Zelensky says war will 'end sooner' with Trump as president

[Deadstick]

So if we have "the Coup" in America it's suddenly ok for Russia to go annex Alaska?

Do you not understand that you are posting complete nonsense?

Nothing about happenings in Kiev entitled Russians to go take over Crimea and other Ukranian territories. Ukranian army fighting back to regain control of the country was completely apropriate and justified.

You are the one talking nonsense, like i said the US instigated Coup started the ball rolling, simple as that,everything that's happened since comes from that coup in 2014, if there had been no coup and Ukraine had not gone all Bandera are you telling me Russia would have taken Crimea and invaded Ukraine anyway?

 

[AntonToo]

You are the one talking nonsense, like i said the US instigated Coup started the ball rolling, simple as that,everything that's happened since comes from that coup in 2014, if there had been no coup and Ukraine had not gone all Bandera are you telling me Russia would have taken Crimea and invaded Ukraine anyway?

I'm telling you that Putin couldn't ever come to terms with Ukrane as a sovereign country. He said straight up in his 2022 full scale invasion menifesto - "Ukraine is not a real country".

His oversized imperialist ego couldn't stand Ukrane rejecting his little corrupt Russian world and going the way of EU. And he knew that if Ukranians ever start living better than Russians his cleptocratic regime's days are numbered.

Kremlin pressured Yanukovich all they could and he finally cracked, took the bribe, abandoned his campaign promises and refused to sign EU agreement. Yanukovich then failed to violetly supress the ensuing protests and Putin saw that his days of being able to subvert Ukraine are over - thats when his little green men rolled into Crimean parlament, followed by hybrid warfare in the eastern Ukraine, followed by full scale invasion in 2022.

Ukranians fought for their rights, for their freedom, for their democracy, for their country and if you can't tell who is on the right side of history in this conflict then you really don't know right from wrong and up from down.

 

[BULLDOG]

You seem fixated on the whole one-day thing. Like I said, be sure to give out the sour grapes after it's over and peace comes again. You'll be a hero.

Fixated or just taking him at his word? MAGAs are willing to just ignore some of the crazier claims but others expect him to actually do what he says.

 

[Deadstick]

I'm telling you that Putin couldn't ever come to terms with Ukrane as a sovereign country.

His oversized imperialist ego couldn't stand Ukrane rejecting his little corrupt Russian world and going the way of EU. And he knew that if Ukranians ever start living better than Russians his cleptocratic regime's days are numbered.

Kremlin pressured Yanukovich all they could and he finally cracked, took the bribe, abandoned his campaign promises and refused to sign EU agreement. Yanukovich then failed to violetly supress the ensuing protests and Putin knew that his days of being able to subvert Ukraine are over - thats when his little green men rolled into Crimean parlament, followed by hybrid warfare in the eastern Ukraine.

Ukranians fought for their rights, for their freedom, for their democracy, for their country and if you, as a westerner can't tell who is on the right side of history in this conflict then you really don't know up from down.

You are on the wrong side of history, it's late here now and i need my sleep, but i leave you with one question, if there had not been a coup in Ukraine would Russia have invaded?

 

[AntonToo]

You are on the wrong side of history, it's late here now and i need my sleep, but i leave you with one question, if there had not been a coup in Ukraine would Russia have invaded?

...read my post again, because your response doesn't seem to show that you understood it.

Putin's inability to accept a sovereign Ukraine is at the core of the conflict.

If Ukraine would turn into another repressive craphole satellite state in Russia's sphere like Belarus, then no, he would not invade. Does that in any way justify his bloody invasions and land grabs? **** no, it's still exactly same lawless barbarianism.

 

[hadit]

Fixated or just taking him at his word? MAGAs are willing to just ignore some of the crazier claims but others expect him to actually do what he says.

Then when he does, they run around with their hair on fire. Tell us, do you hold ALL politicians to that exacting standard or just TRUMP!?

 

[BULLDOG]

Then when he does, they run around with their hair on fire. Tell us, do you hold ALL politicians to that exacting standard or just TRUMP!?

That depends on the politician and their reputation for saying stupid stuff and then trying to carry through with it. Almost anybody can slip up and make a dumb remark, but for most it is just something poorly stated with no chance of actually being enacted. With trump, the dumber the remark, the more likely he is to actually try to enact it.

