Two scenarios on Trump-Russia investigators — and neither is comforting

[Slade3200]

in short - put it all away and the one point to stress as hard as i can is -

if you're asked to provide info and you delete it instead, that is a cause for alarm.

period.

it was wrong of her to do that. it would be wrong for trump or ANYONE to do that and a legal issue for any of us. it should be for our elected officials on either side also.

If she deleted work product then yes, that’s a serious offense, obstruction of justice. If she deleted personal messages that she didn’t want leaked to the public in the heat of a campaign like what is claimed then I get it. Her lawyers were the ones that sorted and deleted the emails, right? Do you think they put their careers and freedom on the line for her?

Keep in mind that Podestas emails were stolen and leaked to the public and it tanked her momentum. She had a right to be paranoid, wouldn’t you agree?

 

[Slade3200]

I think you are using a lot of right wing talking points but don’t have any first hand knowledge of what the actual investigators saw.

I personally delete about 10k emails a year. And I promise if the RNC or the trump campaign or most any other entity had their emails subpoenaed, they would have taken the same security measures when separating the business from the personal. If she deleted any classified work product then the other copy would still be out there to be found and she would be in jail.

I don’t like how Clinton handled the email situation, it was shady and like I said, I didn’t vote for her. But the Hannity talking points that I keep hearing are way over blown.

well i don't hang out on right wing sites, so i just follow my own mind and experiences to formulate my own opinions.

i care immensely about our collective rights. all of 'em. not gay, not white, not black, not whatever. we pretty much got 1 set and we need to protect that for all. that means allowing people i hate to abuse them because that's what a "right" is. my "abuse" is their "necessity" so why am i going to judge them because i don't agree with them?

if that is right based - then hell dude, i'm right to the core.

so people say shit i don't like. i do wish they'd shut up, learn, or whatever, but they honestly don't have to. then it becomes my own choice to walk away and find conversation more to my liking. not tell them to stop because i'm so insecure i can't handle strong counter opinions.

hell i welcome and learn from them. i hope by now we've done that for each other. i guess i could fire back "well you just talk in leftist talking points" but i've come to find you also speak from your experiences and heart, not following the lemmings bleeting the latest political pop culture.

guess i'm a bit disappointed i don't come across that way with you by now. maybe in time.

great. you deleted your mail. common. like i said that alone maybe we can get around. BUT - did you then work to destroy the drive itself knowing an investigation was coming?

2nd time you forgot to go the distance with what she did here. she didn't just delete mail, she destroyed the physical medium it was stored on. who does that? i could tell you or i can ask you to google why you bleachbit a drive and you come to your own conclusions.

but hey - i'll tell you. it's to ensure what was on there cannot be recovered. at least not with a monumental amount of effort. given her "tech guy" was in a forum bragging he had to destroy evidence from a high profile persons computer...

FBI Admits Hillary Used BleachBit Software Designed to 'Hide Traces Of' Deleted Emails
look at those questions from gowdy in bleachbit. is gowdy a fool or trying to pull something over on you? by your own gut feeling, who's hiding something - the accuser or someone who went to such lengths to hide something?

then we have:
The "Oh Shit" Guy That Wiped Hillary's Server With BleachBit Was Just Granted Immunity
timeline:
December 2014 / January 2015 – “Undisclosed Clinton staff member” instructs Combetta to remove archives of Clinton emails from PRN server but he forgets.

March 4, 2015 – Hillary receives subpoena from House Select Committee on Benghazi instructing her to preserve and deliver all emails from her personal servers.
takes up to 3 months to realize you didn't delete your mail? dunno about you but i got a counter on my folder telling me how many items are in there.

March 25, 2015 – Combetta has a conference call with “President Clinton’s Staff.”

March 25 – 31, 2015 – Combetta has “oh shit” moment and realizes he forgot to wipe Hillary’s email archive from the PRN server back in December…which he promptly does using BleachBit.
again - deleting is one thing and at this point deleting it is already a DON'T DO IT because of the March 4th order. she forgot, oops. you don't get a mulligan do you?

February 18, 2016 - Combetta meets with FBI and denies knowing about the existence of the subpoena from the House Select Committee on Benghazi at the time he wiped Hillary's server.
ok - we're back to "what? i do not understand..."

May 3, 2016 - Combetta has follow-up meeting with the FBI and admits that he "was aware of the existence of the preservation request and the fact that it meant he should not disturb Clinton's e-mail data on the PRN server."
OH THAT!!!!! oops. sorry about that. we had to clean up what we forgot to do last year and destroy the drive itself you were asking for...this again is the dude that went into tech forums to ask how to properly remove all info from a drive. he is TRYING to ensure nothing can be read from it again. why?

again, i don't see you this forgiving for trump. at this point trump lied about a secret meeting that was only there cause obama let someone in the country who wasn't supposed to be here and in 2 years nothing was found to prove there was a thing there.

now if trump destroyed a computer full of information you felt were germain to the case against him - did this after he was told not to - and used several 3rd party methods to make sure you could not read the data - would you sit there and go "well ok, it is your data after all".

