Who's to Blame: Big Government or Big Business?

[georgephillip]

And the TEA Party wants a lot of things that the Libertarian's want as well............

The TEA Party wants true Conservatives and not those attached at the hip like the RINO's.............

Your last statement appears to state the TEA Party is a bad thing.............

Is it............

The Tea Party goals of reducing corruption and spending are great in principle. In practice they have focused on petty partisan politics and destroyed their credibility. Hence their low ratings by We the People.

The claim that turds like you want to reduce spending simply isn't believable. The main reason you oppose the TEA party is the fact that they have actually tried to cut spending. That's what you are calling "partisan politics."

Or maybe the Tea Party proves its partisan politics by which aspects of government spending it wants to cut and which 1% of American citizens it wants to protect from paying higher taxes?

 

[OODA_Loop]

Or maybe the Tea Party proves its partisan politics by which aspects of government spending it wants to cut and which 1% of American citizens it wants to protect from paying higher taxes?

TeaParty wants ALL to pay less taxes.

 

[georgephillip]

Or maybe the Tea Party proves its partisan politics by which aspects of government spending it wants to cut and which 1% of American citizens it wants to protect from paying higher taxes?

TeaParty wants ALL to pay less taxes.

Including corporations which are currently hiding trillion$ off shore?

"NEW YORK (Reuters) - Large U.S. companies boosted their offshore earnings by 15 percent last year to a record $1.9 trillion, avoiding hefty tax bills by keeping the profits abroad, according to a new report."

U.S. Companies' Offshore Earnings Hit Record $1.9 Trillion: Study

 

[The T]

Or maybe the Tea Party proves its partisan politics by which aspects of government spending it wants to cut and which 1% of American citizens it wants to protect from paying higher taxes?

TeaParty wants ALL to pay less taxes.

Including corporations which are currently hiding trillion$ off shore?

"NEW YORK (Reuters) - Large U.S. companies boosted their offshore earnings by 15 percent last year to a record $1.9 trillion, avoiding hefty tax bills by keeping the profits abroad, according to a new report."

U.S. Companies' Offshore Earnings Hit Record $1.9 Trillion: Study

Is it the Companys' Money or Government's? LET US BE CLEAR HERE.
I know the answer...do YOU?

 

[georgephillip]

TeaParty wants ALL to pay less taxes.

Including corporations which are currently hiding trillion$ off shore?

"NEW YORK (Reuters) - Large U.S. companies boosted their offshore earnings by 15 percent last year to a record $1.9 trillion, avoiding hefty tax bills by keeping the profits abroad, according to a new report."

U.S. Companies' Offshore Earnings Hit Record $1.9 Trillion: Study

Is it the Companys' Money or Government's? LET US BE CLEAR HERE.
I know the answer...do YOU?

I would say it's the company's money, and they owe government a reasonable share of it for services rendered.

 

[OODA_Loop]

Including corporations which are currently hiding trillion$ off shore?

Sure less taxes for everyone.

 

[georgephillip]

Including corporations which are currently hiding trillion$ off shore?

Sure less taxes for everyone.

Because the richest 0.1% need more money?

"This carried interest loophole benefits managers of financial partnerships such as hedge funds, private equity funds, venture capital funds and real estate funds — who are among the highest-paid people in the world.

"John Paulson, a hedge fund manager in New York City, made $4.9 billion last year, top of the chart for hedge fund managers, according to AR Magazine, which follows hedge funds.

"That’s equivalent to the average per capita income of 184,000 Americans, according to my back-of-envelope calculations based on Census Bureau figures.

"Mr. Paulson declined to comment on this tax break, but here’s how it works. These fund managers are compensated mostly with a performance bonus of 20 percent or more of the profits they make.

"Under this carried interest loophole, that 20 percent is eligible to be taxed at the long-term capital gains rate (if the fund’s underlying assets are held long enough) of just 15 percent rather than the regular personal income rate of 35 percent."

