Why does the United States have the largest prison population in the world ?

[Ray From Cleveland]

Money, there is lots to be made with for profit prisons.

That's an old urban legend. In many cities, there isn't enough prison space for all the criminals. In fact judges are advised to only lock up the worst of the worst. Let the other people off on house arrest or probation.

 

[percysunshine]

It’s no secret that the U.S. incarcerates a shocking number of swaths of its own people, primarily the poor and people of color. With 2.3 million Americans currently being held in prisons, the country has the largest prison population in the world. But even as awareness of mass incarceration grows, two crucial questions remain at the heart of the debate on prison reform: Why does the U.S. imprison so many people, and how do we change our toxic approach? These are the issues Tony Platt, author of “Beyond These Walls: Rethinking Crime and Punishment in the United States,” and Truthdig Editor in Chief Robert Scheer discuss in the latest installment of “Scheer Intelligence.”

(snip)....There’s a tendency these days for people to say the United States proportionally incarcerates more people than any other country in the world. I don’t know if that’s true. I just don’t think we know what the real situation is in China and Russia, which are the big competitors in incarceration. I think the U.S. is in the ballpark; I think the U.S. is close. When you compare the U.S. with Canada or Australia or New Zealand, or France and England, then there’s no contest. There’s no other country that’s comparable to the United States in terms of its political economy that puts as many people away, that hires as many cops, and invests as much money in repression as this country does.

CONTINUED---https://www.truthdig.com/articles/the-liberal-betrayal-of-americas-most-vulnerable/

If every American had to do 30 days to get a taste of what it's like inside, we would put an end to this mass incarceration real fast. You don't realize how bad it is until it happens to someone close to you. Out of sight- out of mind....2.3 million forgotten souls living in hell.

Such a dweeb. Venezuela has their entire population in prison.

 

[the other mike]

Such a dweeb. Venezuela has their entire population in prison.

Thanks perkymoonpie, for your sincere concern.

 

[leftwinger]

I have seen people shoot or smoke Coke. As long as they can keep supply they will constantly reload and continue to death if need be. They will sit sweating huddled in a corner shaking and reload ASAP. They will even attempt to drive out to ATM to dealer after days of non-stop use, to re-supply. Some have been found to trade their daughters to get more.


If you legalize that one, and it became affordable? Say $500/oz. an ounce may kill some over a few days. IV users would be bruised & bloody. No way to return to work for days, if they survived. Pure Coke? Forget about it.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

I have seen people shoot or smoke Coke. As long as they can keep supply they will constantly reload and continue to death if need be. They will sit sweating huddled in a corner shaking and reload ASAP. They will even attempt to drive out to ATM to dealer after days of non-stop use, to re-supply. Some have been found to trade their daughters to get more.


If you legalize that one, and it became affordable? Say $500/oz. an ounce may kill some over a few days. IV users would be bruised & bloody. No way to return to work for days, if they survived. Pure Coke? Forget about it.

I knew a guy that was a friend of one of my tenants. He used to come around, but because he was doped up, you had to keep an eye on him. He'd steal anything.

Before drugs, he was an energetic up and up guy. He went to school, became a certified diesel mechanic, and had a good job. Then came the drugs.

He lost his job because the great money he made wasn't enough to support his habit and he'd steal from his fellow mechanics and the parts departments. He spent time in jail (not prison) for petty theft and possession for personal consumption. Finally he went on a spree. He began to steal from churches after hours.

A veteran detective noticed a pattern with the multiple church thefts. He remembered a similar case 20 years earlier, so he pulled the records. They finally busted him at a church they anticipated him robbing. The judge looked at his criminal record and must have been religious, because she sentenced him to five years in prison.

After a few weeks and realizing he'd never survive without dope, he went to a bathroom stall, shoved toilet paper down his nostrils and throat and suffocated himself.

 

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

We have too many laws in this country and too many governments policing for profits.

 

[the other mike]

I have seen people shoot or smoke Coke. As long as they can keep supply they will constantly reload and continue to death if need be. They will sit sweating huddled in a corner shaking and reload ASAP. They will even attempt to drive out to ATM to dealer after days of non-stop use, to re-supply. Some have been found to trade their daughters to get more.


If you legalize that one, and it became affordable? Say $500/oz. an ounce may kill some over a few days. IV users would be bruised & bloody. No way to return to work for days, if they survived. Pure Coke? Forget about it.

I've had 95% pink Peruvian and stuff like that back in the early 80's -
luckily I got away from it around 1983. ( the year Scarface came out)

I never shot anything, just snorted but some friends used to bang it or freebase ( this was before crack) , and another thing - that was when crystal meth was getting known as cheaper and longer-lasting high- started messing people up even worse than coke.