this is not right or left wing, slade. because we disagree for the love of god don't dive into stereotypes when we've never done that to each other yet. would you HONESTLY NOT CARE if trump did all of the above?

it befuddles common sense, slade. not left or right. let's go back to what i care about - our rights we all share. you and others mistake me for protecting trump but that's not what i am doing - at least in my mind. it is likely a side effect but i am simply wanting both sides to use the same set of criteria for what is right or wrong on a base level. for over a decade we've justified what we used to consider wrong because we hate.

hate.

it's killing us dude, this hate.

and yet here are all this time later and i do not have a clear answer from you so i'll ask 1 more time and *hopefully* let it go.

would you allow trump the same actions that hillary did listed above? or would you just KNOW he was hiding something?​

i'll go back to my right wing talking points after checking in with fox and brietbart on what i should be saying today now cause lord knows that's what i do.

Ice, I know by now that you are a fair minded individual, I wasn’t implying otherwise. But the fact is that this hillary investigation was spun, twisted and turned by the right wing just as the Russia investigation has been spun twisted and turned by the left wing. None of us were part of the hillary investigation and know exactly what happened, we didn’t get a 400 page report on it and I’m not quick to believe the narratives I hear coming out of the media.

What exactly do you think Hillary was hiding?

Let’s assume the worst, she deleted emails and destroyed hard drives. What could be the worst thing she was hiding?! What’s the major crime that’s got you so worked up? I said earlier that it was shady and I didn’t vote for her. I’d be critical of Trump if he did the same thing. I’m critical of Trump over the Russia thing because he lies all the time but I’v also said the investigation went on way to long and was over politicized.

i guess i could point to numerous sites of hillary lies that simply don't seem to bother you. would it help?

as for "what was the crime" - well to me it's simply:

FBI: we need your mail.
Hillary: DELETE DELETE DELETE DESTROY DRIVE.
Hillary: oh those were yoga lessons and wedding plans, what did you say?

if someone is coming to investigate your e-mail practices and you delete your e-mail and destroy what i was on - you honestly don't consider that a party foul?

you hide things when you bleachbit. period. what was she hiding? dunno. maybe nothing. but i certainly don't hire IT personnel to hit newsgroups to find out how to ensure data can't be recovered if "nothing".

would you?

and i give up on the base question at this point. it was beyond shady and i doubt if trump did it you'd be as calm as you are hillary did it.

i don't care who would have done it - i'd be furious. my liking you wouldn't stop me from telling you that you F'd up.

we tend to forgive those we like and allow a lot we'd never allow for those we hate. we've amplified that behavior into an extreme nature and now we simply hate.

tired of it.

I’ve said she was shady numerous times. I was simply asking what you think she was deleting that was so bad, let’s peel thing thing back and assume the worst case. What do you think she was hiding? Candid conversations that she didn’t want leaked and politicized? Illegal activity?

The lady used a private email account, I just don’t see the seriousness of that crime. Was it wrong? yes, does she deserve scrutiny? yes. She lost the presidency because of it. She’s not working in government anymore. It’s over move on.

I think a large part of Trumps lies are solely because of ego and trying to control how he is perceived in the media. I think this whole Russia thing could have been avoided if he had some tact and integrity.

she didn't just use a private e-mail account. people keep at that like using gmail or yahoo is the same thing.

she had the physical server in her house to do with as she wishes. and she did. yahoo and google can give you all the mail you want from those accounts even if you delete it from your own view.

she can make it all go away. she did.

what is the harm? she destroyed what the government specifically asked to see. if you don't view that an issue i'm pretty certain i'll never be intelligent enough to explain it deeper at this point.

we think you're doing something shady and want to see your e-mail.
sorry - i deleted it.

would never wash for me, you and 99% of the people. that 1% playing wordsmith games with our system and politics need to go and need to follow the same laws they put into play we're expected to follow.

and no, she's not gone yet.

The government wanted her work emails, she deleted her personal emails. Many businesses have private emails servers, it is not an uncommon thing. People who want to control their security do that. It isn’t a surprise with all the Clintons have going on that they would want to control their tech.

 

[iceberg]

in short - put it all away and the one point to stress as hard as i can is -

if you're asked to provide info and you delete it instead, that is a cause for alarm.

period.

it was wrong of her to do that. it would be wrong for trump or ANYONE to do that and a legal issue for any of us. it should be for our elected officials on either side also.

If she deleted work product then yes, that’s a serious offense, obstruction of justice. If she deleted personal messages that she didn’t want leaked to the public in the heat of a campaign like what is claimed then I get it. Her lawyers were the ones that sorted and deleted the emails, right? Do you think they put their careers and freedom on the line for her?

the point is you were asked to provide something and you refused. you're taking this straight to the FBI seeing what is there and closing the case if nothing to her simply protecting herself. sorry - deleting possible evidence is not protecting yourself, it's crime punishable by law.

i am NOT speculating her motivations or the motivations of others. i feel you're doing this is to cloud the actual issue and buy some doubt she broke laws when she deleted what she was asked for and then AGAIN - nuked it out of existence.

the focus is not "what did you expect to find" but to me "you deleted it so we couldn't". that brought doubt upon herself and like i said, you, me, almost everyone reading this would be arrested if we did that.

she gets excused.