 

[hadit]

That depends on the politician and their reputation for saying stupid stuff and then trying to carry through with it. Almost anybody can slip up and make a dumb remark, but for most it is just something poorly stated with no chance of actually being enacted. With trump, the dumber the remark, the more likely he is to actually try to enact it.

So, he's damned because he actually tries to do what he says he's going to do? That's what it sounds like you're saying.

 

[BULLDOG]

So, he's damned because he actually tries to do what he says he's going to do? That's what it sounds like you're saying.

He's not damned because he means what he says. He's damned because he says and means such stupid stuff.

 

[AntonToo]

there was also the agreement between the Maidan leaders and Ynukovych to end the violence see text in the link, that agreement gave almost everything the Maidan mob wanted there was to be a Government of National unity and new elections no later than December that year, it was about two days later the Nazi hotheads of right sector stormed Government buildings, they didn't want any election because they may have lost

Just to specifically address this bullshit - Yanukovich specifically refused to sign final agreement:

[Within] 48 hours of signing the agreement with the opposition, [Yanukovich] failed to sign the law on the renewal of the Constitution of Ukraine as amended on December 8, 2004, which had been adopted by the Verkhovna Rada. By doing so, he effectively disavowed his signature on the Agreement, rendering it legally null and void.

Янукович сам лишил себя легитимности, но формально сохраняет звание президента, отмечает профессор права Мусияка

Виктор Янукович формально сохраняет за собой звание президента Украины, поскольку оно "охраняется законом и сохраняется за ним навечно, если только президент Украины не был смещен с поста в порядке импичмента (ч.

interfax.com.ua

Thats not "Nazi hotheads" doing something, this is Yanukovich, who was taken by Russian forces to Russia already and could not possibly be physically threatened by any one in Ukraine, refusing to sign documents - an unconstitutional act.

 

[Deadstick]

Just to specifically address this bullshit - Yanukovich specifically refused to sign final agreement:

[Within] 48 hours of signing the agreement with the opposition, [Yanukovich] failed to sign the law on the renewal of the Constitution of Ukraine as amended on December 8, 2004, which had been adopted by the Verkhovna Rada. By doing so, he effectively disavowed his signature on the Agreement, rendering it legally null and void.

Янукович сам лишил себя легитимности, но формально сохраняет звание президента, отмечает профессор права Мусияка

Виктор Янукович формально сохраняет за собой звание президента Украины, поскольку оно "охраняется законом и сохраняется за ним навечно, если только президент Украины не был смещен с поста в порядке импичмента (ч.

interfax.com.ua

Thats not "Nazi hotheads" doing something, this is Yanukovich, who was taken by Russian forces to Russia already and could not possibly be physically threatened by any one in Ukraine, refusing to sign documents - an unconstitutional act.

It was signed on the 21 of February 2014, you people just can't stop lying the Western MSM can't stop lying they have lied about everything for decades, the Vietnam war was started on a lie and they have been doing it ever since they have lied so many times they don't know they are doing it, here is an example, no wonder your brain has been turned to a blob.

 

[AntonToo]

It was signed on the 21 of February 2014

Here is Yanukovich, in February holding press conference from Russia, after being "escorted" by FSB.

Ousted Ukrainian President Press Conference

Ousted Ukrainian President Viktor Yanukovych spoke at a press conference in the Russian city of Rostov-on-Don. He insisted he was still the "legitimate president" and said he was forced to leave Ukraine because of threats to his life and his family. Yanukovych said he had not yet met with...

www.c-span.org

Yanukovich was still officially the President, and in fact remained so untill elections were held and a new president was elected. His duties were however performed by an interim acting president because again, Yanukovich publicly refused to perform his constitutional duties.

At the same time Crimean Parlament is taken over by Little Green Men and Putin is lying his face off about how it's not Russian millitary (he admits it was in fact Russian millitary in Nov 2014 interview)

 

[Deadstick]

Here is Yanukovich, in February holding press conference from Russia, after being "escorted" by FSB.

Ousted Ukrainian President Press Conference

Ousted Ukrainian President Viktor Yanukovych spoke at a press conference in the Russian city of Rostov-on-Don. He insisted he was still the "legitimate president" and said he was forced to leave Ukraine because of threats to his life and his family. Yanukovych said he had not yet met with...

www.c-span.org

Yanukovich was still officially the President, and in fact remained so untill elections were held and a new president was elected. His duties were however performed by an interim acting president because again, Yanukovich publicly refused to perform his constitutional duties.

