Democrat Debate- Impressions and Tells

[JimBowie1958]

Anderson did a great job. He could have given Webb more time, but over all did fairly well.

The best performer was without question, IMO, Bernie Sanders. The man is a genius, and has the air of a Prophetic voice. If he gets the nomination, no Republican will win against him except maybe Huckabee. Sanders is not going to get the NRA out against him in force. He scored big points by stating he was sick to death of hearing about Hillary's emails. He kept pounding on the main two issues; the American middle class is disappearing because the Too Big To Fail banks and corporations have corrupted the political system and need to be put back in their place, and that college education should be free. These are two HUGE winning issues.

Clinton came across as a highly polished professional Politician and I think people are sick to death of that, over all. I don't think she can beat any of the GOP 'outsider' candidates. 'Vote for me because I have a vagina' is not going to win.

Webb did the best of the debate, other than Sanders, IMO, because he gave reasonable answers that took multiple sides to each question and the complexities of issue, and that takes courage in a political system that is dominated by single issue voters and special interests groups. He was the only won that asked how these plans were going to be paid for. Some smart asses commenting that he would do better in the GOP epitomized the losers of the Democratic Party.

OMalley and Chaffee were really irrelevant, OMalley running to the left of everyo0ne and Chaffee playing the wise old statesman in a party that despises both.

I would seriously consider voting for Sanders or Webb, but not the rest.

 

[AvgGuyIA]

Sanders is a Socialist. Their solution to America's problems would be the same as the communist party of Russia. Kill anybody who disagrees with them. American Socialist will take the easy out too and kill conservatives if they stand there holding the Constitution.

 

[Shrimpbox]

Good assessment JB. I would give Anderson a high grade. He did not pull punches or ask softball questions. I would also agree that Webb was the realist on the panel and he is the only one that I would even consider voting for. The luntz focus group gave Bernie the blue ribbon. All,I can say about the focus group is that those dems live in a totally different world than I do, and it reenforces the huge divide in this country. I cannot believe that all the dems wanted to give every illegal alien in this country all the benefits that would accrue to American citizens.

The overview of the whole debate for me though was that you would think that whole panel was running against an incumbent republican administration. There are so many problems that have not been solved or have been made worse in the last,years. The constant talk about a declining middle class and income inequality are all products of the Obama administration. So a smart political operative would take these comments and make a killer ad FOR republicans with sound bites from this debate.

 

[Blackrook]

Here's thing. Nobody except the fanatic liberal crazies are going to vote for any of these candiates.

 

[Iron Head]

It was actually a lot better than I was expecting. Of course, I did not have very high expectations. Obviously they are all jumping on the wealth disparity issue. The whole "share profits with the workers upon whose backs they were earned" is repulsive and wrong on so many levels. 20 years ago there would have been no way they could have gotten away with that leftist tripe. Now the audience applauds it. Pretty discouraging for the future of our nation.

 

[Blackrook]

It is ingrained in the minds of millions of Americans that they are entitled to free stuff from the government.

 

[Treeshepherd]

Sanders quip about Clinton's damn emails was masterful. He's like, I'm not going to use the issue against you but you did kinda screw up. That was the subtext. He shoulda done more of that instead of wonking about $15 minimum wage and stuff that's way out of the mainstream.

I thought Chafee had the best substantive cracks on Hillary, but like someone said "being attacked by Chafee is like being flogged with a wet noodle." You could say the same thing about O'Malley to a lesser degree.

Clinton stopped the bleeding and that's a win for her.

 

[Mertex]

Anderson did a great job. He could have given Webb more time, but over all did fairly well.

The best performer was without question, IMO, Bernie Sanders. The man is a genius, and has the air of a Prophetic voice. If he gets the nomination, no Republican will win against him except maybe Huckabee. Sanders is not going to get the NRA out against him in force. He scored big points by stating he was sick to death of hearing about Hillary's emails. He kept pounding on the main two issues; the American middle class is disappearing because the Too Big To Fail banks and corporations have corrupted the political system and need to be put back in their place, and that college education should be free. These are two HUGE winning issues.

Clinton came across as a highly polished professional Politician and I think people are sick to death of that, over all. I don't think she can beat any of the GOP 'outsider' candidates. 'Vote for me because I have a vagina' is not going to win.

Webb did the best of the debate, other than Sanders, IMO, because he gave reasonable answers that took multiple sides to each question and the complexities of issue, and that takes courage in a political system that is dominated by single issue voters and special interests groups. He was the only won that asked how these plans were going to be paid for. Some smart asses commenting that he would do better in the GOP epitomized the losers of the Democratic Party.

