Who Is The GOAT?

[IM2]

I still say it is a bigger achievement to win championships with 3 separate teams with totally different chemistries, coaches, environments etc than 6 with the same team. If Lebron gets a ring with the Lakers, I have to go with him even though I have more respect for Jordan.

Let him play for the Timberwolves or some other bottom feeder and then win a title.

Lebron is good. He gets more phantom "Jordan foul calls" than even Jordan got and he is far more protected. Let him play against the Bad Boys of the Pistons with a weaker team behind him and see how he fares.

Jordan could shoot and score in the middle of 3 players. The guy brought beauty to the game that is now missing with the outside, no-contact available shooters of today.

Thats the thing about Lebron. Every team he goes to is a contender to win it all. Thats one thing I cant say about MJ. Lebron goes to Miami and wins 2 rings after going to 4 straight Finals. He goes back to the bad news Cavs and goes 4 more Finals wins 1 ring all the while battling arguably the best dynasty in the NBA. Now he is with the Lakers and once again he is a contender to win it all after a injury year. Did I mention that when he leaves teams they literally fall off a cliff? When MJ left the Bulls the first time they came within a bad call of going to the ECF's

Jordan left after three straight rings. The next two seasons Houston wins (Jordan lost in the playoffs that one year, but he had returned mid-season). He comes back and in the next three full seasons he plays the Bulls win three straight rings. That's incredible.

Cavs went 1-3 against G.S, can anyone imagine Jordan losing 3 of 4 finals?

My point was that when MJ left, the Bulls didnt fall off a cliff. I can easily imagine MJ getting swept if he had played the Dubs without Pippen. Bulls would have gotten smoked.

I doubt that. The warriors had no rodman or ron harper. I think people forget how good Ron Harper was. In his first run, without Pippen, Horace Grant cancels out Draymond Green and Jordan could shut down either Curry or Thompson before they got Durant. With Pippen, Durant is cut off and Jordan Jordan takes Curry. Harper d's up Thompson and Rodman eats Draymond Green alive. The bulls would probably win that series in 5 playing by the old rules and if you use todays no touch rules, Jordan averages 60.

And that's not slighting the Warriors, I just think the bulls were that good.

MJ had trouble guarding Reggie Miller and Allen Iverson. No way he is going to keep up with Curry who is like a combination of the two. MJ would be drained running through all those picks. I'm not forgetting about Harper. I just dont see him being effective against that offense. Curry is an anomaly. He sucks the defense in like no other player I have ever seen. Klay and Draymond would offset Harper and Rodman. Not only would they get the defense but Klay would outscore all 3 of them.

Any effective 3 point shooter is near impossible to defend, especially with Curry who has re-written the rules by wisely figuring out how to protect the line defense by shooting 2-3 feet behind on a regular basis.

You basically have to pressure Curry at mid-court and force him into steals and poor passing. Maybe a Payton or Stockton could limit him with pressure, but only minimally. That's just the nature of a sport in which a guy can fire the ball from anywhere. Unless you can find a 7 footer with footspeed like a 6 footer, you're going to have problems dealing with such a lethal, unorthodox shooter.

Most 3 pt shooters when I was growing up were one trick ponys. The thing with Curry is that not only is he the most prolific 3 point shooter in NBA history, the dude has handles, can get to the rim with either hand, and runs all game long. You cant guard someone like that by yourself so your team has to commit to help which in turns makes you think instead of reacting naturally.

Iverson and Miller got much help with screens. So does Curry. So if Jordan was screened off, Pippen or Harper would switch to Curry and that would be a problem. Curry is great but not like those guys. He's the best shooter perhaps ever, but Jordan, Pippen and Harper were 6'6 and 6'7 and with a 6 ft guard quickness. They had handles and were in just as good as shape as Curry. Green is a milder version of Rodman, and Thompson while an excellent player is no Pippen.

Using todays rules where you can't really touch players, the warriors could not stop either Jordan or Pippen from going to the hole. And Curry would not just get to shoot three pointers all day. Those Bulls were just as effective picking up players both full court and half court. There is a reason why they had 2 of the 3 best season records of all time and dominated in the playoffs.

That would be an interesting series to see.

 

[TNHarley]

Basketball is for queers

Walk up to Shaq and tell him that.

Why not?
Done beat his ass once

 

[sealybobo]

Right now I agree the GOAT is still Jordan. But if Lebron wins a title with the Lakers, then I have to give it to Lebron for winning the championship with three different teams.

Has any qb in football ever won a Super Bowl with two different teams?

Yes Peyton Manning with the Colts and the Broncos. Not sure where you are going with your question.

Just wondering. Because in football it’s very rare. I remember it was a big deal when I was a kid that sparky Anderson won as a coach with two different teams

very few have won with three teams. Big shot bob horrey won with a lot of teams.

i don’t think winning with three different teams will mean lebron is better than mj. If he wins two more maybe

 

[sealybobo]

Watching the Last Dance had me reminiscing and reliving my younger days. It also reminded me how no matter how much I like Lebron he just cant surpass MJ for the title of the GOAT in basketball. MJ was just on another level that no one will probably ever reach. I mean this dude won 3 straight, came back and won 3 more straight. Granted he didnt do it by himself. But he did do it with flair and an artistry that is unmatched. MJ may not be my favorite person but he definitely is the GOAT.

