Bill Maher Insults Troops - Again

[Gunny]

you'll not be too upset if I don't make life plans based upon your suggestions, will you?

Are YOU suggesting that only americans in office can make a difference? Are you suggesting that if one is not in office that they remain silent?

Do you have an valid points or are you just being a prick?

Odd ... I was wondering the same about you.

 

[red states rule]

Odd ... I was wondering the same about you.

No need to wonder - he does not

 

[maineman]

We had an officer like you, maineman.

Came into SHAPE, was going to 'square us away".

Started off with "rise, and shine" at 5:00AM.

Next was exercises.

Lastely was "sick call".

He lasted about 60 days, wonder why?

I always did full length tours of duty. I wonder how you think you know what sort of officer I was by reading comments on a political message board, by the way? Did you always judge the professionalism of your superior officers solely by their political affiliation? Myself, I was never one of those officers that went "by the book" to the detriment of unit cohesiveness and esprit de corps. I think that if you knew what the hell you were doing and worked hard, you would have enjoyed working for me regardless of our political differences.

 

[Gunny]

I always did full length tours of duty. I wonder how you think you know what sort of officer I was by reading comments on a political message board, by the way? Did you always judge the professionalism of your superior officers solely by their political affiliation? Myself, I was never one of those officers that went "by the book" to the detriment of unit cohesiveness and esprit de corps. I think that if you knew what the hell you were doing and worked hard, you would have enjoyed working for me regardless of our political differences.

The condescending attitude in which you have addressed former enlisted personnel from the first post in which I encountered you to this does not support this statement.

 

[maineman]

Gunny:

I don't know what sort of sorry-ass, lousy morale outfits you were in, but the times I dealt with congressional letters or request masts were few and far between. And I NEVER saw either one of those methods being used by sailors who disagreed with the foreign policy behind any particular deployment or unit mission.

So...barring a widespread submission of letters from soldiers and marines to their congressmen complaining that the foreign policy behind their deployment to Iraq seemed inappropriate and they would ask the good congressman to please look into it - the mere idea is really quite funny - or barring a bunch of request masts where similar hordes of soldiers and marines put in for redress of grievances that the secretary of defense was, in their opinion, executing a flawed foreign policy that, in their opinion, did not properly advance legitimate foreign policy goals and objectives for the united states - an even funnier hypothesis.... how are we to know that US military personnel do or do not enthusiastically support the president shy of asking for a show of hands as I somewhat facetiously suggested before?

And my point was: their support of the underlying foreign policy that sends them around the world is irrelevant. Doing the job and doing it well is what being a professional military person is all about. Deciding where the military goes and what they are required to do when they get there is what the suits in DC do. I think, therefore, that your assumption that the military is overwhelmingly supportive of the foreign policy goals of this administration and their execution thereof - especially when it comes to using our military assets - is unfounded. I cannot prove you wrong - (although there are polls out there that suggest less than enthusiastic support from active duty personnel) but the mere fact that congress hasn't been flooded with letters from irate servicemembers is hardly a valid bit of evidence to support your assumption....nor is the lack of coverage in the media...because...as I said.... barring a show of hands, how in the hell is the media going to really find out? Soldiers complaining to the press is certainly not an acceptable method of redressing grievances, is it?

 

[maineman]

The condescending attitude in which you have addressed former enlisted personnel from the first post in which I encountered you to this does not support this statement.

the long standing relationships and friendships I have with many former enlisted sailors who really had a great time working for me does.

I am not condescending towards former enlisted personnel because they are former enlisted and not officers.... I may appear condescending with certain self righteous conservatives who blindly support what I think is a terribly flawed foreign policy being terribly executed by a moronic president...and some of those self righteous folks happen to have been former enlisted members. Hey...like I said...I knew a hell of a lot of great sailors.... talented brilliant motivated.... I got nothing against white hats.... I just don't play real nice with folks who bullheadedly support a foreign policy that puts us at risk and who simultaneously question my patriotism and my intelligence for having that opinion.

