Why are we so afraid to admit the obvious?

[candycorn]

Given the spate of recent violence, the board is understandably abuzz with threads and comments about who is to "blame". And of course, each end is essentially putting 100% of the blame on the other end. Each end is laying out a long list of examples of violence, rhetoric and incitement by the other end.

Guess what? They're both right. Facts are facts.

I have a great deal of respect for the power of ideology. It can make people say and do insane things. It can absolutely blind a person to the obvious. But is it so strong that we'd rather see this country burn down than challenge our own tribe to stop the madness?

When the hate is flowing from both ends like water from a fire hose, does it really matter which end is "worse"?

What is so terrifying about just admitting the obvious?
.

A Trump supporter Sent packages through the mail that contained bombs. Another idiot was so enraged by the hysteria preached by the blob about the migrants heading northward that he shot a dozen people in Pittsburgh.

No dumbass. Both sides aren’t right.

Not Trump's fault. Same as it was not Bernie's fault when his supporter tried to kill Republicans. Grow up, loser.

Cite Bernie’s speeches where he incited violence.

Are you kidding? At every GOP rally his supporters were the violent ones. Heck his whole rhetoric is "revolution". You know many revolutions w/o violence? You're obviously trolling now.

Still awaiting the quote from Bernie.

 

[BrokeLoser]

Now consider Consevatism. Constant pining for civil war, gunning down migrants calling them an invading army, a President that preaches hate, posters here who have avatars pointing a gun at the camera, constant chants of locking up your political enemies, ripping kids from their parents as a “deterrent”. I would submit that the climate of the GOP is one where most days are beautiful but the bad weather days are much more frequent.

We are at war with the lying traitorous left. No compromise, no reaching across the isle the left must be defeated not bargained with. So far so good we control the House, Senate, White House and SCOTUS.

Nailed it.
Good people, good Americans are so fed up...in no way do we seek to get along with the Left on ANY level...we’re done. Its game on and it’s a fucking war. Embrace it and fight...this political climate is not for bipartisan pussies. Time to SACK UP!

 

[AzogtheDefiler]

Trying to talk sense into either side on this issue is totally pointless Moonglow.
Kids on the playground, sniveling "He started it!"
Mac's got a good question. WHY? Are we responsible adults or not?

I think it's a symptom of being controlled by an ideology. It makes people terrified to give an inch.

Additionally, I think it's possible that an ideologue really doesn't see most, if not all, the sins of their side. That's another symptom: Myopia. So when they ask for examples of what should be screamingly obvious, it may be that they really don't know what you're talking about.

That's how powerful this stuff is.
.

Interesting. And I suppose on a political board, you will find real ideologues. I don't know about the right wingers, but some of the Democrat/lefties here are definitely not "seeing it."

Well, the right wingers will deny that anything has been done or said on their side that has contributed to this.

Anything.

They appear to be serious, sincere. Hence my point.
.

Rhetoric has always been there. Crazy people have always been there. Two are not necessarily equated. The Left has advocated for violence just as much as the GOP if not moreso.

Yes, both have. And when it's so prevalent, which side is worse is essentially irrelevant. It all feeds into the momentum.
.

If I state that I don't think Affirmative Action is reasonable and you respond with calling me a racist and I laugh, then violence occurs. Tolerance has been lost because the Left has gone insane:

• Guilty until proven innocent -- see Kavanaugh...but NOT Ellison or Clinton
• Open Borders --- see caravan and DACA. Don't care about our veterans.
• Disrespect the Flag --- Palestinian flag flown at the DNC but state flag of Miss is banned.
• Disney movies are bad --- depict males in roles of authority. Sleeping Beauty never gave permission to be kissed. Ariel lost her voice for man.
• 31 different genders --- dismiss those who believe there are only 2.

This is insanity. We will see how voters respond. In fact it is so insane I am about to register as full GOP and lose my Independent tag. My wife, a life long Democrat has switched to GOP. Sad.

 

[candycorn]

Given the spate of recent violence, the board is understandably abuzz with threads and comments about who is to "blame". And of course, each end is essentially putting 100% of the blame on the other end. Each end is laying out a long list of examples of violence, rhetoric and incitement by the other end.

Guess what? They're both right. Facts are facts.

I have a great deal of respect for the power of ideology. It can make people say and do insane things. It can absolutely blind a person to the obvious. But is it so strong that we'd rather see this country burn down than challenge our own tribe to stop the madness?