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/07/07/opinion/07kristof.html?_r=0

 

[eagle1462010]

The Tea Party goals of reducing corruption and spending are great in principle. In practice they have focused on petty partisan politics and destroyed their credibility. Hence their low ratings by We the People.

The claim that turds like you want to reduce spending simply isn't believable. The main reason you oppose the TEA party is the fact that they have actually tried to cut spending. That's what you are calling "partisan politics."

Or maybe the Tea Party proves its partisan politics by which aspects of government spending it wants to cut and which 1% of American citizens it wants to protect from paying higher taxes?

That is a straw man argument. That is the classic example of Using Class Warfare strategies in politics.........................

While I don't speak for the TEA Party itself, I have time and time again proposed spending cuts across the board which would include the military. I have used Historical data in order to do so............ And historically our revenues have been approximately 18 % of the GDP irregardless of tax rates since WWII.......With small spikes over time.........

We are now spending at a rate of nearly 25% of the GDP which is unsustainable...........

I have proposed Flat tax rates with no deductions. Getting Rid of the current Loop Holes that so many use across the range of incomes to pay less, not at all, or etc.............

In other words the KISS PRINCIPLE..........Keep It Simple Stupid............

A whole different thread which has been pounded on time and time again.

While I openly condemn the markets and currency manipulation I DO NOT TRASH ALL who make a lot of money...........That is BS.........

If they made it HONEST, then they earned it. If they made it through USURPERY then they can kiss my butt.

 

[eagle1462010]

The Tea Party replaces one specie of Republican with another.
Given the level of corruption in DC, injecting new political blood in the form of Libertarian or Green party candidates into the congress could make it much more difficult for moneyed interests to continue their stranglehold on US politics.

And the TEA Party wants a lot of things that the Libertarian's want as well............

The TEA Party wants true Conservatives and not those attached at the hip like the RINO's.............

Your last statement appears to state the TEA Party is a bad thing.............

Is it............

The Tea Party goals of reducing corruption and spending are great in principle. In practice they have focused on petty partisan politics and destroyed their credibility. Hence their low ratings by We the People.

Again a Straw man argument..........As the Status Quo attacks the TEA Party from both Parties because they dare take on the Status Quo who refuse to relinquish their power.............Power like the Chamber of Commerce............who buy politicians all the time.........Who are now OPENLY funding a fight with the TEA Party.............

This thread is about throwing out incumbents. The TEA Party has done so and will continue to do so...........which is what is being referred to as a RINO HUNT............

I've made it clear, that I approve of taking out RINO'S who are not TRUE CONSERVATIVES..................Who talk the talk..........but..........

Those RINO'S who are in bed with the Lobbyist need to go...........And more will fall in 2014.

 

[eagle1462010]

Including corporations which are currently hiding trillion$ off shore?

"NEW YORK (Reuters) - Large U.S. companies boosted their offshore earnings by 15 percent last year to a record $1.9 trillion, avoiding hefty tax bills by keeping the profits abroad, according to a new report."

U.S. Companies' Offshore Earnings Hit Record $1.9 Trillion: Study

Is it the Companys' Money or Government's? LET US BE CLEAR HERE.
I know the answer...do YOU?

I would say it's the company's money, and they owe government a reasonable share of it for services rendered.

And they already get large sums of money for services rendered..........
The problem exists in loop holes in the system, which is exactly why I favor a Flat Tax.

The next issue is that most CORPS will simply RAISE PRICES as their cost of doing business is increased. Which means we can thump are chest and say LOOK GE is PAYING MORE TAXES, while ignoring the price increases the average public pays for their products..............


Which is exactly why Strong Economies have always had a Strong Middle Class in history. It is the multitude that makes us strong. It is money circulation or VELOCITY that is a key indicator of Economic Performance.................

This indicator has been in steady decline since 2000. If it continues to decline so will our economic prosperity..................

That is not a Straw man argument. That is reality, just as it is reality on how the large banks have hosed the system through FIAT CURRENCY, SHADOW TRADING, aka Derivatives................