 

[Blues Man]

There are plenty of ways to use alternative sentencing.

And I don't think drugs should be illegal at all. Decriminalizing all drugs would reduce the prison population by half

And at least double the overdose deaths and addictions. However if we were ever to go in that direction, the first thing we'd have to do is shore up our welfare system. Nobody gets on it who are physically capable of holding a job. I don't want to pay for all these strung out MF's as I'm paying for enough people to sit home and watch their big screens as it is.

Isn't it strange how Portugal decriminalized all drugs and saw addiction rates drop?
The courts were freed up from the lag jam of drug cases, so much money was saved that a small percentage of it was used to offer rehab and both addiction rates and overdoses decreased significantly.

ANd don't try to tell me that won't work here because Portugal is a small country as we can implement it by state, city or town

The problem in our country is people selling drugs more than using them. Not many of our citizens today are in prison for drug use alone. Most that involve drug possession are in there for other crimes; some that are associated with possession, and others that are associated with usage such as breaking and entering or other theft.

I don't know anything about Portugal, so I looked it up. According to this article, legalizing drugs was not really making drugs legal. It's still illegal to sell drugs, police confiscate any drugs when found, and it only shifted the burden of addicts from prison to treatment centers. That last was the only thing that really changed.

Did Portugal Really Legalize All Drugs?

you have to possess drugs before you can use them so getting put in jail for possession is not really any different than getting put on jail for using

I haven’t looked this up....is there a correlation between drug usage, criminal activity and welfare dependency?

Since most drug use is illegal there is obviously a correlation as drug use for the most part is criminal activity

 

[Blues Man]

The problem in our country is people selling drugs more than using them. Not many of our citizens today are in prison for drug use alone. Most that involve drug possession are in there for other crimes; some that are associated with possession, and others that are associated with usage such as breaking and entering or other theft.

I don't know anything about Portugal, so I looked it up. According to this article, legalizing drugs was not really making drugs legal. It's still illegal to sell drugs, police confiscate any drugs when found, and it only shifted the burden of addicts from prison to treatment centers. That last was the only thing that really changed.

Did Portugal Really Legalize All Drugs?

Your source and link certainly destroy our far left Progressive Blues Man's foolish argument.

It didn't make any sense when he wrote it. No matter what you make legal, more people will be involved in it. We had prohibition in this country. Yes, some people still drank, but do we have more alcoholics today than back then or the other way around?

If we legalized all drugs in this country and found it to be a total disaster, there is very little way to reverse it because many more people would be hooked. Making it illegal again would create criminals out of all those poor souls who would find alternatives to getting the drug.

I disagree.

I'm not going to start shooting smack if it was decriminalized, are you?

 

[WEATHER53]

Because we offer the most liberties in the world and thus a fine line to walk and we have races here that do not choose to walk that fine line but rather violate it and they get held accountable

 

[percysunshine]

Such a dweeb. Venezuela has their entire population in prison.

Thanks perkymoonpie, for your sincere concern.

The prisoners in Venezuela have already eaten their pets.

 

[the other mike]

Meanwhile in reality.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

The problem in our country is people selling drugs more than using them. Not many of our citizens today are in prison for drug use alone. Most that involve drug possession are in there for other crimes; some that are associated with possession, and others that are associated with usage such as breaking and entering or other theft.

I don't know anything about Portugal, so I looked it up. According to this article, legalizing drugs was not really making drugs legal. It's still illegal to sell drugs, police confiscate any drugs when found, and it only shifted the burden of addicts from prison to treatment centers. That last was the only thing that really changed.

Did Portugal Really Legalize All Drugs?

Your source and link certainly destroy our far left Progressive Blues Man's foolish argument.

It didn't make any sense when he wrote it. No matter what you make legal, more people will be involved in it. We had prohibition in this country. Yes, some people still drank, but do we have more alcoholics today than back then or the other way around?

If we legalized all drugs in this country and found it to be a total disaster, there is very little way to reverse it because many more people would be hooked. Making it illegal again would create criminals out of all those poor souls who would find alternatives to getting the drug.

I disagree.

I'm not going to start shooting smack if it was decriminalized, are you?

No, but then again I'm not 20 years old looking to impress a girl or get accepted by the "in" crowd at work. That's how I started smoking cigarettes and I still can't quit.

 

[the other mike]

No, but then again I'm not 20 years old looking to impress a girl or get accepted by the "in" crowd at work. That's how I started smoking cigarettes and I still can't quit.