 

[iceberg]

well i don't hang out on right wing sites, so i just follow my own mind and experiences to formulate my own opinions.

i care immensely about our collective rights. all of 'em. not gay, not white, not black, not whatever. we pretty much got 1 set and we need to protect that for all. that means allowing people i hate to abuse them because that's what a "right" is. my "abuse" is their "necessity" so why am i going to judge them because i don't agree with them?

if that is right based - then hell dude, i'm right to the core.

so people say shit i don't like. i do wish they'd shut up, learn, or whatever, but they honestly don't have to. then it becomes my own choice to walk away and find conversation more to my liking. not tell them to stop because i'm so insecure i can't handle strong counter opinions.

hell i welcome and learn from them. i hope by now we've done that for each other. i guess i could fire back "well you just talk in leftist talking points" but i've come to find you also speak from your experiences and heart, not following the lemmings bleeting the latest political pop culture.

guess i'm a bit disappointed i don't come across that way with you by now. maybe in time.

great. you deleted your mail. common. like i said that alone maybe we can get around. BUT - did you then work to destroy the drive itself knowing an investigation was coming?

2nd time you forgot to go the distance with what she did here. she didn't just delete mail, she destroyed the physical medium it was stored on. who does that? i could tell you or i can ask you to google why you bleachbit a drive and you come to your own conclusions.

but hey - i'll tell you. it's to ensure what was on there cannot be recovered. at least not with a monumental amount of effort. given her "tech guy" was in a forum bragging he had to destroy evidence from a high profile persons computer...

FBI Admits Hillary Used BleachBit Software Designed to 'Hide Traces Of' Deleted Emails
look at those questions from gowdy in bleachbit. is gowdy a fool or trying to pull something over on you? by your own gut feeling, who's hiding something - the accuser or someone who went to such lengths to hide something?

then we have:
The "Oh Shit" Guy That Wiped Hillary's Server With BleachBit Was Just Granted Immunity
timeline:
December 2014 / January 2015 – “Undisclosed Clinton staff member” instructs Combetta to remove archives of Clinton emails from PRN server but he forgets.

March 4, 2015 – Hillary receives subpoena from House Select Committee on Benghazi instructing her to preserve and deliver all emails from her personal servers.
takes up to 3 months to realize you didn't delete your mail? dunno about you but i got a counter on my folder telling me how many items are in there.

March 25, 2015 – Combetta has a conference call with “President Clinton’s Staff.”

March 25 – 31, 2015 – Combetta has “oh shit” moment and realizes he forgot to wipe Hillary’s email archive from the PRN server back in December…which he promptly does using BleachBit.
again - deleting is one thing and at this point deleting it is already a DON'T DO IT because of the March 4th order. she forgot, oops. you don't get a mulligan do you?

February 18, 2016 - Combetta meets with FBI and denies knowing about the existence of the subpoena from the House Select Committee on Benghazi at the time he wiped Hillary's server.
ok - we're back to "what? i do not understand..."

May 3, 2016 - Combetta has follow-up meeting with the FBI and admits that he "was aware of the existence of the preservation request and the fact that it meant he should not disturb Clinton's e-mail data on the PRN server."
OH THAT!!!!! oops. sorry about that. we had to clean up what we forgot to do last year and destroy the drive itself you were asking for...this again is the dude that went into tech forums to ask how to properly remove all info from a drive. he is TRYING to ensure nothing can be read from it again. why?

again, i don't see you this forgiving for trump. at this point trump lied about a secret meeting that was only there cause obama let someone in the country who wasn't supposed to be here and in 2 years nothing was found to prove there was a thing there.

now if trump destroyed a computer full of information you felt were germain to the case against him - did this after he was told not to - and used several 3rd party methods to make sure you could not read the data - would you sit there and go "well ok, it is your data after all".

this is not right or left wing, slade. because we disagree for the love of god don't dive into stereotypes when we've never done that to each other yet. would you HONESTLY NOT CARE if trump did all of the above?

it befuddles common sense, slade. not left or right. let's go back to what i care about - our rights we all share. you and others mistake me for protecting trump but that's not what i am doing - at least in my mind. it is likely a side effect but i am simply wanting both sides to use the same set of criteria for what is right or wrong on a base level. for over a decade we've justified what we used to consider wrong because we hate.

hate.

it's killing us dude, this hate.

and yet here are all this time later and i do not have a clear answer from you so i'll ask 1 more time and *hopefully* let it go.

would you allow trump the same actions that hillary did listed above? or would you just KNOW he was hiding something?​

i'll go back to my right wing talking points after checking in with fox and brietbart on what i should be saying today now cause lord knows that's what i do.

Ice, I know by now that you are a fair minded individual, I wasn’t implying otherwise. But the fact is that this hillary investigation was spun, twisted and turned by the right wing just as the Russia investigation has been spun twisted and turned by the left wing. None of us were part of the hillary investigation and know exactly what happened, we didn’t get a 400 page report on it and I’m not quick to believe the narratives I hear coming out of the media.