At the same time Crimean Parlament is taken over by Little Green Men and Putin is lying his face off about how it's not Russian millitary (he admits it was in fact Russian millitary in Nov 2014 interview)

What's your point? you said he didn't sign the deal he did along with three Maidan leaders, but the fascists didn't like it so they stormed Government buildings, what did you expect Yanukovych to do after that wait to be lynched by the fascist mob? the police had been withdrawn from Maidan and the elected Presidents home., there is no way you can get away from the fact the elected Government was overthrown, democracy my arse.

 

[AntonToo]

What's your point? you said he didn't sign the del he did along with three Maidan leaders, but the fascists didn't like it so they stormed Government buildings, what did you expect Yanukovych to do after that wait to be lynched by the fascist mob? the police had been withdrawn from Maidan and the elected Presidents home., there is no way you can get away from the fact the elected Government ws overthrown, democracy my arse.

Again that is bullshit, the point is that Yanukovich publicly refused to sign documents that were part of the agreement OR ANYTHING ELSE. Thats why he was found by the parlament unable to perform his duties in accordance with Ukranian constitution and an interim acting president was asigned.

Exactly none of that justified Putin's invasion and annexation of Ukrainian territories which started the war in Ukraine.

 

[Deadstick]

Again that is bullshit, the point is that Yanukovich publicly refused to sign documents that were part of the agreement OR ANYTHING ELSE. Thats why he was found by the parlament unable to perform his duties in accordance with Ukranian constitution and an interim acting president was asigned.

Exactly none of that justified Putin's invasion and annexation of Ukrainian territories which started the war in Ukraine.

So this didn't happen?
February 21, 2014 9:16 am CET
By Toby Vogel
President Viktor Yanukovych of Ukraine and the three main opposition leaders have signed a deal brokered by Russia and the European Union to end violence and prepare a political transition.
The deal was reached early this morning after a night of tense talks, but it took most of today (21 February) to set out the specifics and to convince the opposition to sign on to it.
Vitaly Klitschko, Oleh Tyahnybok and Arseniy Yatsenyuk signed on behalf of the opposition, which has been camping out on Kiev’s main square since November.

 

[AntonToo]

So this didn't happen?
February 21, 2014 9:16 am CET
By Toby Vogel
President Viktor Yanukovych of Ukraine and the three main opposition leaders have signed a deal brokered by Russia and the European Union to end violence and prepare a political transition.
The deal was reached early this morning after a night of tense talks, but it took most of today (21 February) to set out the specifics and to convince the opposition to sign on to it.
Vitaly Klitschko, Oleh Tyahnybok and Arseniy Yatsenyuk signed on behalf of the opposition, which has been camping out on Kiev’s main square since November.

Are you dumb or something?

I've explained to you three times already that after Yanukovich signed original agreement he then refused to sign follow up documents, breaking the terms of original agreement and voiding it.

 

[Deadstick]

Are you dumb or something?

I've explained to you three times already that after Yanukovich signed original agreement he then refused to sign follow up documents, breaking the terms of original agreement and voiding it.

Are you thick or something? i told you he signed it you said he didn't, so you lied.

 

[AntonToo]

Are you thick or something? i told you he signed it you said he didn't, so you lied.

here is my original post on the subject:

Let try again, in a very simple way:

February 2014: Yanukovich runs off to Russia and refuses to sign final agreement with oppostion that he previously agreed to, while Putin is annexing Crimea

He originally signed agreement, but then refused to sign follow up documents that were part of what he agreed to, just as he refused to sign anything else.

Specifically, the very first point in the agreement Yanukovich signed:

1. Within 48 hours of the signing of this agreement, a special law will be adopted, signed and promulgated, which will restore the Constitution of 2004 including amendments passed until now. Signatories declare their intention to create a coalition and form a national unity government within 10 days thereafter.

This is the special law that Yanukovich refused to sign 2 days later, voiding his original agreement.



This is not rocket science, you should be able to get it even with your deficiency at basic reading skills.

 

[Ringo]

 

[AntonToo]

Nobody "banned elections" fool, they are suspended during wartime by existing Ukranian law and constitution.