OMalley and Chaffee were really irrelevant, OMalley running to the left of everyo0ne and Chaffee playing the wise old statesman in a party that despises both.

I would seriously consider voting for Sanders or Webb, but not the rest.

What a great debate.....Democrats showed Republicans how a debate is done. They discussed issues that Americans are concerned about instead of attacking each other like the "food fight" debate the Republicans held. They talked about supporting programs that help Americans unlike the Republicans, whose main topic was getting rid of programs that help Americans. What a difference.

The best performer was Hillary........Bernie was okay, but your idea that Huckabee would beat him is hilarious. And none of the Republican candidates are going to be able to debate Hillary.......she's way more polished and experienced than any of your "outsiders" who are still wet behind the ears.

The only reason you think Webb did the best was because he was the one that sounded more like a conservative than any of the others. He doesn't have a chance against Hillary, though.

 

[Mertex]

It is ingrained in the minds of millions of Americans that they are entitled to free stuff from the government.

Like you? You don't even support this Forum but here you are posting here and criticizing others as liking "free stuff".......what a buffoon.

 

[007]

I couldn't tell you anything about it because I didn't watch it. If I had to listen to that bunch of progs for very long, I'd probably have to vomit.

 

[JimBowie1958]

Sanders is a Socialist. Their solution to America's problems would be the same as the communist party of Russia. Kill anybody who disagrees with them. American Socialist will take the easy out too and kill conservatives if they stand there holding the Constitution.

This is one of the foibles of the American conservative movement that I have been trying to get my conservative friends to reappraise for the last twenty years at least.

There are many kinds of socialism, from 'democratic socialism' and 'Fabian socialism' on the more populist/Western side of the spectrum all the way to Maoist radicalism which was pretty much as you described. You are not going to defeat Sanders by trying to paint him like a communist. Nobody want to hear that over-reach in comparisons when we have serious 'bad behavior' by Wall Street banks and major corporations and far too much corporate money in our political system, corrupting it. If conservatives don't pull their heads out of their asses on this topic they are going to lose and deserve to lose.

 

[JimBowie1958]

I couldn't tell you anything about it because I didn't watch it. If I had to listen to that bunch of progs for very long, I'd probably have to vomit.

That is your choice of course, but I don't understand how not understanding the opposition helps your party or cause.

 

[JimBowie1958]

It is ingrained in the minds of millions of Americans that they are entitled to free stuff from the government.

No, they paid for those entitlements, Rook, hence the term used, 'ENTITLEments'.

 

[JimBowie1958]

It was actually a lot better than I was expecting. Of course, I did not have very high expectations.

Neither did I, but I was pleasantly surprised.

Obviously they are all jumping on the wealth disparity issue.

And why not? Why do conservatives have this inane idea that this country exists to pad Wall Street bonus checks? What is so fundamentally wrong with designing our economic policies to let anyone willing to work have a prosperous future that conservatives think the whole idea 'repulsive'?

The whole "share profits with the workers upon whose backs they were earned" is repulsive and wrong on so many levels.

Why? Say I have this neato idea to make a widget for $1 and sell them for $5, but I cant personally make enough of them to fill all the orders I get, so I hire people to make the widgets. Three scenarios, which is the more optimal?

Scenario one: I pay each worker $15 an hour plus all benefits imaginable and I net a 1% profit and after a few years of 60 hour work weeks making my business work, I finally sell it and retire.

Scenario 2: I pay the workers the lowest prevailing wage I can get away with and they only make a 50 cent commission per widget they make and I get fabulously rich overseeing them.

Scenario 3: I pay the workers $2 per widget, splitting my profit with them. They make a lot of money and I make a lot of money. I give them stock options in my little company so they make more money as I grow my business and we all profit from playing for the same team; my company I started that is now a joint venture for everyone involved.

I like scenario 3 myself, and wonder why we don't see it more and I know why; too many businesses working on the second model undercut the decent ones and drive them out of business in cut throat capitalism.

WHY DO CONSERVATIVE THINK OUR ECONOMIC POLCIES SHOULD BE GEARED TOWARD CUT THROAT COMPETITION? Who really wants to live life like that?

20 years ago there would have been no way they could have gotten away with that leftist tripe. Now the audience applauds it.

Where is your indignation at the $13 trillion dollars lost in the 2008 real estate meltdown? Where is the outrage at Wall Street banks collecting over $4 trillion in QE bailouts that is coming indirectly out of the savings of every American in the form of higher inflation?

