What are Herman Cain's plans? What is 9-9-9?

Amelia

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Will someone who likes Herman Cain as a candidate please campaign for him here. Give it your best shot.

I'd like to hear more about his plans for the nation from someone who feels informed enough to be a good advocate.





Edit: p.s. What are the odds of Cain being able to get his plans through Congress? Assume the best information campaign possible, to convince the people, so they can convince their representatives. Will that be enough? Will Congress cooperate?
 
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Chris

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What is 999?

666 upside down.

Chances of getting it thru Congress....zero.
 

ClosedCaption

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Herman Cain's '999 plan': long overdue tax reform or job killer? - CSMonitor.com

But probably the largest economic impact would be shifting the tax burden. “It's a huge tax reduction on the very top and a huge tax increase for moderate and low income people," says Michael Graetz, a professor at Columbia University who has testified before Congress on taxes.

For example, economists have a measure called marginal propensity to consume. Low income people tend to spend about 98 percent of their income, middle income people spend 97 percent and high income people spend 90 percent.

Thus, Cain’s proposal would result in an individual who makes $20,000 per year, paying $1,800 in income taxes, plus another $1,605 in sales taxes, assuming they spend 98 percent of their income. The combined income and sales taxes would amount to 17 percent of income.

By way of comparison, using today’s tax rates, that individual – married filing separately – would pay $2,575 in combined taxes or 12.8 percent of their income, according to the website moneychimp.com.

A middle income taxpayer that makes $55,000 per year would pay $9,319 in combined taxes, coming to 16.9 percent of their income. Today, that individual would pay $9,875 and would pay 17.95 percent of their income in taxes.

And, a high income earner who makes $300,000 per year would pay $49,113 in taxes, which would amount to 16.3 percent of their income. But, today, that individual would pay $83,897 or 27.97 percent of their income in taxes.
 

earlycuyler

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Will someone who likes Herman Cain as a candidate please campaign for him here. Give it your best shot.

I'd like to hear more about his plans for the nation from someone who feels informed enough to be a good advocate.





Edit: p.s. What are the odds of Cain being able to get his plans through Congress? Assume the best information campaign possible, to convince the people, so they can convince their representatives. Will that be enough? Will Congress cooperate?
And your edit is the rub. Why would either house of congress want any reform of any kind ?
 

Oddball

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Will someone who likes Herman Cain as a candidate please campaign for him here. Give it your best shot.

I'd like to hear more about his plans for the nation from someone who feels informed enough to be a good advocate.





Edit: p.s. What are the odds of Cain being able to get his plans through Congress? Assume the best information campaign possible, to convince the people, so they can convince their representatives. Will that be enough? Will Congress cooperate?
The odds of him getting the program through congress are nil....It's a really really dumb idea besides.

Given that it would be DOA no matter who controlled congress, he's still is a better candidate than the media anointed "front runners".
 

Foxfyre

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I refuse to believe that it is impossible to adopt a true flat tax which Cain's 9-9-9 plan pretty much is. I refuse to believe that voters pretty well united in what they want from their government are unable to elect people willing to do what they want.

In a nutshell, Cain's 9-9-9 plan is to replace all other federal taxes with:

1. A flat 9% income tax
2. A flat 9% corporate tax
3. A 9% federal sales tax

PLUS the government would be required to operate within the revenues received.

And YES that means that those currently paying no federal tax will pay some federal tax and the upper middle income and 'rich' may pay some less than they currently do. That is IF there is no change in behavior due to the new system, but we know that there are ALWAYS changes in behavior when a new tax system is introduced.

I agree with some that most of those in Congress now won't go along with this because it strips government of much of its power to increase the power, influence, prestige, and personal fortunes of those in government.

But those people can be replaced with true public servants. We can't be defeatists and say that it just can't happen. It can happen and if enough of us want it to, it will.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x9LFwX7YfKg]Herman Cain breaks down his 9-9-9 plan - YouTube[/ame]
 
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Amelia

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Will someone who likes Herman Cain as a candidate please campaign for him here. Give it your best shot.

I'd like to hear more about his plans for the nation from someone who feels informed enough to be a good advocate.





Edit: p.s. What are the odds of Cain being able to get his plans through Congress? Assume the best information campaign possible, to convince the people, so they can convince their representatives. Will that be enough? Will Congress cooperate?
And your edit is the rub. Why would either house of congress want any reform of any kind ?


