Ben Gurion Speaks!

Ventura77

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Oct 11, 2017
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Ben-Gurion remarked only on the buildings, ruins, and scenery. He gave no thought to the [Palestinian] Arabs, their problems, their social conditions, or their cultural life. Nor had he yet acquainted himself with the Jewish community in Palestine [which was mostly non-Zionist Orthodox Jews prior to 1920]. In all of Palestine there were [in 1906] 700,000 inhabitants, only 55,000 of whom were Jews, and only 550 of these were [Zionists] pioneers." (Shabtai Teveth, p. 9-10)

This attitude of ignoring the political rights of the Palestinian people was (and still is) the rule among most Zionists. According to Ben-Gurion's biographer, it's not only that Palestinians were the majority in their homeland as early as 1906, it also should be noted that:

  • The majority of Palestine's Jews were not citizens of the country, but guests from Tsarist Russia.

  • The Jews in Palestinian were mostly Orthodox Jews who made up 7.8% of the total population.

  • At the time, the majority of Orthodox Jews were non-Zionist. Actually, the majority were anti-Zionist.

  • Zionist pioneers were almost absent in Palestine as of 1906, and constituted only 1% of the total Jewish population in Palestine.

Based On Declassified Israeli Documents & Personal Diaries
 
I'll take the above to mean that you're infuriated the Arab-Islamist colonists/invaders tried to impose the Islamist concept of waqf and oppress the minority population.
 
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Zion you got a lot of explaining to do.





In 1938, ben-Gurion admitted that the Zionists were the aggressors and the Palestinians the defenders; by this time he had essentially endorsed the "Iron Wall" dogma of Ze'ev Jabotinsky. Like Jabotinsky, ben-Gurion despised Arabs and their culture. By this time the Zionist leaders had the same attitude toward Arabs that Hitler had had toward Jews. Even Chaim Weizmann, in so many ways the founder of the modern state of Israel and its first president, grew disenchanted with the Zionists' fascination with militarism and their "flirtation with terror." When Weizmann retired the presidency of Israel was offered to Albert Einstein, who turned it down, writing sadly to his stepdaughter that Israeli Jews did not want to hear what he would have to tell them. Einstein, a great humanitarian, believed in equality and justice for all human beings and knew that was the last thing the Zionists had planned for Palestinians, since they had long intended to get rid of as many Arabs as possible.


Source:
Michael R. Burch, an editor and publisher of Holocaust and Nakba poetry
 
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  • Banned
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Zion you got a lot of explaining to do.





In 1938, ben-Gurion admitted that the Zionists were the aggressors and the Palestinians the defenders; by this time he had essentially endorsed the "Iron Wall" dogma of Ze'ev Jabotinsky. Like Jabotinsky, ben-Gurion despised Arabs and their culture. By this time the Zionist leaders had the same attitude toward Arabs that Hitler had had toward Jews. Even Chaim Weizmann, in so many ways the founder of the modern state of Israel and its first president, grew disenchanted with the Zionists' fascination with militarism and their "flirtation with terror." When Weizmann retired the presidency of Israel was offered to Albert Einstein, who turned it down, writing sadly to his stepdaughter that Israeli Jews did not want to hear what he would have to tell them. Einstein, a great humanitarian, believed in equality and justice for all human beings and knew that was the last thing the Zionists had planned for Palestinians, since they had long intended to get rid of as many Arabs as possible.


Source:
Michael R. Burch, an editor and publisher of Holocaust and Nakba poetry







Please note the date on the quotation above. Herzl hatched his plan for the ethnic cleansing of Palestinians and the theft of their land long before the Holocaust. Adolph Hitler was only six years old when Herzl decided to ethnically cleanse Palestinians and steal their land. Here are other pertinent confessions of the racist ringleaders of Zionism:

