Why doesn’t gun control work in Sweden?

[2aguy]

How would a commercial or private gun seller know if he can sell to someone?​

The Legal Definition:​

There are no universal gun laws. However, both state and federal laws regulate possession of a firearm by someone who is mentally ill. Under federal law 18 U.S.C. § 922(d), it's unlawful to sell or otherwise dispose of any firearm or ammunition to any person that “has been adjudicated as a mental defective or has been committed to any mental institution.”

Commerical sellers are required to do mandatory federal background checks.....

Criminals easily get past them by stealing their guns or using straw buyers who can pass any background check.

Private sellers could easily find out for their own sales with a free phone app, that allows them to access the NICS background check system...but you dumb fucks oppose that because if we had that, you wouldn't have a chance to get gun registration...which is what you actually want.

 

[2aguy]

No one is born criminal, you have to earn that title.

Nope.......

The Criminology of Firearms
The whole corpus of criminological research dating back to the 1890'sshows murderers "almost uniformly have a long history of involvement in criminal behavior," and that "[v]irtually all" murderers and other gun criminals have prior felony records — generally long ones.

While only 15 percent of Americans have criminal records, roughly 90 percent of adult murderers have prior adult records — exclusive of their often extensive juvenile records — with crime careers of six or more adult years including four major felonies. Gerald D. Robin, writing for the Academy of Criminal Justice Sciences,notes that, unlike ordinary gun owners, "the average murderer turns out to be no less hardened a criminal than the average robber or burglar."

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The lack of a clear causal link between lawful gun ownership and violent crime rates is unsurprising, given that lawful gun owners have never been the primary facilitators of gun crime. Of course, in any given year, a small number of lawful gun owners will commit crimes with their firearms, but the overwhelming majority of America’s tens of millions of gun owners will never constitute a danger to themselves or others.

On the contrary, the best available evidence suggests that a small number of serial offenders commit the majority of violent crimes, and that many of these serial offenders are already legally prohibited from possessing the firearms they use to perpetrate their crimes.13


Consider, for example, a recent report analyzing gun violence in Washington, DC, which concluded that 60 percent to 70 percent of all gun violence in the nation’s capital in any given year is tightly concentrated in a group of 500 “very high risk” individuals, almost all of whom have significant prior or ongoing interactions with the District’s criminal justice system.14

Almost half of all homicide suspects in DC have been previously incarcerated, while more than one in four were on active probation or parole supervision.15
Id. at 4.

According to the report, “most victims and suspects with prior criminal offenses had been arrested about 11 times for about 13 different offenses by the time of the homicide” in which they were involved—not including juvenile arrests.16
Id. 4–5.

http://[URL='https://www.heritage.o...mon-questions-and-debunking-their-most-common

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[alang1216]

You know, the vast majority of my time is spent explaining that our current gun crime and gun murder issue, contained primarily in democrat party controlled cities...is a result of the policies of the democrat party as implemented by democrat party judges, prosecutors and politicians.......and that stopping them would reduce actual violent gun crime by about 95%.......

Meanwhile, idiots like you want to focus on the rarest of rare, the tiniest number of murders in a country of over 350 million Americans.....because those shootings get 24/7 coverage by the democxrat party controlled media........

Number of mass public shootings in the U.S. in 2022......

12



Total number of people murdered....

74.......

12 people out of over 350 million Americans .............

Number of people murdered by gun in 2022....

19,000, up from the average of 10,000, again, as a direct result of the attacks on police and the policies of releasing violent gun offenders over and over again.

You want to focus on the 74 deaths because you can exploit them against uninformed Americans.

The solution to mass public shootings is securing school buildings, ending gun free zones, and getting friends and family of the few nuts who are actually dangerous to others to get them under care or under control....

Meanwhile, the other 19,000 gun murders can be stopped by simply keeping the 5% of violent criminals who commit them in jail, and prison.....which is not what the democrat party wants, since they are the ones doing all of the releasing of those criminals, and they are destroying local police.......the ones who should be arresting these repeat offenders...

I'm not sure where your numbers come from but I found:

Mass Shooting Incidents per Year​

Since 2015, over 19,000 people have been shot and wounded or killed in a mass shooting. In 2022 alone, over 600 people were killed, with over 2,700 wounded.