If they were worried enough about losing their jobs ... coz the ideas were popular enough with enough people .... erm, including the people who contribute to campaigns .....

okay okay, that's a pipe dream.
 

Avorysuds

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I refuse to believe that it is impossible to adopt a true flat tax which Cain's 9-9-9 plan pretty much is. I refuse to believe that voters pretty well united in what they want from their government are unable to elect people willing to do what they want.

In a nutshell, Cain's 9-9-9 plan is to replace all other federal taxes with:

1. A flat 9% income tax
2. A flat 9% corporate tax
3. A 9% federal sales tax

PLUS the government would be required to operate within the revenues received.

And YES that means that those currently paying no federal tax will pay some federal tax and the upper middle income and 'rich' may pay some less than they currently do. That is IF there is no change in behavior due to the new system, but we know that there are ALWAYS changes in behavior when a new tax system is introduced.

I agree with some that most of those in Congress now won't go along with this because it strips government of much of its power to increase the power, influence, prestige, and personal fortunes of those in government.

But those people can be replaced with true public servants. We can't be defeatists and say that it just can't happen. It can happen and if enough of us want it to, it will.

Herman Cain breaks down his 9-9-9 plan - YouTube
So if I have a small business and I make 100k a year how much do you think I get to keep under Cain's 999 plan mixed with states/local taxes when I get to write none of his bullshit off? Lets say my overhead is 40k a year not by taxes.
 
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ABikerSailor

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You know........there are several places where that 9 percent flat tax would be non enforcable, namely federal lands like Native American reservations and military bases.

What would happen? The rich would have enough money that they could travel to places like Native American reservations and military bases so that they wouldn't have to pay sales tax. Poor people wouldn't have the same ability to do the same thing, so again, we have the poor paying for the rich.
 
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Amelia

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I refuse to believe that it is impossible to adopt a true flat tax which Cain's 9-9-9 plan pretty much is. I refuse to believe that voters pretty well united in what they want from their government are unable to elect people willing to do what they want.

In a nutshell, Cain's 9-9-9 plan is to replace all other federal taxes with:

1. A flat 9% income tax
2. A flat 9% corporate tax
3. A 9% federal sales tax

PLUS the government would be required to operate within the revenues received.

And YES that means that those currently paying no federal tax will pay some federal tax and the upper middle income and 'rich' may pay some less than they currently do. That is IF there is no change in behavior due to the new system, but we know that there are ALWAYS changes in behavior when a new tax system is introduced.

I agree with some that most of those in Congress now won't go along with this because it strips government of much of its power to increase the power, influence, prestige, and personal fortunes of those in government.

But those people can be replaced with true public servants. We can't be defeatists and say that it just can't happen. It can happen and if enough of us want it to, it will.

Herman Cain breaks down his 9-9-9 plan - YouTube




Letting this sink in. Loading up the debate segment on my slow computer.

While it loads thinking dismally "but but but" about how long it would take to get the right number of congress people in office backed by the right number of voters who believed in them on the importance of any one sweeping plan ..... as opposed to the 49 to 54 ish percent of voters who put someone into office, but not really because even that many people really believed in the plan. Most of them just voted on a whim and will be easilly influenced by how poll questions are phrased and so on. Not really true believers who would have enough numbers to hold a majority of congress accountable.



um, okay, the video is loaded now. going to watch it.
 

Foxfyre

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I refuse to believe that it is impossible to adopt a true flat tax which Cain's 9-9-9 plan pretty much is. I refuse to believe that voters pretty well united in what they want from their government are unable to elect people willing to do what they want.

In a nutshell, Cain's 9-9-9 plan is to replace all other federal taxes with:

1. A flat 9% income tax
2. A flat 9% corporate tax
3. A 9% federal sales tax

PLUS the government would be required to operate within the revenues received.

And YES that means that those currently paying no federal tax will pay some federal tax and the upper middle income and 'rich' may pay some less than they currently do. That is IF there is no change in behavior due to the new system, but we know that there are ALWAYS changes in behavior when a new tax system is introduced.

I agree with some that most of those in Congress now won't go along with this because it strips government of much of its power to increase the power, influence, prestige, and personal fortunes of those in government.

But those people can be replaced with true public servants. We can't be defeatists and say that it just can't happen. It can happen and if enough of us want it to, it will.

Herman Cain breaks down his 9-9-9 plan - YouTube
So if I have a small business and I make 100k a year how much do you think I get to keep under Cain's 999 plan mixed with states/local taxes when I get to write none of his bullshit off? Lets say my overhead is 40k a year not by taxes.
You would still be able to write off the cost of doing business. You might lose some of the more ridiculous loopholes. The lower rate should easily offset any deductions you might lose.

