75 years ago The Battle of Midway raged

[IsaacNewton]

After the attack on Pearl Harbor December 7, 1941 the US was ill-prepared for war. In the next six months the US and its allies Britain, Russia, and Australia were losing on all fronts. Needing SOMETHING good to happen the US on April 18, 1942 launched the Dolittle Raid on Japan, sending 16 B-25 medium range bombers launched from aircraft carriers that had sailed to within 700 miles east of Japan. They bombed Tokyo and a number of other Japanese cities. Minimal damage strategically but a huge boost to moral for America and its allies.

Two weeks later, May 4-8, 1942, the first major battle between Japan and the US took place in The Coral Sea northeast of Australia. US intelligence learned the Japanese were sending an invasion force to Port Moresby, north of Australia. Two US aircraft carriers were sent to thwart the invasion and they caught the light Japanese carrier Shoho and sank it. Two large Japanese carriers, the Shokaku and the Zuikaku, both of which were in the six carrier fleet that attacked Pearl Harbor, were in position near Guadalcanal to support the Port Moresby invasion and deal with any US carriers that showed up. They steamed southwest after learning US carriers were operating in the area. The two forces discovered each other and the attacks resulted in the Shokaku being severely damaged and out of commission, the Zuikaku losing most of its aircraft. The US lost the Lexington and the Yorktown was severely damaged as well. However the Japanese invasion fleet had turned around and it was a strategic victory for the US, though tactically a draw or slight advantage to the Japanese.

The Australians didn't call it the Battle of the Coral Sea. They called it The Battle of Australia because if the Japanese had won Australia would have been cut off from its supply lines to the US and it would have been isolated.

The Japanese decided the US carriers had to be dealt with and they planned the Midway invasion for the beginning of June 1942. US intelligence intercepted various encrypted Japanese navy communications and determined Midway was the target. A US carrier Task Force of the Enterprise and the Hornet sailed to a spot northeast of Midway Island which is about 1,300 miles northwest of Hawaii. They were joined a few days later by the Yorktown which had steamed from it's battle in the Coral Sea to get much needed and frantic repair at Pearl Harbor before joining the Hornet and Enterprise. Now with three large carriers the US fleet waited for the Japanese to show up.

The Japanese, unaware of the presence of the US carriers, attacked Midway Island. The US carriers launched a massive air attack against the four Japanese carriers, all of which had been part of the attack on Pearl Harbor, sinking three of them outright in about ten minutes of fighting. The IJN carrier Hiryu still operational attacked and severely damaged the Yorktown. US scouts found the Hiryu and it was sunk. Over the next few days the US fleet chased and sank or damaged a number of other Japanese ships. The Yorktown was torpedoed by a Jap sub and sank.

The losses for Japan were irreplaceable. Of the six front-line carriers Japan had four were now sunk, one was badly damaged and needed months of repairs. The US had lost the Yorktown and Lexington. As US industry was double the size of Japan the US could replace every ship it lost. Japan could not. By the end of the war the US had 25 large aircraft carriers and 75 smaller carriers.

The Battle of Midway was without question the turning point in the war in the pacific and in essence the end of Japan's conquests. I met one of the SBD (dive bomber) tail gunners on the Hornet in Alameda a few years ago and he had some great first hand accounts of what he saw.

All of this took place in a month and a half. Not a bad bit of work for a bunch of twenty year olds.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Tomorrow marks the invasion of Normandy, d-day.

 

[Billo_Really]

And the reason we won that battle was because of the Navy's left wing.

 

[Billo_Really]

Tomorrow marks the invasion of Normandy, d-day.

And just this last week was the anniversary of the attack on the USS Liberty.

 

[IsaacNewton]

Either stay on topic or retire to the Flame Zone.

 

[Sunni Man]

Before the battle of Midway, all the Japanese did was advance.

After Midway, all they did was retreat. .....

 

[williepete]

After the attack on Pearl Harbor December 7, 1941 the US was ill-prepared for war. In the next six months the US and its allies Britain, Russia, and Australia were losing on all fronts. Needing SOMETHING good to happen the US on April 18, 1942 launched the Dolittle Raid on Japan, sending 16 B-25 medium range bombers launched from aircraft carriers that had sailed to within 700 miles east of Japan. They bombed Tokyo and a number of other Japanese cities. Minimal damage strategically but a huge boost to moral for America and its allies.

Two weeks later, May 4-8, 1942, the first major battle between Japan and the US took place in The Coral Sea northeast of Australia. US intelligence learned the Japanese were sending an invasion force to Port Moresby, north of Australia. Two US aircraft carriers were sent to thwart the invasion and they caught the light Japanese carrier Shoho and sank it. Two large Japanese carriers, the Shokaku and the Zuikaku, both of which were in the six carrier fleet that attacked Pearl Harbor, were in position near Guadalcanal to support the Port Moresby invasion and deal with any US carriers that showed up. They steamed southwest after learning US carriers were operating in the area. The two forces discovered each other and the attacks resulted in the Shokaku being severely damaged and out of commission, the Zuikaku losing most of its aircraft. The US lost the Lexington and the Yorktown was severely damaged as well. However the Japanese invasion fleet had turned around and it was a strategic victory for the US, though tactically a draw or slight advantage to the Japanese.

