Zone1 Vatican Sect leader Francis says Judas is hard to understand but COULD BE SAVED!

[nomadic5]

So you actually believe that if you gave money to the church, a priest had the power to 'shorten" your Purgatory "sentence"? And that you shouldn't eat meat on Fri.?

I have not studied this particular issue as much as I have other issues. But an indulgence is something Christ Church practiced and still does. In my understanding of this, giving money is a sacrifice that means you are serious about the person being prayed for, the person in Purgatory. I am not speaking for the official Church here, just giving my thoughts on the topic.

In any case, there is no Church law that says you have to give money to a priest for an indulgence. But Purgatory is painful so if you love someone, you want him to get out of there asap and get to Heaven...

 

[The Irish Ram]

So, you can pay away sin?

 

[Blackrook]

Protestants don't know about purgatory because their version of the Bible doesn't have Maccabees.

Judas did appear to repent his betrayal of Christ, but then he killed himself.

 

[shockedcanadian]

I didn't get the name of the author of this, but the quotes are from Francis (my words are in brackets)



"Judas is a difficult character to understand... when he sees what he has done, he turns to the ‘righteous,’ to the priests: ‘I have sinned: I handed over an innocent man to be killed.’ They answer him: ‘What does that matter to us? That’s your affair.’ (Matthew 27:3-10) Then he goes away with that guilt that suffocates him.”


The [alleged/purported] Pontiff invites us to imagine a different fate for Judas: “Perhaps if he had met the Virgin Mary, things would have gone differently, but the poor man goes away, doesn’t find a way out of his situation, and he went to hang himself.”


“But, there’s one thing that makes me think that Judas’ story doesn’t end there … Perhaps someone might think, ‘this pope is a heretic…’ But, no! They should go see a particular medieval capital of a column in the Basilica of St. Mary Magdalen in Vézelay, Burgundy [in France],” he said.


The [alleged/purported] Successor of Peter describes how people in the Middle Ages taught the Gospel through sculptures and paintings. “On that capital, on one side there is Judas, hanged; but on the other is the Good Shepherd who is carrying him on his shoulders and is carrying him away.”



Comments:


Really? Jesus said that there were none lost who were given to Him (Apostles) except for the "son of perdition"

aka Hell

Francis needs to go to confession... "Father, forgive me, I am not a Catholic"

and the priest would say "Halleluia! You finally speak Truth!"

Anyone can be saved. It requires a forgiving and thoughtful world though. We are desperately lacking such ecolved humans especiallly in creepy Toronto.

 

[Carl in Michigan]

No, I am believing what Christ's Church teaches and also, what life has taught me, which confirms the fact that I am 1000% correct to listen to Christ's Church (if nothing else does)

The New Testament was put together by Christ's Church

Protestants usually don't know Churchhistory (or they wouldn't beprotestants)

As someone once said

"To be deep in history is to cease being Protestant"

Your church was founded by Simon Magus. He was your first pope. You are free to believe what you want to believe, but the rest of us don't recognize the authority of your church.

It's okay to have an opinion about Judas, but because you believe it, doesn't make it so.

 

[onefour1]

Judas Iscariot was a son of perdition.

John 17:12
12 While I was with them in the world, I kept them in thy name: those that thou gavest me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled.

Hebrews 6:4-6
4 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.

 

[nomadic5]

Your church was founded by Simon Magus. He was your first pope. You are free to believe what you want to believe, but the rest of us don't recognize the authority of your church.

It's okay to have an opinion about Judas, but because you believe it, doesn't make it so.

What a liar

Study some history.. grab a brain

 

[nomadic5]

Judas Iscariot was a son of perdition.

John 17:12
12 While I was with them in the world, I kept them in thy name: those that thou gavest me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled.

This seems to imply that Judas was destined to go to Hell

perfect example of why we need a CHURCH established by Christ toshow us what Scipture really means--- which does not include (cannot include) every amateur theologian's opinions on what it means

The rest of th Bible would seem to imply that NO ONE is dstined for one or the other Place

 

[onefour1]

This seems to imply that Judas was destined to go to Hell

perfect example of why we need a CHURCH established by Christ toshow us what Scipture really means--- which does not include (cannot include) every amateur theologian's opinions on what it means

The rest of th Bible would seem to imply that NO ONE is dstined for one or the other Place

John 17:12 are the words of Jesus telling us that Judas Iscariot was a son of perdition. A son of perdition is one who blasphemes against the Holy Ghost.

Matthew 12:31-32
31 Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men.
32 And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come.

The only reason I believe that Judas Iscariot was a son of perdition is because Jesus tells us in John 17:12 that he is one The Bible is clear that those who sin against the Holy Ghost are not to be forgiven in this world nor in the world to come.