When the hate is flowing from both ends like water from a fire hose, does it really matter which end is "worse"?

What is so terrifying about just admitting the obvious?
.

How have you challenged your tribe?

Bump

 

[AzogtheDefiler]

Trying to talk sense into either side on this issue is totally pointless Moonglow.
Kids on the playground, sniveling "He started it!"
Mac's got a good question. WHY? Are we responsible adults or not?

I think it's a symptom of being controlled by an ideology. It makes people terrified to give an inch.

Additionally, I think it's possible that an ideologue really doesn't see most, if not all, the sins of their side. That's another symptom: Myopia. So when they ask for examples of what should be screamingly obvious, it may be that they really don't know what you're talking about.

That's how powerful this stuff is.
.

Interesting. And I suppose on a political board, you will find real ideologues. I don't know about the right wingers, but some of the Democrat/lefties here are definitely not "seeing it."

Well, the right wingers will deny that anything has been done or said on their side that has contributed to this.

Anything.

They appear to be serious, sincere. Hence my point.
.

Rhetoric has always been there. Crazy people have always been there. Two are not necessarily equated. The Left has advocated for violence just as much as the GOP if not moreso.

Factually incorrect. I seem to have missed any Dem Presidential Nominee volunteering to pay the legal bills for those committing assault at their rallies.

Your mileage may vary

That was a joke. Obviously Leftists don't have a sense of humor. Did you miss HRC calling half the country a basket of deplorables. LOL. Or Maxine Waters or Eric Holder advocating direct violence and not apoligizing for it?

 

[AzogtheDefiler]

Given the spate of recent violence, the board is understandably abuzz with threads and comments about who is to "blame". And of course, each end is essentially putting 100% of the blame on the other end. Each end is laying out a long list of examples of violence, rhetoric and incitement by the other end.

Guess what? They're both right. Facts are facts.

I have a great deal of respect for the power of ideology. It can make people say and do insane things. It can absolutely blind a person to the obvious. But is it so strong that we'd rather see this country burn down than challenge our own tribe to stop the madness?

When the hate is flowing from both ends like water from a fire hose, does it really matter which end is "worse"?

What is so terrifying about just admitting the obvious?
.

A Trump supporter Sent packages through the mail that contained bombs. Another idiot was so enraged by the hysteria preached by the blob about the migrants heading northward that he shot a dozen people in Pittsburgh.

No dumbass. Both sides aren’t right.

Not Trump's fault. Same as it was not Bernie's fault when his supporter tried to kill Republicans. Grow up, loser.

Cite Bernie’s speeches where he incited violence.

Are you kidding? At every GOP rally his supporters were the violent ones. Heck his whole rhetoric is "revolution". You know many revolutions w/o violence? You're obviously trolling now.

Still awaiting the quote from Bernie.

Then Google it. It is your friend. Do you deny that a Sanders supporter tried to kill the GOP softball team?

 

[Mac1958]

I think it's a symptom of being controlled by an ideology. It makes people terrified to give an inch.

Additionally, I think it's possible that an ideologue really doesn't see most, if not all, the sins of their side. That's another symptom: Myopia. So when they ask for examples of what should be screamingly obvious, it may be that they really don't know what you're talking about.

That's how powerful this stuff is.
.

Interesting. And I suppose on a political board, you will find real ideologues. I don't know about the right wingers, but some of the Democrat/lefties here are definitely not "seeing it."

Well, the right wingers will deny that anything has been done or said on their side that has contributed to this.

Anything.

They appear to be serious, sincere. Hence my point.
.

Rhetoric has always been there. Crazy people have always been there. Two are not necessarily equated. The Left has advocated for violence just as much as the GOP if not moreso.

Yes, both have. And when it's so prevalent, which side is worse is essentially irrelevant. It all feeds into the momentum.
.

If I state that I don't think Affirmative Action is reasonable and you respond with calling me a racist and I laugh, then violence occurs. Tolerance has been lost because the Left has gone insane:

• Guilty until proven innocent -- see Kavanaugh...but NOT Ellison or Clinton
• Open Borders --- see caravan and DACA. Don't care about our veterans.
• Disrespect the Flag --- Palestinian flag flown at the DNC but state flag of Miss is banned.
• Disney movies are bad --- depict males in roles of authority. Sleeping Beauty never gave permission to be kissed. Ariel lost her voice for man.
• 31 different genders --- dismiss those who believe there are only 2.

