Where Did Biden Get This Claim? Billionaires Pay an Average Federal Tax Rate of Only 8.2%?

[BluesLegend]

Have you noticed no matter how many times this lie is debunked, Dems keep telling the lie?

 

[john doe 101]

During his State of the Union speech, President Biden said that American billionaires pay an average federal tax rate of only 8.2%. I quote:

There are 1,000 billionaires in America. You know what the average federal tax rate for these billionaires is? 8.2 percent! That’s far less than the vast majority of Americans pay. No billionaire should pay a lower tax rate than a teacher, a sanitation worker, a nurse!

How can this be? Even if those billionaires earn no money from capital gains and just live off the interest on their money, either from regular savings accounts or from the various types of CDs, those earnings are taxed at the same rate as salaried income.

Any income earned from capital gains that exceeds $41K for individuals and $95K for households is taxed at a rate of 15%. If it exceeds $519K for individuals and $584K for households, it is taxed at a rate of 20%.

The majority of working Americans pay a federal income tax rate of no more than 12%, since they fall into the first and second tax brackets. Approximately 60 million Americans pay an average tax rate of only 1.5%, even before tax credits are applied (LINK).

Anyone have any idea where Biden got this claim that the average federal tax rate for billionaires is only 8.2%?

You ever hear of effective tax rate?

 

[jotathought]

Interest income is still income.
Subject to taxation.

But deducting a $500M luxury yacht as a business expense requires an extremely wealthy owner and very expensive accountants and attorneys.

Although your example is pure hyperbole, what laws were broken by applying deductions and paying for business expenses, like employees and attorneys?

 

[rampart]

During his State of the Union speech, President Biden said that American billionaires pay an average federal tax rate of only 8.2%. I quote:

There are 1,000 billionaires in America. You know what the average federal tax rate for these billionaires is? 8.2 percent! That’s far less than the vast majority of Americans pay. No billionaire should pay a lower tax rate than a teacher, a sanitation worker, a nurse!

How can this be? Even if those billionaires earn no money from capital gains and just live off the interest on their money, either from regular savings accounts or from the various types of CDs, those earnings are taxed at the same rate as salaried income.

Any income earned from capital gains that exceeds $41K for individuals and $95K for households is taxed at a rate of 15%. If it exceeds $519K for individuals and $584K for households, it is taxed at a rate of 20%.

The majority of working Americans pay a federal income tax rate of no more than 12%, since they fall into the first and second tax brackets. Approximately 60 million Americans pay an average tax rate of only 1.5%, even before tax credits are applied (LINK).

Anyone have any idea where Biden got this claim that the average federal tax rate for billionaires is only 8.2%?

man, i wrote up the little excel macro to find that average tax rate. but that isn't the question.

biden knows this average federal tax rate because professional civil servants, lords of the deep state, can hand him those numbers fairly quickloy.

we find this "administrative state" to be more effective than the gop "lets go with the gut feelingz of of a wannabe autocrat who flys bt the seat of his depends.

 

[Thinker101]

Wealthy people have many ways of dodging taxes that aren't available to regular folk. They can avoid capital gains by borrowing against investment values rather than realizing the gains and paying taxes on them, for instance.

Good news, everyone that owns a house, or a car, or anything of value can borrow against them....dumbass.

 

[Foxfyre]

During his State of the Union speech, President Biden said that American billionaires pay an average federal tax rate of only 8.2%. I quote:

There are 1,000 billionaires in America. You know what the average federal tax rate for these billionaires is? 8.2 percent! That’s far less than the vast majority of Americans pay. No billionaire should pay a lower tax rate than a teacher, a sanitation worker, a nurse!

How can this be? Even if those billionaires earn no money from capital gains and just live off the interest on their money, either from regular savings accounts or from the various types of CDs, those earnings are taxed at the same rate as salaried income.

Any income earned from capital gains that exceeds $41K for individuals and $95K for households is taxed at a rate of 15%. If it exceeds $519K for individuals and $584K for households, it is taxed at a rate of 20%.