My choice for GOAT of professional basketball, the NBA, is Wilt Chamberlain. When he came along he changed the fabric of the game. He was the first REALLY dominant big man in the game. George Mikan, who came before him, WAS a terrific big man, but he didn't dominate like Wilt did. Chamberlain set some offensive records that will most likely never be touched. He scored 100 points in a game, and the season he did this he AVERAGED 50.4 points per game! He was also a fierce rebounder and holds the record for highest rebounds per game average over a career. And he pulled down an incredible 55 rebounds in one game. He should have won many more championships than he did, however the teams he was on were no match for the amazing Celtics in the 1960's. The Celtics just had better players and better teams overall, and better coaches, as well. Having posted this, Michael Jordan IS my #2 pick for GOAT, for all of the reasons you mentioned. He was an absolutely great offensive player, but a fine defender as well. And he was a great leader on the court. I just don't think he quite changed the fabric of the game like Wilt did.

Oh he (Jordan) changed the fabric alright. He owned the league all 6 plus years. Wilt was the man but kept losing to the Celtics.

 

[sealybobo]

Watching the Last Dance had me reminiscing and reliving my younger days. It also reminded me how no matter how much I like Lebron he just cant surpass MJ for the title of the GOAT in basketball. MJ was just on another level that no one will probably ever reach. I mean this dude won 3 straight, came back and won 3 more straight. Granted he didnt do it by himself. But he did do it with flair and an artistry that is unmatched. MJ may not be my favorite person but he definitely is the GOAT.

My choice for GOAT of professional basketball, the NBA, is Wilt Chamberlain. When he came along he changed the fabric of the game. He was the first REALLY dominant big man in the game. George Mikan, who came before him, WAS a terrific big man, but he didn't dominate like Wilt did. Chamberlain set some offensive records that will most likely never be touched. He scored 100 points in a game, and the season he did this he AVERAGED 50.4 points per game! He was also a fierce rebounder and holds the record for highest rebounds per game average over a career. And he pulled down an incredible 55 rebounds in one game. He should have won many more championships than he did, however the teams he was on were no match for the amazing Celtics in the 1960's. The Celtics just had better players and better teams overall, and better coaches, as well. Having posted this, Michael Jordan IS my #2 pick for GOAT, for all of the reasons you mentioned. He was an absolutely great offensive player, but a fine defender as well. And he was a great leader on the court. I just don't think he quite changed the fabric of the game like Wilt did.

Yes Wilt was untouchable in terms of how he dominated, but Jordan did it in a much tougher era, but more importantly, he brought a competitive, beauty and swagger to the game that turned the NBA into a global powerhouse.

What Ruth did for baseball, Jordan did to basketball.

Right. And it’s hard to compare bigs with guys like Jordan, Kobe and lebron.

one could say don’t forget magic johnson. He could play all 5 positions.

 

[sealybobo]

Watching the Last Dance had me reminiscing and reliving my younger days. It also reminded me how no matter how much I like Lebron he just cant surpass MJ for the title of the GOAT in basketball. MJ was just on another level that no one will probably ever reach. I mean this dude won 3 straight, came back and won 3 more straight. Granted he didnt do it by himself. But he did do it with flair and an artistry that is unmatched. MJ may not be my favorite person but he definitely is the GOAT.

My choice for GOAT of professional basketball, the NBA, is Wilt Chamberlain. When he came along he changed the fabric of the game. He was the first REALLY dominant big man in the game. George Mikan, who came before him, WAS a terrific big man, but he didn't dominate like Wilt did. Chamberlain set some offensive records that will most likely never be touched. He scored 100 points in a game, and the season he did this he AVERAGED 50.4 points per game! He was also a fierce rebounder and holds the record for highest rebounds per game average over a career. And he pulled down an incredible 55 rebounds in one game. He should have won many more championships than he did, however the teams he was on were no match for the amazing Celtics in the 1960's. The Celtics just had better players and better teams overall, and better coaches, as well. Having posted this, Michael Jordan IS my #2 pick for GOAT, for all of the reasons you mentioned. He was an absolutely great offensive player, but a fine defender as well. And he was a great leader on the court. I just don't think he quite changed the fabric of the game like Wilt did.

Crazy to say jordan didn’t change the fabric. Did Wayne Gretzky? So did Jordan.

 

[sealybobo]

Right now I agree the GOAT is still Jordan. But if Lebron wins a title with the Lakers, then I have to give it to Lebron for winning the championship with three different teams.

Did you see my previous post listing all the greats jordan denied rings to? Who did lebrondeny a ring to? Dirk got a ring vs lebron. Did you see all the hofers in the documentary crying about how they would have a ring if not for mj? Charles Barkley, Gary Payton, Carl Malone, Reggie Miller, Patrick ewing.

please list all th3 hall of farmers that would have won a ring if not for lebron.

lebron might actually be 3rd behind Kobe the more I think about it

 

[MarathonMike]

Right now I agree the GOAT is still Jordan. But if Lebron wins a title with the Lakers, then I have to give it to Lebron for winning the championship with three different teams.