What exactly do you think Hillary was hiding?

Let’s assume the worst, she deleted emails and destroyed hard drives. What could be the worst thing she was hiding?! What’s the major crime that’s got you so worked up? I said earlier that it was shady and I didn’t vote for her. I’d be critical of Trump if he did the same thing. I’m critical of Trump over the Russia thing because he lies all the time but I’v also said the investigation went on way to long and was over politicized.

i guess i could point to numerous sites of hillary lies that simply don't seem to bother you. would it help?

as for "what was the crime" - well to me it's simply:

FBI: we need your mail.
Hillary: DELETE DELETE DELETE DESTROY DRIVE.
Hillary: oh those were yoga lessons and wedding plans, what did you say?

if someone is coming to investigate your e-mail practices and you delete your e-mail and destroy what i was on - you honestly don't consider that a party foul?

you hide things when you bleachbit. period. what was she hiding? dunno. maybe nothing. but i certainly don't hire IT personnel to hit newsgroups to find out how to ensure data can't be recovered if "nothing".

would you?

and i give up on the base question at this point. it was beyond shady and i doubt if trump did it you'd be as calm as you are hillary did it.

i don't care who would have done it - i'd be furious. my liking you wouldn't stop me from telling you that you F'd up.

we tend to forgive those we like and allow a lot we'd never allow for those we hate. we've amplified that behavior into an extreme nature and now we simply hate.

tired of it.

I’ve said she was shady numerous times. I was simply asking what you think she was deleting that was so bad, let’s peel thing thing back and assume the worst case. What do you think she was hiding? Candid conversations that she didn’t want leaked and politicized? Illegal activity?

The lady used a private email account, I just don’t see the seriousness of that crime. Was it wrong? yes, does she deserve scrutiny? yes. She lost the presidency because of it. She’s not working in government anymore. It’s over move on.

I think a large part of Trumps lies are solely because of ego and trying to control how he is perceived in the media. I think this whole Russia thing could have been avoided if he had some tact and integrity.

she didn't just use a private e-mail account. people keep at that like using gmail or yahoo is the same thing.

she had the physical server in her house to do with as she wishes. and she did. yahoo and google can give you all the mail you want from those accounts even if you delete it from your own view.

she can make it all go away. she did.

what is the harm? she destroyed what the government specifically asked to see. if you don't view that an issue i'm pretty certain i'll never be intelligent enough to explain it deeper at this point.

we think you're doing something shady and want to see your e-mail.
sorry - i deleted it.

would never wash for me, you and 99% of the people. that 1% playing wordsmith games with our system and politics need to go and need to follow the same laws they put into play we're expected to follow.

and no, she's not gone yet.

The government wanted her work emails, she deleted her personal emails. Many businesses have private emails servers, it is not an uncommon thing. People who want to control their security do that. It isn’t a surprise with all the Clintons have going on that they would want to control their tech.

prove she simply deleted personal mail. your assumptions would fall in court w/o proof so prove what she deleted.

then bleachbit.

then again - tell me you'd not cry foul if trump did it.

 

[iceberg]

in short - put it all away and the one point to stress as hard as i can is -

if you're asked to provide info and you delete it instead, that is a cause for alarm.

period.

it was wrong of her to do that. it would be wrong for trump or ANYONE to do that and a legal issue for any of us. it should be for our elected officials on either side also.

If she deleted work product then yes, that’s a serious offense, obstruction of justice. If she deleted personal messages that she didn’t want leaked to the public in the heat of a campaign like what is claimed then I get it. Her lawyers were the ones that sorted and deleted the emails, right? Do you think they put their careers and freedom on the line for her?

Keep in mind that Podestas emails were stolen and leaked to the public and it tanked her momentum. She had a right to be paranoid, wouldn’t you agree?

i was speeding officer because i was paranoid.
i had to kill that person because i was paranoid.

i don't care what you are - you break the law you pay for it. tell the judge you were paranoid and see if he/she cares.

 

[iceberg]

well i don't hang out on right wing sites, so i just follow my own mind and experiences to formulate my own opinions.

i care immensely about our collective rights. all of 'em. not gay, not white, not black, not whatever. we pretty much got 1 set and we need to protect that for all. that means allowing people i hate to abuse them because that's what a "right" is. my "abuse" is their "necessity" so why am i going to judge them because i don't agree with them?

if that is right based - then hell dude, i'm right to the core.

so people say shit i don't like. i do wish they'd shut up, learn, or whatever, but they honestly don't have to. then it becomes my own choice to walk away and find conversation more to my liking. not tell them to stop because i'm so insecure i can't handle strong counter opinions.

hell i welcome and learn from them. i hope by now we've done that for each other. i guess i could fire back "well you just talk in leftist talking points" but i've come to find you also speak from your experiences and heart, not following the lemmings bleeting the latest political pop culture.

guess i'm a bit disappointed i don't come across that way with you by now. maybe in time.

great. you deleted your mail. common. like i said that alone maybe we can get around. BUT - did you then work to destroy the drive itself knowing an investigation was coming?