The majority of working Americans pay a federal income tax rate of no more than 12%, since they fall into the first and second tax brackets. Approximately 60 million Americans pay an average tax rate of only 1.5%, even before tax credits are applied (LINK).

Anyone have any idea where Biden got this claim that the average federal tax rate for billionaires is only 8.2%?

Biden apparently got the figure by factoring in unrealized capital gains that have been taxed NEVER in the history of the USA. (Biden aims to change that so if your investments go up in value, you'll have to pay capital gains on the increase even if you do not trade or sell or take the dividends from those investments. Again such gains have NEVER been taxed in the history of the USA.)

Most billionaires do not take a salary but rather take capital gains on their investments. and capital gains are taxed at a lower rate than are taxable salaries and wages as they should be. Most economists would say billionaires on average pay taxes at a rate that is little less than double that little less than double than that paid by the average American.

No, billionaires don’t pay average of 8.2% in federal taxes

President Biden claimed during the State of the Union that the “average federal tax rate” for billionaires is 8.2%. But the actual number is higher.

www.firstcoastnews.com

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

During his State of the Union speech, President Biden said that American billionaires pay an average federal tax rate of only 8.2%. I quote:

There are 1,000 billionaires in America. You know what the average federal tax rate for these billionaires is? 8.2 percent! That’s far less than the vast majority of Americans pay. No billionaire should pay a lower tax rate than a teacher, a sanitation worker, a nurse!

How can this be? Even if those billionaires earn no money from capital gains and just live off the interest on their money, either from regular savings accounts or from the various types of CDs, those earnings are taxed at the same rate as salaried income.

Any income earned from capital gains that exceeds $41K for individuals and $95K for households is taxed at a rate of 15%. If it exceeds $519K for individuals and $584K for households, it is taxed at a rate of 20%.

The majority of working Americans pay a federal income tax rate of no more than 12%, since they fall into the first and second tax brackets. Approximately 60 million Americans pay an average tax rate of only 1.5%, even before tax credits are applied (LINK).

Anyone have any idea where Biden got this claim that the average federal tax rate for billionaires is only 8.2%?

He lied.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

That accurately represents the 'effective' tax rate.

It doesn't.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

You ever hear of effective tax rate?

You have a scenario where a billionaire pays an effective rate of 8.2%?

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

America's billionaires pay an average income tax rate of just 8.2%, Biden administration says

Analysis showing billionaires have a lower income tax rate than ordinary Americans comes as administration makes the case for raising taxes on the richest people in the U.S.

www.cbsnews.com

The analysis estimated billionaires paid 8.2% of their income between 2010 and 2018, including on forms of income that go largely untaxed — lower than the rates paid by most Americans. It notes in that final year of analysis, those families had at least $2.1 billion in wealth, according to Forbes.

If you include income that isn't income, they pay 8.2%.

If you only include actual income as income, they pay higher rates than most Americans pay.

 

[Dadoalex]

Although your example is pure hyperbole, what laws were broken by applying deductions and paying for business expenses, like employees and attorneys?

did I say anything was illegal?

Perhaps your side of the fence has you feeling guilty?

 

[jotathought]

did I say anything was illegal?

Perhaps your side of the fence has you feeling guilty?

Not really .. your hyperbole is bullshit. I'm sure if you were a wealthy individual with a $500M yacht .. you'd donate additional money to the US Treasury ... meanwhile .. nearly 50% of wage earners pay no income tax .. and then bitch about wealthy people not paying their "fair share.."

 

[Dadoalex]

Not really .. your hyperbole is bullshit. I'm sure if you were a wealthy individual with a $500M yacht .. you'd donate additional money to the US Treasury ... meanwhile .. nearly 50% of wage earners pay no income tax .. and then bitch about wealthy people not paying their "fair share.."

My "hyperbole" is fact.

Didja know Trump buried his ex on a golf course so he could get a lower tax rate?

No illegal. But ...

 

[Crepitus]

Good news, everyone that owns a house, or a car, or anything of value can borrow against them....dumbass.

Holy shit you're stupid.

Why is it that all you freaks with "thinker" in your screen name can't?

 

[mikegriffith1]

Carried interest.