Has any qb in football ever won a Super Bowl with two different teams?

Yes Peyton Manning with the Colts and the Broncos. Not sure where you are going with your question.

Just wondering. Because in football it’s very rare. I remember it was a big deal when I was a kid that sparky Anderson won as a coach with two different teams

very few have won with three teams. Big shot bob horrey won with a lot of teams.

i don’t think winning with three different teams will mean lebron is better than mj. If he wins two more maybe

It's a tough call. 6 championships with the same team or 4 championships with 3 different teams. I don't personally like Lebron but if he gets a 4th ring with a 3rd team I give him the edge for GOAT.

 

[shockedcanadian]

Right now I agree the GOAT is still Jordan. But if Lebron wins a title with the Lakers, then I have to give it to Lebron for winning the championship with three different teams.

Did you see my previous post listing all the greats jordan denied rings to? Who did lebrondeny a ring to? Dirk got a ring vs lebron. Did you see all the hofers in the documentary crying about how they would have a ring if not for mj? Charles Barkley, Gary Payton, Carl Malone, Reggie Miller, Patrick ewing.

please list all th3 hall of farmers that would have won a ring if not for lebron.

lebron might actually be 3rd behind Kobe the more I think about it

I don't even place Lebron top five, even that could be a stretch.

 

[sealybobo]

Right now I agree the GOAT is still Jordan. But if Lebron wins a title with the Lakers, then I have to give it to Lebron for winning the championship with three different teams.

Has any qb in football ever won a Super Bowl with two different teams?

Yes Peyton Manning with the Colts and the Broncos. Not sure where you are going with your question.

Just wondering. Because in football it’s very rare. I remember it was a big deal when I was a kid that sparky Anderson won as a coach with two different teams

very few have won with three teams. Big shot bob horrey won with a lot of teams.

i don’t think winning with three different teams will mean lebron is better than mj. If he wins two more maybe

It's a tough call. 6 championships with the same team or 4 championships with 3 different teams. I don't personally like Lebron but if he gets a 4th ring with a 3rd team I give him the edge for GOAT.

Sorry but IMO he has to win two more or I can’t take him seriously, if he wins one more it’s because he’s on the right team. If he wins two more then I won’t argue with you, too much.

because no matter what lebron does moving forward he’ll neve4 be mj. Mj was a winner. Lebron is a great playe4 but not the competitor mj was

 

[sealybobo]

Another 17 year old could come along like lebron did but after 4 years he could completely dominate and change my mind. Lebron as great as he has been has not done this. He can break scoring records thats not the same. And it’s not just that mj played on better teams. We saw lebron not carry teams when Michael would have and we even saw lebron get cramps from being dehyd

 

[Asclepias]

Another 17 year old could come along like lebron did but after 4 years he could completely dominate and change my mind. Lebron as great as he has been has not done this. He can break scoring records thats not the same. And it’s not just that mj played on better teams. We saw lebron not carry teams when Michael would have and we even saw lebron get cramps from being dehyd

Just the opposite. Lebron took weaker teams further. MJ is more skilled. Anyone can learn his footwork. You cant teach what Lebron is good at. His ability to get to rim and passing is more a product of his freakish athleticism than skill. No way MJ would have been able to drag that first Cavs team to the Finals.

 

[MarathonMike]

Right now I agree the GOAT is still Jordan. But if Lebron wins a title with the Lakers, then I have to give it to Lebron for winning the championship with three different teams.

Has any qb in football ever won a Super Bowl with two different teams?

Yes Peyton Manning with the Colts and the Broncos. Not sure where you are going with your question.

Just wondering. Because in football it’s very rare. I remember it was a big deal when I was a kid that sparky Anderson won as a coach with two different teams

very few have won with three teams. Big shot bob horrey won with a lot of teams.

i don’t think winning with three different teams will mean lebron is better than mj. If he wins two more maybe

It's a tough call. 6 championships with the same team or 4 championships with 3 different teams. I don't personally like Lebron but if he gets a 4th ring with a 3rd team I give him the edge for GOAT.

Sorry but IMO he has to win two more or I can’t take him seriously, if he wins one more it’s because he’s on the right team. If he wins two more then I won’t argue with you, too much.

because no matter what lebron does moving forward he’ll neve4 be mj. Mj was a winner. Lebron is a great playe4 but not the competitor mj was

A reasonable position. I just disagree That's why it's a debate.

 

[Asclepias]

I still say it is a bigger achievement to win championships with 3 separate teams with totally different chemistries, coaches, environments etc than 6 with the same team. If Lebron gets a ring with the Lakers, I have to go with him even though I have more respect for Jordan.

Let him play for the Timberwolves or some other bottom feeder and then win a title.

Lebron is good. He gets more phantom "Jordan foul calls" than even Jordan got and he is far more protected. Let him play against the Bad Boys of the Pistons with a weaker team behind him and see how he fares.

Jordan could shoot and score in the middle of 3 players. The guy brought beauty to the game that is now missing with the outside, no-contact available shooters of today.