 

[Derideo_Te]

And the TEA Party wants a lot of things that the Libertarian's want as well............

The TEA Party wants true Conservatives and not those attached at the hip like the RINO's.............

Your last statement appears to state the TEA Party is a bad thing.............

Is it............

The Tea Party goals of reducing corruption and spending are great in principle. In practice they have focused on petty partisan politics and destroyed their credibility. Hence their low ratings by We the People.

Again a Straw man argument..........As the Status Quo attacks the TEA Party from both Parties because they dare take on the Status Quo who refuse to relinquish their power.............Power like the Chamber of Commerce............who buy politicians all the time.........Who are now OPENLY funding a fight with the TEA Party.............

This thread is about throwing out incumbents. The TEA Party has done so and will continue to do so...........which is what is being referred to as a RINO HUNT............

I've made it clear, that I approve of taking out RINO'S who are not TRUE CONSERVATIVES..................Who talk the talk..........but..........

Those RINO'S who are in bed with the Lobbyist need to go...........And more will fall in 2014.

The truth is not a straw man. The Tea Party members in office have done their cause far more harm than good. That is reflected by the polls of We the People and the reaction of the establishment GOP.

If the TP'ers were truly interested in dealing with corruption they would have been holding hearings on the corruption and leaking it to the media. They would have been working really hard on passing a budget that included realistic spending cuts instead of wasting their time passing mindless feel good "repeal Obamacare" nonsense.

The reason the TP'ers failed to accomplish their stated goals is because they are far more interested in pursuing their partisan agenda than their principles. Taking down "RINOs" is yet another fool's errand. All of those RINOs backed the insanity of the TP'ers when they shut down the government and yet you intend to repay them by throwing them out of office? That is called a betrayal and that is why the establishment GOP now sees the TP as a threat instead of an ally.

As an Independent I agree in principle with eliminating corruption and balancing the budget. But the way the TP has gone about it is completely wrong and done that cause more damage than anything else in my opinion.

 

[eagle1462010]

Capital Gains: Essential Tax Tips for Capital Gains & Losses

Capital Gains Holding Periods: Long Term & Short Term

Capital gains are taxed differently depending on whether your investment is considered long-term or short-term. How long you have held an investment is called the holding period.
The holding period is determined from the day after you bought your investment until the date you sell your investment. The IRS states, "To determine how long you held the investment property, begin counting on the date after the day you acquired the property. The day you disposed of the property is part of your holding period." (Publication 550; also refer to Revenue Ruling 70-598.)

The short-term holding period is one year or less. Short-term capital gains are taxed at ordinary income tax rates, which range from 10% to 39.6% for the year 2013.

The long-term holding period is more than one year. Long-term capital gains are taxed at long-term capital gains rates, which is usually less than ordinary tax rates. The long-term capital gains tax rate is either zero percent, 15%, or 20%, depending on your marginal tax bracket.

In addition, high income taxpayers may have a 3.8% unearned income Medicare contribution tax applied to their capital gains and other net investment income. Thus the highest tax rate that could apply to capital gains income is 39.6+3.8= 43.4% on short term gains taxed at ordinary rates or 23.8% (20% + 3.8%) on long-term gains.

Tax planning for investors focuses on deferring the sale of profitable investments until you qualify for the discounted long-term capital gains tax rate.

Flip a house and you could get taxed at 43.4%. Hold it a year and you could pay 23.8%.

Reinvest as businesses do, and you can show more business expenses to avoid paying the taxes all together, and business cost versus loss are part of the equation.......

Either way, when you cash out in any given year you can be taxed on all assets sold...............

We currently have a system set up in the IRS that rewards those that hold their money or assets for a period of at least one year...........Thus our own policy of taxation promotes the holding of assets.............

As far as bonds, and the casino of Wall Street, it's an entirely different animal when you look at the derivatives, Margin rates, and etc.............Using Fiat currency and worthless paper to artificially drive up the markets.................

