?

It this discussion about God, there has been an attempt to prove that
God exists by some argument or another, and that Jesus Christ is God. Before
we can get anyone to consider any argument, we first have to answer a few
other questions, like why there is even a need for such a concept as God.
If this point can not be accepted, then any argument about who is God is
pointless to the listener who is convinced there is no God. They will just
dismiss everything out of hand as irrelavent as we have seen.

In this post I will try and answer the following basic questions:
1. Why is Science alone not enough?
2. Are not the satisfaction of physical needs enough for man?


Why do we even need religion?


When someone hears about a religion, ha asks, "What need is there for
religion! It is now the scientific age. The age of religion has already
passed. If we study science well, develop our culture, and make progress in
every field, that is enough. Why is there any need for religion?" I think
there are some who naturally think this way.


Especially from the end of the 19th century to the earlier part of the 20th
century, there were many, many people who thought like that. In those days,
many people said to themselves, "if only we study science and find out the
new scientific facts and many scientific principles, and if the world
advances that way, it will naturally go on advancing and prospering in every
way." If the potential force of science were completely realized, all the
people in the world would live happily and peacefully. Literally, we would
have a Utopian world.


The Dream of Science Shattered
Well, do you remember! The dream of science has been shattered right after
the
beginning of the 20th century. The dream has been broken into pieces.
Look at the aspects of the 20th century with its highly-developed scientific
civilization. World War I brought us such great calamities and then, a little
later, came the ravages of World War II, and then the continuous 'cold war'
as well as the frequent 'hot wars'.


The world in which we now live in this 20th century, even though proud of
highly-developed science, has actually become unimaginably bloody and cruel.
Now science is at the height of progress and we are living in its atomic age.
But when we think of the results which science has brought us, we, the people
of the world, shudder with the fear that sometime in a future moment the
atomic bomb may fall on our cities.


So, first, science has brought us a sanguinary world. Second, science has
brought to all mankind a world of instability and fear. Think deeply on these
things.


Of course, we need science. We need science just as we need fire. Do you know
how much we need fire? It is used to cook dinner and to make the room warm.
How much we need fire! But the fire must be used in the right way. If not,
that fire may become the cause of great damage and terrible disasters. It is
the same with science. Science must be used in the right way. If not, it may
cause more terrible disasters.


Of course, science can help make airplanes, and atomic and hydrogen bombs.
But it can never make a good man who will make the best use of science.
Where, and who then is going to make a base, depraved, ill-natured man just!
Where should he go to make himself justified? From this situation arise
religious
concerns.


Man cannot make himself justified. He must return to the Creator who first
made him.


The Emptiness of Material Life
Some people often say that bread is the most important thing we need. So they
cry for bread, which leads some political leaders to cry out,"Follow me, and
I will give you bread." In one sense, that is right. Clothes, food, and
shelter are important needs. But we should remember one thing here; and that
is, has anyone really found satisfaction in life by solving economic
problems?


All the communist countries have been treating people like slaves and as
machines with the promise that by doing so they will solve the problem of
daily bread. Let's suppose that they've solved this problem of bread. Do you
think they can be happy without freedom under the dictatorship of Communists?


In my opinion, America is a country that has helped its people solve economic
problems under the freedom of democracy. America has prepared its people to
solve all the problems of everyday life and allowed them to enjoy freedom
under the policy of a democracy. Do you think there is anyone in America who
finds true satisfaction in life just by solving their fleshly problems?
16,000 persons commit suicide every year in America.


If man were composed of a body only, he would be happy just to have good food
and good clothes. But, as you know, a man is not made up of merely a body. In
man there is a strange flame of fire, namely, a soul. Even if he is given all
kinds of good conditions in his physical life, he will always feel empty and
dissatisfied if he doesn't have spiritual peace and satisfaction.


Therefore, the Bible says, "Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every
word that proceeds from the mouth of God." The theory of the Communists that
man can be happy by bread alone regards man as an animal. But man has
something precious in his body that the animal doesn't have: his soul or
spirit which yearns for something better than bread. He searches for
something more valuable. If he doesn't get anything more valuable, he always
feels the emptiness of life until this void is filled.


So scientific advances, and fullfillment of physical needs does not bring a
filling of this emptiness... this is a start of an understanding of Man's
need for God. Nothing satisfies certian spiritual needs of mankind except
there be a God, and that necessitates religion. Finding God is not in this or
that certain scientific fact.. but in the fact that noting else fills these
needs.

Evolution - June 1997: Why do we need God ... or Religion? - Is not Science Enough?

Anne Marie