Thats the thing about Lebron. Every team he goes to is a contender to win it all. Thats one thing I cant say about MJ. Lebron goes to Miami and wins 2 rings after going to 4 straight Finals. He goes back to the bad news Cavs and goes 4 more Finals wins 1 ring all the while battling arguably the best dynasty in the NBA. Now he is with the Lakers and once again he is a contender to win it all after a injury year. Did I mention that when he leaves teams they literally fall off a cliff? When MJ left the Bulls the first time they came within a bad call of going to the ECF's

Jordan left after three straight rings. The next two seasons Houston wins (Jordan lost in the playoffs that one year, but he had returned mid-season). He comes back and in the next three full seasons he plays the Bulls win three straight rings. That's incredible.

Cavs went 1-3 against G.S, can anyone imagine Jordan losing 3 of 4 finals?

My point was that when MJ left, the Bulls didnt fall off a cliff. I can easily imagine MJ getting swept if he had played the Dubs without Pippen. Bulls would have gotten smoked.

I doubt that. The warriors had no rodman or ron harper. I think people forget how good Ron Harper was. In his first run, without Pippen, Horace Grant cancels out Draymond Green and Jordan could shut down either Curry or Thompson before they got Durant. With Pippen, Durant is cut off and Jordan Jordan takes Curry. Harper d's up Thompson and Rodman eats Draymond Green alive. The bulls would probably win that series in 5 playing by the old rules and if you use todays no touch rules, Jordan averages 60.

And that's not slighting the Warriors, I just think the bulls were that good.

MJ had trouble guarding Reggie Miller and Allen Iverson. No way he is going to keep up with Curry who is like a combination of the two. MJ would be drained running through all those picks. I'm not forgetting about Harper. I just dont see him being effective against that offense. Curry is an anomaly. He sucks the defense in like no other player I have ever seen. Klay and Draymond would offset Harper and Rodman. Not only would they get the defense but Klay would outscore all 3 of them.

Any effective 3 point shooter is near impossible to defend, especially with Curry who has re-written the rules by wisely figuring out how to protect the line defense by shooting 2-3 feet behind on a regular basis.

You basically have to pressure Curry at mid-court and force him into steals and poor passing. Maybe a Payton or Stockton could limit him with pressure, but only minimally. That's just the nature of a sport in which a guy can fire the ball from anywhere. Unless you can find a 7 footer with footspeed like a 6 footer, you're going to have problems dealing with such a lethal, unorthodox shooter.

Most 3 pt shooters when I was growing up were one trick ponys. The thing with Curry is that not only is he the most prolific 3 point shooter in NBA history, the dude has handles, can get to the rim with either hand, and runs all game long. You cant guard someone like that by yourself so your team has to commit to help which in turns makes you think instead of reacting naturally.

Iverson and Miller got much help with screens. So does Curry. So if Jordan was screened off, Pippen or Harper would switch to Curry and that would be a problem. Curry is great but not like those guys. He's the best shooter perhaps ever, but Jordan, Pippen and Harper were 6'6 and 6'7 and with a 6 ft guard quickness. They had handles and were in just as good as shape as Curry. Green is a milder version of Rodman, and Thompson while an excellent player is no Pippen.

Using todays rules where you can't really touch players, the warriors could not stop either Jordan or Pippen from going to the hole. And Curry would not just get to shoot three pointers all day. Those Bulls were just as effective picking up players both full court and half court. There is a reason why they had 2 of the 3 best season records of all time and dominated in the playoffs.

That would be an interesting series to see.

You do make one good point. MJ and Pippen would be better defenders than PG and Kawhi.

 

[IM2]

Basketball is for queers

Walk up to Shaq and tell him that.

Why not?
Done beat his ass once

Sure you have.

 

[IM2]

I still say it is a bigger achievement to win championships with 3 separate teams with totally different chemistries, coaches, environments etc than 6 with the same team. If Lebron gets a ring with the Lakers, I have to go with him even though I have more respect for Jordan.

Let him play for the Timberwolves or some other bottom feeder and then win a title.

Lebron is good. He gets more phantom "Jordan foul calls" than even Jordan got and he is far more protected. Let him play against the Bad Boys of the Pistons with a weaker team behind him and see how he fares.

Jordan could shoot and score in the middle of 3 players. The guy brought beauty to the game that is now missing with the outside, no-contact available shooters of today.

Thats the thing about Lebron. Every team he goes to is a contender to win it all. Thats one thing I cant say about MJ. Lebron goes to Miami and wins 2 rings after going to 4 straight Finals. He goes back to the bad news Cavs and goes 4 more Finals wins 1 ring all the while battling arguably the best dynasty in the NBA. Now he is with the Lakers and once again he is a contender to win it all after a injury year. Did I mention that when he leaves teams they literally fall off a cliff? When MJ left the Bulls the first time they came within a bad call of going to the ECF's

Jordan left after three straight rings. The next two seasons Houston wins (Jordan lost in the playoffs that one year, but he had returned mid-season). He comes back and in the next three full seasons he plays the Bulls win three straight rings. That's incredible.

Cavs went 1-3 against G.S, can anyone imagine Jordan losing 3 of 4 finals?

My point was that when MJ left, the Bulls didnt fall off a cliff. I can easily imagine MJ getting swept if he had played the Dubs without Pippen. Bulls would have gotten smoked.

