Why aren't more people Libertarian?

[Paulie]

I can't buy a damned beer on Sunday here because conservatives are just so damned freedom loving.

Pointing out that conservatives aren't libertarians has what to do with this discussion?

It has everything to do with it as I already said that most of you government haters have no problem with using it for your own extraordinarily narrow purposes. If you don't want to be continually lumped in with the pretenders then it is what passes for the libertarian party's fault for trying to broaden their base among the hillbilly retards. I live in a southern state where they hate the federal government but they love to outlaw things that harm no one. This is your new libertarian party and it is a massive hypocritical joke.

Come talk to me when you've shed this incessant desire to lump everything into particular groups...and PARTIES for that matter.

The few REAL libertarians on this board dismiss the LP, just an fyi.

 

[occupied]

Pointing out that conservatives aren't libertarians has what to do with this discussion?

It has everything to do with it as I already said that most of you government haters have no problem with using it for your own extraordinarily narrow purposes. If you don't want to be continually lumped in with the pretenders then it is what passes for the libertarian party's fault for trying to broaden their base among the hillbilly retards. I live in a southern state where they hate the federal government but they love to outlaw things that harm no one. This is your new libertarian party and it is a massive hypocritical joke.

I wasn't aware the Libertarian Party was in power in any states. Which one is it?

You almost act as if you are unaware that the teaparty republicans are calling themselves libertarians when it suits them, acting as if all it entails is a reactionary hatred of everything federal, these are the ones ruining your image and the kind of person that makes up the bulk of American libertarians. I can admit that you at least walk the walk but the OP asks why more people are not libertarians and the real answer is that the crazies have ruined the brand. I have no faith that any candidate of the libertarian party would not revert to basic knee jerk conservative republican if they were to gain power in some way because that is what they are at heart.

 

[Contumacious]

I can't buy a damned beer on Sunday here because conservatives are just so damned freedom loving.

Pointing out that conservatives aren't libertarians has what to do with this discussion?

It has everything to do with it as I already said that most of you government haters have no problem with using it for your own extraordinarily narrow purposes. If you don't want to be continually lumped in with the pretenders then it is what passes for the libertarian party's fault for trying to broaden their base among the hillbilly retards. I live in a southern state where they hate the federal government but they love to outlaw things that harm no one. This is your new libertarian party and it is a massive hypocritical joke.

HUH?


What the fucketh?

Gee, when did the Libertarian party Platform adopt a proviso stating that they support tyranny so long as the Supreme Leader has a southern drawl?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?

.

 

[longknife]

I've never really paid attention to the Libertarian Party as, to my knowledge, it has little or no presence here in Nevada where I live. But, after doing some research, I might consider aligning myself with it and will see just what presence it has here. Here are two of their official links:
Libertarian Party | Maximum Freedom, Minimum Government
Platform | Libertarian Party

And, this is from Wikipedia @ Libertarian Party (United States) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The Libertarian Party is the third largest[6] political party in the United States in terms of the popular vote in the country's elections and number of candidates run per election. It is also identified by many as the fastest growing political party in the United States.[7] The political platform of the Libertarian Party reflects the ideas of libertarianism, favoring minimally regulated markets, a less powerful state, strong civil liberties (including support for same-sex marriage and other LGBT rights), the legalization of cannabis, separation of church and state, open immigration, non-interventionism and neutrality in diplomatic relations (i.e., avoiding foreign military or economic entanglements with other nations), freedom of trade and travel to all foreign countries, and a more responsive and direct democracy.[8] The Libertarian Party has also supported the repeal of NAFTA, CAFTA, and similar trade agreements, as well as the United States' exit from the United Nations, WTO, and NATO.[9]

However, as someone posted, we tend to turn to government to solve all of our problems. Reducing government sounds like a good idea but has drawbacks most of us don't wish to deal with.

Public libraries calling for entry and lending fees because they're no longer supported by tax dollars.

Pay to enter and use your local park.

Only receive police and fire services if you live within that specific tax entity and be forced to pay a fee like other utilities for lack of tax base.

And so it goes.

I think it was a fear of the GOP established by the DNC that Gov Romney would do things just like that. We've become, I'm afraid, a Handout Society.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

It has everything to do with it as I already said that most of you government haters have no problem with using it for your own extraordinarily narrow purposes. If you don't want to be continually lumped in with the pretenders then it is what passes for the libertarian party's fault for trying to broaden their base among the hillbilly retards. I live in a southern state where they hate the federal government but they love to outlaw things that harm no one. This is your new libertarian party and it is a massive hypocritical joke.

I wasn't aware the Libertarian Party was in power in any states. Which one is it?