2nd time you forgot to go the distance with what she did here. she didn't just delete mail, she destroyed the physical medium it was stored on. who does that? i could tell you or i can ask you to google why you bleachbit a drive and you come to your own conclusions.

but hey - i'll tell you. it's to ensure what was on there cannot be recovered. at least not with a monumental amount of effort. given her "tech guy" was in a forum bragging he had to destroy evidence from a high profile persons computer...

FBI Admits Hillary Used BleachBit Software Designed to 'Hide Traces Of' Deleted Emails
look at those questions from gowdy in bleachbit. is gowdy a fool or trying to pull something over on you? by your own gut feeling, who's hiding something - the accuser or someone who went to such lengths to hide something?

then we have:
The "Oh Shit" Guy That Wiped Hillary's Server With BleachBit Was Just Granted Immunity
timeline:
December 2014 / January 2015 – “Undisclosed Clinton staff member” instructs Combetta to remove archives of Clinton emails from PRN server but he forgets.

March 4, 2015 – Hillary receives subpoena from House Select Committee on Benghazi instructing her to preserve and deliver all emails from her personal servers.
takes up to 3 months to realize you didn't delete your mail? dunno about you but i got a counter on my folder telling me how many items are in there.

March 25, 2015 – Combetta has a conference call with “President Clinton’s Staff.”

March 25 – 31, 2015 – Combetta has “oh shit” moment and realizes he forgot to wipe Hillary’s email archive from the PRN server back in December…which he promptly does using BleachBit.
again - deleting is one thing and at this point deleting it is already a DON'T DO IT because of the March 4th order. she forgot, oops. you don't get a mulligan do you?

February 18, 2016 - Combetta meets with FBI and denies knowing about the existence of the subpoena from the House Select Committee on Benghazi at the time he wiped Hillary's server.
ok - we're back to "what? i do not understand..."

May 3, 2016 - Combetta has follow-up meeting with the FBI and admits that he "was aware of the existence of the preservation request and the fact that it meant he should not disturb Clinton's e-mail data on the PRN server."
OH THAT!!!!! oops. sorry about that. we had to clean up what we forgot to do last year and destroy the drive itself you were asking for...this again is the dude that went into tech forums to ask how to properly remove all info from a drive. he is TRYING to ensure nothing can be read from it again. why?

again, i don't see you this forgiving for trump. at this point trump lied about a secret meeting that was only there cause obama let someone in the country who wasn't supposed to be here and in 2 years nothing was found to prove there was a thing there.

now if trump destroyed a computer full of information you felt were germain to the case against him - did this after he was told not to - and used several 3rd party methods to make sure you could not read the data - would you sit there and go "well ok, it is your data after all".

this is not right or left wing, slade. because we disagree for the love of god don't dive into stereotypes when we've never done that to each other yet. would you HONESTLY NOT CARE if trump did all of the above?

it befuddles common sense, slade. not left or right. let's go back to what i care about - our rights we all share. you and others mistake me for protecting trump but that's not what i am doing - at least in my mind. it is likely a side effect but i am simply wanting both sides to use the same set of criteria for what is right or wrong on a base level. for over a decade we've justified what we used to consider wrong because we hate.

hate.

it's killing us dude, this hate.

and yet here are all this time later and i do not have a clear answer from you so i'll ask 1 more time and *hopefully* let it go.

would you allow trump the same actions that hillary did listed above? or would you just KNOW he was hiding something?​

i'll go back to my right wing talking points after checking in with fox and brietbart on what i should be saying today now cause lord knows that's what i do.

Ice, I know by now that you are a fair minded individual, I wasn’t implying otherwise. But the fact is that this hillary investigation was spun, twisted and turned by the right wing just as the Russia investigation has been spun twisted and turned by the left wing. None of us were part of the hillary investigation and know exactly what happened, we didn’t get a 400 page report on it and I’m not quick to believe the narratives I hear coming out of the media.

What exactly do you think Hillary was hiding?

Let’s assume the worst, she deleted emails and destroyed hard drives. What could be the worst thing she was hiding?! What’s the major crime that’s got you so worked up? I said earlier that it was shady and I didn’t vote for her. I’d be critical of Trump if he did the same thing. I’m critical of Trump over the Russia thing because he lies all the time but I’v also said the investigation went on way to long and was over politicized.

i guess i could point to numerous sites of hillary lies that simply don't seem to bother you. would it help?

as for "what was the crime" - well to me it's simply:

FBI: we need your mail.
Hillary: DELETE DELETE DELETE DESTROY DRIVE.
Hillary: oh those were yoga lessons and wedding plans, what did you say?

if someone is coming to investigate your e-mail practices and you delete your e-mail and destroy what i was on - you honestly don't consider that a party foul?

you hide things when you bleachbit. period. what was she hiding? dunno. maybe nothing. but i certainly don't hire IT personnel to hit newsgroups to find out how to ensure data can't be recovered if "nothing".

would you?

and i give up on the base question at this point. it was beyond shady and i doubt if trump did it you'd be as calm as you are hillary did it.

i don't care who would have done it - i'd be furious. my liking you wouldn't stop me from telling you that you F'd up.

we tend to forgive those we like and allow a lot we'd never allow for those we hate. we've amplified that behavior into an extreme nature and now we simply hate.

tired of it.