I doubt that. The warriors had no rodman or ron harper. I think people forget how good Ron Harper was. In his first run, without Pippen, Horace Grant cancels out Draymond Green and Jordan could shut down either Curry or Thompson before they got Durant. With Pippen, Durant is cut off and Jordan Jordan takes Curry. Harper d's up Thompson and Rodman eats Draymond Green alive. The bulls would probably win that series in 5 playing by the old rules and if you use todays no touch rules, Jordan averages 60.

And that's not slighting the Warriors, I just think the bulls were that good.

MJ had trouble guarding Reggie Miller and Allen Iverson. No way he is going to keep up with Curry who is like a combination of the two. MJ would be drained running through all those picks. I'm not forgetting about Harper. I just dont see him being effective against that offense. Curry is an anomaly. He sucks the defense in like no other player I have ever seen. Klay and Draymond would offset Harper and Rodman. Not only would they get the defense but Klay would outscore all 3 of them.

Any effective 3 point shooter is near impossible to defend, especially with Curry who has re-written the rules by wisely figuring out how to protect the line defense by shooting 2-3 feet behind on a regular basis.

You basically have to pressure Curry at mid-court and force him into steals and poor passing. Maybe a Payton or Stockton could limit him with pressure, but only minimally. That's just the nature of a sport in which a guy can fire the ball from anywhere. Unless you can find a 7 footer with footspeed like a 6 footer, you're going to have problems dealing with such a lethal, unorthodox shooter.

Most 3 pt shooters when I was growing up were one trick ponys. The thing with Curry is that not only is he the most prolific 3 point shooter in NBA history, the dude has handles, can get to the rim with either hand, and runs all game long. You cant guard someone like that by yourself so your team has to commit to help which in turns makes you think instead of reacting naturally.

Iverson and Miller got much help with screens. So does Curry. So if Jordan was screened off, Pippen or Harper would switch to Curry and that would be a problem. Curry is great but not like those guys. He's the best shooter perhaps ever, but Jordan, Pippen and Harper were 6'6 and 6'7 and with a 6 ft guard quickness. They had handles and were in just as good as shape as Curry. Green is a milder version of Rodman, and Thompson while an excellent player is no Pippen.

Using todays rules where you can't really touch players, the warriors could not stop either Jordan or Pippen from going to the hole. And Curry would not just get to shoot three pointers all day. Those Bulls were just as effective picking up players both full court and half court. There is a reason why they had 2 of the 3 best season records of all time and dominated in the playoffs.

That would be an interesting series to see.

You do make one good point. MJ and Pippen would be better defenders than PG and Kawhi.

These topics make for great debates. I think we forget about the Lakers of the 80's In these discussions as well.

 

[shockedcanadian]

I still say it is a bigger achievement to win championships with 3 separate teams with totally different chemistries, coaches, environments etc than 6 with the same team. If Lebron gets a ring with the Lakers, I have to go with him even though I have more respect for Jordan.

Let him play for the Timberwolves or some other bottom feeder and then win a title.

Lebron is good. He gets more phantom "Jordan foul calls" than even Jordan got and he is far more protected. Let him play against the Bad Boys of the Pistons with a weaker team behind him and see how he fares.

Jordan could shoot and score in the middle of 3 players. The guy brought beauty to the game that is now missing with the outside, no-contact available shooters of today.

Thats the thing about Lebron. Every team he goes to is a contender to win it all. Thats one thing I cant say about MJ. Lebron goes to Miami and wins 2 rings after going to 4 straight Finals. He goes back to the bad news Cavs and goes 4 more Finals wins 1 ring all the while battling arguably the best dynasty in the NBA. Now he is with the Lakers and once again he is a contender to win it all after a injury year. Did I mention that when he leaves teams they literally fall off a cliff? When MJ left the Bulls the first time they came within a bad call of going to the ECF's

Jordan left after three straight rings. The next two seasons Houston wins (Jordan lost in the playoffs that one year, but he had returned mid-season). He comes back and in the next three full seasons he plays the Bulls win three straight rings. That's incredible.

Cavs went 1-3 against G.S, can anyone imagine Jordan losing 3 of 4 finals?

My point was that when MJ left, the Bulls didnt fall off a cliff. I can easily imagine MJ getting swept if he had played the Dubs without Pippen. Bulls would have gotten smoked.

I doubt that. The warriors had no rodman or ron harper. I think people forget how good Ron Harper was. In his first run, without Pippen, Horace Grant cancels out Draymond Green and Jordan could shut down either Curry or Thompson before they got Durant. With Pippen, Durant is cut off and Jordan Jordan takes Curry. Harper d's up Thompson and Rodman eats Draymond Green alive. The bulls would probably win that series in 5 playing by the old rules and if you use todays no touch rules, Jordan averages 60.

And that's not slighting the Warriors, I just think the bulls were that good.

MJ had trouble guarding Reggie Miller and Allen Iverson. No way he is going to keep up with Curry who is like a combination of the two. MJ would be drained running through all those picks. I'm not forgetting about Harper. I just dont see him being effective against that offense. Curry is an anomaly. He sucks the defense in like no other player I have ever seen. Klay and Draymond would offset Harper and Rodman. Not only would they get the defense but Klay would outscore all 3 of them.