"There is no Zionism, colonization, or Jewish state without the EVICTION of the Arabs and the expropriation of their lands."—Prime Minister Ariel Sharon
"Zionism is a TRANSFER of the Jews."—David Ben-Gurion, Israel's first Prime Minister
Regarding the TRANSFER of the Arabs, this is much easier than any other TRANSFER."—Ben-Gurion
"The compulsory TRANSFER of the Arabs ... could give us something which we never had [even in Biblical times]."—Ben-Gurion
"Jewish power, which grows steadily, will also increase our possibilities to carry out the TRANSFER on a large scale."—Ben-Gurion
"With compulsory TRANSFER we have a vast area ... I support compulsory transfer. I don't see anything immoral in it."—Ben-Gurion
"It is impossible to imagine general EVACUATION without compulsion, and brutal compulsion."—Ben-Gurion
"There are two issues here: sovereignty and the REMOVAL of a certain number of Arabs, and we must insist on both of them."Ben-Gurion
"Let us not ignore the truth ... politically we are the aggressors and they defend themselves ... The country is theirs, because they inhabit it ..."Ben-Gurion
"Before the founding of the state ... our main interest was self-defense ... But now the issue at hand is conquest, not self-defense."Ben-Gurion
"We should prepare to go over to the offensive. Our aim is to smash Lebanon, Trans-Jordan, and Syria."Ben-Gurion
"We must do everything to ensure they [ethnically cleansed Palestinian refugees] never return."—Ben-Gurion
"Ben-Gurion ... was prepared to accept the [partition] ... on two conditions: [Jewish] sovereignty and compulsory TRANSFER."Yosef Bankover
"I believed and to this day still believe, in our people's eternal and historic right to this entire land."—Prime Minister Ehud Olmert
"All of the land of Israel is ours."—Prime Minister Yitzhak Shamir
 
Ben-Gurion remarked only on the buildings, ruins, and scenery. He gave no thought to the [Palestinian] Arabs, their problems, their social conditions, or their cultural life. Nor had he yet acquainted himself with the Jewish community in Palestine [which was mostly non-Zionist Orthodox Jews prior to 1920]. In all of Palestine there were [in 1906] 700,000 inhabitants, only 55,000 of whom were Jews, and only 550 of these were [Zionists] pioneers." (Shabtai Teveth, p. 9-10)

This attitude of ignoring the political rights of the Palestinian people was (and still is) the rule among most Zionists. According to Ben-Gurion's biographer, it's not only that Palestinians were the majority in their homeland as early as 1906, it also should be noted that:

  • The majority of Palestine's Jews were not citizens of the country, but guests from Tsarist Russia.

  • The Jews in Palestinian were mostly Orthodox Jews who made up 7.8% of the total population.

  • At the time, the majority of Orthodox Jews were non-Zionist. Actually, the majority were anti-Zionist.

  • Zionist pioneers were almost absent in Palestine as of 1906, and constituted only 1% of the total Jewish population in Palestine.

Based On Declassified Israeli Documents & Personal Diaries
Brought to you by "Palestine Remembered"? Engage internet toilet flush...

ncwonit.gif
 
Zion you got a lot of explaining to do.





In 1938, ben-Gurion admitted that the Zionists were the aggressors and the Palestinians the defenders; by this time he had essentially endorsed the "Iron Wall" dogma of Ze'ev Jabotinsky. Like Jabotinsky, ben-Gurion despised Arabs and their culture. By this time the Zionist leaders had the same attitude toward Arabs that Hitler had had toward Jews. Even Chaim Weizmann, in so many ways the founder of the modern state of Israel and its first president, grew disenchanted with the Zionists' fascination with militarism and their "flirtation with terror." When Weizmann retired the presidency of Israel was offered to Albert Einstein, who turned it down, writing sadly to his stepdaughter that Israeli Jews did not want to hear what he would have to tell them. Einstein, a great humanitarian, believed in equality and justice for all human beings and knew that was the last thing the Zionists had planned for Palestinians, since they had long intended to get rid of as many Arabs as possible.


Source:
Michael R. Burch, an editor and publisher of Holocaust and Nakba poetry







Please note the date on the quotation above. Herzl hatched his plan for the ethnic cleansing of Palestinians and the theft of their land long before the Holocaust. Adolph Hitler was only six years old when Herzl decided to ethnically cleanse Palestinians and steal their land. Here are other pertinent confessions of the racist ringleaders of Zionism:

