America Behind in Math and Science

Discussion in 'Education' started by HappyPeaches, Dec 11, 2008.

  1. HappyPeaches
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    HappyPeaches Rookie

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    Hey everyone! Peachboy here again. Here ApplePi's newsletter for today. He does one every Monday and Thursday. If you want, e-mail him (apple.pi.pie@gmail.com) asking for the newsletter, and you can receive it directly.

     
    Last edited: Dec 12, 2008
  2. Southpaw
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    Southpaw Member

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    Privatize schools. Reward excellence, not bureaucracy.

    Teach the children to actually think, not just memorize for a test.
     
  3. Shogun
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    Shogun Free: Mudholes Stomped

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    provatized schools would become no better than public schools as soon as the population of students shift from public to private. It's kinda like how Apple computers don't have as many malware bugs because not as many people use them as they do Pcs.

    it's pretty rhetorical crap to suggest that kids learn to think instead of memorize by rote while imagining that staggered scale wages for "better" teachers will produce anything other than accusations of corruption while the PRODUCT of kids' education is not immediately discernible. As if these "good" teachers won't be teaching by rote while fighting over which kids will make their "success rate" appear better than everyone elses.


    hell, not to mention that teaching kids that a jewish ghost waved a magic finger in the science class will do them a lot of good in a private setting...
     
  4. Southpaw
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    Entirely wrong. Privatized schools will do better because the focus will be on the product and not the system. That's why private businesses absolutely destroy government-run businesses.

    The system will have its own difficulties, that much is certainly true.

    That being said, teachers in our schools today are hamstrung by teaching towards one test and being forced to follow regulations which mitigate their efficiency.

    How on earth does this bear any relevance to the topic at hand? Why are you bringing it up?
     
  5. Amanda
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    Amanda Calm as a Hindu cow

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    I hated math and science classes. They were boring and none of it has ever matter even a tiny bit in real life except being able to add and subtract numbers which I have been able to do since I was 6 or 7 and didn't even learn in school.

    I think there should be as much math and science as the student wants. If I'm not interested I shouldn't have had to sit through it. This would give more time and smaller class sizes for the kids that care about it.
     
  6. HappyPeaches
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    HappyPeaches Rookie

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    But privatized schools generally have better teachers than public school, so even if the population of students shifted from public to private, the teachers, who are generally better, should be able to handle the shift. If they can't, the private schools would just increase the amount of teachers per student.

    Kids will succeed more in school and life if they are taught to think on their own. It is NOT crap because if the students learn to think on their own, they will be able to apply what they know to the real world. We don't want robot kids who can only do things that are straightforward. We want them to be problem solvers that can survive the real world.

    What are you talking about?
     
  7. Shogun
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    Entirely wrong. Privatized schools will do better because the focus will be on the product and not the system. That's why private businesses absolutely destroy government-run businesses.

    private business is not a panacea and doesn't always destroy government business. I'm betting that your local police force is not a private business. Why not?

    The system will have its own difficulties, that much is certainly true.


    Inideed, and whose to say that they won't be WORSE than what we have now as millions of average kids fall between the cracks so that competitiveness amongst teachers causes more effort in advertising than education while fighting for the best crop of students? the FACT is that private schools cannot handle the capacity of all the students that public schools take on and I think you people are naieve as hell about the repercussions of your own ideas while trying to sell the concept.


    That being said, teachers in our schools today are hamstrung by teaching towards one test and being forced to follow regulations which mitigate their efficiency.


    forced by whom? No Child Left Behind wasn't created for the sake of better schools so much as it was created for the sake of the reputation of an ignorant president. You think private schools WONT have tests and likert scale multiple choice tests? Besides, You trade regulation for regulation. A difference which may not have the kind of result that you'd think.



    How on earth does this bear any relevance to the topic at hand? Why are you bringing it up?



    it's a classic motivation behind demonising public schools for the sake of private schools. This thread complains about math and science scores while your solution thus far is to thrust kids into a private environment where it's ok to teach kids that a jewish ghost is more valid than the scientific method. Ironic considering the thread title.
     
  8. editec
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    editec Mr. Forgot-it-All

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    Heads up Americans suck at history, too.

    How else can you explain the state of the nation?
     
  9. Shogun
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    But privatized schools generally have better teachers than public school, so even if the population of students shifted from public to private, the teachers, who are generally better, should be able to handle the shift. If they can't, the private schools would just increase the amount of teachers per student.

    They also have a SELECT group of students that are not at all representative of the batch that goes to public schools. Can you not fathom how transplanting kids from public schools will water down this SELECTED type of student? Private school teachers are not merely better at their jobs. They don't use some secret guarded methodology that is passed down from tenure to tenure. They use tests and Likert scale multiple choice questions too. They make students memorize too. This pipe dream reminds me of the Fair Tax people and their supposed panacea for taxes.



    Kids will succeed more in school and life if they are taught to think on their own. It is NOT crap because if the students learn to think on their own, they will be able to apply what they know to the real world. We don't want robot kids who can only do things that are straightforward. We want them to be problem solvers that can survive the real world.


    :lol: yea, dude... that rhetorical nonesense sure does sound good on paper, doesn't it?


    What are you talking about?



    see above.




    I think the both of you are failing to identify the correct problem with students these days. It's not a matter of creating a segregated education system between public and publicly funded private schools. It's a matter of motivation that can't be solved by pretending that private schools tan handle the capacity of public schools while disregarding the average kids that no teacher wants to accept because their annual evaluation depends on packing their class with the brightest students (AGAIN, selective classes just as before)



    the better solution than what you suggest is to pay the kids for THEIR performance.
     
  10. Southpaw
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    Public security is one of the few things that do fall under the government's jurisdiction, primarily because that is what the government was created to do. That whole 'defend the rights of the people' thing.

    You would need controls in place to make sure that kids weren't just shuffled off in order to help some teachers run up the numbers. That's okay. The same types of controls are in place in every single business on earth to keep individual managers from doing the same thing with their budget estimates.

    Actually, I'd prefer to trade regulation for oversight. I see a difference. I'd like the government to set high standards and reward company-run schools that meet those standards via increased contracts.


    No one is talking about religious private schools. I went to a very secular private school. It happened to be very competitive in Texas and the US. Your point is absolutely out of context. It sounds like you are just sounding off on a pet peeve because you have run out of things to say about the current topic.
     

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