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Why God is Unknowable Unless He Reveals Himself

Blues Man

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Is the person who lives a good life only to get a reward or to avoid punishment a better person than the one who lives a good life and believes that there is no afterlife, no punishment, no reward?
God knows what is in our heart. Nevertheless, one who avoids sin only because he believes in God and God's punishment is better off than the atheist that doesn't believe in either and then goes out and commits terrible deeds.

That seems like a petty god to me if he cares more about people worshiping him than what people actually do in their lives.
 

K9Buck

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The thing is there are millions of people who don't believe in your god that live what can be described as a righteous life.
According to the Bible, non-Christians will be judged at the "Great white throne judgment". Christians avoid that judgment by virtue of them being a follower of Christ. Non-believers will be required to pay for their sins but can thereafter reach Heaven and eternal life. Many others will be destroyed, meaning they will cease to exist, or at least that is my understanding. I don't believe that people go to Hell, which is a place that is currently empty of residents and which was created for Satan and his angels.
 

K9Buck

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That seems like a petty god to me if he cares more about people worshiping him than what people actually do in their lives.
Where did I say anything about "worship"?

Let's put it this way. God is a really cool guy that's having an awesome party up in his highrise pad. He wants everyone to come, but only if they're also cool and not a fucking asshole. Therefore, we live life to see if we're cool or if we're a fucking asshole. Thereafter, cool people get to go to his penthouse party and assholes stay out. Got it?
 

K9Buck

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Religion is just another control placed upon people by those who want to claim authority
So you accept the possibility that God exists, but refute the possibility that God would give instructions on how we should live our lives? Why do you believe one is possible but not the other?
 

Blues Man

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The thing is there are millions of people who don't believe in your god that live what can be described as a righteous life.
According to the Bible, non-Christians will be judged at the "Great white throne judgment". Christians avoid that judgment by virtue of them being a follower of Christ. Non-believers will be required to pay for their sins but can thereafter reach Heaven and eternal life. Many others will be destroyed, meaning they will cease to exist, or at least that is my understanding. I don't believe that people go to Hell, which is a place that is currently empty of residents and which was created for Satan and his angels.
I simply don't believe any of that.

Like I said I would not live my life any differently than I do today if any god revealed himself to the world this morning.
 

Blues Man

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Religion is just another control placed upon people by those who want to claim authority
So you accept the possibility that God exists, but refute the possibility that God would give instructions on how we should live our lives? Why do you believe one is possible but not the other?

I don't know if gods exist or not but I really don't care if they do or don't.

And if an all powerful god wanted to tell people how to live their lives why not just appear to everyone all at once instead of whispering in the ears of a few people and then charge those people with convincing the entire world that of his existence?
 

K9Buck

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I don't know if gods exist or not but I really don't care if they do or don't.
Yea, as evidenced by your inexhaustible participation in the religion forum.
 

K9Buck

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Like I said I would not live my life any differently than I do today if any god revealed himself to the world this morning.
And that's why God doesn't make himself obvious to us. You can live your life as you see fit and then you will be judged by Christ himself. Good luck!
 

Blues Man

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Like I said I would not live my life any differently than I do today if any god revealed himself to the world this morning.
And that's why God doesn't make himself obvious to us. You can live your life as you see fit and then you will be judged by Christ himself. Good luck!
I don't think that's true.

You are merely trusting the words of a few people that lived a few thousand years ago.
 

K9Buck

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Well, that was a waste of time.
 

Meriweather

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Personally I have always wondered why an all powerful all knowing god only made himself known to just a few people and not the entirety of all people all at once.
We can also ask why the human race doesn't seek God all at once. The fact is that we are all in different stages of development and life. There is a saying that whoever it was that discovered water, it wasn't a fish. God's being surrounds us, so the first step is to stop acting like fish who cannot discover water.
 

Blues Man

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Personally I have always wondered why an all powerful all knowing god only made himself known to just a few people and not the entirety of all people all at once.
We can also ask why the human race doesn't seek God all at once. The fact is that we are all in different stages of development and life. There is a saying that whoever it was that discovered water, it wasn't a fish. God's being surrounds us, so the first step is to stop acting like fish who cannot discover water.
But in the OT it was god seeking out humans to give his message to.

So why just pick a couple people to talk to?
 

Meriweather

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If you wanted all the people in the world to worship you would would you if you were all powerful just tell 5 or 6 people and them have them try to convince everyone else?
Beginning with the wrong premise seldom gets anyone to the correct conclusion. Who do you love? Ever (metaphorically) worship the ground another person walks on? Anyone ever say to you, "You're going to love her/him" and you loved her the very instant you were introduced? Maybe you began loving that person on their assurance that you would?

We grow to love and worship people after we have met them, and if we do, it is because they think you are so great they love and worship you.

The Israelites were introduced to God through the Law. As they grew in love for the Law they understood who God is and they grew in love and worship of Him.

God does not tell five or six to convince anyone. Those five or six cannot help but try to share an experience that is great enough for everyone.
 

Meriweather

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But in the OT it was god seeking out humans to give his message to.

So why just pick a couple people to talk to?
Again, what if your beginning premise is not correct? God's call is for everyone. Why do only a couple of people seek to hear and to respond back?
 

Blues Man

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If you wanted all the people in the world to worship you would would you if you were all powerful just tell 5 or 6 people and them have them try to convince everyone else?
Beginning with the wrong premise seldom gets anyone to the correct conclusion. Who do you love? Ever (metaphorically) worship the ground another person walks on? Anyone ever say to you, "You're going to love her/him" and you loved her the very instant you were introduced? Maybe you began loving that person on their assurance that you would?

We grow to love and worship people after we have met them, and if we do, it is because they think you are so great they love and worship you.

The Israelites were introduced to God through the Law. As they grew in love for the Law they understood who God is and they grew in love and worship of Him.

God does not tell five or six to convince anyone. Those five or six cannot help but try to share an experience that is great enough for everyone.

God spoke directly to people as documented in the OT

Adam
Cain
Noah
Moses
Samuel
David
Saul
 

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