wind power, winning all the way

[Derideo_Te]

I call BS............

Here is the EIA estimate of energy production, by source, looking to 2040. All renewables COMBINED only come to 12% as fossil fuels dominate.

Institute for Energy Research | EIA Forecast: Fossil Fuels Remain Dominant Through 2040

Scroll down to the 3rd graph..........this from the OBAMA EIA........provides a quick jolt of reality that even in 2040, renewabes continue to be a fringe joke.
This idea that wind will provide 50% of our electricy is waaaaaaaaaay off the reservation!!!!


And the 4.6% number pretty much sums it up for ALL renewables, given that solar only contributes 0.2%, thus, renewables COMBINED are still less than 5%...........not exactly party throwing time if Im a green camper.

From your own link;

In 2000 renewables were only 9% of total energy and the bulk of that was hydro. In just a decade renewables have jumped by 33% almost entirely from wind and solar sources. The climb to 16% will be from those same two technologies maturing and becoming more mainstream.

And FYI utilities are the biggest investors in solar and wind because they know that the price of fossil fuels will continue to escalate while the wind and sunshine are free! Economically they make a compelling argument. Environmentally they do too. None of those coal ash ponds that are destroying the rivers. None of the toxic nuclear waste. None of the fossil fuel greenhouse gases that need to be scrubbed.

Indeed......a government statistic brings the # to 16% And as we have seen, particularly in the past 5 years, the government statistics are ALWAYS overinflated!! Private projections are far less......around 10% - 11%. Mainstream??! Perhaps to the radicals.

IER is not a government agency and these are their projections, not the government.

Perhaps you should try reading your own links before you post them.

 

[westwall]

From your own link;

In 2000 renewables were only 9% of total energy and the bulk of that was hydro. In just a decade renewables have jumped by 33% almost entirely from wind and solar sources. The climb to 16% will be from those same two technologies maturing and becoming more mainstream.

And FYI utilities are the biggest investors in solar and wind because they know that the price of fossil fuels will continue to escalate while the wind and sunshine are free! Economically they make a compelling argument. Environmentally they do too. None of those coal ash ponds that are destroying the rivers. None of the toxic nuclear waste. None of the fossil fuel greenhouse gases that need to be scrubbed.

Indeed......a government statistic brings the # to 16% And as we have seen, particularly in the past 5 years, the government statistics are ALWAYS overinflated!! Private projections are far less......around 10% - 11%. Mainstream??! Perhaps to the radicals.

IER is not a government agency and these are their projections, not the government.

Perhaps you should try reading your own links before you post them.

Absent a MAJOR legislative push from the government that drives fossil fuel generators out of business, wind is going to die within the next 15 years. It is unreliable and grotesquely expensive for what you get. It does nothing to reduce the carbon footprint, and murders endangered bird species at a rate far, far above every other source of avian lethality on this planet.

Yes, don't bother to trot that "study" out that shows buildings kill between 3 million and 60 million birds...any study that has that huge a variance is simply not credible in any scientific field. And even if it were true, those are NOT rare and endangered raptors being killed.

Windmills alone kill those types of birds. And also don't forget the millions of bats killed every year too. They don't get killed by buildings (sonar helps them avoid them don't you know) at all....but they are chopped to bits by windmills.

 

[skookerasbil]

From your own link;

In 2000 renewables were only 9% of total energy and the bulk of that was hydro. In just a decade renewables have jumped by 33% almost entirely from wind and solar sources. The climb to 16% will be from those same two technologies maturing and becoming more mainstream.

And FYI utilities are the biggest investors in solar and wind because they know that the price of fossil fuels will continue to escalate while the wind and sunshine are free! Economically they make a compelling argument. Environmentally they do too. None of those coal ash ponds that are destroying the rivers. None of the toxic nuclear waste. None of the fossil fuel greenhouse gases that need to be scrubbed.

Indeed......a government statistic brings the # to 16% And as we have seen, particularly in the past 5 years, the government statistics are ALWAYS overinflated!! Private projections are far less......around 10% - 11%. Mainstream??! Perhaps to the radicals.

IER is not a government agency and these are their projections, not the government.

Perhaps you should try reading your own links before you post them.

Oooops................shoot me.


The EIA says 14%!! >> http://www.redfishtech.com/catch_of_the_day/wp-content/uploads/2011/01/EIA-AEO2011-Figure-2-Early-Release-Overview-Projected-Fuel-Mix-for-Electricity-Generation.jpg


My bad..............still fringe though!!!

 

[Luddly Neddite]

Plus -

 

[Derideo_Te]

Indeed......a government statistic brings the # to 16% And as we have seen, particularly in the past 5 years, the government statistics are ALWAYS overinflated!! Private projections are far less......around 10% - 11%. Mainstream??! Perhaps to the radicals.