Any effective 3 point shooter is near impossible to defend, especially with Curry who has re-written the rules by wisely figuring out how to protect the line defense by shooting 2-3 feet behind on a regular basis.

You basically have to pressure Curry at mid-court and force him into steals and poor passing. Maybe a Payton or Stockton could limit him with pressure, but only minimally. That's just the nature of a sport in which a guy can fire the ball from anywhere. Unless you can find a 7 footer with footspeed like a 6 footer, you're going to have problems dealing with such a lethal, unorthodox shooter.

Most 3 pt shooters when I was growing up were one trick ponys. The thing with Curry is that not only is he the most prolific 3 point shooter in NBA history, the dude has handles, can get to the rim with either hand, and runs all game long. You cant guard someone like that by yourself so your team has to commit to help which in turns makes you think instead of reacting naturally.

Iverson and Miller got much help with screens. So does Curry. So if Jordan was screened off, Pippen or Harper would switch to Curry and that would be a problem. Curry is great but not like those guys. He's the best shooter perhaps ever, but Jordan, Pippen and Harper were 6'6 and 6'7 and with a 6 ft guard quickness. They had handles and were in just as good as shape as Curry. Green is a milder version of Rodman, and Thompson while an excellent player is no Pippen.

Using todays rules where you can't really touch players, the warriors could not stop either Jordan or Pippen from going to the hole. And Curry would not just get to shoot three pointers all day. Those Bulls were just as effective picking up players both full court and half court. There is a reason why they had 2 of the 3 best season records of all time and dominated in the playoffs.

That would be an interesting series to see.

You do make one good point. MJ and Pippen would be better defenders than PG and Kawhi.

These topics make for great debates. I think we forget about the Lakers of the 80's In these discussions as well.

I don't. They had a team concept though, with Magic, Kareem and Worthy, among others.

 

[IM2]

I still say it is a bigger achievement to win championships with 3 separate teams with totally different chemistries, coaches, environments etc than 6 with the same team. If Lebron gets a ring with the Lakers, I have to go with him even though I have more respect for Jordan.

Let him play for the Timberwolves or some other bottom feeder and then win a title.

Lebron is good. He gets more phantom "Jordan foul calls" than even Jordan got and he is far more protected. Let him play against the Bad Boys of the Pistons with a weaker team behind him and see how he fares.

Jordan could shoot and score in the middle of 3 players. The guy brought beauty to the game that is now missing with the outside, no-contact available shooters of today.

Thats the thing about Lebron. Every team he goes to is a contender to win it all. Thats one thing I cant say about MJ. Lebron goes to Miami and wins 2 rings after going to 4 straight Finals. He goes back to the bad news Cavs and goes 4 more Finals wins 1 ring all the while battling arguably the best dynasty in the NBA. Now he is with the Lakers and once again he is a contender to win it all after a injury year. Did I mention that when he leaves teams they literally fall off a cliff? When MJ left the Bulls the first time they came within a bad call of going to the ECF's

Jordan left after three straight rings. The next two seasons Houston wins (Jordan lost in the playoffs that one year, but he had returned mid-season). He comes back and in the next three full seasons he plays the Bulls win three straight rings. That's incredible.

Cavs went 1-3 against G.S, can anyone imagine Jordan losing 3 of 4 finals?

My point was that when MJ left, the Bulls didnt fall off a cliff. I can easily imagine MJ getting swept if he had played the Dubs without Pippen. Bulls would have gotten smoked.

I doubt that. The warriors had no rodman or ron harper. I think people forget how good Ron Harper was. In his first run, without Pippen, Horace Grant cancels out Draymond Green and Jordan could shut down either Curry or Thompson before they got Durant. With Pippen, Durant is cut off and Jordan Jordan takes Curry. Harper d's up Thompson and Rodman eats Draymond Green alive. The bulls would probably win that series in 5 playing by the old rules and if you use todays no touch rules, Jordan averages 60.

And that's not slighting the Warriors, I just think the bulls were that good.

MJ had trouble guarding Reggie Miller and Allen Iverson. No way he is going to keep up with Curry who is like a combination of the two. MJ would be drained running through all those picks. I'm not forgetting about Harper. I just dont see him being effective against that offense. Curry is an anomaly. He sucks the defense in like no other player I have ever seen. Klay and Draymond would offset Harper and Rodman. Not only would they get the defense but Klay would outscore all 3 of them.

Any effective 3 point shooter is near impossible to defend, especially with Curry who has re-written the rules by wisely figuring out how to protect the line defense by shooting 2-3 feet behind on a regular basis.

You basically have to pressure Curry at mid-court and force him into steals and poor passing. Maybe a Payton or Stockton could limit him with pressure, but only minimally. That's just the nature of a sport in which a guy can fire the ball from anywhere. Unless you can find a 7 footer with footspeed like a 6 footer, you're going to have problems dealing with such a lethal, unorthodox shooter.