That isn't EQUITABLE CAPITALISM.............that's a PYRAMID SCHEME.........Which will crash again, probably after the next election cycle.........

 

[eagle1462010]

Hence their lower ratings by the Media attack dogs from both sides of the equation.

Petty Partisan politics................What have the Status Quo CUT...............

NOTHING.................As our debt grows beyond reason................

On Obamacare, WE THE PEOPLE aren't happy with it. Unless you ignore public sentiment on the issue..........

The Shut Down was an attempt to Defund Obamacare, but ultimately should have been about CUTS TO GOV'T SPENDING................

The RINO'S caved and refused to walk away with CUTS on SPENDING, because we have 2 Parties all serving the same masters..............

The TEA Party want's a smaller Gov't. Wants cuts across the spectrum.

Fighting a Status Quo on both sides of the equation along the way...........

Holding hearings on the issue..........Every year Congress HOLD'S HEARINGS.........Every year the CBO, GAO, Treasury, and etc...........release reports that our current path is UNSUSTAINABLE.................

All ignored, as the Status Quo on both sides refuses to CUT Gov't..............

We will remain at odds on this subject...........And the TEA Party will not go away..........As our country is now projected to pay 800 BILLION a year on the INTEREST ON THE DEBT by 2020.....................

REALITY is a hard thing to grasp, when you choose to deny what is happening. There are those willing to face it, and fight against this continued debt, while others simply IGNORE IT.

The Tea Party goals of reducing corruption and spending are great in principle. In practice they have focused on petty partisan politics and destroyed their credibility. Hence their low ratings by We the People.

Again a Straw man argument..........As the Status Quo attacks the TEA Party from both Parties because they dare take on the Status Quo who refuse to relinquish their power.............Power like the Chamber of Commerce............who buy politicians all the time.........Who are now OPENLY funding a fight with the TEA Party.............

This thread is about throwing out incumbents. The TEA Party has done so and will continue to do so...........which is what is being referred to as a RINO HUNT............

I've made it clear, that I approve of taking out RINO'S who are not TRUE CONSERVATIVES..................Who talk the talk..........but..........

Those RINO'S who are in bed with the Lobbyist need to go...........And more will fall in 2014.

The truth is not a straw man. The Tea Party members in office have done their cause far more harm than good. That is reflected by the polls of We the People and the reaction of the establishment GOP.

If the TP'ers were truly interested in dealing with corruption they would have been holding hearings on the corruption and leaking it to the media. They would have been working really hard on passing a budget that included realistic spending cuts instead of wasting their time passing mindless feel good "repeal Obamacare" nonsense.

The reason the TP'ers failed to accomplish their stated goals is because they are far more interested in pursuing their partisan agenda than their principles. Taking down "RINOs" is yet another fool's errand. All of those RINOs backed the insanity of the TP'ers when they shut down the government and you you intend to repay them by throwing them out of office? That is called a betrayal and that is why the establishment GOP now sees the TP as a threat instead of an ally.

As an Independent I agree in principle with eliminating corruption and balancing the budget. But the way the TP has gone about it is completely wrong and done that cause more damage than anything else in my opinion.

 

[eagle1462010]

The reason the TP'ers failed to accomplish their stated goals is because they are far more interested in pursuing their partisan agenda than their principles. Taking down "RINOs" is yet another fool's errand. All of those RINOs backed the insanity of the TP'ers when they shut down the government and you you intend to repay them by throwing them out of office? That is called a betrayal and that is why the establishment GOP now sees the TP as a threat instead of an ally

.

Principles................The TEA Party principles are right in line with their stated principles......Less Gov't, and full repeal of Obamacare..............

Betrayal...............From Career politicians who helped get us in this mess............

This whole thread has been about throwing incumbents out of office.

but Now because I support the TEA Party it is suddenly wrong for them to throw some out......

Leading me to believe that their of course is a CONSERVATIVE versus OTHER battle intertwined in this discussion. Which is a DIFFERENCE OF CORE BELIEFS...........