The Australians didn't call it the Battle of the Coral Sea. They called it The Battle of Australia because if the Japanese had won Australia would have been cut off from its supply lines to the US and it would have been isolated.

The Japanese decided the US carriers had to be dealt with and they planned the Midway invasion for the beginning of June 1942. US intelligence intercepted varoius encrypted Japanese navy communications and determined Midway was the target. A US carrier Task Force of the Enterprise and the Hornet sailed to a spot northeast of Midway Island which is about 1,300 miles northwest of Hawaii. They were joined a few days later by the Yorktown which had steamed from it's battle in the Coral Sea to get much needed and frantic repair at Pearl Harbor before joining the Hornet and Enterprise. Now with three large carriers the US fleet waited for the Japanese to show up.

The Japanese, unaware of the presence of the US carriers, attacked Midway Island. The US carriers launched a massive air attack against the four Japanese carriers, all of which had been part of the attack on Pearl Harbor, sinking three of them outright in about ten minutes of fighting. The IJN carrier Hiryu still operational attacked and severely damaged the Yorktown. US scouts found the Hiryu and it was sunk. Over the next few days the US fleet chased and sank or damaged a number of other Japanese ships. The Yorktown was torpedoed by a Jap sub and sank.

The losses for Japan were irreplaceable. Of the six front-line carriers Japan had four were now sunk, one was badly damaged and needed months of repairs. The US had lost the Yorktown and Lexington. As US industry was double the size of Japan the US could replace every ship it lost. Japan could not. By the end of the war the US had 25 large aircraft carriers and 75 smaller carriers.

The Battle of Midway was without question the turning point in the war in the pacific and in essence the end of Japan's conquests. I met one of the SBD (dive bomber) tail gunners on the Hornet in Alameda a few years ago and he had some great first hand accounts of what he saw.

All of this took place in a month and a half. Not a bad bit of work for a bunch of twenty year olds.

Excellent post. So many lessons to be learned from these battles. Would have loved to have shared your conversation with the SBD tail gunner. Those guys had big brass ones. The role of breaking the Imperial Japanese Naval code cannot be understated.

From a pilot's perspective, I've always found it interesting how the Americans put so much value on cycling experienced combat pilots back to the training squadrons to pass on the valuable and perishable lessons learned in combat. Due to shortages, the Japanese and Germans were unable to do so. Their best and brightest died in harness unable to pass on those little, vital combat tips that meant the difference between surviving first combat or not. We learned after the Korean war that once a pilot had around 12-15 combat missions under his belt, his chances of survival skyrocketed. Newbies died wholesale. Thus, we have Red Flag exercises to give pilots their simulated first dozen combat sorties.

After Midway, the cream of the Imperial Japanese Navy pilots were wiped out. The few that remained could not be spared for the training squadrons. Replacement pilots delivered to the fleet showed up with an appallingly lower experience level than American replacement pilots--both in flight time and the critical instruction from combat experienced flight instructors.

The Battle of the Philippine Sea in June 1944, better known as “the great Marianas turkey shoot” was a prime example of this failure in training. The Japanese were simply sending young pilots out to be slaughtered.

From the Battlefield series:

 

[gipper]

After the attack on Pearl Harbor December 7, 1941 the US was ill-prepared for war. In the next six months the US and its allies Britain, Russia, and Australia were losing on all fronts. Needing SOMETHING good to happen the US on April 18, 1942 launched the Dolittle Raid on Japan, sending 16 B-25 medium range bombers launched from aircraft carriers that had sailed to within 700 miles east of Japan. They bombed Tokyo and a number of other Japanese cities. Minimal damage strategically but a huge boost to moral for America and its allies.

Two weeks later, May 4-8, 1942, the first major battle between Japan and the US took place in The Coral Sea northeast of Australia. US intelligence learned the Japanese were sending an invasion force to Port Moresby, north of Australia. Two US aircraft carriers were sent to thwart the invasion and they caught the light Japanese carrier Shoho and sank it. Two large Japanese carriers, the Shokaku and the Zuikaku, both of which were in the six carrier fleet that attacked Pearl Harbor, were in position near Guadalcanal to support the Port Moresby invasion and deal with any US carriers that showed up. They steamed southwest after learning US carriers were operating in the area. The two forces discovered each other and the attacks resulted in the Shokaku being severely damaged and out of commission, the Zuikaku losing most of its aircraft. The US lost the Lexington and the Yorktown was severely damaged as well. However the Japanese invasion fleet had turned around and it was a strategic victory for the US, though tactically a draw or slight advantage to the Japanese.