Most 3 pt shooters when I was growing up were one trick ponys. The thing with Curry is that not only is he the most prolific 3 point shooter in NBA history, the dude has handles, can get to the rim with either hand, and runs all game long. You cant guard someone like that by yourself so your team has to commit to help which in turns makes you think instead of reacting naturally.

Iverson and Miller got much help with screens. So does Curry. So if Jordan was screened off, Pippen or Harper would switch to Curry and that would be a problem. Curry is great but not like those guys. He's the best shooter perhaps ever, but Jordan, Pippen and Harper were 6'6 and 6'7 and with a 6 ft guard quickness. They had handles and were in just as good as shape as Curry. Green is a milder version of Rodman, and Thompson while an excellent player is no Pippen.

Using todays rules where you can't really touch players, the warriors could not stop either Jordan or Pippen from going to the hole. And Curry would not just get to shoot three pointers all day. Those Bulls were just as effective picking up players both full court and half court. There is a reason why they had 2 of the 3 best season records of all time and dominated in the playoffs.

That would be an interesting series to see.

You do make one good point. MJ and Pippen would be better defenders than PG and Kawhi.

These topics make for great debates. I think we forget about the Lakers of the 80's In these discussions as well.

I don't. They had a team concept though, with Magic, Kareem and Worthy, among others.

The Bulls and Warriors had that too. But that Lakers team would have been very tough to handle.

 

[Asclepias]

I still say it is a bigger achievement to win championships with 3 separate teams with totally different chemistries, coaches, environments etc than 6 with the same team. If Lebron gets a ring with the Lakers, I have to go with him even though I have more respect for Jordan.

Let him play for the Timberwolves or some other bottom feeder and then win a title.

Lebron is good. He gets more phantom "Jordan foul calls" than even Jordan got and he is far more protected. Let him play against the Bad Boys of the Pistons with a weaker team behind him and see how he fares.

Jordan could shoot and score in the middle of 3 players. The guy brought beauty to the game that is now missing with the outside, no-contact available shooters of today.

Thats the thing about Lebron. Every team he goes to is a contender to win it all. Thats one thing I cant say about MJ. Lebron goes to Miami and wins 2 rings after going to 4 straight Finals. He goes back to the bad news Cavs and goes 4 more Finals wins 1 ring all the while battling arguably the best dynasty in the NBA. Now he is with the Lakers and once again he is a contender to win it all after a injury year. Did I mention that when he leaves teams they literally fall off a cliff? When MJ left the Bulls the first time they came within a bad call of going to the ECF's

Jordan left after three straight rings. The next two seasons Houston wins (Jordan lost in the playoffs that one year, but he had returned mid-season). He comes back and in the next three full seasons he plays the Bulls win three straight rings. That's incredible.

Cavs went 1-3 against G.S, can anyone imagine Jordan losing 3 of 4 finals?

My point was that when MJ left, the Bulls didnt fall off a cliff. I can easily imagine MJ getting swept if he had played the Dubs without Pippen. Bulls would have gotten smoked.

I doubt that. The warriors had no rodman or ron harper. I think people forget how good Ron Harper was. In his first run, without Pippen, Horace Grant cancels out Draymond Green and Jordan could shut down either Curry or Thompson before they got Durant. With Pippen, Durant is cut off and Jordan Jordan takes Curry. Harper d's up Thompson and Rodman eats Draymond Green alive. The bulls would probably win that series in 5 playing by the old rules and if you use todays no touch rules, Jordan averages 60.

And that's not slighting the Warriors, I just think the bulls were that good.

MJ had trouble guarding Reggie Miller and Allen Iverson. No way he is going to keep up with Curry who is like a combination of the two. MJ would be drained running through all those picks. I'm not forgetting about Harper. I just dont see him being effective against that offense. Curry is an anomaly. He sucks the defense in like no other player I have ever seen. Klay and Draymond would offset Harper and Rodman. Not only would they get the defense but Klay would outscore all 3 of them.

Any effective 3 point shooter is near impossible to defend, especially with Curry who has re-written the rules by wisely figuring out how to protect the line defense by shooting 2-3 feet behind on a regular basis.

You basically have to pressure Curry at mid-court and force him into steals and poor passing. Maybe a Payton or Stockton could limit him with pressure, but only minimally. That's just the nature of a sport in which a guy can fire the ball from anywhere. Unless you can find a 7 footer with footspeed like a 6 footer, you're going to have problems dealing with such a lethal, unorthodox shooter.

Most 3 pt shooters when I was growing up were one trick ponys. The thing with Curry is that not only is he the most prolific 3 point shooter in NBA history, the dude has handles, can get to the rim with either hand, and runs all game long. You cant guard someone like that by yourself so your team has to commit to help which in turns makes you think instead of reacting naturally.

Iverson and Miller got much help with screens. So does Curry. So if Jordan was screened off, Pippen or Harper would switch to Curry and that would be a problem. Curry is great but not like those guys. He's the best shooter perhaps ever, but Jordan, Pippen and Harper were 6'6 and 6'7 and with a 6 ft guard quickness. They had handles and were in just as good as shape as Curry. Green is a milder version of Rodman, and Thompson while an excellent player is no Pippen.