I’ve said she was shady numerous times. I was simply asking what you think she was deleting that was so bad, let’s peel thing thing back and assume the worst case. What do you think she was hiding? Candid conversations that she didn’t want leaked and politicized? Illegal activity?

The lady used a private email account, I just don’t see the seriousness of that crime. Was it wrong? yes, does she deserve scrutiny? yes. She lost the presidency because of it. She’s not working in government anymore. It’s over move on.

I think a large part of Trumps lies are solely because of ego and trying to control how he is perceived in the media. I think this whole Russia thing could have been avoided if he had some tact and integrity.

she didn't just use a private e-mail account. people keep at that like using gmail or yahoo is the same thing.

she had the physical server in her house to do with as she wishes. and she did. yahoo and google can give you all the mail you want from those accounts even if you delete it from your own view.

she can make it all go away. she did.

what is the harm? she destroyed what the government specifically asked to see. if you don't view that an issue i'm pretty certain i'll never be intelligent enough to explain it deeper at this point.

we think you're doing something shady and want to see your e-mail.
sorry - i deleted it.

would never wash for me, you and 99% of the people. that 1% playing wordsmith games with our system and politics need to go and need to follow the same laws they put into play we're expected to follow.

and no, she's not gone yet.

The government wanted her work emails, she deleted her personal emails. Many businesses have private emails servers, it is not an uncommon thing. People who want to control their security do that. It isn’t a surprise with all the Clintons have going on that they would want to control their tech.

most businesses do. there are also legal guidelines for archiving their e-mail they must follow. now if i go tell GM, Ford, wal Mart or the like that i want the last 6 months of their e-mails for a criminal investigation whoever deleted said mail would be tossed in jail.

want to keep this comparison going?

this is not a bad hillary / good trump statement to me. remove the names. remove the situation. now ask yourself - what would happen to you or i if the FBI said "hand over your e-mail" and we deleted it.

we need to stop micro-slicing situations around as if our reasons to break laws are valid because of our emotional state. i'd dare say most people make their mistakes during their emotional times.

now again - if you or i would be arrested, she should have been also.

anything else is just poor window dressing trying to get you to look away from the core that we all need to get back to being held accountable to the same set of laws regardless of our paranoia.

 

[hadit]

At the end of the day, when the Russian sabotage in favor of Trump was discovered, America should have let the attacks continue without investigation. We should have never looked into the guy who the sabotage campaign directly benefitted, who also happens to have deep financial ties to Russia and who’s top officials were outed as criminals.

We should have dismissed his overtures to Russia and secret meetings with Russians as innocent fun.

There's a right way to do things and a wrong way. When the police set out to arrest someone for a crime, there are laws that prescribe the methods they can use to obtain evidence. There seems to be some irregularities in the way the Mueller investigation was started. Don't you want to make sure it was done lawfully? I do.

 

[iceberg]

At the end of the day, when the Russian sabotage in favor of Trump was discovered, America should have let the attacks continue without investigation. We should have never looked into the guy who the sabotage campaign directly benefitted, who also happens to have deep financial ties to Russia and who’s top officials were outed as criminals.

We should have dismissed his overtures to Russia and secret meetings with Russians as innocent fun.

There's a right way to do things and a wrong way. When the police set out to arrest someone for a crime, there are laws that prescribe the methods they can use to obtain evidence. There seems to be some irregularities in the way the Mueller investigation was started. Don't you want to make sure it was done lawfully? I do.

i don't care about your emotional state.
i don't care about your emo-justifications.

did you break the law or skirt around it intentionally?

no - move on.
yes - fry them.

 

[hadit]

we have numerous questionable texts between members of our FBI
we have our DOJ dictating terminology to our FBI on what to call something because terminology carries specific counter-actions. so they edited their words based on leadership recommendations.
we have the lead of our DOJ meeting with the husband/former president of a presidential candidate in private while his wife, a candidate for President is being researched for a "matter".
we have several proven instances of the FBI spying on Congress illegally
we have a ukrainian connection that was feeding the dems info on trump

and so much more.

now if trump lying about meetings is enough to launch an investigation, then please tell me how all the above is NOT when all of the above ends in said investigation of trump.

Questionable texts and terminology

And a couple totally unrelated matters

Translation: your partisanship requires you to inflate all things Trump into the worst of lawbreaking while minimizing or totally ignoring lawbreaking by those out to get him. Situational ethics at its worst.