"There is no Zionism, colonization, or Jewish state without the EVICTION of the Arabs and the expropriation of their lands."—Prime Minister Ariel Sharon
"Zionism is a TRANSFER of the Jews."—David Ben-Gurion, Israel's first Prime Minister
Regarding the TRANSFER of the Arabs, this is much easier than any other TRANSFER."—Ben-Gurion
"The compulsory TRANSFER of the Arabs ... could give us something which we never had [even in Biblical times]."—Ben-Gurion
"Jewish power, which grows steadily, will also increase our possibilities to carry out the TRANSFER on a large scale."—Ben-Gurion
"With compulsory TRANSFER we have a vast area ... I support compulsory transfer. I don't see anything immoral in it."—Ben-Gurion
"It is impossible to imagine general EVACUATION without compulsion, and brutal compulsion."—Ben-Gurion
"There are two issues here: sovereignty and the REMOVAL of a certain number of Arabs, and we must insist on both of them."Ben-Gurion
"Let us not ignore the truth ... politically we are the aggressors and they defend themselves ... The country is theirs, because they inhabit it ..."Ben-Gurion
"Before the founding of the state ... our main interest was self-defense ... But now the issue at hand is conquest, not self-defense."Ben-Gurion
"We should prepare to go over to the offensive. Our aim is to smash Lebanon, Trans-Jordan, and Syria."Ben-Gurion
"We must do everything to ensure they [ethnically cleansed Palestinian refugees] never return."—Ben-Gurion
"Ben-Gurion ... was prepared to accept the [partition] ... on two conditions: [Jewish] sovereignty and compulsory TRANSFER."Yosef Bankover
"I believed and to this day still believe, in our people's eternal and historic right to this entire land."—Prime Minister Ehud Olmert
"All of the land of Israel is ours."—Prime Minister Yitzhak Shamir
If you're going to copy and paste from that same garbage site, you have to post the link, Achmed.
 
Zion you got a lot of explaining to do.





In 1938, ben-Gurion admitted that the Zionists were the aggressors and the Palestinians the defenders; by this time he had essentially endorsed the "Iron Wall" dogma of Ze'ev Jabotinsky. Like Jabotinsky, ben-Gurion despised Arabs and their culture. By this time the Zionist leaders had the same attitude toward Arabs that Hitler had had toward Jews. Even Chaim Weizmann, in so many ways the founder of the modern state of Israel and its first president, grew disenchanted with the Zionists' fascination with militarism and their "flirtation with terror." When Weizmann retired the presidency of Israel was offered to Albert Einstein, who turned it down, writing sadly to his stepdaughter that Israeli Jews did not want to hear what he would have to tell them. Einstein, a great humanitarian, believed in equality and justice for all human beings and knew that was the last thing the Zionists had planned for Palestinians, since they had long intended to get rid of as many Arabs as possible.


Source:
Michael R. Burch, an editor and publisher of Holocaust and Nakba poetry
Nakba poetry by Achmed Ventura

Roses are red, violets are blue
I'm a schizophrenic internet jihadi propagandist, and so am I

:udaman:
 
Zion you got a lot of explaining to do.





In 1938, ben-Gurion admitted that the Zionists were the aggressors and the Palestinians the defenders; by this time he had essentially endorsed the "Iron Wall" dogma of Ze'ev Jabotinsky. Like Jabotinsky, ben-Gurion despised Arabs and their culture. By this time the Zionist leaders had the same attitude toward Arabs that Hitler had had toward Jews. Even Chaim Weizmann, in so many ways the founder of the modern state of Israel and its first president, grew disenchanted with the Zionists' fascination with militarism and their "flirtation with terror." When Weizmann retired the presidency of Israel was offered to Albert Einstein, who turned it down, writing sadly to his stepdaughter that Israeli Jews did not want to hear what he would have to tell them. Einstein, a great humanitarian, believed in equality and justice for all human beings and knew that was the last thing the Zionists had planned for Palestinians, since they had long intended to get rid of as many Arabs as possible.


Source:
Michael R. Burch, an editor and publisher of Holocaust and Nakba poetry
Nakba poetry by Achmed Ventura

Roses are red, violets are blue
I'm a schizophrenic internet jihadi propagandist, and so am I

:udaman:

Why is it Islamic Jihad in the West, mostly harms Muslims, and helps Jews?
 
Zion you got a lot of explaining to do.





