Abortion = Social JUSTICE?

[Care4all]

it is not surprising that socialists see 50 million dead as a "social justics" for them it is, for everyone else it is barbarity and inhumannity

And how about the government bureaucrat who is in favor of forced abortion and sterilization:

"a. Indeed, it has been concluded that compulsory population-control laws, even including laws requiring compulsory abortion, could be sustained under the existing Constitution if the population crisis became sufficiently severe to endanger the society.

b. It would even be possible to require pregnant single women to marry or have abortions, perhaps as an alternative to placement for adoption, depending on the society.

c. Adding a sterilant to drinking water or staple foods is a suggestion that seems to horrify people more than most proposals for involuntary fertility control. Indeed, this would pose some very difficult political, legal, and social questions, to say nothing of the technical problems. No such sterilant exists today, nor does one appear to be under development. To be acceptable, such a substance would have to meet some rather stiff requirements: it must be uniformly effective, despite widely varying doses received by individuals, and despite varying degrees of fertility and sensitivity among individuals; it must be free of dangerous or unpleasant side effects; and it must have no effect on members of the opposite sex, children, old people, pets, or livestock.

Perhaps I should mention that the author of these views, John P. Holdren has these official titles: Director of the White House Office of Science and Technology Policy; Assistant to the President for Science and Technology; and Co-Chair of the President's Council of Advisors on Science and Technology. That’s right, the Obama Science Czar.

'Science Czar' John P. Holdren's disturbing beliefs about America, capitalism and humanity

Perhaps it's just me being cynical, but I read the 3 points noted above as statements regarding legality and feasibility, not as recommendations.

The article is written by a Conservative mouthpiece, so perhaps not surprising that it's critical of him.

All the dates in the article seem to reference writings from 30 or more years ago.

I have no idea whether he favors the practices described or not, but as usual with politically motivated stories perhaps there is more to this than initially meets the eye.

I here now nominate, Tigerbob, as the Boards Most Level Headed Poster!

 

[tigerbob]

That was a popular stance among Republicans for years, remember?

http://www.usmessageboard.com/the-flame-zone/73750-republicans-population-control-and-abortion.html

My bad - found it.

 

[Valerie]

And how about the government bureaucrat who is in favor of forced abortion and sterilization:

"a. Indeed, it has been concluded that compulsory population-control laws, even including laws requiring compulsory abortion, could be sustained under the existing Constitution if the population crisis became sufficiently severe to endanger the society.

b. It would even be possible to require pregnant single women to marry or have abortions, perhaps as an alternative to placement for adoption, depending on the society.

c. Adding a sterilant to drinking water or staple foods is a suggestion that seems to horrify people more than most proposals for involuntary fertility control. Indeed, this would pose some very difficult political, legal, and social questions, to say nothing of the technical problems. No such sterilant exists today, nor does one appear to be under development. To be acceptable, such a substance would have to meet some rather stiff requirements: it must be uniformly effective, despite widely varying doses received by individuals, and despite varying degrees of fertility and sensitivity among individuals; it must be free of dangerous or unpleasant side effects; and it must have no effect on members of the opposite sex, children, old people, pets, or livestock.

Perhaps I should mention that the author of these views, John P. Holdren has these official titles: Director of the White House Office of Science and Technology Policy; Assistant to the President for Science and Technology; and Co-Chair of the President's Council of Advisors on Science and Technology. That’s right, the Obama Science Czar.

'Science Czar' John P. Holdren's disturbing beliefs about America, capitalism and humanity

Perhaps it's just me being cynical, but I read the 3 points noted above as statements regarding legality and feasibility, not as recommendations.

The article is written by a Conservative mouthpiece, so perhaps not surprising that it's critical of him.

All the dates in the article seem to reference writings from 30 or more years ago.

I have no idea whether he favors the practices described or not, but as usual with politically motivated stories perhaps there is more to this than initially meets the eye.

I here now nominate, Tigerbob, as the Boards Most Level Headed Poster!

Seconded! Isn't he great!?


You too, of course!

 

[tigerbob]

That was a popular stance among Republicans for years, remember?

http://www.usmessageboard.com/the-flame-zone/73750-republicans-population-control-and-abortion.html

Oh, my bad again. I thought you'd posted something factual, but it was a link to the Flame Zone.

 

[Care4all]

fail

Tissue? You can deny it all you want but conservatives were very into population control before they were infiltrated by the religious right. It's very amusing, really.

That's news to me.

I'd be happy to read up on this if you can provide anything to back it up. Thanks.

Well, if teaching about birth control is eugenetics as some claim, then Ambassador George H W Bush being sent to China by Nixon, with the goal of getting them to reduce their population growth and extending our birth control knowledge to them along with paying for the birth control pills they needed to start the program, which eventually lead to their program of today which forces abortion upon all women that already have one child....then....yeah, republicans had a major role in eugenetics, population control....primarily of unliked nations....

That is, if you think that birth control pills is support of eugenetics as some seem to, on this board?

I posted a link right after ravi's post on that showing that Prescott Bush, was the Treasurer for Margaret Sangers first fund raiser...

The thing is, after reading a little bit about her, I think that Prescott Bush supporting her movement was the right thing to do, if he did it for the reasons that she wanted to do it...but I am not so certain this is the case....?