Both the number of mass shooting incidents and the number of people shot in them have increased since 2015, reaching a high of 686 mass shooting incidents in 2021.

 

[2aguy]

I'm not sure where your numbers come from but I found:

Mass Shooting Incidents per Year​

View attachment 860881

Since 2015, over 19,000 people have been shot and wounded or killed in a mass shooting. In 2022 alone, over 600 people were killed, with over 2,700 wounded.

Both the number of mass shooting incidents and the number of people shot in them have increased since 2015, reaching a high of 686 mass shooting incidents in 2021.

Yeah...that is a lie.......they group in gang shootings, where gang bangers are shooting other gang bangers, with actual mass public shootings where an individual walks into a public place to murder strangers.

Two different crimes, very different solutions.

My list comes from the Mother Jones, Mass Public Shooting Tracker.....that actually uses the definition of mass public shooting....

They have to mix up the two types of crime in order to get those fake numbers....so that uniformed people, like you, will think mass public shootings are common, instead of rarer than lightning strikes...

US mass shootings, 1982–2023: Data from Mother Jones’ investigation

Dating back to at least 2005, the FBI and leading criminologists essentially defined a mass shooting as a single attack in a public place in which four or more victims were killed. We adopted that baseline for fatalities when we gathered data in 2012 on three decades worth of cases.
-------

• Here is a description of the criteria we use:
  
  
  • The perpetrator took the lives of at least four people. A 2008 FBI report identifies an individual as a mass murderer—versus a spree killer or a serial killer—if he kills four or more people in a single incident (not including himself), typically in a single location. (*In 2013, the US government’s fatality baseline was revised down to three; our database reflects this change beginning from Jan. 2013, as detailed above.)
  • The killings were carried out by a lone shooter. (Except in the case of the Columbine massacre and the Westside Middle School killings, which involved two shooters.)
  • The shootings occurred in a public place. (Except in the case of a party on private property in Crandon, Wisconsin, and another in Seattle, where crowds of strangers had gathered, essentially constituting a public crowd.) Crimes primarily related to gang activity or armed robbery are not included, nor are mass killings that took place in private homes (often stemming from domestic violence).
  • Perpetrators who died or were wounded during the attack are not included in the victim tallies.
  • We included a handful of cases also known as “spree killings“—cases in which the killings occurred in more than one location, but still over a short period of time, that otherwise fit the above criteria.
  ----------------------

Our research focused on indiscriminate rampages in public places resulting in four or more victims killed by the attacker. We exclude shootings stemming from more conventionally motivated crimes such as armed robbery or gang violence. (Or in which the perpetrators have not been identified.) Other news outlets and researchers have since published larger tallies that include a wide range of gun crimes in which four or more people have been either wounded or killed. While those larger datasets of multiple-victim shootings are useful for studying the broader problem of gun violence, our investigation provides an in-depth look at a distinct phenomenon—from the firearms used and mental health factors to the growing copycat problem. Tracking mass shootings is complex; we believe ours is the most useful approach for studying this specific phenomenon.



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The actual number of mass shootings from Mother Jones......


US Mass Shootings, 1982-2015: Data From Mother Jones' Investigation


2022...12

2021...6

2020....2

2019....10

2018... 12

2017: 11 ( 5 according to the old standard)

2016....6

2015....4 ( obama's new standard....7)

2014....2 (4)

2013....5

2012....7

2011....3

2010....1

2009....4

2008....3

2007....4

2006....3

2005...2

2004....1

2003...1

2002 not listed so more than likely 0

2001....1

2000....1

1999....5

1998...3

1997....2

1996....1

1995...1

1994...1

1993...4

1992...2

1991...3

1990...1

1989...2

1988....1

1987...1

1986...1

1985... not listed so probably 0

1984...2

1983...not listed so probably 0

1982...1

School shootings...

2022.....1
2021....1
2020....0
2019....0
2018.....2
2017....0
2016...0
2015....1 (community college)
2014...1
2013.....0
2012....2
2011....0
2010...0
2006.....1
1999.......1
1998.....2
1992....1
1989....1

US Mass Shootings, 1982-2015: Data From Mother Jones' Investigation

US Mass Shootings, 1982-2015: Data From Mother Jones' Investigation


Deer kill 200 people a year.....

Lawn mowers between 90-100 people a year....

Ladders 300 people a year....

bathtubs 350 people a year...