Using todays rules where you can't really touch players, the warriors could not stop either Jordan or Pippen from going to the hole. And Curry would not just get to shoot three pointers all day. Those Bulls were just as effective picking up players both full court and half court. There is a reason why they had 2 of the 3 best season records of all time and dominated in the playoffs.

That would be an interesting series to see.

You do make one good point. MJ and Pippen would be better defenders than PG and Kawhi.

These topics make for great debates. I think we forget about the Lakers of the 80's In these discussions as well.

Oh yeah. The Lakers were a thing of beauty. Textbook fastbreak action led by yours truly Magic. He is actually the reason I started playing basketball and left football and baseball alone.

 

[IM2]

I still say it is a bigger achievement to win championships with 3 separate teams with totally different chemistries, coaches, environments etc than 6 with the same team. If Lebron gets a ring with the Lakers, I have to go with him even though I have more respect for Jordan.

Let him play for the Timberwolves or some other bottom feeder and then win a title.

Lebron is good. He gets more phantom "Jordan foul calls" than even Jordan got and he is far more protected. Let him play against the Bad Boys of the Pistons with a weaker team behind him and see how he fares.

Jordan could shoot and score in the middle of 3 players. The guy brought beauty to the game that is now missing with the outside, no-contact available shooters of today.

Thats the thing about Lebron. Every team he goes to is a contender to win it all. Thats one thing I cant say about MJ. Lebron goes to Miami and wins 2 rings after going to 4 straight Finals. He goes back to the bad news Cavs and goes 4 more Finals wins 1 ring all the while battling arguably the best dynasty in the NBA. Now he is with the Lakers and once again he is a contender to win it all after a injury year. Did I mention that when he leaves teams they literally fall off a cliff? When MJ left the Bulls the first time they came within a bad call of going to the ECF's

Jordan left after three straight rings. The next two seasons Houston wins (Jordan lost in the playoffs that one year, but he had returned mid-season). He comes back and in the next three full seasons he plays the Bulls win three straight rings. That's incredible.

Cavs went 1-3 against G.S, can anyone imagine Jordan losing 3 of 4 finals?

My point was that when MJ left, the Bulls didnt fall off a cliff. I can easily imagine MJ getting swept if he had played the Dubs without Pippen. Bulls would have gotten smoked.

I doubt that. The warriors had no rodman or ron harper. I think people forget how good Ron Harper was. In his first run, without Pippen, Horace Grant cancels out Draymond Green and Jordan could shut down either Curry or Thompson before they got Durant. With Pippen, Durant is cut off and Jordan Jordan takes Curry. Harper d's up Thompson and Rodman eats Draymond Green alive. The bulls would probably win that series in 5 playing by the old rules and if you use todays no touch rules, Jordan averages 60.

And that's not slighting the Warriors, I just think the bulls were that good.

MJ had trouble guarding Reggie Miller and Allen Iverson. No way he is going to keep up with Curry who is like a combination of the two. MJ would be drained running through all those picks. I'm not forgetting about Harper. I just dont see him being effective against that offense. Curry is an anomaly. He sucks the defense in like no other player I have ever seen. Klay and Draymond would offset Harper and Rodman. Not only would they get the defense but Klay would outscore all 3 of them.

Any effective 3 point shooter is near impossible to defend, especially with Curry who has re-written the rules by wisely figuring out how to protect the line defense by shooting 2-3 feet behind on a regular basis.

You basically have to pressure Curry at mid-court and force him into steals and poor passing. Maybe a Payton or Stockton could limit him with pressure, but only minimally. That's just the nature of a sport in which a guy can fire the ball from anywhere. Unless you can find a 7 footer with footspeed like a 6 footer, you're going to have problems dealing with such a lethal, unorthodox shooter.

Most 3 pt shooters when I was growing up were one trick ponys. The thing with Curry is that not only is he the most prolific 3 point shooter in NBA history, the dude has handles, can get to the rim with either hand, and runs all game long. You cant guard someone like that by yourself so your team has to commit to help which in turns makes you think instead of reacting naturally.

Iverson and Miller got much help with screens. So does Curry. So if Jordan was screened off, Pippen or Harper would switch to Curry and that would be a problem. Curry is great but not like those guys. He's the best shooter perhaps ever, but Jordan, Pippen and Harper were 6'6 and 6'7 and with a 6 ft guard quickness. They had handles and were in just as good as shape as Curry. Green is a milder version of Rodman, and Thompson while an excellent player is no Pippen.

Using todays rules where you can't really touch players, the warriors could not stop either Jordan or Pippen from going to the hole. And Curry would not just get to shoot three pointers all day. Those Bulls were just as effective picking up players both full court and half court. There is a reason why they had 2 of the 3 best season records of all time and dominated in the playoffs.

That would be an interesting series to see.

You do make one good point. MJ and Pippen would be better defenders than PG and Kawhi.

These topics make for great debates. I think we forget about the Lakers of the 80's In these discussions as well.

Oh yeah. The Lakers were a thing of beauty. Textbook fastbreak action led by yours truly Magic. He is actually the reason I started playing basketball and left football and baseball alone.

I was probably a better baseball player but our school didn't have a baseball team. My favorite football player was Jack Tatum and thanks to Jimmy Carr and Lee Kemp, I started wrestling.