The Australians didn't call it the Battle of the Coral Sea. They called it The Battle of Australia because if the Japanese had won Australia would have been cut off from its supply lines to the US and it would have been isolated.

The Japanese decided the US carriers had to be dealt with and they planned the Midway invasion for the beginning of June 1942. US intelligence intercepted varoius encrypted Japanese navy communications and determined Midway was the target. A US carrier Task Force of the Enterprise and the Hornet sailed to a spot northeast of Midway Island which is about 1,300 miles northwest of Hawaii. They were joined a few days later by the Yorktown which had steamed from it's battle in the Coral Sea to get much needed and frantic repair at Pearl Harbor before joining the Hornet and Enterprise. Now with three large carriers the US fleet waited for the Japanese to show up.

The Japanese, unaware of the presence of the US carriers, attacked Midway Island. The US carriers launched a massive air attack against the four Japanese carriers, all of which had been part of the attack on Pearl Harbor, sinking three of them outright in about ten minutes of fighting. The IJN carrier Hiryu still operational attacked and severely damaged the Yorktown. US scouts found the Hiryu and it was sunk. Over the next few days the US fleet chased and sank or damaged a number of other Japanese ships. The Yorktown was torpedoed by a Jap sub and sank.

The losses for Japan were irreplaceable. Of the six front-line carriers Japan had four were now sunk, one was badly damaged and needed months of repairs. The US had lost the Yorktown and Lexington. As US industry was double the size of Japan the US could replace every ship it lost. Japan could not. By the end of the war the US had 25 large aircraft carriers and 75 smaller carriers.

The Battle of Midway was without question the turning point in the war in the pacific and in essence the end of Japan's conquests. I met one of the SBD (dive bomber) tail gunners on the Hornet in Alameda a few years ago and he had some great first hand accounts of what he saw.

All of this took place in a month and a half. Not a bad bit of work for a bunch of twenty year olds.

Excellent post. So many lessons to be learned from these battles. Would have loved to have shared your conversation with the SBD tail gunner. Those guys had big brass ones. The role of breaking the Imperial Japanese Naval code cannot be understated.

From a pilot's perspective, I've always found it interesting how the Americans put so much value on cycling experienced combat pilots back to the training squadrons to pass on the valuable and perishable lessons learned in combat. Due to shortages, the Japanese and Germans were unable to do so. Their best and brightest died in harness unable to pass on those little, vital combat tips that meant the difference between surviving first combat or not. We learned after the Korean war that once a pilot had around 12-15 combat missions under his belt, his chances of survival skyrocketed. Newbies died wholesale. Thus, we have Red Flag exercises to give pilots their simulated first dozen combat sorties.

After Midway, the cream of the Imperial Japanese Navy pilots were wiped out. The few that remained could not be spared for the training squadrons. Replacement pilots delivered to the fleet showed up with an appallingly lower experience level than American replacement pilots--both in flight time and the critical instruction from combat experienced flight instructors.

The Battle of the Philippine Sea in June 1944, better known as “the great Marianas turkey shoot” was a prime example of this failure in training. The Japanese were simply sending young pilots out to be slaughtered.

From the Battlefield series:

War is ALWAYS the health of the state. So, fuck that.

 

[IsaacNewton]

After the attack on Pearl Harbor December 7, 1941 the US was ill-prepared for war. In the next six months the US and its allies Britain, Russia, and Australia were losing on all fronts. Needing SOMETHING good to happen the US on April 18, 1942 launched the Dolittle Raid on Japan, sending 16 B-25 medium range bombers launched from aircraft carriers that had sailed to within 700 miles east of Japan. They bombed Tokyo and a number of other Japanese cities. Minimal damage strategically but a huge boost to moral for America and its allies.

Two weeks later, May 4-8, 1942, the first major battle between Japan and the US took place in The Coral Sea northeast of Australia. US intelligence learned the Japanese were sending an invasion force to Port Moresby, north of Australia. Two US aircraft carriers were sent to thwart the invasion and they caught the light Japanese carrier Shoho and sank it. Two large Japanese carriers, the Shokaku and the Zuikaku, both of which were in the six carrier fleet that attacked Pearl Harbor, were in position near Guadalcanal to support the Port Moresby invasion and deal with any US carriers that showed up. They steamed southwest after learning US carriers were operating in the area. The two forces discovered each other and the attacks resulted in the Shokaku being severely damaged and out of commission, the Zuikaku losing most of its aircraft. The US lost the Lexington and the Yorktown was severely damaged as well. However the Japanese invasion fleet had turned around and it was a strategic victory for the US, though tactically a draw or slight advantage to the Japanese.