While I will never agree to government dictating how much an executive or anybody else can be paid, I would have no problem with a cap on how much compensation could be deducted from corporate income to determine the net profit. That would keep corporations from transferring all excess income to corporate salaries, bonuses, and/or benefits and then having no 'profit' to pay taxes on.

Taxes on corporations or business are not on gross income but are on net profits.

This, along with repeal of ornerous and unnecessary regulation, would so free up the burden on both corporations and the self employed to generate an economic boom of the likes this country has never seen. And the lower income folks would have no incentive to stay 'low income' and the economic boom would provide them all sorts of opportunity to become middle class.
 

Foxfyre

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You know........there are several places where that 9 percent flat tax would be non enforcable, namely federal lands like Native American reservations and military bases.

What would happen? The rich would have enough money that they could travel to places like Native American reservations and military bases so that they wouldn't have to pay sales tax. Poor people wouldn't have the same ability to do the same thing, so again, we have the poor paying for the rich.
Some just can't give up the 'class warfare' mentality, huh. Those with the resources are already utilizing tax free areas when they can, so I can't see how that would change any. I live in a state with a LOT of land set aside as Indian reservations but the state still seems to be collecting enough gross receipts tax (in lieu of sales tax) just fine. I'm sure the feds will do as well. And there are just an awful lot of things that the Indians come off the reservation to buy--and pay tax--because it isn't available on the reservations.
 

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I refuse to believe that it is impossible to adopt a true flat tax which Cain's 9-9-9 plan pretty much is. I refuse to believe that voters pretty well united in what they want from their government are unable to elect people willing to do what they want.

In a nutshell, Cain's 9-9-9 plan is to replace all other federal taxes with:

1. A flat 9% income tax
2. A flat 9% corporate tax
3. A 9% federal sales tax

PLUS the government would be required to operate within the revenues received.

And YES that means that those currently paying no federal tax will pay some federal tax and the upper middle income and 'rich' may pay some less than they currently do. That is IF there is no change in behavior due to the new system, but we know that there are ALWAYS changes in behavior when a new tax system is introduced.

I agree with some that most of those in Congress now won't go along with this because it strips government of much of its power to increase the power, influence, prestige, and personal fortunes of those in government.

But those people can be replaced with true public servants. We can't be defeatists and say that it just can't happen. It can happen and if enough of us want it to, it will.

Herman Cain breaks down his 9-9-9 plan - YouTube
So if I have a small business and I make 100k a year how much do you think I get to keep under Cain's 999 plan mixed with states/local taxes when I get to write none of his bullshit off? Lets say my overhead is 40k a year not by taxes.
You would still be able to write off the cost of doing business. You might lose some of the more ridiculous loopholes. The lower rate should easily offset any deductions you might lose.

While I will never agree to government dictating how much an executive or anybody else can be paid, I would have no problem with a cap on how much compensation could be deducted from corporate income to determine the net profit. That would keep corporations from transferring all excess income to corporate salaries, bonuses, and/or benefits and then having no 'profit' to pay taxes on.

Taxes on corporations or business are not on gross income but are on net profits.

This, along with repeal of ornerous and unnecessary regulation, would so free up the burden on both corporations and the self employed to generate an economic boom of the likes this country has never seen. And the lower income folks would have no incentive to stay 'low income' and the economic boom would provide them all sorts of opportunity to become middle class.
Or anything they chose to be with a little elbow grease and brain power...The American Way. Just as Mr. Cain applied it despite the odds in the times he grew up. This is why he is an attractive candidate for so many.

100% American Success.
 

Oddball

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I refuse to believe that it is impossible to adopt a true flat tax which Cain's 9-9-9 plan pretty much is. I refuse to believe that voters pretty well united in what they want from their government are unable to elect people willing to do what they want.

In a nutshell, Cain's 9-9-9 plan is to replace all other federal taxes with:

1. A flat 9% income tax
2. A flat 9% corporate tax
3. A 9% federal sales tax

PLUS the government would be required to operate within the revenues received.

And YES that means that those currently paying no federal tax will pay some federal tax and the upper middle income and 'rich' may pay some less than they currently do. That is IF there is no change in behavior due to the new system, but we know that there are ALWAYS changes in behavior when a new tax system is introduced.

