Zone1 Why did Jesus come to earth?

[Meriweather]

That was only one of the reasons He came to earth. The first, primary and most important reason was to open, once and for all, the way to the Father through His death and resurrection.

This brings us back to how would Jesus' life and purpose become known throughout the world without Jesus first building a Church to convey these reasons and purpose throughout the earth--and over the millennia? The Church is the essential part in God's plan.

 

[Meriweather]

Romans church, not Jesus.
You can speak of magic all you want, but the fact remains, the catholic church was shaped by the Romans. Not jesus.

Without Jesus there would be no Church. Keep in mind Paul was a Roman, chosen by God, to bring Jesus' Church into Rome. Meanwhile, others were bringing the Church to Africa, India, Syria and other parts of the world. Peter, the steward of the Church after Christ ascended, was crucified in Rome and his body buried on the southern slope of the Vatican hill.

At the time, Roman ideology and literature metaphorically described their empire reaching to the ends of the earth. Note Jesus used this metaphor instructing his disciples to proclaim his Gospel to the ends of the earth--in other words--all over the Roman empire.

 

[TNHarley]

Without Jesus there would be no Church. Keep in mind Paul was a Roman, chosen by God, to bring Jesus' Church into Rome. Meanwhile, others were bringing the Church to Africa, India, Syria and other parts of the world. Peter, the steward of the Church after Christ ascended, was crucified in Rome and his body buried on the southern slope of the Vatican hill.

At the time, Roman ideology and literature metaphorically described their empire reaching to the ends of the earth. Note Jesus used this metaphor instructing his disciples to proclaim his Gospel to the ends of the earth--in other words--all over the Roman empire.

The romans shaped the catholic church. Not jesus. Not paul. The romans.
There is no getting around that. Rome decided what the catholic church would be/teach.

 

[hadit]

This brings us back to how would Jesus' life and purpose become known throughout the world without Jesus first building a Church to convey these reasons and purpose throughout the earth--and over the millennia? The Church is the essential part in God's plan.

It is an essential part, but not the most important. Without His sacrifice, there would be no reason for the Church to exist, we would still be under the law and the Jews would be evangelizing the world to follow it.

 

[Meriweather]

The romans shaped the catholic church. Not jesus. Not paul. The romans.
There is no getting around that. Rome decided what the catholic church would be/teach.

Christians, not the government of Rome, shaped the Church. Christians made those decisions. Read up on the Councils.

 

[Meriweather]

It is an essential part, but not the most important. Without His sacrifice, there would be no reason for the Church to exist, we would still be under the law and the Jews would be evangelizing the world to follow it.

Without the Church, the sacrifice may as well not have existed. During his life, Jesus did several things, and one of those was to build a Church/assembly/kingdom and to appoint a steward. No one should dismiss this as a non-essential, any more than they should dismiss any part of his life, death, and resurrection as dispensable.

 

[hadit]

Without the Church, the sacrifice may as well not have existed. During his life, Jesus did several things, and one of those was to build a Church/assembly/kingdom and to appoint a steward. No one should dismiss this as a non-essential, any more than they should dismiss any part of his life, death, and resurrection as dispensable.

No one is saying it's non-essential, I'm just saying that there doesn't need to be a world-wide organization to spread the Gospel.

 

[TNHarley]

Christians, not the government of Rome, shaped the Church. Christians made those decisions. Read up on the Councils.

ay caramba

 

[hobelim]

I am proclaiming Jesus is who he said he is: The son of God, one with God, the word of God, the messiah who established a kingdom on earth.

If that is true how do you resolve the fact that around 500 bce Nebuchadnezzar said this after descending into madness living like a dumb beast for seven years without enough sense to either look up or get out of the rain;

"At the end of that time, I, Nebuchadnezzar, raised my eyes toward heaven, and my sanity was restored. Then I praised the Most High; I honored and glorified him who lives forever and ever for his dominion is an everlasting dominion, and his kingdom endures from generation to generation."

If God is God there has never been a time when his Kingdom was not in power. Jesus opened eyes to this fact.


"There are some of you standing around who will not die until you see the kingdom of God in already in power"



So please, enough with your vanity as if God needed a church and a brood of vipers to rule the world for him.