The Australians didn't call it the Battle of the Coral Sea. They called it The Battle of Australia because if the Japanese had won Australia would have been cut off from its supply lines to the US and it would have been isolated.

The Japanese decided the US carriers had to be dealt with and they planned the Midway invasion for the beginning of June 1942. US intelligence intercepted varoius encrypted Japanese navy communications and determined Midway was the target. A US carrier Task Force of the Enterprise and the Hornet sailed to a spot northeast of Midway Island which is about 1,300 miles northwest of Hawaii. They were joined a few days later by the Yorktown which had steamed from it's battle in the Coral Sea to get much needed and frantic repair at Pearl Harbor before joining the Hornet and Enterprise. Now with three large carriers the US fleet waited for the Japanese to show up.

The Japanese, unaware of the presence of the US carriers, attacked Midway Island. The US carriers launched a massive air attack against the four Japanese carriers, all of which had been part of the attack on Pearl Harbor, sinking three of them outright in about ten minutes of fighting. The IJN carrier Hiryu still operational attacked and severely damaged the Yorktown. US scouts found the Hiryu and it was sunk. Over the next few days the US fleet chased and sank or damaged a number of other Japanese ships. The Yorktown was torpedoed by a Jap sub and sank.

The losses for Japan were irreplaceable. Of the six front-line carriers Japan had four were now sunk, one was badly damaged and needed months of repairs. The US had lost the Yorktown and Lexington. As US industry was double the size of Japan the US could replace every ship it lost. Japan could not. By the end of the war the US had 25 large aircraft carriers and 75 smaller carriers.

The Battle of Midway was without question the turning point in the war in the pacific and in essence the end of Japan's conquests. I met one of the SBD (dive bomber) tail gunners on the Hornet in Alameda a few years ago and he had some great first hand accounts of what he saw.

All of this took place in a month and a half. Not a bad bit of work for a bunch of twenty year olds.

Excellent post. So many lessons to be learned from these battles. Would have loved to have shared your conversation with the SBD tail gunner. Those guys had big brass ones. The role of breaking the Imperial Japanese Naval code cannot be understated.

From a pilot's perspective, I've always found it interesting how the Americans put so much value on cycling experienced combat pilots back to the training squadrons to pass on the valuable and perishable lessons learned in combat. Due to shortages, the Japanese and Germans were unable to do so. Their best and brightest died in harness unable to pass on those little, vital combat tips that meant the difference between surviving first combat or not. We learned after the Korean war that once a pilot had around 12-15 combat missions under his belt, his chances of survival skyrocketed. Newbies died wholesale. Thus, we have Red Flag exercises to give pilots their simulated first dozen combat sorties.

After Midway, the cream of the Imperial Japanese Navy pilots were wiped out. The few that remained could not be spared for the training squadrons. Replacement pilots delivered to the fleet showed up with an appallingly lower experience level than American replacement pilots--both in flight time and the critical instruction from combat experienced flight instructors.

The Battle of the Philippine Sea in June 1944, better known as “the great Marianas turkey shoot” was a prime example of this failure in training. The Japanese were simply sending young pilots out to be slaughtered.

From the Battlefield series:

Good points on the pilot experience. The US put great importance on training and preserving the lives of pilots. US aircraft were built to take damage and return the pilot safely to his base. The Japanese doctrine on aircraft was entirely different. They viewed air combat as Samurai view combat. No weakness, always on attack. As a result the Japanese Zero was built like a flying paper kite. It was nearly half the weight of the US F4F Wildcat which gave the Zero excellent speed, climb ability, long range, and superb aerial combat maneuverability. It was the premier fighter aircraft at the beginning of the war. However they were very easy to shoot down if a US pilot could get a firing solution. A few shots at the wing root, where the wing attaches to the fuselage, and many times the wing would snap off. The Zero also did not have self-sealing fuel tanks which most US planes had. Incendiary rounds that penetrated a wing fuel tank quickly ignited the fuel.

Many US aircraft came back badly shot up but still flying. The experienced pilots able to fly again as you noted. In addition US pilots had standing ordres, 'Aviate, navigate, communicate, and if all else fails win the war'. Individuals were given the leeway to act on their own initiative if battle plans fell apart. The Japanese operated more like an ant colony. Individual initiative was not highly thought of.

 

[williepete]

As a result the Japanese Zero was built like a flying paper kite.

Very true. The development of the Zero is a fascinating story on its own. Until we got our hands on a nearly intact Zero that crashed in Akutan, we had no idea how flimsy it was. Repairing and flying that Zero opened up to us all her strengths and weaknesses. Much of this knowledge was poured into Grumman's development of the Hellcat. Until the Hellcat was delivered, U.S. pilots were taught to exploit their strengths and avoid the Zero's strengths.

The Akutan Zero: How a Captured Japanese Fighter Plane Helped Win World War II - History in the Headlines