 

[tigerbob]

Yes, blatant eugenetics were at play with the Republicans as well....they supported planned parenthood...for the purpose of reducing pregnancies in the Black communities.

http://www.randomhouse.com/doubleday/thefamily/media/thefamily_document007a.pdf


Prescott S. Bush as Treasurer of Planned Parenthood First National Fundrasing Drive—1947

Planned Parenthood fundraising letter of January 8, 1947, lists Prescott S. Bush as treasurer of Margaret Sanger's first national fundraising drive. At that time, contraception was against the law in Connecticut, and the state had a large Catholic constituency. In 1950, during Prescott's first race for the U.S. Senate, the syndicated columnist Drew Pearson accused Bush of being a member of Planned Parenthood. Bush lost and accused Pearson of spreading the lie that cost him elected office. This fund-raising letter proved Pearson right.

Bush was treasurer of Planned Parenthood, therefore Republicans were in favor of eugenics.

I'm paraphrasing for clarity but is that what you're saying? If so, it's a pretty extreme example of weak inductive reasoning.

 

[tigerbob]

Tissue? You can deny it all you want but conservatives were very into population control before they were infiltrated by the religious right. It's very amusing, really.

That's news to me.

I'd be happy to read up on this if you can provide anything to back it up. Thanks.

Well, if teaching about birth control is eugenetics as some claim, then Ambassador George H W Bush being sent to China by Nixon, with the goal of getting them to reduce their population growth and extending our birth control knowledge to them along with paying for the birth control pills they needed to start the program, which eventually lead to their program of today which forces abortion upon all women that already have one child....then....yeah, republicans had a major role in eugenetics, population control....primarily of unliked nations....

That is, if you think that birth control pills is support of eugenetics as some seem to, on this board?

I posted a link right after ravi's post on that showing that Prescott Bush, was the Treasurer for Margaret Sangers first fund raiser...

The thing is, after reading a little bit about her, I think that Prescott Bush supporting her movement was the right thing to do, if he did it for the reasons that she wanted to do it...but I am not so certain this is the case....?

Yep - just read that (I finally caught up with the thread).

 

[JBeukema]

Why is it that stupid people use 'eugenics' like it's a bad word?

Oh wait, they do that with lots of good ideas, like 'socialism' that threaten to upset the status quo...

 

[Ravi]

Why is it that stupid people use 'eugenics' like it's a bad word?

Oh wait, they do that with lots of good ideas, like 'socialism' that threaten to upset the status quo...

Population control is a form of eugenics. Why isn't Sanger your hero?

 

[JBeukema]

If ravi were smart lol she would notice that I have yet to praise or condemn Sanger's desire to see certain groups wipe themselves out; in fact, I have given no opinion on the matter

 

[Ravi]

Ah, I didn't realize you were a fan of the third reich. Cool.

 

[JBeukema]

So now, ravi, true gto her character and seeing herself with no intelligent response, seeks merely to characterize JB and attach to him a label deemed undesirable.

I am neither a German nationalist nor a socialist.

 

[Ravi]

So now, ravi, true gto her character and seeing herself with no intelligent response, seeks merely to characterize JB and attach to him a label deemed undesirable.

I am neither a German nationalist nor a socialist.

And yet you liken Sanger to the third reich...while pretending you haven't given an opinion of approval or disapproval of her methods.

Need a shovel?

 

[AllieBaba]

Good grief, Ravi, if he supports abortion and is a proponent of eugenics, he supports the same b.s. you do. Only he's less hysterical about it.

 

[Ravi]

Good grief, Ravi, if he supports abortion and is a proponent of eugenics, he supports the same b.s. you do. Only he's less hysterical about it.

The funny thing is, Babble, is that you are the one that supports eugenics since you've expressed over and over that women don't have a right to choose when to reproduce. I, on the other hand, support the exact opposite.

 

[JBeukema]

Good grief, Ravi, if he supports abortion and is a proponent of eugenics, he supports the same b.s. you do. Only he's less hysterical about it.

You might want to give the abortion threads a once-over.. I am not a proponent of abortion save for medical emergencies, as you might recall.

Good grief, Ravi, if he supports abortion and is a proponent of eugenics, he supports the same b.s. you do. Only he's less hysterical about it.

The funny thing is, Babble, is that you are the one that supports eugenics since you've expressed over and over that women don't have a right to choose when to reproduce. I, on the other hand, support the exact opposite.

Are you always this stupid, or do you just play a moron in the internet?

 

[Care4all]

I'd bet that NOT ONE female that has gotten an abortion or who is considering one, EVER THOUGHT that she was having an abortion to support the political movement of Population Control...

 

[JBeukema]

I'd bet that NOT ONE female that has gotten an abortion or who is considering one, EVER THOUGHT that she was having an abortion to support the political movement of Population Control...

You're called 'useful idiots' for a reason...

 

[Anguille]

..you gotta have someone to HATE, ya know?

Isn't that the sad truth!!!

And not just concerning the question of women's rights, a lot of people just have to have someone or some group of people to hate. It's as if they've got a hate virus or something! Maybe it's congenital. Maybe it's how they were brought up. In any case, it means any debate with then will just end up at a deadend because it's not the issue and what's right or wrong that concerns them, it's having a target at which to aim their vitriol that is most important to them.

 

[Valerie]

I'd bet that NOT ONE female that has gotten an abortion or who is considering one, EVER THOUGHT that she was having an abortion to support the political movement of Population Control...

You're called 'useful idiots' for a reason...

Sure, because our planet is in grave danger of being underpopulated?