Cars killed over 39,000 people in 2019...



Total number of people killed in mass public shootings by year...


2022....74
2021...43
2020....5
2019....73
2018.....93
2017........117
2016......71
2015......37
2014..... 9
2013..... 36
2012..... 72
2011..... 19
2010....9
2009...39
2008...18
2007...54
2006...21
2005...17
2004...5
2003...7
2002...not listed by mother jones
2001...5
2000...7
1999...42
1998...14
1997...9
1996...6
1995...6
1994....5
1993...23
1992...9
1991...35
1990...10
1989...15
1988...7
1987...6
1986...15
1985...(none listed)
1984...28
1983 (none listed)
1982...8

 

[alang1216]

Private sellers could easily find out for their own sales with a free phone app, that allows them to access the NICS background check system...but you dumb fucks oppose that because if we had that, you wouldn't have a chance to get gun registration...which is what you actually want.

In most states private seller can just go ahead and sell it to the person who wants to buy it. However, you need to have a “reasonable” expectation that the buyer is not a felon or otherwise prohibited from owning firearms. The proper way to handle private sales for both you and the buyer is simply write a bill of sale with the buyers drivers license info on it and your drivers license info. Stick it in a drawer and you him/her and don’t worry about it. If you ever get asked “who did this gun go to?” pull out the paper and tell them.

 

[2aguy]

In most states private seller can just go ahead and sell it to the person who wants to buy it. However, you need to have a “reasonable” expectation that the buyer is not a felon or otherwise prohibited from owning firearms. The proper way to handle private sales for both you and the buyer is simply write a bill of sale with the buyers drivers license info on it and your drivers license info. Stick it in a drawer and you him/her and don’t worry about it. If you ever get asked “who did this gun go to?” pull out the paper and tell them.

And how does that do anything about what you were complaining about?

My free phone app would work. It would be free, anyone can use it, anywhere, anytime. You simply punch in the same info. a police officer punches in when he stops you for a traffic ticket, it checks for criminal convictions, mental health issues, outstanding warrants.....it does it without a permanent record being kept, and it does it without any need for gun registration.

Free, easy, yes or no statement for criminal history, no permanent record, no need to register guns, anyone can use it, anytime, anyplace..............

And anti-gun extremists would not support it since the only reason they demand universal background checks is so they can then demand gun registration...the actual goal.

 

[alang1216]

And how does that do anything about what you were complaining about?

My free phone app would work. It would be free, anyone can use it, anywhere, anytime. You simply punch in the same info. a police officer punches in when he stops you for a traffic ticket, it checks for criminal convictions, mental health issues, outstanding warrants.....it does it without a permanent record being kept, and it does it without any need for gun registration.

Free, easy, yes or no statement for criminal history, no permanent record, no need to register guns, anyone can use it, anytime, anyplace..............

And anti-gun extremists would not support it since the only reason they demand universal background checks is so they can then demand gun registration...the actual goal.

I'll bite. What is the app?

 

[2aguy]

I'll bite. What is the app?

Not built yet but it would be great

 

[AZrailwhale]

You realize that in straw purchases "law abiding gun owners" buy a gun for somebody not eligible to. buy one STRIKE ONE GUN OWNER

Private sellers (no background check) again "law abiding gun owners" selling a guy to somebody not eligible to buy one. STRIKE TWO GUN OWNER

Theft, already covered STRIKE THREE GUN OWNER

It looks like the solutions all involves the "law abiding" gun owner.

Except that in case one, the straw buyer is committing a criminal act, so he’s not a law abiding gun owner. In the second case, the gun owner isn’t committing a crime unless he KNOWS the buyer is a prohibited person and in the third case the gun owner isn’t responsible for someone stealing from him. So you are zero for three.

 

[AZrailwhale]

They are "law abiding" until they get caught.
So to get guns out of criminals hands, the recourse is to make the "law abiding" gun owner, actually obey the law.

Criminality has nothing to do with getting caught. A criminal is anyone who COMMITS a crime. Al Capone was never caught committing a crime, do you have any doubt that he was a criminal?

 

[AZrailwhale]

It's kind alike, everybody having the right to own a car, whether they know how to drive or not.

Everybody does have the right to own a car. You don’t even have to have a license to drive it as long as you stay off public roads.