Why is it good to throw more profits to the ridiculously rich and kick hard working Americans to the curb to live or die or what ever? What is right about letting companies fire workers in their 50's who have never worked at another company in their whole lives and have no other skill set to go get a comparably paying job that wont hire them anyway due to their age? Whole towns in this country are dying off and American conservatives are like 'and so what?' This is one facet of conservatism that alienates so many Americans from conservative ideology.

Pretty discouraging for the future of our nation.

Americans coming together to protect their own interest is discouraging? Discouraging for who exactly? Corporations? Wall Street banks?

Don't worry, they'll survive Iron head and still live at a logarithmically higher life style scale than you or I do.

 

[AvgGuyIA]

It is ingrained in the minds of millions of Americans that they are entitled to free stuff from the government.

No, they paid for those entitlements, Rook, hence the term used, 'ENTITLEments'.

An ObamaPhone is an entitlement?

 

[JimBowie1958]

Sanders quip about Clinton's damn emails was masterful. He's like, I'm not going to use the issue against you but you did kinda screw up. That was the subtext. He shoulda done more of that instead of wonking about $15 minimum wage and stuff that's way out of the mainstream.

I thought Chafee had the best substantive cracks on Hillary, but like someone said "being attacked by Chafee is like being flogged with a wet noodle." You could say the same thing about O'Malley to a lesser degree.

Clinton stopped the bleeding and that's a win for her.

Sanders beat Hillary because of more subtext than you are giving Democrat voters for; her campaign contributions. Sanders is slamming Wall Street and international corporations hard, and they deserve it. No one is forgetting that Hillary is collecting tens of millions of dollars from those same Wall Street banks and corporations she represented as Senator from New York.

Sanders won, hands down without a single doubt. Which is good for the Democrats because Sanders can win against the GOP 'Outsiders' and Hillary can't.

 

[JimBowie1958]

It is ingrained in the minds of millions of Americans that they are entitled to free stuff from the government.

No, they paid for those entitlements, Rook, hence the term used, 'ENTITLEments'.

An ObamaPhone is an entitlement?

Where did those people pay for an Obamaphone? Of course those are not entitlements. An entitlement is something the tax payer has been paying extra taxes for like Social Security and Medicaid and so now they are ENTITLED to receive them just like if they had a contract with AIG for a life long annuity that collects while working and then you can withdraw from once you retire.

ENTITLEment. When Republicans talk about cutting or replacing Social Security to most voters that has the same toxic ring to it that confiscating everyone's IRA and retirement savings to finance Social Security.

 

[AvgGuyIA]

It was actually a lot better than I was expecting. Of course, I did not have very high expectations.

Neither did I, but I was pleasantly surprised.

Obviously they are all jumping on the wealth disparity issue.

And why not? Why do conservatives have this inane idea that this country exists to pad Wall Street bonus checks? What is so fundamentally wrong with designing our economic policies to let anyone willing to work have a prosperous future that conservatives think the whole idea 'repulsive'?

The whole "share profits with the workers upon whose backs they were earned" is repulsive and wrong on so many levels.

Why? Say I have this neato idea to make a widget for $1 and sell them for $5, but I cant personally make enough of them to fill all the orders I get, so I hire people to make the widgets. Three scenarios, which is the more optimal?

Scenario one: I pay each worker $15 an hour plus all benefits imaginable and I net a 1% profit and after a few years of 60 hour work weeks making my business work, I finally sell it and retire.

Scenario 2: I pay the workers the lowest prevailing wage I can get away with and they only make a 50 cent commission per widget they make and I get fabulously rich overseeing them.

Scenario 3: I pay the workers $2 per widget, splitting my profit with them. They make a lot of money and I make a lot of money. I give them stock options in my little company so they make more money as I grow my business and we all profit from playing for the same team; my company I started that is now a joint venture for everyone involved.

I like scenario 3 myself, and wonder why we don't see it more and I know why; too many businesses working on the second model undercut the decent ones and drive them out of business in cut throat capitalism.

WHY DO CONSERVATIVE THINK OUR ECONOMIC POLCIES SHOULD BE GEARED TOWARD CUT THROAT COMPETITION? Who really wants to live life like that?

20 years ago there would have been no way they could have gotten away with that leftist tripe. Now the audience applauds it.

Where is your indignation at the $13 trillion dollars lost in the 2008 real estate meltdown? Where is the outrage at Wall Street banks collecting over $4 trillion in QE bailouts that is coming indirectly out of the savings of every American in the form of higher inflation?