For what it's worth, I can tell you how I quit after 31 years of smoking cigarettes.
In June of 2009, I had minor out-patient hernia surgery (lifting injury ) in which I was knocked out on anesthesia for an hour and when I came to, the surgeon told me I was having some trouble breathing during the hernia repair . He didn't ask me if I smoked (although I assume he knew I did) , he just gave me some inhalers and recommended that I see a 'respiratory specialist'. (all about the $)

Long story short, I used the inhalers for about a week while I was recovering from the operation and on pain meds, never went to a specialist, and then I just made the decision to finally make up my mind to quit for good.( after 2 weak, failed attempts before) So I chewed the nicotine gum for about 6 weeks and that was it. ( it took about 6 months before I was sure I could have a beer or smoke weed without wanting a cigarette, but I never looked back) -- July 4th will be 10 years.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

No, but then again I'm not 20 years old looking to impress a girl or get accepted by the "in" crowd at work. That's how I started smoking cigarettes and I still can't quit.

For what it's worth, I can tell you how I quit after 31 years of smoking cigarettes.
In June of 2009, I had minor out-patient hernia surgery (lifting injury ) in which I was knocked out on anesthesia for an hour and when I came to, the surgeon told me I was having some trouble breathing during the hernia repair . He didn't ask me if I smoked (although I assume he knew I did) , he just gave me some inhalers and recommended that I see a 'respiratory specialist'. (all about the $)

Long story short, I used the inhalers for about a week while I was recovering from the operation and on pain meds, never went to a specialist, and then I just made the decision to finally make up my mind to quit for good.( after 2 weak, failed attempts before) So I chewed the nicotine gum for about 6 weeks and that was it. ( it took about 6 months before I was sure I could have a beer or smoke weed without wanting a cigarette, but I never looked back) -- July 4th will be 10 years.

Like drugs, everything is different depending on the person. For instance I tried different drugs when I was younger. Opioid products did nothing to me, but then again, I'm a beer man. For other people, one snort and your life is over after that point. There is no quitting.

I had a friend that decided to quit, and it bothered him for two days. After that, he never wanted another one. In fact he even hates the smell today. His brother (who also tried to quit repeatedly) still smokes, and he's not allowed to smoke in his house or his second job. He quit for about five months last year, but couldn't take it.

I knew another guy at a stop of ours who said he opened up a pack of cigarettes in the morning as he always did, and never touched them. It didn't bother him, but he carried that pack of cigarettes around for two years before he stopped. He said the habit to beat was carrying them around and not actually quitting smoking. At another stop of ours, a guy told me he quit for ten years. It bugged him the entire time, and one day at a bar, he bummed a cigarette off another patron, and went right back to smoking two packs a day as he did the day before he quit.

Like drugs, some people just can't quit I guess. I started at age 12 and I'm 58 now. It's one of the reasons I don't cut down drug users; because I'm not in their shoes. Just because I'll never get hooked doesn't mean there's something wrong with them, it's just how these poisons that we ingest work on people differently.

 

[Likkmee]

It's a FreeDumb thing.

 

[Blues Man]

The problem in our country is people selling drugs more than using them. Not many of our citizens today are in prison for drug use alone. Most that involve drug possession are in there for other crimes; some that are associated with possession, and others that are associated with usage such as breaking and entering or other theft.

I don't know anything about Portugal, so I looked it up. According to this article, legalizing drugs was not really making drugs legal. It's still illegal to sell drugs, police confiscate any drugs when found, and it only shifted the burden of addicts from prison to treatment centers. That last was the only thing that really changed.

Did Portugal Really Legalize All Drugs?

Your source and link certainly destroy our far left Progressive Blues Man's foolish argument.

It didn't make any sense when he wrote it. No matter what you make legal, more people will be involved in it. We had prohibition in this country. Yes, some people still drank, but do we have more alcoholics today than back then or the other way around?

If we legalized all drugs in this country and found it to be a total disaster, there is very little way to reverse it because many more people would be hooked. Making it illegal again would create criminals out of all those poor souls who would find alternatives to getting the drug.

I disagree.

I'm not going to start shooting smack if it was decriminalized, are you?

No, but then again I'm not 20 years old looking to impress a girl or get accepted by the "in" crowd at work. That's how I started smoking cigarettes and I still can't quit.

I think you're overestimating the number of people who will try drugs for the first time if they are decriminalized
The fact is anyone can get just about any drug they want now so decriminalization won't usher in a generation of new users

 

[Blues Man]

No, but then again I'm not 20 years old looking to impress a girl or get accepted by the "in" crowd at work. That's how I started smoking cigarettes and I still can't quit.

For what it's worth, I can tell you how I quit after 31 years of smoking cigarettes.
In June of 2009, I had minor out-patient hernia surgery (lifting injury ) in which I was knocked out on anesthesia for an hour and when I came to, the surgeon told me I was having some trouble breathing during the hernia repair . He didn't ask me if I smoked (although I assume he knew I did) , he just gave me some inhalers and recommended that I see a 'respiratory specialist'. (all about the $)

Long story short, I used the inhalers for about a week while I was recovering from the operation and on pain meds, never went to a specialist, and then I just made the decision to finally make up my mind to quit for good.( after 2 weak, failed attempts before) So I chewed the nicotine gum for about 6 weeks and that was it. ( it took about 6 months before I was sure I could have a beer or smoke weed without wanting a cigarette, but I never looked back) -- July 4th will be 10 years.