If you haven't noticed, Congress has some of the lowest approval ratings ever..............It is ripe with FIRE THEM ALL attitudes.................The TEA Party is going after some of those CAREER politicians as we believe they have BETRAYED the GOP Party..............

2 sides 2 opinions different strategies............Either way, our current economic path is WRONG..........The TEA Party fights to end this endless cycle of debt............and it will continue as all the discussion with the STATUS QUO leads to MORE GOV'T.......... As they have been doing for decades.

 

[Derideo_Te]

The reason the TP'ers failed to accomplish their stated goals is because they are far more interested in pursuing their partisan agenda than their principles. Taking down "RINOs" is yet another fool's errand. All of those RINOs backed the insanity of the TP'ers when they shut down the government and you you intend to repay them by throwing them out of office? That is called a betrayal and that is why the establishment GOP now sees the TP as a threat instead of an ally

.

Principles................The TEA Party principles are right in line with their stated principles......Less Gov't, and full repeal of Obamacare..............

Those "principles" are just LIBERTARIAN dogma!

The goals of eliminating corruption and reducing spending were SACRIFICED on the partisan alter of unrealistic libertarian idealism which is why the Tea Party ended up being rejected by We the People.

In essence you are calling everyone a RINO who doesn't embrace extremist Libertarianism. Your real agenda is to hijack the GOP and turn it into the Libertarian Party instead. No wonder there is a civil war inside the Republican party.

But thanks for being honest. I do appreciate knowing where you actually stand politically speaking.

 

[OnePercenter]

Big Business!

 

[eagle1462010]

The reason the TP'ers failed to accomplish their stated goals is because they are far more interested in pursuing their partisan agenda than their principles. Taking down "RINOs" is yet another fool's errand. All of those RINOs backed the insanity of the TP'ers when they shut down the government and you you intend to repay them by throwing them out of office? That is called a betrayal and that is why the establishment GOP now sees the TP as a threat instead of an ally

.

Principles................The TEA Party principles are right in line with their stated principles......Less Gov't, and full repeal of Obamacare..............

Those "principles" are just LIBERTARIAN dogma!

The goals of eliminating corruption and reducing spending were SACRIFICED on the partisan alter of unrealistic libertarian idealism which is why the Tea Party ended up being rejected by We the People.

In essence you are calling everyone a RINO who doesn't embrace extremist Libertarianism. Your real agenda is to hijack the GOP and turn it into the Libertarian Party instead. No wonder there is a civil war inside the Republican party.

But thanks for being honest. I do appreciate knowing where you actually stand politically speaking.

I believe in Conservatism and Constitutional Gov't. Not pure Libertarianism...............

I believe in Balancing the Budget and ending the cycle of debt...........

I see No response from our current Gov't but the same ole dogma.............

I see No real cuts at all and a ever expanding Gov't.........

Have they ended Earmarks...........No
Have they at least Frozen all new spending...........No
Have they increased the size of Gov't...........Yes and spare me the usual Gov't is less under Obama hype as Obamacare will greatly increase the size of Gov't and it's spending..................

Which means we will continue down the cycle of debt as they ignore it and continue to increase our debts............Without any REAL SOLUTIONS.................

Getting right down to it..................If we disagree FINE..............Which means a REAL DISCUSSION on CUTS and ADDED REVENUES.................

Your side of the equation will NOT GET ALL IT WANTS and NEITHER WILL CONSERVATIVES................

So until we have a REAL give and take NEGOTIATION other than the BS one's going on now their will be no change and the cycle of debt will continue..............Making it harder and harder to stop the cycle of debt..................

Neither side is willing to do the things necessary to stop it...............And since they refuse to do so, it is time for them to go..............

Your side refuses to budge...........and neither do we...........The Status Quo GOP just SURRENDERS and refuses to push the fight which is why many Dems now actually SUPPORT THEM............

LOL and attacks those like the TEA Party because they only want to negotiate with those who will Surrender............

And so it will continue..............And the TEA Party will mount more RINO'S on the wall until your side will be FORCED INTO A REAL BARGAINING TABLE...............