 

[Crixus]

At the end of the day, when the Russian sabotage in favor of Trump was discovered, America should have let the attacks continue without investigation. We should have never looked into the guy who the sabotage campaign directly benefitted, who also happens to have deep financial ties to Russia and who’s top officials were outed as criminals.

except we can't find a valid reason to investigate trump except you don't like him.

all the rest of what you say is bullshit and unverifiable without emotions pushing them.

russia trolled the shit out of us. not illegal now is it? if so you'd be banned from this forum in seconds, dude.

we'll see what barr finds. my guess is you're about to start crying like a little girl who's hair got put into the inkwell.

Our intelligence agencies unanimously agreed that Russia attacked our election, the attacks were in favor of Trump, Trump has deep financial ties to Russia, Trump’s people had secret meetings with Russians, Trump had criminals at the highest levels of his campaign. All of that is undeniable. Had Trump not tried so hard to obstruct justice, maybe this could have ended sooner for him.

And sadly we’ll never hear from the 12 Russians Mueller wanted to take to court, because the Russian government wants Trump in power.

Stupid hipster says what?

 

[Slade3200]

in short - put it all away and the one point to stress as hard as i can is -

if you're asked to provide info and you delete it instead, that is a cause for alarm.

period.

it was wrong of her to do that. it would be wrong for trump or ANYONE to do that and a legal issue for any of us. it should be for our elected officials on either side also.

If she deleted work product then yes, that’s a serious offense, obstruction of justice. If she deleted personal messages that she didn’t want leaked to the public in the heat of a campaign like what is claimed then I get it. Her lawyers were the ones that sorted and deleted the emails, right? Do you think they put their careers and freedom on the line for her?

the point is you were asked to provide something and you refused. you're taking this straight to the FBI seeing what is there and closing the case if nothing to her simply protecting herself. sorry - deleting possible evidence is not protecting yourself, it's crime punishable by law.

i am NOT speculating her motivations or the motivations of others. i feel you're doing this is to cloud the actual issue and buy some doubt she broke laws when she deleted what she was asked for and then AGAIN - nuked it out of existence.

the focus is not "what did you expect to find" but to me "you deleted it so we couldn't". that brought doubt upon herself and like i said, you, me, almost everyone reading this would be arrested if we did that.

she gets excused.

I get what your saying but if she was asked for her work emails and she deleted her personal emails then that’s not a crime. If they had evidence that she deleted work product then that’s obstruction and she should be punished. Emails go two ways so if she deleted work emails then there would be another copy or copy’s out there in the other party’s inbox and evidence could be collected. But that crime was not found. People heard deleted emails and spun it into a crime with no mention of such things from the guys that actually investigated

 

[Slade3200]

in short - put it all away and the one point to stress as hard as i can is -

if you're asked to provide info and you delete it instead, that is a cause for alarm.

period.

it was wrong of her to do that. it would be wrong for trump or ANYONE to do that and a legal issue for any of us. it should be for our elected officials on either side also.

If she deleted work product then yes, that’s a serious offense, obstruction of justice. If she deleted personal messages that she didn’t want leaked to the public in the heat of a campaign like what is claimed then I get it. Her lawyers were the ones that sorted and deleted the emails, right? Do you think they put their careers and freedom on the line for her?

Keep in mind that Podestas emails were stolen and leaked to the public and it tanked her momentum. She had a right to be paranoid, wouldn’t you agree?

i was speeding officer because i was paranoid.
i had to kill that person because i was paranoid.

i don't care what you are - you break the law you pay for it. tell the judge you were paranoid and see if he/she cares.

Again, deleting personal emails is not a crime. If she deleted government work product that was requested by the fbi then that’s a crime. The fbi did not find that she did that.

 

[Slade3200]

Ice, I know by now that you are a fair minded individual, I wasn’t implying otherwise. But the fact is that this hillary investigation was spun, twisted and turned by the right wing just as the Russia investigation has been spun twisted and turned by the left wing. None of us were part of the hillary investigation and know exactly what happened, we didn’t get a 400 page report on it and I’m not quick to believe the narratives I hear coming out of the media.

What exactly do you think Hillary was hiding?

Let’s assume the worst, she deleted emails and destroyed hard drives. What could be the worst thing she was hiding?! What’s the major crime that’s got you so worked up? I said earlier that it was shady and I didn’t vote for her. I’d be critical of Trump if he did the same thing. I’m critical of Trump over the Russia thing because he lies all the time but I’v also said the investigation went on way to long and was over politicized.

i guess i could point to numerous sites of hillary lies that simply don't seem to bother you. would it help?

as for "what was the crime" - well to me it's simply:

FBI: we need your mail.
Hillary: DELETE DELETE DELETE DESTROY DRIVE.
Hillary: oh those were yoga lessons and wedding plans, what did you say?

if someone is coming to investigate your e-mail practices and you delete your e-mail and destroy what i was on - you honestly don't consider that a party foul?

you hide things when you bleachbit. period. what was she hiding? dunno. maybe nothing. but i certainly don't hire IT personnel to hit newsgroups to find out how to ensure data can't be recovered if "nothing".

would you?

and i give up on the base question at this point. it was beyond shady and i doubt if trump did it you'd be as calm as you are hillary did it.

i don't care who would have done it - i'd be furious. my liking you wouldn't stop me from telling you that you F'd up.

we tend to forgive those we like and allow a lot we'd never allow for those we hate. we've amplified that behavior into an extreme nature and now we simply hate.

tired of it.