Like drugs, everything is different depending on the person. For instance I tried different drugs when I was younger. Opioid products did nothing to me, but then again, I'm a beer man. For other people, one snort and your life is over after that point. There is no quitting.

I had a friend that decided to quit, and it bothered him for two days. After that, he never wanted another one. In fact he even hates the smell today. His brother (who also tried to quit repeatedly) still smokes, and he's not allowed to smoke in his house or his second job. He quit for about five months last year, but couldn't take it.

I knew another guy at a stop of ours who said he opened up a pack of cigarettes in the morning as he always did, and never touched them. It didn't bother him, but he carried that pack of cigarettes around for two years before he stopped. He said the habit to beat was carrying them around and not actually quitting smoking. At another stop of ours, a guy told me he quit for ten years. It bugged him the entire time, and one day at a bar, he bummed a cigarette off another patron, and went right back to smoking two packs a day as he did the day before he quit.

Like drugs, some people just can't quit I guess. I started at age 12 and I'm 58 now. It's one of the reasons I don't cut down drug users; because I'm not in their shoes. Just because I'll never get hooked doesn't mean there's something wrong with them, it's just how these poisons that we ingest work on people differently.

No one gets addicted after one use of anything.
Addiction takes time and repeated use to develop.

 

[mikegriffith1]

Why? Because we believe in law and order and the rule of law. Because we don't want to become a banana republic where most criminals never see jail time. Because the cost of allowing criminals to go loose on the streets is far greater than the cost of jailing them.

And if this or that demographic is over-represented in the prison population in relation to their percentage of the overall population, that is no one's fault but theirs. If 30% of all criminals happen to belong to a demographic that constitutes only 18% of the population, that is no one's fault but theirs.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

No, but then again I'm not 20 years old looking to impress a girl or get accepted by the "in" crowd at work. That's how I started smoking cigarettes and I still can't quit.

For what it's worth, I can tell you how I quit after 31 years of smoking cigarettes.
In June of 2009, I had minor out-patient hernia surgery (lifting injury ) in which I was knocked out on anesthesia for an hour and when I came to, the surgeon told me I was having some trouble breathing during the hernia repair . He didn't ask me if I smoked (although I assume he knew I did) , he just gave me some inhalers and recommended that I see a 'respiratory specialist'. (all about the $)

Long story short, I used the inhalers for about a week while I was recovering from the operation and on pain meds, never went to a specialist, and then I just made the decision to finally make up my mind to quit for good.( after 2 weak, failed attempts before) So I chewed the nicotine gum for about 6 weeks and that was it. ( it took about 6 months before I was sure I could have a beer or smoke weed without wanting a cigarette, but I never looked back) -- July 4th will be 10 years.

Like drugs, everything is different depending on the person. For instance I tried different drugs when I was younger. Opioid products did nothing to me, but then again, I'm a beer man. For other people, one snort and your life is over after that point. There is no quitting.

I had a friend that decided to quit, and it bothered him for two days. After that, he never wanted another one. In fact he even hates the smell today. His brother (who also tried to quit repeatedly) still smokes, and he's not allowed to smoke in his house or his second job. He quit for about five months last year, but couldn't take it.

I knew another guy at a stop of ours who said he opened up a pack of cigarettes in the morning as he always did, and never touched them. It didn't bother him, but he carried that pack of cigarettes around for two years before he stopped. He said the habit to beat was carrying them around and not actually quitting smoking. At another stop of ours, a guy told me he quit for ten years. It bugged him the entire time, and one day at a bar, he bummed a cigarette off another patron, and went right back to smoking two packs a day as he did the day before he quit.

Like drugs, some people just can't quit I guess. I started at age 12 and I'm 58 now. It's one of the reasons I don't cut down drug users; because I'm not in their shoes. Just because I'll never get hooked doesn't mean there's something wrong with them, it's just how these poisons that we ingest work on people differently.

No one gets addicted after one use of anything.
Addiction takes time and repeated use to develop.

Oh no. That is completely wrong. Opioid addiction happens almost immediately. I've seen it with my own eyes. That's not to say somebody goes from straight to being a junkie overnight; that does take time. However the addiction (which simply means unable to stop) is there from snort one with certain people. It's the same way with severe alcoholics. They can't function without it. They didn't start out as casual or social drinkers. Most of the people with serious problems found love in booze from the first time they got drunk.