Nope, that won't work. In nearly all cases, carried interest is taxed as capital gains income, which, in the case of the rich, is far more than 8.2%. See my OP for the tax rates on capital gains income.

Having read many bogus, pseudo-scholarly liberal economic "analyses," I suspect this 8.2% figure is based on a large pile of distortion and omission.

Deducting that $800K sports car as a business expense

Really? And how often, if ever, do you really think that happens? Claiming a huge business-expense deduction for a vehicle is a good way to ensure you get audited by the IRS.

I should mention that the Trump tax cuts capped the tax deduction for state and local property taxes at $10K. This provision has hit the rich the hardest, since they pay far, far more in property taxes than average American workers do.

Deducting those million dollar vacations as business expense...

You must be kidding. Is this the kind of delusion that drives the liberal hatred of wealth and success? You think claiming an occasional high-end vacation as a business expense, even assuming a billionaire would take such a risk of prosecution for tax fraud, is going to bring down a billionaire's average tax rate to 8.2%? Really?

Again, large business-expense deductions are a common tripwire for an IRS audit. You can go to jail and/or pay a stiff fine for that kind of tax fraud.

That's why they pay those grossly inadequate tax rates.

You haven't established that billionaires pay an average federal tax rate of only 8.2%.

There is nothing on the White House website that documents the claim that the uber-rich pay an average federal tax rate of only 8.2%. Any White House OMB/CEA "analysis" that says they do should be available for scrutiny. Given the known tax rates on interest from savings accounts and CDs and from capital gains income, I'd like to know how billionaires could pay an average tax rate of only 8.2%.

Ever wonder why in a country where 85% of the people want to simplify the tax codes the codes never actually get simplified?

Because 1% of those 15% are the incredibly wealthy and the other 14% are accountants, tax attorneys and Senators/Congressmen.

Uh, so you think the Republicans have been ones who have blocked attempts to simplify the tax code?! Really?!

 

[Dadoalex]

Nope, that won't work. In nearly all cases, carried interest is taxed as capital gains income, which, in the case of the rich, is far more than 8.2%. See my OP for the tax rates on capital gains income.

Having read many bogus, pseudo-scholarly liberal economic "analyses," I suspect this 8.2% figure is based on a large pile of distortion and omission.


Really? And how often, if ever, do you really think that happens? Claiming a huge business-expense deduction for a vehicle is a good way to ensure you get audited by the IRS.

I should mention that the Trump tax cuts capped the tax deduction for state and local property taxes at $10K. This provision has hit the rich the hardest, since they pay far, far more in property taxes than average American workers do.


You must be kidding. Is this the kind of delusion that drives the liberal hatred of wealth and success? You think claiming an occasional high-end vacation as a business expense, even assuming a billionaire would take such a risk of prosecution for tax fraud, is going to bring down a billionaire's average tax rate to 8.2%? Really?

Again, large business-expense deductions are a common tripwire for an IRS audit. You can go to jail and/or pay a stiff fine for that kind of tax fraud.


You haven't established that billionaires pay an average federal tax rate of only 8.2%.

There is nothing on the White House website that documents the claim that the uber-rich pay an average federal tax rate of only 8.2%. Any White House OMB/CEA "analysis" that says they do should be available for scrutiny. Given the known tax rates on interest from savings accounts and CDs and from capital gains income, I'd like to know how billionaires could pay an average tax rate of only 8.2%.


Uh, so you think the Republicans have been ones who have blocked attempts to simplify the tax code?! Really?!

That you have zero understanding of the topic is clear.
That what you think of as comprehension is nothing more than MAGA talking points is also clear.

 

[Thinker101]

Holy shit you're stupid.

Why is it that all you freaks with "thinker" in your screen name can't?

Well, gee, that sure clears up your understanding on the topic...dumbass.

 

[hadit]

Its bullshit liberal "math".

A lot of billionaires have untaxed capital gains on the books, and libs want to count the rise in value in Amazon or Tesla as "income", even before Bezos or Musk sell the stock. Count those gains as "income" when they aren't defined as such by IRS.

But they won't count any unrealized losses as "expenses" for tax purposes.