This is insanity. We will see how voters respond. In fact it is so insane I am about to register as full GOP and lose my Independent tag. My wife, a life long Democrat has switched to GOP. Sad.

Okay, those would be examples of complaints the Right has about the Left.

And?
.

 

[AzogtheDefiler]

Interesting. And I suppose on a political board, you will find real ideologues. I don't know about the right wingers, but some of the Democrat/lefties here are definitely not "seeing it."

Well, the right wingers will deny that anything has been done or said on their side that has contributed to this.

Anything.

They appear to be serious, sincere. Hence my point.
.

Rhetoric has always been there. Crazy people have always been there. Two are not necessarily equated. The Left has advocated for violence just as much as the GOP if not moreso.

Yes, both have. And when it's so prevalent, which side is worse is essentially irrelevant. It all feeds into the momentum.
.

If I state that I don't think Affirmative Action is reasonable and you respond with calling me a racist and I laugh, then violence occurs. Tolerance has been lost because the Left has gone insane:

• Guilty until proven innocent -- see Kavanaugh...but NOT Ellison or Clinton
• Open Borders --- see caravan and DACA. Don't care about our veterans.
• Disrespect the Flag --- Palestinian flag flown at the DNC but state flag of Miss is banned.
• Disney movies are bad --- depict males in roles of authority. Sleeping Beauty never gave permission to be kissed. Ariel lost her voice for man.
• 31 different genders --- dismiss those who believe there are only 2.

This is insanity. We will see how voters respond. In fact it is so insane I am about to register as full GOP and lose my Independent tag. My wife, a life long Democrat has switched to GOP. Sad.

Okay, those would be examples of complaints the Right has about the Left.

And?
.

Those are facts that are not in dispute. And? And don't you agree all those views are insane?

 

[DOTR]

Trying to talk sense into either side on this issue is totally pointless Moonglow.
Kids on the playground, sniveling "He started it!"
Mac's got a good question. WHY? Are we responsible adults or not?

I think it's a symptom of being controlled by an ideology. It makes people terrified to give an inch.

Additionally, I think it's possible that an ideologue really doesn't see most, if not all, the sins of their side. That's another symptom: Myopia. So when they ask for examples of what should be screamingly obvious, it may be that they really don't know what you're talking about.

That's how powerful this stuff is.
.

Interesting. And I suppose on a political board, you will find real ideologues. I don't know about the right wingers, but some of the Democrat/lefties here are definitely not "seeing it."

Well, the right wingers will deny that anything has been done or said on their side that has contributed to this.

Anything.

They appear to be serious, sincere. Hence my point.
.

What right wingers? Contributing to what? You are still asking "when did you stop beating your wife?"

You see resistance to elite rule as violence. So be it.

And if you have a shred of decency then try answering this question. Havent we tried voting? Elections? Played along with the charade?

What scares you is that people may begin to realize their votes and voices are, at best, ignored.

 

[candycorn]

I think it's a symptom of being controlled by an ideology. It makes people terrified to give an inch.

Additionally, I think it's possible that an ideologue really doesn't see most, if not all, the sins of their side. That's another symptom: Myopia. So when they ask for examples of what should be screamingly obvious, it may be that they really don't know what you're talking about.

That's how powerful this stuff is.
.

Interesting. And I suppose on a political board, you will find real ideologues. I don't know about the right wingers, but some of the Democrat/lefties here are definitely not "seeing it."

Well, the right wingers will deny that anything has been done or said on their side that has contributed to this.

Anything.

They appear to be serious, sincere. Hence my point.
.

Rhetoric has always been there. Crazy people have always been there. Two are not necessarily equated. The Left has advocated for violence just as much as the GOP if not moreso.

Factually incorrect. I seem to have missed any Dem Presidential Nominee volunteering to pay the legal bills for those committing assault at their rallies.

Your mileage may vary

That was a joke. Obviously Leftists don't have a sense of humor. Did you miss HRC calling half the country a basket of deplorables. LOL. Or Maxine Waters or Eric Holder advocating direct violence and not apoligizing for it?

Didn’t see them advocating any such thing.

 

[candycorn]

A Trump supporter Sent packages through the mail that contained bombs. Another idiot was so enraged by the hysteria preached by the blob about the migrants heading northward that he shot a dozen people in Pittsburgh.

No dumbass. Both sides aren’t right.

Not Trump's fault. Same as it was not Bernie's fault when his supporter tried to kill Republicans. Grow up, loser.