I agree with some that most of those in Congress now won't go along with this because it strips government of much of its power to increase the power, influence, prestige, and personal fortunes of those in government.

But those people can be replaced with true public servants. We can't be defeatists and say that it just can't happen. It can happen and if enough of us want it to, it will.

Herman Cain breaks down his 9-9-9 plan - YouTube
A total 18% federal tax on all monies earned that end up getting spent back into the economy won't fly with anyone who has two functioning brain cells to rub together...Throw in state sales taxes upwards of 7% and you're looking a 25% total tax bite on purchases.

The plan won't even get into committee, let alone out of it.
 

PLYMCO_PILGRIM

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Will someone who likes Herman Cain as a candidate please campaign for him here. Give it your best shot.

I'd like to hear more about his plans for the nation from someone who feels informed enough to be a good advocate.





Edit: p.s. What are the odds of Cain being able to get his plans through Congress? Assume the best information campaign possible, to convince the people, so they can convince their representatives. Will that be enough? Will Congress cooperate?
What is the 9-9-9 plan? Here you go


Phase 1 - 9-9-9
•Current circumstances call for bolder action.
•The Phase 1 Enhanced Plan incorporates the features of Phase One and gets us a step closer to Phase two.
•I call on the Super Committee to pass the Phase 1 Enhanced Plan along with their spending cut package.
•The Phase 1 Enhanced Plan unites Flat Tax supporters with Fair tax supporters.
•Achieves the broadest possible tax base along with the lowest possible rate of 9%.
•It ends the Payroll Tax completely – a permanent holiday!
•Zero capital gains tax
•Ends the Death Tax.
•Eliminates double taxation of dividends
•Business Flat Tax – 9%
◦Gross income less all investments, all purchases from other businesses and all dividends paid to shareholders.
◦Empowerment Zones will offer additional deductions for payroll employed in the zone.
•Individual Flat Tax – 9%.
◦Gross income less charitable deductions.
◦Empowerment Zones will offer additional deductions for those living and/or working in the zone.
•National Sales Tax – 9%.
◦This gets the Fair Tax off the sidelines and into the game.


Phase 2 – The Fair Tax
•Amidst a backdrop of the economic boom created by the Phase 1 Enhanced Plan, I will begin the process of educating the American people on the benefits of continuing the next step to the Fair Tax.
•The Fair Tax would ultimately replace individual and corporate income taxes.
•It would make it possible to end the IRS as we know it.
•The Fair Tax makes our exported goods and services the most competitively internationally than any other tax system.


Enhanced Plan – Summary•Unites all tax payers so we all pay income taxes and no one pays payroll taxes
•Provides the least incentive to evade taxes and the fewest opportunities to do so
•Lifts a $430 billion dead-weight burden on the economy due to compliance, enforcement, collection, etc.
•Is fair, neutral, transparent, and efficient
•Ends nearly all deductions and special interest favors
•Ends all payroll taxes
•Ends the Death Tax
•Features zero tax on capital gains and repatriated profits
•Lowest marginal rates on production
•Allows immediate expensing of business investments
•Eliminates double taxation of dividends
•Increases capital formation. Capital per worker drives productivity and wage growth
•Capital formation will aid capital availability for small businesses
•Features a platform to launch properly structured Empowerment Zones to revitalize our inner cities
•We all know the Fed has tripled the money supply since 2008. They have been printing money out of thin air to finance the Obama spending machine. While true Fed reform that restores sound money may have to wait for my election, the best thing we can do now is to pursue policies that increase the DEMAND for dollars to help mitigate the risks associated with the increase in the supply.
•Pro-growth economic policies equal a strong dollar policy



If the republicans get a majority in the senate and retain a majority in the house the odds of him being able to do this increase greatly. If the dems hold one or gain the other then the odds are slim.

Also if the majority of americans get behind the plan then yes, as you say, they can pressure their reps to vote for it.

I personally have an issue with the 9-9-9 plan and that issue is that some income, such as cap gains, is exempt from the 9% income tax. If it was ANY and ALL income at 9% I wouldn't have an issue.

Anything else you specifically want to know about?
 

PLYMCO_PILGRIM

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So 9-9-9 is just a Trojan Horse to get the "fair tax" scam enacted.

Fuck Herman Cain.
Yeah he is a fair tax advocate.

Glad I showed you something you didn't know....well...sorta since I like cain and now you really hate him :lol:. But still I'm glad I helped show you something new even if its bad for my guy.
 

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