You almost act as if you are unaware that the teaparty republicans are calling themselves libertarians when it suits them, acting as if all it entails is a reactionary hatred of everything federal, these are the ones ruining your image and the kind of person that makes up the bulk of American libertarians. I can admit that you at least walk the walk but the OP asks why more people are not libertarians and the real answer is that the crazies have ruined the brand. I have no faith that any candidate of the libertarian party would not revert to basic knee jerk conservative republican if they were to gain power in some way because that is what they are at heart.

Oh I'm not unaware of the fact. It's something libertarians have seen for decades. When out of power Republicans will talk like libertarians, and even claim to be libertarians, but when in power they'll do what they've always done. I simply don't understand why you insist on referring to these people as libertarians. It's quite dishonest.

 

[Paulie]

I've never really paid attention to the Libertarian Party as, to my knowledge, it has little or no presence here in Nevada where I live. But, after doing some research, I might consider aligning myself with it and will see just what presence it has here. Here are two of their official links:
Libertarian Party | Maximum Freedom, Minimum Government
Platform | Libertarian Party

And, this is from Wikipedia @ Libertarian Party (United States) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The Libertarian Party is the third largest[6] political party in the United States in terms of the popular vote in the country's elections and number of candidates run per election. It is also identified by many as the fastest growing political party in the United States.[7] The political platform of the Libertarian Party reflects the ideas of libertarianism, favoring minimally regulated markets, a less powerful state, strong civil liberties (including support for same-sex marriage and other LGBT rights), the legalization of cannabis, separation of church and state, open immigration, non-interventionism and neutrality in diplomatic relations (i.e., avoiding foreign military or economic entanglements with other nations), freedom of trade and travel to all foreign countries, and a more responsive and direct democracy.[8] The Libertarian Party has also supported the repeal of NAFTA, CAFTA, and similar trade agreements, as well as the United States' exit from the United Nations, WTO, and NATO.[9]

However, as someone posted, we tend to turn to government to solve all of our problems. Reducing government sounds like a good idea but has drawbacks most of us don't wish to deal with.

Public libraries calling for entry and lending fees because they're no longer supported by tax dollars.

Pay to enter and use your local park.

Only receive police and fire services if you live within that specific tax entity and be forced to pay a fee like other utilities for lack of tax base.

And so it goes.

I think it was a fear of the GOP established by the DNC that Gov Romney would do things just like that. We've become, I'm afraid, a Handout Society.

I'm only assuming here, but I'll bet the LP has a pretty strong presence in NV. It's one of the states that placed the most libertarians into local and state positions of leadership this past year.

 

[longknife]

It has everything to do with it as I already said that most of you government haters have no problem with using it for your own extraordinarily narrow purposes. If you don't want to be continually lumped in with the pretenders then it is what passes for the libertarian party's fault for trying to broaden their base among the hillbilly retards. I live in a southern state where they hate the federal government but they love to outlaw things that harm no one. This is your new libertarian party and it is a massive hypocritical joke.

I wasn't aware the Libertarian Party was in power in any states. Which one is it?

You almost act as if you are unaware that the teaparty republicans are calling themselves libertarians when it suits them, acting as if all it entails is a reactionary hatred of everything federal, these are the ones ruining your image and the kind of person that makes up the bulk of American libertarians. I can admit that you at least walk the walk but the OP asks why more people are not libertarians and the real answer is that the crazies have ruined the brand. I have no faith that any candidate of the libertarian party would not revert to basic knee jerk conservative republican if they were to gain power in some way because that is what they are at heart.

I, for one, can't figure out where you get that label! There are conservative Republicans who are supported by groups calling themselves Tea Party as they DO NOT WANT to align themselves with any of the current political parties!

 

[occupied]

Pointing out that conservatives aren't libertarians has what to do with this discussion?

It has everything to do with it as I already said that most of you government haters have no problem with using it for your own extraordinarily narrow purposes. If you don't want to be continually lumped in with the pretenders then it is what passes for the libertarian party's fault for trying to broaden their base among the hillbilly retards. I live in a southern state where they hate the federal government but they love to outlaw things that harm no one. This is your new libertarian party and it is a massive hypocritical joke.

Come talk to me when you've shed this incessant desire to lump everything into particular groups...and PARTIES for that matter.

The few REAL libertarians on this board dismiss the LP, just an fyi.

Yeah, there's another problem I have with you guys, an automatic rejection of others who call themselves libertarians when they make you look like idiots or hypocrites. How are you supposed to gain a consensus with an ideology that slippery and prone to division? Every one of you seems to be a party of one and go to great lengths to avoid being identified with any issue preferring to stand alone at the fringes simply repeating that everyone else is wrong about everything and offering nothing to the discussion except impossible pipe dreams of utopian bliss if we would all just do what you say.