IER is not a government agency and these are their projections, not the government.

Perhaps you should try reading your own links before you post them.

Absent a MAJOR legislative push from the government that drives fossil fuel generators out of business, wind is going to die within the next 15 years. It is unreliable and grotesquely expensive for what you get. It does nothing to reduce the carbon footprint, and murders endangered bird species at a rate far, far above every other source of avian lethality on this planet.

Yes, don't bother to trot that "study" out that shows buildings kill between 3 million and 60 million birds...any study that has that huge a variance is simply not credible in any scientific field. And even if it were true, those are NOT rare and endangered raptors being killed.

Windmills alone kill those types of birds. And also don't forget the millions of bats killed every year too. They don't get killed by buildings (sonar helps them avoid them don't you know) at all....but they are chopped to bits by windmills.

Ok, I will take that bet! The reason is because people said the same things about airports and birds and yet now we have birds who nest on airports.

Personally I think the windmills should be located offshore because the wind is more constant in those locations and there are millions of seagulls and no bats.

A friend of mine is a marine biologist and was part of a study for a tidal powered energy generator. The local environmentalists were seriously concerned that the seals would be sucked in and "chopped to bits" especially during high tide when the current was flowing the strongest and the most energy was being generated. They posters "spotters" on the equipment and along the shoreline to give warnings when they saw a seal so that the equipment could be immediately shut down and no seals would be harmed.

This study lasted for 9 months without a single warning or shutdown and yet not a single seal was ever harmed. The reason was simple. The seals didn't waste their energy swimming at high tide. Instead they were all taking naps. They knew that it took more energy to swim at high tide than slack tide so they just stayed out of the water.

Yes, there are birds being killed but we have had windmills up and working since the 1970's. The birds are still in those areas and they are the survivors who have learned to avoid them. The carnage on wild life from fossil fuels continues unabated. To ignore one of the best options we have for future energy needs simply because there are a few birds who must learn to adapt strikes me as shortsighted. I would happily live with a windmill in my backyard rather than one of those coal sludge pools that are polluting the water supply.

 

[Iceweasel]

A friend of mine is a marine biologist and was part of a study for a tidal powered energy generator. The local environmentalists were seriously concerned that the seals would be sucked in and "chopped to bits" especially during high tide when the current was flowing the strongest and the most energy was being generated. They posters "spotters" on the equipment and along the shoreline to give warnings when they saw a seal so that the equipment could be immediately shut down and no seals would be harmed.

This study lasted for 9 months without a single warning or shutdown and yet not a single seal was ever harmed. The reason was simple. The seals didn't waste their energy swimming at high tide. Instead they were all taking naps. They knew that it took more energy to swim at high tide than slack tide so they just stayed out of the water.

Yes, there are birds being killed but we have had windmills up and working since the 1970's. The birds are still in those areas and they are the survivors who have learned to avoid them. The carnage on wild life from fossil fuels continues unabated. To ignore one of the best options we have for future energy needs simply because there are a few birds who must learn to adapt strikes me as shortsighted. I would happily live with a windmill in my backyard rather than one of those coal sludge pools that are polluting the water supply.

Coal plants have come along way since the 1800s.

I'm glad it worked out for the seals but they could have installed screens. But it sounds like that would have put a bunch of people out of work.

 

[flacaltenn]

Plus -

What's wrong with that picture is that Germany never PRODUCED 30GW of solar..
They got emotionally involved in the analysis and wasted a lot of money.. And the rate-payers now greatly resent that.. Doesn't matter what the installed capacities are --- what matters is what you produce.

So that 10GW in the US is actually producing nearly the SAME amount of power as that larger German number..

Solar Subsidy Sinkhole: Re-Evaluating Germany's Blind Faith in the Sun - SPIEGEL ONLINE

The costs of subsidizing solar electricity have exceeded the 100-billion-euro mark in Germany, but poor results are jeopardizing the country's transition to renewable energy. The government is struggling to come up with a new concept to promote the inefficient technology in the future.

The only thing that's missing at the moment is sunshine. For weeks now, the 1.1 million solar power systems in Germany have generated almost no electricity. The days are short, the weather is bad and the sky is overcast.
As is so often the case in winter, all solar panels more or less stopped generating electricity at the same time. To avert power shortages, Germany currently has to import large amounts of electricity generated at nuclear power plants in France and the Czech Republic.

 

[skookerasbil]

I love the way lefties throw out stats...especially when it comes to renewables. They always show growth rates as compared to itself and NEVER as compared to what? Renewables are a joke.....and will be for decades as fossil fuels DOMINATE.