This has happened before in the 90's and with Reagan.............and it will happen again.

 

[bripat9643]

Or maybe the Tea Party proves its partisan politics by which aspects of government spending it wants to cut and which 1% of American citizens it wants to protect from paying higher taxes?

TeaParty wants ALL to pay less taxes.

Including corporations which are currently hiding trillion$ off shore?

"NEW YORK (Reuters) - Large U.S. companies boosted their offshore earnings by 15 percent last year to a record $1.9 trillion, avoiding hefty tax bills by keeping the profits abroad, according to a new report."

U.S. Companies' Offshore Earnings Hit Record $1.9 Trillion: Study

They aren't hiding anything. The law says if they earn money in another country, they can keep those earnings in that country. What makes you think corporations are obligated to pay more taxes than the law requires?

 

[bripat9643]

Including corporations which are currently hiding trillion$ off shore?

Sure less taxes for everyone.

Because the richest 0.1% need more money?

"This carried interest loophole benefits managers of financial partnerships such as hedge funds, private equity funds, venture capital funds and real estate funds — who are among the highest-paid people in the world.

"John Paulson, a hedge fund manager in New York City, made $4.9 billion last year, top of the chart for hedge fund managers, according to AR Magazine, which follows hedge funds.

"That’s equivalent to the average per capita income of 184,000 Americans, according to my back-of-envelope calculations based on Census Bureau figures.

"Mr. Paulson declined to comment on this tax break, but here’s how it works. These fund managers are compensated mostly with a performance bonus of 20 percent or more of the profits they make.

"Under this carried interest loophole, that 20 percent is eligible to be taxed at the long-term capital gains rate (if the fund’s underlying assets are held long enough) of just 15 percent rather than the regular personal income rate of 35 percent."

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/07/07/opinion/07kristof.html?_r=0

Where did you get the idea that the federal government is authorized to decide how much money you have? Oh, and why shouldn't a capital gain be treated like a capital gain?

 

[bripat9643]

The Tea Party goals of reducing corruption and spending are great in principle. In practice they have focused on petty partisan politics and destroyed their credibility. Hence their low ratings by We the People.

Again a Straw man argument..........As the Status Quo attacks the TEA Party from both Parties because they dare take on the Status Quo who refuse to relinquish their power.............Power like the Chamber of Commerce............who buy politicians all the time.........Who are now OPENLY funding a fight with the TEA Party.............

This thread is about throwing out incumbents. The TEA Party has done so and will continue to do so...........which is what is being referred to as a RINO HUNT............

I've made it clear, that I approve of taking out RINO'S who are not TRUE CONSERVATIVES..................Who talk the talk..........but..........

Those RINO'S who are in bed with the Lobbyist need to go...........And more will fall in 2014.

The truth is not a straw man. The Tea Party members in office have done their cause far more harm than good. That is reflected by the polls of We the People and the reaction of the establishment GOP.

If the TP'ers were truly interested in dealing with corruption they would have been holding hearings on the corruption and leaking it to the media. They would have been working really hard on passing a budget that included realistic spending cuts instead of wasting their time passing mindless feel good "repeal Obamacare" nonsense.

The reason the TP'ers failed to accomplish their stated goals is because they are far more interested in pursuing their partisan agenda than their principles. Taking down "RINOs" is yet another fool's errand. All of those RINOs backed the insanity of the TP'ers when they shut down the government and yet you intend to repay them by throwing them out of office? That is called a betrayal and that is why the establishment GOP now sees the TP as a threat instead of an ally.

As an Independent I agree in principle with eliminating corruption and balancing the budget. But the way the TP has gone about it is completely wrong and done that cause more damage than anything else in my opinion.

What a load of horseshit. No matter what the TEA party did, turds like you would attack them. Spending cuts is precisely the thing you and Harry Reid are against. Democrats have demonstrated that every time it has been proposed. Cutting Obamacare would be a huge cut in spending.