 

[Meriweather]

No one is saying it's non-essential, I'm just saying that there doesn't need to be a world-wide organization to spread the Gospel.

Jesus came to build an earthly kingdom, meant for the whole world. Which part are you thinking of leaving out?

 

[SweetSue92]

One of the homilies I listened to today said:

Jesus came to establish a Church.

After automatically thinking, "No. Jesus came...." (a list of reasons), consider without the Church, how would we know all Jesus' accomplished. Was Jesus establishing a Church (upon this rock I will build my Church) foremost in God's planning?

He told us:

"I have come that they may have life, and have it to the full."--John 10:10

 

[Meriweather]

If that is true how do you resolve the fact that around 500 bce Nebuchadnezzar said this after descending into madness living like a dumb beast for seven years without enough sense to either look up or get out of the rain;

"At the end of that time, I, Nebuchadnezzar, raised my eyes toward heaven, and my sanity was restored. Then I praised the Most High; I honored and glorified him who lives forever and ever for his dominion is an everlasting dominion, and his kingdom endures from generation to generation."

If God is God there has never been a time when his Kingdom was not in power. Jesus opened eyes to this fact.


"There are some of you standing around who will not die until you see the kingdom of God in already in power"



So please, enough with your vanity as if God needed a church and a bunch of hypocrites to rule the world for him

The Church does not rule the world, It is Christ's kingdom, and he appointed a steward. He said even during hellish time (both from without and within) they would not prevail against his Church/Kingdom.

And yes, we agree that the Kingdom of God is within the reach of all. Jesus taught this during his time on earth.

 

[SweetSue92]

Jesus came to build an earthly kingdom, meant for the whole world. Which part are you thinking of leaving out?

He literally said, "My Kingdom is NOT OF THIS WORLD...."--John 18:36

 

[hobelim]

"I have come that they may have life, and have it to the full."--John 10:10

Abundant blessings and eternal life is the promise for complying with the Divine commands in the WAY Jesus taught which is the same WAY that Moses originally taught to follow the Law that was lost to time after his death.

 

[hobelim]

he Church does not rule the world, It is Christ's kingdom, and he appointed a steward.

If so then the church is teeming with faithless stewards who judge and condemn anyone who doesn't support their perversions of what Jesus taught: the only right way to understand and follow the Divine commands that fulfills the promise of abundant blessings and eternal life in the sanctuary of God here and now on earth.

 

[Meriweather]

He literally said, "My Kingdom is NOT OF THIS WORLD...."--John 18:36

Jesus also said the Kingdom of heaven is at hand (meaning in the reach of everyone) and that sinners and prostitutes were entering it ahead of some. Kingdom living begins now, not when we pass away. It is also true the Kingdom of God is not about the world, it is about living in the presence of God, and the Bible also notes God is in our midst.

 

[hobelim]

it is about living in the presence of God

Is it possible for anyone who defies the Law of God as if it was a religious duty to live in the presence of God?

I heard that the wages of sin are death, descent into hades, and existence on earth without life, without God.

But that only what I heard from your church.

 

[SweetSue92]

Jesus also said the Kingdom of heaven is at hand (meaning in the reach of everyone) and that sinners and prostitutes were entering it ahead of some. Kingdom living begins now, not when we pass away. It is also true the Kingdom of God is not about the world, it is about living in the presence of God, and the Bible also notes God is in our midst.

I agree with this, but the shading is important. Jesus did not come to establish an earthly kingdom so much as to save sinners from their sin--and to rescue them from death. This is not only corroborated in the NT but in the old as well, even in the garden, when God cursed the snake.

 

[Meriweather]

If so then the church is teeming with faithless stewards. who judge and condemn anyone who does not support their perversions of what Jesus taught, the only right way to follow that law that leads to eternal life.

The Church is also teeming more with faithful stewards who do not judge and condemn. The steward is the servant of the servants of God who are the assembly/Church. We live in the Kingdom of God.

 

[hobelim]

We live in the Kingdom of God.

Maybe so.

But on the wrong side of the Law. Your sin is as obvious as a white boulder in the middle of a plowed field.

You can't claim that the wages of sin are death and then expect me to believe you have eternal life by doing the very thing God promises results in death, a curse. Unless of course death is exactly what you are peddling, tricking people into believing that descending into hell is a religious experience, which it is, just not a good one.