 

[Viktor]

You realize if they are doing a straw purchase they are not law abiding.

Youneed to figure out what a law abiding citizen is. Your out.

ajtandy

24 viewsmore_horiz
@ajtandy·
Nov 14
Amazon product

 

[Blues Man]

How would a commercial or private gun seller know if he can sell to someone?​

The Legal Definition:​

There are no universal gun laws. However, both state and federal laws regulate possession of a firearm by someone who is mentally ill. Under federal law 18 U.S.C. § 922(d), it's unlawful to sell or otherwise dispose of any firearm or ammunition to any person that “has been adjudicated as a mental defective or has been committed to any mental institution.”

Thta's up to the government to provide the information via the NICS database

 

[M14 Shooter]

Since 2015, over 19,000 people have been shot and wounded or killed in a mass shooting. In 2022 alone, over 600 people were killed, with over 2,700 wounded.

Both the number of mass shooting incidents and the number of people shot in them have increased since 2015, reaching a high of 686 mass shooting incidents in 2021.

This is where "mass shooting" is defined as any event where 3+ people are shot.
In these mass shootings, the average death rate is 1.02/incident, with about 45% of incidents resulting in 0 deaths.

 

[2aguy]

Latest article on the problem in sweden...

Can the anti-gunners here on U.S.messageboard tell us if it is against the law in Sweden for 15 year olds to use illegal guns to commit murders for hire?

Asking for a friend....


The victims and the perpetrators are increasingly young.

Police last year investigated 336 15- to 17-year-olds for having illegal firearms, eight times more than a decade ago, the National Council for Crime Prevention said this month.

Gangs now recruit kids to carry out contract killings -- some younger than 15 -- knowing they can't be jailed.

"This new generation (of criminals) is ruthless," said Garip Gunes, who started a youth football team to keep kids in the disadvantaged Stockholm suburb of Rinkeby out of trouble.

"Many parents are worried about their kids and don't let them go out except to go to school or football practice. They're worried they'll end up in the line of fire," he told AFP.

Criminology professor Felipe Estrada Dorner of Stockholm University told AFP the situation "has gotten totally out of control: they've started attacking loved ones and those who have nothing to do with these conflicts."

"This is a big change from the violence that has prevailed until now."

Forty-seven people have been killed in 314 shootings so far this year, police said, compared to only seven deaths in 2016.

'Child soldiers' and blood feuds: Sweden's out-of-control gang wars

One night in September, teacher Thomas Cervin was woken by gunshots in his apartment building in Uppsala. His neighbour had just become the latest target in Sweden's terrifying gang wars.

www.france24.com

 

[Libby von H]

Wait, is Sweden having multiple shootings every single day now?

Don't let a stupid asshole comment like this pass ;"low crime rates because their populations don’t engage in crime"
That is tautological. Low crime rate means doesn't engage in crime. Yet that moron posits a cause and effect. How stupid.
How about this similary moronic comment : the population doesn engage in crime and therefor they have a low crime rate !!!
A tautology.
PROOF : you can't say the population engages in crime but they have a low crime rate.
OR THey have a high crime rate but the population doesn't engage in crime.

IT is saddening that the person that said that doesn't feel like a low-intelligence toad

 

[2aguy]

Don't let a stupid asshole comment like this pass ;"low crime rates because their populations don’t engage in crime"
That is tautological. Low crime rate means doesn't engage in crime. Yet that moron posits a cause and effect. How stupid.
How about this similary moronic comment : the population doesn engage in crime and therefor they have a low crime rate !!!
A tautology.
PROOF : you can't say the population engages in crime but they have a low crime rate.
OR THey have a high crime rate but the population doesn't engage in crime.

IT is saddening that the person that said that doesn't feel like a low-intelligence toad

Moron.....the Swedes did not have high crime rates.....they imported 3rd world males, who took over their drug trade, and now they have high crime rates including gun crime, hand grenades and murder...you dumb ass.....

 

[alang1216]

Thta's up to the government to provide the information via the NICS database

So you would have no objection to me viewing your record there?

 

[2aguy]

So you would have no objection to me viewing your record there?

Wouldn’t need to see the info……you just need a yes or no answer for the background check…

 

[alang1216]

Wouldn’t need to see the info……you just need a yes or no answer for the background check…

Sounds great, let me know when the app is ready and how well it works.