 

[maineman]

If US military personnel did not support what we are doing in Iraq, it would be fairly common knowledge; especially, since the MSM would pounce on THAT story about as fast as they could.

http://www.militarycity.com/polls/2006_main.php

I realize that Army Times may not be considered "Main Stream Media", but I would suggest that this very recent poll published therein might be seen as tending to shoot holes in your assertion above.

comments?

 

[maineman]

a few juicy quotes from that article:

"For the first time, more troops disapprove of the president’s han dling of the war than approve of it. Barely one-third of service members approve of the way the president is handling the war, ac cording to the 2006 Military Times Poll."

"Only 35 percent of the military members polled this year said they approve of the way President Bush is handling the war, while 42 percent said they disapproved"

"Just as telling, in this year’s poll only 41 percent of the military said the U.S. should have gone to war in Iraq in the first place, down from 65 percent in 2003".

Ah.... but we all know that the Army Times is a leftist commie rag, eh Gunny?

 

[Gunny]

Gunny:

I don't know what sort of sorry-ass, lousy morale outfits you were in, but the times I dealt with congressional letters or request masts were few and far between. And I NEVER saw either one of those methods being used by sailors who disagreed with the foreign policy behind any particular deployment or unit mission.

I was never in a sorry-ass outfit. If you will take note, I did not say anyone DID use those particular methods to disagree with foreign policy. Only that they COULD, and the right to do so does exist.

So...barring a widespread submission of letters from soldiers and marines to their congressmen complaining that the foreign policy behind their deployment to Iraq seemed inappropriate and they would ask the good congressman to please look into it - the mere idea is really quite funny - or barring a bunch of request masts where similar hordes of soldiers and marines put in for redress of grievances that the secretary of defense was, in their opinion, executing a flawed foreign policy that, in their opinion, did not properly advance legitimate foreign policy goals and objectives for the united states - an even funnier hypothesis.... how are we to know that US military personnel do or do not enthusiastically support the president shy of asking for a show of hands as I somewhat facetiously suggested before?

And my point was: their support of the underlying foreign policy that sends them around the world is irrelevant. Doing the job and doing it well is what being a professional military person is all about. Deciding where the military goes and what they are required to do when they get there is what the suits in DC do. I think, therefore, that your assumption that the military is overwhelmingly supportive of the foreign policy goals of this administration and their execution thereof - especially when it comes to using our military assets - is unfounded. I cannot prove you wrong - (although there are polls out there that suggest less than enthusiastic support from active duty personnel) but the mere fact that congress hasn't been flooded with letters from irate servicemembers is hardly a valid bit of evidence to support your assumption....nor is the lack of coverage in the media...because...as I said.... barring a show of hands, how in the hell is the media going to really find out? Soldiers complaining to the press is certainly not an acceptable method of redressing grievances, is it?

I understood your point that whether or not military personnel agree with the mission they are carrying out is irrelevant. I did not disagree with it.

The intent of my statement from the beginning was merely to say that military personnel DO have a forum in which to express their personal grievances. Once beyond that point, any discussion of the topic from all sides is speculation unless and until it actually happens.

 

[maineman]

your point that I took issue with was:

If US military personnel did not support what we are doing in Iraq, it would be fairly common knowledge; especially, since the MSM would pounce on THAT story about as fast as they could.

I think that the Army Times poll I linked for you shows the fallacy of that statement, don't you?

 

[Gunny]

the long standing relationships and friendships I have with many former enlisted sailors who really had a great time working for me does.

I am not condescending towards former enlisted personnel because they are former enlisted and not officers.... I may appear condescending with certain self righteous conservatives who blindly support what I think is a terribly flawed foreign policy being terribly executed by a moronic president...and some of those self righteous folks happen to have been former enlisted members. Hey...like I said...I knew a hell of a lot of great sailors.... talented brilliant motivated.... I got nothing against white hats.... I just don't play real nice with folks who bullheadedly support a foreign policy that puts us at risk and who simultaneously question my patriotism and my intelligence for having that opinion.