In 1938, ben-Gurion admitted that the Zionists were the aggressors and the Palestinians the defenders; by this time he had essentially endorsed the "Iron Wall" dogma of Ze'ev Jabotinsky. Like Jabotinsky, ben-Gurion despised Arabs and their culture. By this time the Zionist leaders had the same attitude toward Arabs that Hitler had had toward Jews. Even Chaim Weizmann, in so many ways the founder of the modern state of Israel and its first president, grew disenchanted with the Zionists' fascination with militarism and their "flirtation with terror." When Weizmann retired the presidency of Israel was offered to Albert Einstein, who turned it down, writing sadly to his stepdaughter that Israeli Jews did not want to hear what he would have to tell them. Einstein, a great humanitarian, believed in equality and justice for all human beings and knew that was the last thing the Zionists had planned for Palestinians, since they had long intended to get rid of as many Arabs as possible.


Source:
Michael R. Burch, an editor and publisher of Holocaust and Nakba poetry

Yes, yes
Zion you got a lot of explaining to do.





In 1938, ben-Gurion admitted that the Zionists were the aggressors and the Palestinians the defenders; by this time he had essentially endorsed the "Iron Wall" dogma of Ze'ev Jabotinsky. Like Jabotinsky, ben-Gurion despised Arabs and their culture. By this time the Zionist leaders had the same attitude toward Arabs that Hitler had had toward Jews. Even Chaim Weizmann, in so many ways the founder of the modern state of Israel and its first president, grew disenchanted with the Zionists' fascination with militarism and their "flirtation with terror." When Weizmann retired the presidency of Israel was offered to Albert Einstein, who turned it down, writing sadly to his stepdaughter that Israeli Jews did not want to hear what he would have to tell them. Einstein, a great humanitarian, believed in equality and justice for all human beings and knew that was the last thing the Zionists had planned for Palestinians, since they had long intended to get rid of as many Arabs as possible.


Source:
Michael R. Burch, an editor and publisher of Holocaust and Nakba poetry
Nakba poetry by Achmed Ventura

Roses are red, violets are blue
I'm a schizophrenic internet jihadi propagandist, and so am I

:udaman:

Why is it Islamic Jihad in the West, mostly harms Muslims, and helps Jews?

Why is it that some are predisposed to conspiracy theories?
 
This attitude of ignoring the political rights of the Palestinian people was (and still is) the rule among most Zionists.

What, exactly, are the political rights of the Arab Palestinians people?
 
Zion you got a lot of explaining to do.





In 1938, ben-Gurion admitted that the Zionists were the aggressors and the Palestinians the defenders; by this time he had essentially endorsed the "Iron Wall" dogma of Ze'ev Jabotinsky. Like Jabotinsky, ben-Gurion despised Arabs and their culture. By this time the Zionist leaders had the same attitude toward Arabs that Hitler had had toward Jews. Even Chaim Weizmann, in so many ways the founder of the modern state of Israel and its first president, grew disenchanted with the Zionists' fascination with militarism and their "flirtation with terror." When Weizmann retired the presidency of Israel was offered to Albert Einstein, who turned it down, writing sadly to his stepdaughter that Israeli Jews did not want to hear what he would have to tell them. Einstein, a great humanitarian, believed in equality and justice for all human beings and knew that was the last thing the Zionists had planned for Palestinians, since they had long intended to get rid of as many Arabs as possible.


Source:
Michael R. Burch, an editor and publisher of Holocaust and Nakba poetry

Yes, yes
Zion you got a lot of explaining to do.





In 1938, ben-Gurion admitted that the Zionists were the aggressors and the Palestinians the defenders; by this time he had essentially endorsed the "Iron Wall" dogma of Ze'ev Jabotinsky. Like Jabotinsky, ben-Gurion despised Arabs and their culture. By this time the Zionist leaders had the same attitude toward Arabs that Hitler had had toward Jews. Even Chaim Weizmann, in so many ways the founder of the modern state of Israel and its first president, grew disenchanted with the Zionists' fascination with militarism and their "flirtation with terror." When Weizmann retired the presidency of Israel was offered to Albert Einstein, who turned it down, writing sadly to his stepdaughter that Israeli Jews did not want to hear what he would have to tell them. Einstein, a great humanitarian, believed in equality and justice for all human beings and knew that was the last thing the Zionists had planned for Palestinians, since they had long intended to get rid of as many Arabs as possible.


Source:
Michael R. Burch, an editor and publisher of Holocaust and Nakba poetry
Nakba poetry by Achmed Ventura

Roses are red, violets are blue
I'm a schizophrenic internet jihadi propagandist, and so am I

:udaman:

Why is it Islamic Jihad in the West, mostly harms Muslims, and helps Jews?