All you have to do is look at the EU which is turning its back on renewables in the last couple of years. Why? Because the politicians figured out their asses were going to be so thrown out of office if they kept sticking the people with mega-electricity bills. Bye....bye subsidies. ( there are about 4 billion links on this in the thread PROOF THE SKEPTICS ARE WINNING )


Or put another way so people can understand the bastardization of stats by the far left..........



The lefty k00ks might tell you that Kate Hudson wins a big boobs contest, but they don't tell you she is in a contest with Keira Knightly.










fAiL

 

[skookerasbil]

RealClearEnergy - Coal Will Be King by 2030

 

[skookerasbil]

PS.....look what happened to the magic of wind power in the US when the polar vortex hit >>>


Wind Choked When it was Needed Most



Ask me how hard Im laughing?

 

[Derideo_Te]

A friend of mine is a marine biologist and was part of a study for a tidal powered energy generator. The local environmentalists were seriously concerned that the seals would be sucked in and "chopped to bits" especially during high tide when the current was flowing the strongest and the most energy was being generated. They posters "spotters" on the equipment and along the shoreline to give warnings when they saw a seal so that the equipment could be immediately shut down and no seals would be harmed.

This study lasted for 9 months without a single warning or shutdown and yet not a single seal was ever harmed. The reason was simple. The seals didn't waste their energy swimming at high tide. Instead they were all taking naps. They knew that it took more energy to swim at high tide than slack tide so they just stayed out of the water.

Yes, there are birds being killed but we have had windmills up and working since the 1970's. The birds are still in those areas and they are the survivors who have learned to avoid them. The carnage on wild life from fossil fuels continues unabated. To ignore one of the best options we have for future energy needs simply because there are a few birds who must learn to adapt strikes me as shortsighted. I would happily live with a windmill in my backyard rather than one of those coal sludge pools that are polluting the water supply.

Coal plants have come along way since the 1800s.

I'm glad it worked out for the seals but they could have installed screens. But it sounds like that would have put a bunch of people out of work.

The screens would have drowned the seals.

They were college kids and retired folks mostly.

 

[westwall]

IER is not a government agency and these are their projections, not the government.

Perhaps you should try reading your own links before you post them.

Absent a MAJOR legislative push from the government that drives fossil fuel generators out of business, wind is going to die within the next 15 years. It is unreliable and grotesquely expensive for what you get. It does nothing to reduce the carbon footprint, and murders endangered bird species at a rate far, far above every other source of avian lethality on this planet.

Yes, don't bother to trot that "study" out that shows buildings kill between 3 million and 60 million birds...any study that has that huge a variance is simply not credible in any scientific field. And even if it were true, those are NOT rare and endangered raptors being killed.

Windmills alone kill those types of birds. And also don't forget the millions of bats killed every year too. They don't get killed by buildings (sonar helps them avoid them don't you know) at all....but they are chopped to bits by windmills.

Ok, I will take that bet! The reason is because people said the same things about airports and birds and yet now we have birds who nest on airports.

Personally I think the windmills should be located offshore because the wind is more constant in those locations and there are millions of seagulls and no bats.

A friend of mine is a marine biologist and was part of a study for a tidal powered energy generator. The local environmentalists were seriously concerned that the seals would be sucked in and "chopped to bits" especially during high tide when the current was flowing the strongest and the most energy was being generated. They posters "spotters" on the equipment and along the shoreline to give warnings when they saw a seal so that the equipment could be immediately shut down and no seals would be harmed.

This study lasted for 9 months without a single warning or shutdown and yet not a single seal was ever harmed. The reason was simple. The seals didn't waste their energy swimming at high tide. Instead they were all taking naps. They knew that it took more energy to swim at high tide than slack tide so they just stayed out of the water.

Yes, there are birds being killed but we have had windmills up and working since the 1970's. The birds are still in those areas and they are the survivors who have learned to avoid them. The carnage on wild life from fossil fuels continues unabated. To ignore one of the best options we have for future energy needs simply because there are a few birds who must learn to adapt strikes me as shortsighted. I would happily live with a windmill in my backyard rather than one of those coal sludge pools that are polluting the water supply.

Seals are much smarter than birds. The Altamont Pass windfarm (about 40 miles from San Francisco) has been in operation since the 1970's and in that period the raptor population has been chopped (quite literally) in half.

All endangered birds in that area are being driven to extinction by the windfarm. A 50% reduction in the raptor population was so alarming even the environmentalists are taking notice.

 

[whitehall]

What the fuck is wrong with you? Do you think coal-fueled power plants are GOOD for the world's wildlife?

Aren't humans part of the "world's wildlife". Fossil fuel keeps humans alive. We would literally be dead if we had to depend on solar and wind energy. You have to be mentally incompetent to think that acres of sizzling mirrors that kill every living thing that comes near them and gigantic windmills what spit out eagle feathers and contribute a laughable 4% of the grid are worth it.

