Verizon strike ending . Unions win new contract !

[Hutch Starskey]

How do you relocate cell towers?

The cell towers went on strike?

You said Verizon should move to a RTW state. How do they do that ?

You do know that an employee can be based in one state but get paid by the company that is headquartered in another state don't you?

Verizon is headquartered in NYC. They have operations nationwide.
How does that solve your union problem?
That was his argument.

 

[Hutch Starskey]

You do understand that not only is Verizon wireless in all fifty states but verizon is also the local phone company. The phone company can't just pick up and move.
You are truly dopey.

As far as I read, the media didn't state what kind of jobs we are even talking about here. And if they are stationary jobs, how does this wage or benefits increase fare with their competitors?

One thing I did note is that they were upset because Verizon was beginning to outsource.

Really? And why not? Why can't they move most all of their work somewhere else?

Should they take all of their poles, wires and switches and leave? Think about it. They're a utility company.

Outsource to contractors. They've been doing that for years for the larger construction projects. The day to day stuff still needs to be done.

Umm. The poles, wires etc do not belong to the workers. In fact the poles don't even belong to the telco....Most Telco plant is attached to the property of the incumbent electric provider.
AT&T has been using outside contractors to build main plant for over 20 years.
Until recently. AT&T had been using contractors to run service drops. The contractors go t out of that because it doesn't make any money. So they gave it back to AT&T....AT&T has a separate division for drop bury work. Those workers are not under the union contract.

Can you follow the discussion? No one said they belong to workers.
Ray said Verizon should move to a RTW state to avoid unions. How do you move a local phone company?

 

[Freewill]

How do you relocate cell towers?

The cell towers went on strike?

You said Verizon should move to a RTW state. How do they do that ?

You do know that an employee can be based in one state but get paid by the company that is headquartered in another state don't you?

Which can be a really interesting. My place of employment is near the state border. So there were lots of folks living in the next states. The town it is in is really small. the number of employees has to be 10 times the number of residents. The residences get free garbage pickup, free cable and I believe they now get free water brought to them by the company. Their land taxes are virtually zero. Which is OK it is a fair trade off for having a giant company in your backyard.

But, the greedy democrats went even further. They tried to take employment taxes from all the employees instead of sending them to their local communities. Thus a person would have to pay 1 percent of their wages twice. Those in state took it to court and the greedy bastard democrats didn't get the in state money. But that didn't stop them from taking it from the out of state workers. As far as I know they still do.

Funny thing is that this all started because an out of state company bought out the in state company. When they did they said they were no longer going to send money to individual communities only to the community where the business is located. When the local community saw all that money it went to their head.

 

[Freewill]

Does anyone who has Verizon miss them while they were on strike?

I didn't....

Me either. And like what's going on with this huge minimum wage increase, expect Verizon to invest in more automation.

Yes, because robots can go to a physical location, climb poles, find and repair a single pair of wires in thousands. Dream on.

No, but the end of copper service is near. And all the tech had better learn how to work with fiber. Otherwise they will be looking for work.

that is not totally true. As I understand ATT system works on copper hardline cable. They run the fiber to hubs and branch off to the houses using the phone line.

Verizon on the other hand is direct fiber optics to the house.

That means I can get ATT "high speed" internet and not Verizon.

We also thought it a great cost saving idea to get rid of our land line. Really great idea if you don't forget to change your phone or if you are not an absentminded professor who misplaces their phone, and you don't have to be a professor. Plus it is harder to screen phone calls.

 

[Skull Pilot]

How do you relocate cell towers?

The cell towers went on strike?

You said Verizon should move to a RTW state. How do they do that ?

You do know that an employee can be based in one state but get paid by the company that is headquartered in another state don't you?

Verizon is headquartered in NYC. They have operations nationwide.
How does that solve your union problem?
That was his argument.

If they were headquartered in a RTW state they could hire nonunion workers

I don't see what's so hard to understand about that

 

[Hutch Starskey]

How do you relocate cell towers?

The cell towers went on strike?

You said Verizon should move to a RTW state. How do they do that ?

You do know that an employee can be based in one state but get paid by the company that is headquartered in another state don't you?

Verizon is headquartered in NYC. They have operations nationwide.
How does that solve your union problem?
That was his argument.

If they were headquartered in a RTW state they could hire nonunion workers

I don't see what's so hard to understand about that

You don't understand at all.
Having headquarters in a RTW state does nothing to prevent unions in non RTW states where they operate.

 

[Skull Pilot]

The cell towers went on strike?

You said Verizon should move to a RTW state. How do they do that ?

You do know that an employee can be based in one state but get paid by the company that is headquartered in another state don't you?