Why is it good to throw more profits to the ridiculously rich and kick hard working Americans to the curb to live or die or what ever? What is right about letting companies fire workers in their 50's who have never worked at another company in their whole lives and have no other skill set to go get a comparably paying job that wont hire them anyway due to their age? Whole towns in this country are dying off and American conservatives are like 'and so what?' This is one facet of conservatism that alienates so many Americans from conservative ideology.

Pretty discouraging for the future of our nation.

Americans coming together to protect their own interest is discouraging? Discouraging for who exactly? Corporations? Wall Street banks?

Don't worry, they'll survive Iron head and still live at a logarithmically higher life style scale than you or I do.

Where is JimBowie? I think some liberal took over his password. Let's say you mortgage your house, cashed in your life insurance and 401k to start your business. You've taken all the risk and potentially jeopardize Junior's college education fund. Which option do you choose now?

 

[JimBowie1958]

Here's thing. Nobody except the fanatic liberal crazies are going to vote for any of these candiates.

Oh, Gawd, Rook you are so wrong, fatally wrong on that one.

Millions of Americans are out of work after decades of their lives avoiding criminal activity, working hard and saving and now they are on the edge of being wiped out totally while the fat cat bankers on Wall Street and corporations make windfall profits hand over fist. They watch while their hard working kids graduate from college and cant find a damned job because Republicans have been signing free trade treaties that are exporting their jobs and their futures. Many of them cant afford to put their kids through college and so bright energetic talent is simply lost to us while some H1-B serf takes the job instead so once again corporations can make bigger profits.

And the American middle class workers are seething with rage from it all. And Republicans just don't seem to get it.

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

Anderson did a great job. He could have given Webb more time, but over all did fairly well.

The best performer was without question, IMO, Bernie Sanders. The man is a genius, and has the air of a Prophetic voice. If he gets the nomination, no Republican will win against him except maybe Huckabee. Sanders is not going to get the NRA out against him in force. He scored big points by stating he was sick to death of hearing about Hillary's emails. He kept pounding on the main two issues; the American middle class is disappearing because the Too Big To Fail banks and corporations have corrupted the political system and need to be put back in their place, and that college education should be free. These are two HUGE winning issues.

Clinton came across as a highly polished professional Politician and I think people are sick to death of that, over all. I don't think she can beat any of the GOP 'outsider' candidates. 'Vote for me because I have a vagina' is not going to win.

Webb did the best of the debate, other than Sanders, IMO, because he gave reasonable answers that took multiple sides to each question and the complexities of issue, and that takes courage in a political system that is dominated by single issue voters and special interests groups. He was the only won that asked how these plans were going to be paid for. Some smart asses commenting that he would do better in the GOP epitomized the losers of the Democratic Party.

OMalley and Chaffee were really irrelevant, OMalley running to the left of everyo0ne and Chaffee playing the wise old statesman in a party that despises both.

I would seriously consider voting for Sanders or Webb, but not the rest.

Sanders shit the bed. Outside of his fan club, like Donald Trump I suspect he hit his ceiling and his some of his financial/economic replies sounded sophomoric and silly

ex:

Senator Sanders, in 2008, congressional leaders were told, without the 2008 bailout, the U.S. was possibly days away from a complete meltdown. Despite that, you still voted against it.

As president, would you stand by your principles if it risked the country's financial stability?

SANDERS: Well, I remember that meeting very well. I remember it like it was yesterday. Hank Paulson, Bernanke came in, and they say, "guys, the economy is going to collapse because Wall Street is going under. It's gonna take the economy with them."

And you know what I said to Hank Paulson? I said, "Hank, your guys -- you come from Goldman Sachs. Your millionaire and billionaire friends caused this problem. How about your millionaire and billionaire friends paying for the bailout, not working families in this country?"

So to answer your question, no, I would not have let the economy collapse. But it was wrong to ask the middle class to bail out Wall Street. And by the way, I want Wall Street now to help kids in this country go to college, public colleges and universities, free with a Wall Street speculation tax.​

If the economy collapsed there would have been no one left to bail anybody out -- not the millionaires and billionaires and not working families in this country. And please, before you lecture Dante, I was part of Occupy movement
----------

GOP outsider candidates are easily beatable. The polls that make people like YOU think they are powerful are the ones that show them leading the GOP pack with minority of the vote in a race with many many candidate

O'Malley did well and so did Webb. Chafee is Chafee