People, former enlisted or not, are entitled to support the President and/or his foreign policy if that is what they believe to be right without having their credibility questioned for doing so. Attacking my argument because you disagree with it is one thing ... attacking my credibility as a member of the US Marine Corps because you disagree with my political opinion quite another.

I did not question your patriotism, nor your intelligence that I recall. You will find, with ONE exception, I defend the service of those that say they have served unless as in that one exception, that individual proves himself to be a fraud.

 

[Gunny]

http://www.militarycity.com/polls/2006_main.php

I realize that Army Times may not be considered "Main Stream Media", but I would suggest that this very recent poll published therein might be seen as tending to shoot holes in your assertion above.

comments?

What assertion? I don't even approve of Bush's handling of the war in regard to Iraq. I can easily see anyone actually trained in strategy and tactics not appreciating the way it's being conducted.

 

[Gunny]

a few juicy quotes from that article:

"For the first time, more troops disapprove of the president’s han dling of the war than approve of it. Barely one-third of service members approve of the way the president is handling the war, ac cording to the 2006 Military Times Poll."

"Only 35 percent of the military members polled this year said they approve of the way President Bush is handling the war, while 42 percent said they disapproved"

"Just as telling, in this year’s poll only 41 percent of the military said the U.S. should have gone to war in Iraq in the first place, down from 65 percent in 2003".

Ah.... but we all know that the Army Times is a leftist commie rag, eh Gunny?

You tell me. I don't recall ever questioning the credibility of the Army Times, nor given the current political climate, do I find those numbers that surprising.

 

[Gunny]

your point that I took issue with was:

If US military personnel did not support what we are doing in Iraq, it would be fairly common knowledge; especially, since the MSM would pounce on THAT story about as fast as they could.

I think that the Army Times poll I linked for you shows the fallacy of that statement, don't you?

Not especially. I am quite infamous for not paying attention to polls. They usually just parrot the agenda of whoever is doing the polling.

However, the statement I made is speculative, caveted by "if" and "would be."

 

[manu1959]

you'll not be too upset if I don't make life plans based upon your suggestions, will you?

Are YOU suggesting that only americans in office can make a difference? Are you suggesting that if one is not in office that they remain silent?

Do you have an valid points or are you just being a prick?

i asked a simple question....what are your qualifications?

 

[manu1959]

I always did full length tours of duty. I wonder how you think you know what sort of officer I was by reading comments on a political message board, by the way? Did you always judge the professionalism of your superior officers solely by their political affiliation? Myself, I was never one of those officers that went "by the book" to the detriment of unit cohesiveness and esprit de corps. I think that if you knew what the hell you were doing and worked hard, you would have enjoyed working for me regardless of our political differences.

it is your manners that give you away.....

 

[T-Bor]

It saddens me how the left has no problem smearing and insulting the troops. The left has very little respect for the military

Unlike the Right which has very little respect for the LIVES of our troops and especially the aftercare they get and the treatment of prisoners..etc, etc..the list goes on..

Oh one more thing. Bill Mahrs show is a comedy show. Its meant to be humorous. But I do love seeing how he titilates your testicles. That to me is even funnier. By the way, Bill Mahrs show ROCKS !!!!!!!

 

[boedicca]

I do not GROK wanting to see Bill Maher titillate RSR's testicles. Wouldn't this make the show at least R-rated?

 

[jasendorf]

^----- Troop

Not insulted.

But Maher has it wrong though. The troops don't boo because troops don't boo the Commander in Chief. It's not our place to boo him. Even if we disagree with his actions or the Administartion's actions, we do not boo. We do what we do because we love this country and serve the citizens and Constitution of this country. And, since the Constitution designates the President as the Commander in Chief of the Armed Forces, we maintain a modicum of appropriate respect for the rank. That's what we do.

 

[T-Bor]

oh come on thats a bunch of crap. There are a whole lot of people in the military because they had nowhere else to go. They did not sign up because they LOVE their country. They signed up because they needed a life. Somewhere to go and perhaps earn some respect and or a career. Some people may sign up solely because they love their country, but I doubt that their is a large percentage of those types.