I don't believe that God predestines anyone to go to heaven or hell. He allows mankind to use their free will to choose for themselves to do good or evil. However, I do believe that God knows exactly what we will choose with our free will and thus knows the end from the beginning. Free will is critical for our progression and God would not be just in judging us if we did not choose in and of ourselves to do good or evil. So predestination is not a true principle of God.

 

[nomadic5]

Protestants don't know about purgatory because their version of the Bible doesn't have Maccabees.

Judas did appear to repent his betrayal of Christ, but then he killed himself.

But their Bibles have Mt 18:23

and Phil 2:12 (working out your salvation with fear and trembling. What if you haven't completed such a hurculean task before you die?)

 

[nomadic5]

John 17:12 are the words of Jesus telling us that Judas Iscariot was a son of perdition. A son of perdition is one who blasphemes against the Holy Ghost.

I got this far. A protestant would just say that your words here are not found in the Bible.

But a Catholic like me would ask: What about the fact he repented of what he'd done?

just wondering...

 

[onefour1]

I got this far. A protestant would just say that your words here are not found in the Bible.

But a Catholic like me would ask: What about the fact he repented of what he'd done?

just wondering...

All my quotes of scripture on this topic are straight from the Bible. All manner of sin and debauchery may be forgiven, but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost is the unforgiveable sin. There is no forgiveness in this world nor in the world to come according to Matthew 12:31-32 for those who commit the unpardonable sin. A son of perdition is one who commits this sin and they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame. They are then on a level of Satan and his minions except they will partake in the resurrection.

 

[Ace Nova]

I didn't get the name of the author of this, but the quotes are from Francis (my words are in brackets)



"Judas is a difficult character to understand... when he sees what he has done, he turns to the ‘righteous,’ to the priests: ‘I have sinned: I handed over an innocent man to be killed.’ They answer him: ‘What does that matter to us? That’s your affair.’ (Matthew 27:3-10) Then he goes away with that guilt that suffocates him.”


The [alleged/purported] Pontiff invites us to imagine a different fate for Judas: “Perhaps if he had met the Virgin Mary, things would have gone differently, but the poor man goes away, doesn’t find a way out of his situation, and he went to hang himself.”


“But, there’s one thing that makes me think that Judas’ story doesn’t end there … Perhaps someone might think, ‘this pope is a heretic…’ But, no! They should go see a particular medieval capital of a column in the Basilica of St. Mary Magdalen in Vézelay, Burgundy [in France],” he said.


The [alleged/purported] Successor of Peter describes how people in the Middle Ages taught the Gospel through sculptures and paintings. “On that capital, on one side there is Judas, hanged; but on the other is the Good Shepherd who is carrying him on his shoulders and is carrying him away.”



Comments:


Really? Jesus said that there were none lost who were given to Him (Apostles) except for the "son of perdition"

aka Hell

Francis needs to go to confession... "Father, forgive me, I am not a Catholic"

and the priest would say "Halleluia! You finally speak Truth!"

Matthew 19

25 When the disciples heard this, they were greatly astonished and asked, “Who then can be saved?”

26 Jesus looked at them and said, “With man this is impossible, but with God all things are possible."

 

[nomadic5]

Anyone can be saved. It requires a forgiving and thoughtful world though. We are desperately lacking such ecolved humans especiallly in creepy Toronto.

it looks to me like we forgive too damned much at times

the ELITE dims (liberals) are always "forgiven" which ofcourse leads them to doing MORE crime... I suppose anyone would do more crime if it were always totally and completely "forgiven" them... no consequences. Who would not be tempted to do... just whatever if there were no consequences?

 

[nomadic5]

Matthew 19

25 When the disciples heard this, they were greatly astonished and asked, “Who then can be saved?”

26 Jesus looked at them and said, “With man this is impossible, but with God all things are possible."

we humans are supposed to help God... Jesus said to spread the Gospel

We can't just say "hey, God, you're big enough. You go tell the whole world the Gospel... I want to wtch the game..."

 

[nomadic5]

All my quotes of scripture on this topic are straight from the Bible. All manner of sin and debauchery may be forgiven, but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost is the unforgiveable sin. There is no forgiveness in this world nor in the world to come according to Matthew 12:31-32 for those who commit the unpardonable sin. A son of perdition is one who commits this sin and they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame. They are then on a level of Satan and his minions except they will partake in the resurrection.

Non Catholics don't know what the unforgivable sin is

they think it's just saying unkind things to the Holy Spirit.

No, it is REJECTING Christ/His forgiveness

& I think rejecting His Church is rejecting HIM