Verizon is headquartered in NYC. They have operations nationwide.
How does that solve your union problem?
That was his argument.

If they were headquartered in a RTW state they could hire nonunion workers

I don't see what's so hard to understand about that

You don't understand at all.
Having headquarters in a RTW state does nothing to prevent unions in non RTW states where they operate.

The company would not always have to hire unionized employees as they do now. All they have to do is say all their employees are based out of a RTW state

 

[Hutch Starskey]

You said Verizon should move to a RTW state. How do they do that ?

You do know that an employee can be based in one state but get paid by the company that is headquartered in another state don't you?

Verizon is headquartered in NYC. They have operations nationwide.
How does that solve your union problem?
That was his argument.

If they were headquartered in a RTW state they could hire nonunion workers

I don't see what's so hard to understand about that

You don't understand at all.
Having headquarters in a RTW state does nothing to prevent unions in non RTW states where they operate.

The company would not always have to hire unionized employees as they do now. All they have to do is say all their employees are based out of a RTW state

Are you insane? That would be fraud.
They are still required to follow the laws of the states they operate in.

 

[JoeNormal]

By not raising wages annually to keep pace with inflation employers are lowering wages over time.
Unions don't renegotiate annually. Over a decade, wages can lose 20% of their value.
It's not even so much a raise as an adjustment to the current cost of living.

I haven't had a raise in four years. I'm like many Americans. Somebody has to pay the costs for Commie Care or otherwise increase medical insurance costs. Where do you think that money comes from?

This is where unions are a problem. Nobody has to keep up with the cost of living. Chances are, the income of these companies didn't increase with the cost of living either.

If you haven't gotten a raise in 4 years, it must be because your productivity hasn't risen in 4 years. It couldn't be that your employer would be focused solely on raising profits. Nah, that never happens.

 

[JoeNormal]

OK...I get that. But a company needs to add in a cost of living raise and raises for staying and being productive. Any halfway decent company does this automatically. If they don't, they are poorly run. If they agree to sit down at the table, then that is their choice. Sometimes the company wins, sometimes workers win. Why does it bother you that in the end they might get a little more money? You surely don't hate people that much do you? I cheer for the little guy. Who doesn't? We can both agree management of any company is not trustworthy.

And unions are?

Let me explain how this works:

The union gets a percentage of a union workers pay. The higher the pay of course, the higher the union contributions. So it makes sense for the union to get as much from a company as possible.

Unions never gave a crap about their employees. All they care about is how they can leech off of them.

Because the left refuses to accept this fact, they "assume" that if the unions are making demands, it must be because the company is screwing the workers.

So before you can convince me that the workers were getting shorted, show me some evidence. Show me how these poor union workers were making less than acceptable wages or benefits. Because at least from what I read, what the union is really upset about is the outsourcing. That's because unions don't get a cut of outsourcing pay.

They are in it for themselves like unions have always been.

The union provides leadership and unity. I thought you believed that was worth something. You sure don't seem to complain about upper management in the corporate world charging a shit load of money for it.

 

[JoeNormal]

You're an employers dream. A good soldier who will never question their authority.

Correct, I am an employers dream. That's because I respect the agreement I made with them and they appreciate it. That's why even in the worst of economic times, I stayed employed while others were crying that there was no work for them. And if I decide to leave my current job, I will have a great resume and references as well.

Do you remember that web site a few years ago that showed everyday people holding handwritten notes about how they had 3 jobs, a ton of debt yet THEY didn't complain. Out of curiosity, were you on that site?

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

The union provides leadership and unity. I thought you believed that was worth something. You sure don't seem to complain about upper management in the corporate world charging a shit load of money for it.

Charging a shitload of money for what?

I think at the beginning, unions were a good thing. But that was a time when there was no government protection, no availability for education, no news channels to report on human transgressions, no nothing. It was the worker and the employer, and that was it.

During the era I was growing up, I seen what unions became. As a truck driver, I can tell you the end result of overpowering unions. I could fill pages with my union experience stories. My company lost a lot of customers because of unions.

Greed is what killed the unions and the public support of them. Perhaps with the exception of government, unions will be totally eliminated in this country within 20 or 30 years.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

If you haven't gotten a raise in 4 years, it must be because your productivity hasn't risen in 4 years. It couldn't be that your employer would be focused solely on raising profits. Nah, that never happens.

If he does, then it's none of my business. My business is he pays me to do X work. If the pay is satisfactory, then I work. If it's not, then I find somebody that will pay satisfactory wages. If I can't find such a company, then my boss is paying me at the top of my scale.