Cite Bernie’s speeches where he incited violence.

Are you kidding? At every GOP rally his supporters were the violent ones. Heck his whole rhetoric is "revolution". You know many revolutions w/o violence? You're obviously trolling now.

Still awaiting the quote from Bernie.

Then Google it. It is your friend. Do you deny that a Sanders supporter tried to kill the GOP softball team?

Translation...he never did what you accused him of.

 

[Mac1958]

Well, the right wingers will deny that anything has been done or said on their side that has contributed to this.

Anything.

They appear to be serious, sincere. Hence my point.
.

Rhetoric has always been there. Crazy people have always been there. Two are not necessarily equated. The Left has advocated for violence just as much as the GOP if not moreso.

Yes, both have. And when it's so prevalent, which side is worse is essentially irrelevant. It all feeds into the momentum.
.

If I state that I don't think Affirmative Action is reasonable and you respond with calling me a racist and I laugh, then violence occurs. Tolerance has been lost because the Left has gone insane:

• Guilty until proven innocent -- see Kavanaugh...but NOT Ellison or Clinton
• Open Borders --- see caravan and DACA. Don't care about our veterans.
• Disrespect the Flag --- Palestinian flag flown at the DNC but state flag of Miss is banned.
• Disney movies are bad --- depict males in roles of authority. Sleeping Beauty never gave permission to be kissed. Ariel lost her voice for man.
• 31 different genders --- dismiss those who believe there are only 2.

This is insanity. We will see how voters respond. In fact it is so insane I am about to register as full GOP and lose my Independent tag. My wife, a life long Democrat has switched to GOP. Sad.

Okay, those would be examples of complaints the Right has about the Left.

And?
.

Those are facts that are not in dispute. And? And don't you agree all those views are insane?

My point is that you only seem to see the sins of one side.

Which is the point of the thread.
.

 

[AzogtheDefiler]

Interesting. And I suppose on a political board, you will find real ideologues. I don't know about the right wingers, but some of the Democrat/lefties here are definitely not "seeing it."

Well, the right wingers will deny that anything has been done or said on their side that has contributed to this.

Anything.

They appear to be serious, sincere. Hence my point.
.

Rhetoric has always been there. Crazy people have always been there. Two are not necessarily equated. The Left has advocated for violence just as much as the GOP if not moreso.

Factually incorrect. I seem to have missed any Dem Presidential Nominee volunteering to pay the legal bills for those committing assault at their rallies.

Your mileage may vary

That was a joke. Obviously Leftists don't have a sense of humor. Did you miss HRC calling half the country a basket of deplorables. LOL. Or Maxine Waters or Eric Holder advocating direct violence and not apoligizing for it?

Didn’t see them advocating any such thing.

Then you're not looking

 

[Tumblin Tumbleweed]

Trying to talk sense into either side on this issue is totally pointless Moonglow.
Kids on the playground, sniveling "He started it!"
Mac's got a good question. WHY? Are we responsible adults or not?

I think it's a symptom of being controlled by an ideology. It makes people terrified to give an inch.

Additionally, I think it's possible that an ideologue really doesn't see most, if not all, the sins of their side. That's another symptom: Myopia. So when they ask for examples of what should be screamingly obvious, it may be that they really don't know what you're talking about.

That's how powerful this stuff is.
.

Interesting. And I suppose on a political board, you will find real ideologues. I don't know about the right wingers, but some of the Democrat/lefties here are definitely not "seeing it."

Well, the right wingers will deny that anything has been done or said on their side that has contributed to this.

Anything.

They appear to be serious, sincere. Hence my point.
.

Rhetoric has always been there. Crazy people have always been there. Two are not necessarily equated. The Left has advocated for violence just as much as the GOP if not moreso.

What do we do about it?

 

[BasicHumanUnit]

What the OP is doing, in addition to this.....Argument to moderation - Wikipedia

Is correlating the acts of a FEW nuts who claimed to be RW...to a MUCH larger, MUCH more vocal (Maxine waters etc), MUCH more violent group (the left)

To assert that the Right has "just as many examples" of violent behavior as the collective Left is ludicrous at best, deliberately deceptive at worst. This held true even going back 100 years or more as the lynchings and segregationists were nearly always Democrats.

Obama stoked racial division ad nausea during his 8 years. Trump has done no such thing. In fact, Trump has gone out of his way to honor past black soldiers and other minorities. Obama wouldn't even salute white Marines guarding Marine One.

sorry, the OP FAILS
It is nowhere near equal.