 

[Abraham3]

My comment was in response to your complaint about the environmental consequences of wind turbines. Coal fired plants do far, far more environmental harm. Yet you ignore the point.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Travel from Sweetwater to Dumas/Dalhart in Texas and see the power of wind machines. They are far safer than fossil fuel energy makers.

 

[skookerasbil]

Travel from Sweetwater to Dumas/Dalhart in Texas and see the power of wind machines. They are far safer than fossil fuel energy makers.

Probably an awesome sight......but they don't produce dick in terms of electricity. Not at all in relative terms, anyway. Overpriced. Inefficient. Unreliable. fAiL

 

[Derideo_Te]

Absent a MAJOR legislative push from the government that drives fossil fuel generators out of business, wind is going to die within the next 15 years. It is unreliable and grotesquely expensive for what you get. It does nothing to reduce the carbon footprint, and murders endangered bird species at a rate far, far above every other source of avian lethality on this planet.

Yes, don't bother to trot that "study" out that shows buildings kill between 3 million and 60 million birds...any study that has that huge a variance is simply not credible in any scientific field. And even if it were true, those are NOT rare and endangered raptors being killed.

Windmills alone kill those types of birds. And also don't forget the millions of bats killed every year too. They don't get killed by buildings (sonar helps them avoid them don't you know) at all....but they are chopped to bits by windmills.

Ok, I will take that bet! The reason is because people said the same things about airports and birds and yet now we have birds who nest on airports.

Personally I think the windmills should be located offshore because the wind is more constant in those locations and there are millions of seagulls and no bats.

A friend of mine is a marine biologist and was part of a study for a tidal powered energy generator. The local environmentalists were seriously concerned that the seals would be sucked in and "chopped to bits" especially during high tide when the current was flowing the strongest and the most energy was being generated. They posters "spotters" on the equipment and along the shoreline to give warnings when they saw a seal so that the equipment could be immediately shut down and no seals would be harmed.

This study lasted for 9 months without a single warning or shutdown and yet not a single seal was ever harmed. The reason was simple. The seals didn't waste their energy swimming at high tide. Instead they were all taking naps. They knew that it took more energy to swim at high tide than slack tide so they just stayed out of the water.

Yes, there are birds being killed but we have had windmills up and working since the 1970's. The birds are still in those areas and they are the survivors who have learned to avoid them. The carnage on wild life from fossil fuels continues unabated. To ignore one of the best options we have for future energy needs simply because there are a few birds who must learn to adapt strikes me as shortsighted. I would happily live with a windmill in my backyard rather than one of those coal sludge pools that are polluting the water supply.

Seals are much smarter than birds. The Altamont Pass windfarm (about 40 miles from San Francisco) has been in operation since the 1970's and in that period the raptor population has been chopped (quite literally) in half.

All endangered birds in that area are being driven to extinction by the windfarm. A 50% reduction in the raptor population was so alarming even the environmentalists are taking notice.

Hmmm, no other factors at play? Like urban growth, pesticides, loss of nesting sites and food sources? Just the wind farm is to blame?

 

[Derideo_Te]

Travel from Sweetwater to Dumas/Dalhart in Texas and see the power of wind machines. They are far safer than fossil fuel energy makers.

Probably an awesome sight......but they don't produce dick in terms of electricity. Not at all in relative terms, anyway. Overpriced. Inefficient. Unreliable. fAiL

Too bad the facts say otherwise!

How effective are wind turbines compared to other sources of energy? | barnard on wind

 

[Iceweasel]

I'm glad it worked out for the seals but they could have installed screens. But it sounds like that would have put a bunch of people out of work.

The screens would have drowned the seals.

They were college kids and retired folks mostly.

Were they volunteers or paid? I thought you said "hired". So they were worried about the seals getting chopped up but decided against screens for fear of drowning them? Sounds like you are making things up as you go along.

 

[skookerasbil]

Travel from Sweetwater to Dumas/Dalhart in Texas and see the power of wind machines. They are far safer than fossil fuel energy makers.

Probably an awesome sight......but they don't produce dick in terms of electricity. Not at all in relative terms, anyway. Overpriced. Inefficient. Unreliable. fAiL

Too bad the facts say otherwise!

How effective are wind turbines compared to other sources of energy? | barnard on wind

Look like we have a new member of the religion in here!!! Cool!!




[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AihHLiifqnw]Ontario wind turbines -- An inefficient, unreliable energy fiasco - YouTube[/ame]



Poor fuckers in Canada better hope they dont get strong winds for several days in the middle of a polar vortex!!! That'd be awesome!!!