 

[Paulie]

It has everything to do with it as I already said that most of you government haters have no problem with using it for your own extraordinarily narrow purposes. If you don't want to be continually lumped in with the pretenders then it is what passes for the libertarian party's fault for trying to broaden their base among the hillbilly retards. I live in a southern state where they hate the federal government but they love to outlaw things that harm no one. This is your new libertarian party and it is a massive hypocritical joke.

Come talk to me when you've shed this incessant desire to lump everything into particular groups...and PARTIES for that matter.

The few REAL libertarians on this board dismiss the LP, just an fyi.

Yeah, there's another problem I have with you guys, an automatic rejection of others who call themselves libertarians when they make you look like idiots or hypocrites. How are you supposed to gain a consensus with an ideology that slippery and prone to division? Every one of you seems to be a party of one and go to great lengths to avoid being identified with any issue preferring to stand alone at the fringes simply repeating that everyone else is wrong about everything and offering nothing to the discussion except impossible pipe dreams of utopian bliss if we would all just do what you say.

I don't dismiss anyone that stays true to the individual freedom platform. The moment someone becomes authoritarian, that's when I reject them. You give authoritarianism and inch and it'll take a mile. There's no room for that in the ideology.

Other than that, be different all you want. Not all libertarians agree on everything. I don't even agree with Ron Paul on everything.

 

[occupied]

I wasn't aware the Libertarian Party was in power in any states. Which one is it?

You almost act as if you are unaware that the teaparty republicans are calling themselves libertarians when it suits them, acting as if all it entails is a reactionary hatred of everything federal, these are the ones ruining your image and the kind of person that makes up the bulk of American libertarians. I can admit that you at least walk the walk but the OP asks why more people are not libertarians and the real answer is that the crazies have ruined the brand. I have no faith that any candidate of the libertarian party would not revert to basic knee jerk conservative republican if they were to gain power in some way because that is what they are at heart.

I, for one, can't figure out where you get that label! There are conservative Republicans who are supported by groups calling themselves Tea Party as they DO NOT WANT to align themselves with any of the current political parties!

They vote republican, they caucus with the republicans when elected and fall back to default republicanism when they think no one is paying attention. I call them teaparty republicans because they are the same old republicans with a racing stripe.

 

[Paulie]

I agree with Rand on even LESS, but I still give him the benefit of the doubt becuase so far he hasn't done anything legislatively that restricts freedom. In fact he seems to be the lone REAL voice in the Senate for the cause.

 

[occupied]

Come talk to me when you've shed this incessant desire to lump everything into particular groups...and PARTIES for that matter.

The few REAL libertarians on this board dismiss the LP, just an fyi.

Yeah, there's another problem I have with you guys, an automatic rejection of others who call themselves libertarians when they make you look like idiots or hypocrites. How are you supposed to gain a consensus with an ideology that slippery and prone to division? Every one of you seems to be a party of one and go to great lengths to avoid being identified with any issue preferring to stand alone at the fringes simply repeating that everyone else is wrong about everything and offering nothing to the discussion except impossible pipe dreams of utopian bliss if we would all just do what you say.

I don't dismiss anyone that stays true to the individual freedom platform. The moment someone becomes authoritarian, that's when I reject them. You give authoritarianism and inch and it'll take a mile. There's no room for that in the ideology.

Other than that, be different all you want. Not all libertarians agree on everything. I don't even agree with Ron Paul on everything.

That's fine for you but politics involves consensus, teamwork and compromise, without that you are not involved in politics, merely a detached critic.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

Yeah, there's another problem I have with you guys, an automatic rejection of others who call themselves libertarians when they make you look like idiots or hypocrites. How are you supposed to gain a consensus with an ideology that slippery and prone to division? Every one of you seems to be a party of one and go to great lengths to avoid being identified with any issue preferring to stand alone at the fringes simply repeating that everyone else is wrong about everything and offering nothing to the discussion except impossible pipe dreams of utopian bliss if we would all just do what you say.

I don't dismiss anyone that stays true to the individual freedom platform. The moment someone becomes authoritarian, that's when I reject them. You give authoritarianism and inch and it'll take a mile. There's no room for that in the ideology.

Other than that, be different all you want. Not all libertarians agree on everything. I don't even agree with Ron Paul on everything.

That's fine for you but politics involves consensus, teamwork and compromise, without that you are not involved in politics, merely a detached critic.

As far as I'm aware Paulie isn't involved in politics, aside from possibly campaigning for candidates he supports. Regardless, nobody on this board is likely involved in politics, and we're all merely critics.