Why is it that some are predisposed to conspiracy theories?

Well, most of the time the perpetrators are the ones who gain some kind of advantage.
Jews gain an advantage from "Islamic terrorism" all Muslims gain is hatred, people wanting to deport them etc.
Jews gain support, sympathy, Zionists, and so forth from Islamic terrorism.
 
Zion you got a lot of explaining to do.





In 1938, ben-Gurion admitted that the Zionists were the aggressors and the Palestinians the defenders; by this time he had essentially endorsed the "Iron Wall" dogma of Ze'ev Jabotinsky. Like Jabotinsky, ben-Gurion despised Arabs and their culture. By this time the Zionist leaders had the same attitude toward Arabs that Hitler had had toward Jews. Even Chaim Weizmann, in so many ways the founder of the modern state of Israel and its first president, grew disenchanted with the Zionists' fascination with militarism and their "flirtation with terror." When Weizmann retired the presidency of Israel was offered to Albert Einstein, who turned it down, writing sadly to his stepdaughter that Israeli Jews did not want to hear what he would have to tell them. Einstein, a great humanitarian, believed in equality and justice for all human beings and knew that was the last thing the Zionists had planned for Palestinians, since they had long intended to get rid of as many Arabs as possible.


Source:
Michael R. Burch, an editor and publisher of Holocaust and Nakba poetry

Yes, yes
Zion you got a lot of explaining to do.





In 1938, ben-Gurion admitted that the Zionists were the aggressors and the Palestinians the defenders; by this time he had essentially endorsed the "Iron Wall" dogma of Ze'ev Jabotinsky. Like Jabotinsky, ben-Gurion despised Arabs and their culture. By this time the Zionist leaders had the same attitude toward Arabs that Hitler had had toward Jews. Even Chaim Weizmann, in so many ways the founder of the modern state of Israel and its first president, grew disenchanted with the Zionists' fascination with militarism and their "flirtation with terror." When Weizmann retired the presidency of Israel was offered to Albert Einstein, who turned it down, writing sadly to his stepdaughter that Israeli Jews did not want to hear what he would have to tell them. Einstein, a great humanitarian, believed in equality and justice for all human beings and knew that was the last thing the Zionists had planned for Palestinians, since they had long intended to get rid of as many Arabs as possible.


Source:
Michael R. Burch, an editor and publisher of Holocaust and Nakba poetry
Nakba poetry by Achmed Ventura

Roses are red, violets are blue
I'm a schizophrenic internet jihadi propagandist, and so am I

:udaman:

Why is it Islamic Jihad in the West, mostly harms Muslims, and helps Jews?

Why is it that some are predisposed to conspiracy theories?




The irony that you argument is with Ben Gurion appears to elude your tiny brain...
 
Zion you got a lot of explaining to do.





In 1938, ben-Gurion admitted that the Zionists were the aggressors and the Palestinians the defenders; by this time he had essentially endorsed the "Iron Wall" dogma of Ze'ev Jabotinsky. Like Jabotinsky, ben-Gurion despised Arabs and their culture. By this time the Zionist leaders had the same attitude toward Arabs that Hitler had had toward Jews. Even Chaim Weizmann, in so many ways the founder of the modern state of Israel and its first president, grew disenchanted with the Zionists' fascination with militarism and their "flirtation with terror." When Weizmann retired the presidency of Israel was offered to Albert Einstein, who turned it down, writing sadly to his stepdaughter that Israeli Jews did not want to hear what he would have to tell them. Einstein, a great humanitarian, believed in equality and justice for all human beings and knew that was the last thing the Zionists had planned for Palestinians, since they had long intended to get rid of as many Arabs as possible.


Source:
Michael R. Burch, an editor and publisher of Holocaust and Nakba poetry

Yes, yes
Zion you got a lot of explaining to do.