Our business is very competitive. During the last recession when other companies were closing down, ours barely survived. That's because my employer kept a rainy day fund for just such an occasion. Other companies did pay their employees more, and of course the union places had to, but they had no backup. The first sign off a loss, they shut the doors.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

OK yray. Let's suppose those jobs were low paying. Let's say $30 grand per year or thereabouts. If nobody applied for them would you be upset and think dog gone it there ate able bodied Americans who should be doing those jobs?

Only if they are on social programs instead of working. But if they're not living off of my tax dollars, they should be able to do what they want.

 

[JoeNormal]

The union provides leadership and unity. I thought you believed that was worth something. You sure don't seem to complain about upper management in the corporate world charging a shit load of money for it.

Charging a shitload of money for what?

I think at the beginning, unions were a good thing. But that was a time when there was no government protection, no availability for education, no news channels to report on human transgressions, no nothing. It was the worker and the employer, and that was it.

During the era I was growing up, I seen what unions became. As a truck driver, I can tell you the end result of overpowering unions. I could fill pages with my union experience stories. My company lost a lot of customers because of unions.

Greed is what killed the unions and the public support of them. Perhaps with the exception of government, unions will be totally eliminated in this country within 20 or 30 years.

Charging a shitload of money for what? For providing leadership and unity as I just said.

I've actually never been a union member and having lived through the 70's on the outside looking in, I can't argue too much with some of what you're saying. Back then it seemed that being part of a union made you immune from getting fired for doing shitty work. We're not in the 70's any longer and the pendulum has swung way too far in the other direction. Now, corporations and their upper management hold all the cards and being in that club apparently makes you immune from having to keep your greed in check. Employees are kept in fear that their jobs might be outsourced, automated or eliminated at any time and they'd better just STFU about any sort of concessions that a union would have fought for on their behalf.

 

[Jarlaxle]

Well you don't have to stick with Verizon. Go to a provider that doesn't like its employees. If you want good employees then STEP UP and pay them. More psy equals more productivity. Less pay equals less productivity. Pretend to pay me I pretend to work. Its called capitalism.

You act like people have a choice. Many simply DON'T. (I didn't.)

 

[Jarlaxle]

Keep pushing it?
So there can never be pay raises ever?

Sure there can, when the employer decides it's time for one, or the employer considers an employees request for one. But no, not by force. That's when you throw a monkey wrench into the works.

Collective bargaining is not force. It's leverage.

It is extortion, no matter how you sugarcoat it.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Charging a shitload of money for what? For providing leadership and unity as I just said.

I've actually never been a union member and having lived through the 70's on the outside looking in, I can't argue too much with some of what you're saying. Back then it seemed that being part of a union made you immune from getting fired for doing shitty work. We're not in the 70's any longer and the pendulum has swung way too far in the other direction. Now, corporations and their upper management hold all the cards and being in that club apparently makes you immune from having to keep your greed in check. Employees are kept in fear that their jobs might be outsourced, automated or eliminated at any time and they'd better just STFU about any sort of concessions that a union would have fought for on their behalf.

And they have every right to fear that. Unions are unions, but they can't call all the shots in the company. i think that if Verizon wanted to outsource some of their work, that's not the unions business--that's the companies business. If Verizon wanted to update their automation, again, that's none of the unions business.

 

[Jarlaxle]

The workers bound together are the union. If they send their own jobs overseas that's their issue although I don't find it wise.If the workers take a vote and decide to strike then they will. Its the last bastion of a workers right and way protect decent jobs in America.

That's why I think (and hope) that Verizon moves out of the area to break up the union like so many of our former customers. Then they will have no job. Do you hear me Verizon? Move to a Right-to-Work state like all the others. Then you don't have to tolerate these unions any longer.

You do understand that not only is Verizon wireless in all fifty states but verizon is also the local phone company. The phone company can't just pick up and move.
You are truly dopey.

No Verizon landlines in this state, bud.

 

[Jarlaxle]

You do know that an employee can be based in one state but get paid by the company that is headquartered in another state don't you?

Verizon is headquartered in NYC. They have operations nationwide.
How does that solve your union problem?
That was his argument.

If they were headquartered in a RTW state they could hire nonunion workers

I don't see what's so hard to understand about that

You don't understand at all.
Having headquarters in a RTW state does nothing to prevent unions in non RTW states where they operate.

The company would not always have to hire unionized employees as they do now. All they have to do is say all their employees are based out of a RTW state

Are you insane? That would be fraud.
They are still required to follow the laws of the states they operate in.

My neighbor is, legally, employed in Nebraska. He has not actually been there in several years...but he is still, legally, employed there.