 

[AzogtheDefiler]

Not Trump's fault. Same as it was not Bernie's fault when his supporter tried to kill Republicans. Grow up, loser.

Cite Bernie’s speeches where he incited violence.

Are you kidding? At every GOP rally his supporters were the violent ones. Heck his whole rhetoric is "revolution". You know many revolutions w/o violence? You're obviously trolling now.

Still awaiting the quote from Bernie.

Then Google it. It is your friend. Do you deny that a Sanders supporter tried to kill the GOP softball team?

Translation...he never did what you accused him of.

I am not your search monkey. Figure it out. He most certainly did.

 

[DOTR]

Okay, those would be examples of complaints the Right has about the Left.

And?
.

And..since they are all antithetical to American culture and history...and have been rejected by the American people...how should we react when they are imposed anyhow?
Lets take an example. Gay marriage. We didnt want it considered. When forced to consider it we, even California, crushingly voted it down. But not only was it imposed on us but the left moved immediately to make any disagreement with it grounds for digital execution. All opposition is now suppressed as hate speech.

What do you suggest people who refuse to be serfs do in such a case? What would (did) Thomas Jefferson and George Washington have done if told they couldn't vote and couldn't speak on an issue?

 

[AzogtheDefiler]

Rhetoric has always been there. Crazy people have always been there. Two are not necessarily equated. The Left has advocated for violence just as much as the GOP if not moreso.

Yes, both have. And when it's so prevalent, which side is worse is essentially irrelevant. It all feeds into the momentum.
.

If I state that I don't think Affirmative Action is reasonable and you respond with calling me a racist and I laugh, then violence occurs. Tolerance has been lost because the Left has gone insane:

• Guilty until proven innocent -- see Kavanaugh...but NOT Ellison or Clinton
• Open Borders --- see caravan and DACA. Don't care about our veterans.
• Disrespect the Flag --- Palestinian flag flown at the DNC but state flag of Miss is banned.
• Disney movies are bad --- depict males in roles of authority. Sleeping Beauty never gave permission to be kissed. Ariel lost her voice for man.
• 31 different genders --- dismiss those who believe there are only 2.

This is insanity. We will see how voters respond. In fact it is so insane I am about to register as full GOP and lose my Independent tag. My wife, a life long Democrat has switched to GOP. Sad.

Okay, those would be examples of complaints the Right has about the Left.

And?
.

Those are facts that are not in dispute. And? And don't you agree all those views are insane?

My point is that you only seem to see the sins of one side.

Which is the point of the thread.
.

Do you or do you not agree that those views are insane? If you say "yes" then we can be on the same page and address the other side.

 

[candycorn]

Well, the right wingers will deny that anything has been done or said on their side that has contributed to this.

Anything.

They appear to be serious, sincere. Hence my point.
.

Rhetoric has always been there. Crazy people have always been there. Two are not necessarily equated. The Left has advocated for violence just as much as the GOP if not moreso.

Factually incorrect. I seem to have missed any Dem Presidential Nominee volunteering to pay the legal bills for those committing assault at their rallies.

Your mileage may vary

That was a joke. Obviously Leftists don't have a sense of humor. Did you miss HRC calling half the country a basket of deplorables. LOL. Or Maxine Waters or Eric Holder advocating direct violence and not apoligizing for it?

Didn’t see them advocating any such thing.

Then you're not looking

Ok

 

[AzogtheDefiler]

Trying to talk sense into either side on this issue is totally pointless Moonglow.
Kids on the playground, sniveling "He started it!"
Mac's got a good question. WHY? Are we responsible adults or not?

I think it's a symptom of being controlled by an ideology. It makes people terrified to give an inch.

Additionally, I think it's possible that an ideologue really doesn't see most, if not all, the sins of their side. That's another symptom: Myopia. So when they ask for examples of what should be screamingly obvious, it may be that they really don't know what you're talking about.

That's how powerful this stuff is.
.

Interesting. And I suppose on a political board, you will find real ideologues. I don't know about the right wingers, but some of the Democrat/lefties here are definitely not "seeing it."

Well, the right wingers will deny that anything has been done or said on their side that has contributed to this.

Anything.

They appear to be serious, sincere. Hence my point.
.

Rhetoric has always been there. Crazy people have always been there. Two are not necessarily equated. The Left has advocated for violence just as much as the GOP if not moreso.

What do we do about it?

We live with it like we have since inception.