In 1938, ben-Gurion admitted that the Zionists were the aggressors and the Palestinians the defenders; by this time he had essentially endorsed the "Iron Wall" dogma of Ze'ev Jabotinsky. Like Jabotinsky, ben-Gurion despised Arabs and their culture. By this time the Zionist leaders had the same attitude toward Arabs that Hitler had had toward Jews. Even Chaim Weizmann, in so many ways the founder of the modern state of Israel and its first president, grew disenchanted with the Zionists' fascination with militarism and their "flirtation with terror." When Weizmann retired the presidency of Israel was offered to Albert Einstein, who turned it down, writing sadly to his stepdaughter that Israeli Jews did not want to hear what he would have to tell them. Einstein, a great humanitarian, believed in equality and justice for all human beings and knew that was the last thing the Zionists had planned for Palestinians, since they had long intended to get rid of as many Arabs as possible.


Source:
Michael R. Burch, an editor and publisher of Holocaust and Nakba poetry
Nakba poetry by Achmed Ventura

Roses are red, violets are blue
I'm a schizophrenic internet jihadi propagandist, and so am I

:udaman:

Why is it Islamic Jihad in the West, mostly harms Muslims, and helps Jews?

Why is it that some are predisposed to conspiracy theories?

Well, most of the time the perpetrators are the ones who gain some kind of advantage.
Jews gain an advantage from "Islamic terrorism" all Muslims gain is hatred, people wanting to deport them etc.
Jews gain support, sympathy, Zionists, and so forth from Islamic terrorism.

Put down the cheap vodka, comrade.
 
Zion you got a lot of explaining to do.





In 1938, ben-Gurion admitted that the Zionists were the aggressors and the Palestinians the defenders; by this time he had essentially endorsed the "Iron Wall" dogma of Ze'ev Jabotinsky. Like Jabotinsky, ben-Gurion despised Arabs and their culture. By this time the Zionist leaders had the same attitude toward Arabs that Hitler had had toward Jews. Even Chaim Weizmann, in so many ways the founder of the modern state of Israel and its first president, grew disenchanted with the Zionists' fascination with militarism and their "flirtation with terror." When Weizmann retired the presidency of Israel was offered to Albert Einstein, who turned it down, writing sadly to his stepdaughter that Israeli Jews did not want to hear what he would have to tell them. Einstein, a great humanitarian, believed in equality and justice for all human beings and knew that was the last thing the Zionists had planned for Palestinians, since they had long intended to get rid of as many Arabs as possible.


Source:
Michael R. Burch, an editor and publisher of Holocaust and Nakba poetry

Yes, yes
Zion you got a lot of explaining to do.





In 1938, ben-Gurion admitted that the Zionists were the aggressors and the Palestinians the defenders; by this time he had essentially endorsed the "Iron Wall" dogma of Ze'ev Jabotinsky. Like Jabotinsky, ben-Gurion despised Arabs and their culture. By this time the Zionist leaders had the same attitude toward Arabs that Hitler had had toward Jews. Even Chaim Weizmann, in so many ways the founder of the modern state of Israel and its first president, grew disenchanted with the Zionists' fascination with militarism and their "flirtation with terror." When Weizmann retired the presidency of Israel was offered to Albert Einstein, who turned it down, writing sadly to his stepdaughter that Israeli Jews did not want to hear what he would have to tell them. Einstein, a great humanitarian, believed in equality and justice for all human beings and knew that was the last thing the Zionists had planned for Palestinians, since they had long intended to get rid of as many Arabs as possible.


Source:
Michael R. Burch, an editor and publisher of Holocaust and Nakba poetry
Nakba poetry by Achmed Ventura

Roses are red, violets are blue
I'm a schizophrenic internet jihadi propagandist, and so am I

:udaman:

Why is it Islamic Jihad in the West, mostly harms Muslims, and helps Jews?

Why is it that some are predisposed to conspiracy theories?




The irony that you argument is with Ben Gurion appears to elude your tiny brain...

Actually, no Louie. This is another of your flame threads drenched in the frantic tirades that defines your cutting and pasting / plagiarizing from internet tabloids. I’m an observer playing the over/under on when your feverish tirades will cause you to break a nail as a part of your keyboard gee-had.
 
This attitude of ignoring the political rights of the Palestinian people was (and still is) the rule among most Zionists.

What, exactly, are the political rights of the Arab Palestinians people?



ask Ben Gurion from his memoirs and diaries princess...he's quite candid LOL

Well, if you think that the Arab Palestinians have the right to prevent the formation of a State for the Jewish people, I'd say you are mistaken. If you think the Arab Palestinians have the right to a State themselves, I would agree. (Though I might argue that they got one with Jordan).
 

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