 

[occupied]

I don't dismiss anyone that stays true to the individual freedom platform. The moment someone becomes authoritarian, that's when I reject them. You give authoritarianism and inch and it'll take a mile. There's no room for that in the ideology.

Other than that, be different all you want. Not all libertarians agree on everything. I don't even agree with Ron Paul on everything.

That's fine for you but politics involves consensus, teamwork and compromise, without that you are not involved in politics, merely a detached critic.

As far as I'm aware Paulie isn't involved in politics, aside from possibly campaigning for candidates he supports. Regardless, nobody on this board is likely involved in politics, and we're all merely critics.

At it's most basic level politics is simply the activity of getting people to rally to your position on an issue possibly by deal making and compromise, being an ideological purist is to reject this. I wonder at the "my way or the highway" attitude of many self described libertarians, I do not see any respect for the ideas and ideals of others there at all, one of the pillars of a free society.

 

[Contumacious]

That's fine for you but politics involves consensus, teamwork and compromise, without that you are not involved in politics, merely a detached critic.

As far as I'm aware Paulie isn't involved in politics, aside from possibly campaigning for candidates he supports. Regardless, nobody on this board is likely involved in politics, and we're all merely critics.

At it's most basic level politics is simply the activity of getting people to rally to your position on an issue possibly by deal making and compromise, being an ideological purist is to reject this. I wonder at the "my way or the highway" attitude of many self described libertarians, I do not see any respect for the ideas and ideals of others there at all, one of the pillars of a free society.

Do you know why we are only 17 Trillion dollars in the hole? Becuase the republicans and the democrats compromised . Otherwise the debt would have been 34 TTTTrillions.


Do you know why TSA agents only check our balls? Because of a compromise. Originally Congress wanted to give the agents the authority to insert their honorable fingers up are assholes.

Do you know why we have the "Patriot" Act? Because of a A compromise. Originally the federal government wanted to declare permanent martial law.

I is very happy about compromises. I hope the Libertarians change.

As always Heil Hitler.

.

 

[longknife]

You almost act as if you are unaware that the teaparty republicans are calling themselves libertarians when it suits them, acting as if all it entails is a reactionary hatred of everything federal, these are the ones ruining your image and the kind of person that makes up the bulk of American libertarians. I can admit that you at least walk the walk but the OP asks why more people are not libertarians and the real answer is that the crazies have ruined the brand. I have no faith that any candidate of the libertarian party would not revert to basic knee jerk conservative republican if they were to gain power in some way because that is what they are at heart.

I, for one, can't figure out where you get that label! There are conservative Republicans who are supported by groups calling themselves Tea Party as they DO NOT WANT to align themselves with any of the current political parties!

They vote republican, they caucus with the republicans when elected and fall back to default republicanism when they think no one is paying attention. I call them teaparty republicans because they are the same old republicans with a racing stripe.

They have formed their own Tea Party Cacus but, due to the rules of the House and Senate, they cannot be anything but Republican, Democrat, or Independent. They go to where they have a chance at getting committee assignments - which are handed out according to political party. If you're going to be productive and truly represent your constituents, you have to play by the rules.

 

[Mac1958]

.

My problem with Libertarians is that they have gone the absolutist route for as long as I can remember. I think that's a shame, because my guess is that a pragmatic fiscal conservative/social liberal approach is favored by a large percentage of Americans. But when you start talking about abolishing a long list of departments and safety net mechanisms, you lose most of us.

Funny how moderation is good in eating, drinking, exercise and life in general, but it's taboo in politics.

.

 

[dblack]

.

My problem with Libertarians is that they have gone the absolutist route for as long as I can remember. I think that's a shame, because my guess is that a pragmatic fiscal conservative/social liberal approach is favored by a large percentage of Americans. But when you start talking about abolishing a long list of departments and safety net mechanisms, you lose most of us..

This has been the source of much debate within the party. Apparently, so far, the consensus has been that the notoriety of the extreme positions gets the party more attention, a net good under the theory that there's no such thing as bad press. Some of us think it's time to review that approach.

 

[Mac1958]

.

My problem with Libertarians is that they have gone the absolutist route for as long as I can remember. I think that's a shame, because my guess is that a pragmatic fiscal conservative/social liberal approach is favored by a large percentage of Americans. But when you start talking about abolishing a long list of departments and safety net mechanisms, you lose most of us..

This has been the source of much debate within the party. Apparently, so far, the consensus has been that the notoriety of the extreme positions gets the party more attention, a net good under the theory that there's no such thing as bad press. Some of us think it's time to review that approach.

Boy, I'd love to see that. With dissatisfaction as high as it is, the door is wide open.

.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Because libertarianism just like communism is a philosophy for criminals.