 

[mikegriffith1]

That you have zero understanding of the topic is clear.

Oh, really? Where am I wrong? You can Google the tax rates on interest/income from savings accounts, CDs, carried interest, and capital gains. I could cite several scholarly studies that debuk the liberal lie that the rich don't pay their fair share, but you'd never read them.

The liberal fantasy that billionaires somehow lower their tax rate down to an average of 8.2% by deducting luxury cars and high-end vacations is just that: pure fantasy. I notice none of you wealth haters has cited a single source to support this fanciful claim.

That what you think of as comprehension is nothing more than MAGA talking points is also clear.

No, what is clear is that you are so far on the extreme left of the spectrum that you have no interest in substantive dialogue. In your mind, anyone who disagrees with you must be part of the MAGA crowd, as if supporting Trump automatically disqualifies one's views as invalid.

Scholars were making the point that the rich pay a fair share of their income in taxes long before Trump came along.

Just FYI, Trump was my fourth pick among the GOP candidates in 2016, and I've said many times that I wish he were not running again and would retire.

 

[Dadoalex]

Oh, really? Where am I wrong? You can Google the tax rates on interest/income from savings accounts, CDs, carried interest, and capital gains. I could cite several scholarly studies that debuk the liberal lie that the rich don't pay their fair share, but you'd never read them.

The liberal fantasy that billionaires somehow lower their tax rate down to an average of 8.2% by deducting luxury cars and high-end vacations is just that: pure fantasy. I notice none of you wealth haters has cited a single source to support this fanciful claim.


No, what is clear is that you are so far on the extreme left of the spectrum that you have no interest in substantive dialogue. In your mind, anyone who disagrees with you must be part of the MAGA crowd, as if supporting Trump automatically disqualifies one's views as invalid.

Scholars were making the point that the rich pay a fair share of their income in taxes long before Trump came along.

Just FYI, Trump was my fourth pick among the GOP candidates in 2016, and I've said many times that I wish he were not running again and would retire.

I'll stay with you don't have the foggiest clue.

Private Planes and Luxury Yachts Aren’t Just Toys for the Ultrawealthy. They’re Also Huge Tax Breaks.

What’s the only thing better than having your own Gulfstream jet? Why, getting to claim millions in tax deductions for it. All you have to do is make a case you’re using it for business, which turns out to be surprisingly easy.

www.propublica.org

Private Jet Costs, Sketchy Deductions Among Red Flags in Trump Taxes

Dozens of audit triggers litter Donald Trump’s tax returns, according to Congress’s top non-partisan tax lawyers: questionable private jet expenses, large unsubstantiated charitable deductions and dubious payments to the former president’s children, among others.

www.bloomberg.com

Private jet buyers got a big bonus from Trump's new tax law

Through bonus depreciation, private jet buyers will not be able to deduct 100% of its cost immediately.

www.businessinsider.com

Opinion| Stephen Prince: I own a private plane — I don't need a tax break to fly one.

The wealthiest Americans have an obligation to speak up when the system is unfairly rigged in our favor.

www.nbcnews.com

Leased cars

The tax benefits of leasing vs. buying a car for your business

Is it better to lease or purchase a business vehicle? That depends on vehicle use.

finance.yahoo.com

Using Section 179 to Write Off Luxury Vehicles

There may be tax benefits to leasing or buying a car for business. If your business purchases or leases heavy luxury vehicles, you may be able to write off a good portion of their cost using Section 179.

corvee.com

Ten Ways Billionaires Avoid Taxes on an Epic Scale

After a year of reporting on the tax machinations of the ultrawealthy, ProPublica spotlights the top tax-avoidance techniques that provide massive benefits to billionaires.

www.propublica.org

McCaffery Breaks Down How The Rich Avoid Taxes

Investing money can help you build wealth, but taxes can take a big bite out of your earnings. Following a buy, borrow, die strategy is one way to minimize your tax liability and preserve more of your wealth. The concept … Continue reading → The post Buy, Borrow, Die: How the Rich Avoid Taxes...

finance.yahoo.com

Like I said...MAGAT Talking points.