I’ve said she was shady numerous times. I was simply asking what you think she was deleting that was so bad, let’s peel thing thing back and assume the worst case. What do you think she was hiding? Candid conversations that she didn’t want leaked and politicized? Illegal activity?

The lady used a private email account, I just don’t see the seriousness of that crime. Was it wrong? yes, does she deserve scrutiny? yes. She lost the presidency because of it. She’s not working in government anymore. It’s over move on.

I think a large part of Trumps lies are solely because of ego and trying to control how he is perceived in the media. I think this whole Russia thing could have been avoided if he had some tact and integrity.

she didn't just use a private e-mail account. people keep at that like using gmail or yahoo is the same thing.

she had the physical server in her house to do with as she wishes. and she did. yahoo and google can give you all the mail you want from those accounts even if you delete it from your own view.

she can make it all go away. she did.

what is the harm? she destroyed what the government specifically asked to see. if you don't view that an issue i'm pretty certain i'll never be intelligent enough to explain it deeper at this point.

we think you're doing something shady and want to see your e-mail.
sorry - i deleted it.

would never wash for me, you and 99% of the people. that 1% playing wordsmith games with our system and politics need to go and need to follow the same laws they put into play we're expected to follow.

and no, she's not gone yet.

The government wanted her work emails, she deleted her personal emails. Many businesses have private emails servers, it is not an uncommon thing. People who want to control their security do that. It isn’t a surprise with all the Clintons have going on that they would want to control their tech.

most businesses do. there are also legal guidelines for archiving their e-mail they must follow. now if i go tell GM, Ford, wal Mart or the like that i want the last 6 months of their e-mails for a criminal investigation whoever deleted said mail would be tossed in jail.

want to keep this comparison going?

this is not a bad hillary / good trump statement to me. remove the names. remove the situation. now ask yourself - what would happen to you or i if the FBI said "hand over your e-mail" and we deleted it.

we need to stop micro-slicing situations around as if our reasons to break laws are valid because of our emotional state. i'd dare say most people make their mistakes during their emotional times.

now again - if you or i would be arrested, she should have been also.

anything else is just poor window dressing trying to get you to look away from the core that we all need to get back to being held accountable to the same set of laws regardless of our paranoia.

If it was as simple as you day then the FBi would have indicated her for obstruction of Justice. They didn’t do so, that tells me that she complied with what she was asked to do and whatever she deleted was permissible for her to do so.

 

[iceberg]

i guess i could point to numerous sites of hillary lies that simply don't seem to bother you. would it help?

as for "what was the crime" - well to me it's simply:

FBI: we need your mail.
Hillary: DELETE DELETE DELETE DESTROY DRIVE.
Hillary: oh those were yoga lessons and wedding plans, what did you say?

if someone is coming to investigate your e-mail practices and you delete your e-mail and destroy what i was on - you honestly don't consider that a party foul?

you hide things when you bleachbit. period. what was she hiding? dunno. maybe nothing. but i certainly don't hire IT personnel to hit newsgroups to find out how to ensure data can't be recovered if "nothing".

would you?

and i give up on the base question at this point. it was beyond shady and i doubt if trump did it you'd be as calm as you are hillary did it.

i don't care who would have done it - i'd be furious. my liking you wouldn't stop me from telling you that you F'd up.

we tend to forgive those we like and allow a lot we'd never allow for those we hate. we've amplified that behavior into an extreme nature and now we simply hate.

tired of it.

I’ve said she was shady numerous times. I was simply asking what you think she was deleting that was so bad, let’s peel thing thing back and assume the worst case. What do you think she was hiding? Candid conversations that she didn’t want leaked and politicized? Illegal activity?

The lady used a private email account, I just don’t see the seriousness of that crime. Was it wrong? yes, does she deserve scrutiny? yes. She lost the presidency because of it. She’s not working in government anymore. It’s over move on.

I think a large part of Trumps lies are solely because of ego and trying to control how he is perceived in the media. I think this whole Russia thing could have been avoided if he had some tact and integrity.

she didn't just use a private e-mail account. people keep at that like using gmail or yahoo is the same thing.

she had the physical server in her house to do with as she wishes. and she did. yahoo and google can give you all the mail you want from those accounts even if you delete it from your own view.

she can make it all go away. she did.

what is the harm? she destroyed what the government specifically asked to see. if you don't view that an issue i'm pretty certain i'll never be intelligent enough to explain it deeper at this point.

we think you're doing something shady and want to see your e-mail.
sorry - i deleted it.

would never wash for me, you and 99% of the people. that 1% playing wordsmith games with our system and politics need to go and need to follow the same laws they put into play we're expected to follow.

and no, she's not gone yet.

The government wanted her work emails, she deleted her personal emails. Many businesses have private emails servers, it is not an uncommon thing. People who want to control their security do that. It isn’t a surprise with all the Clintons have going on that they would want to control their tech.

most businesses do. there are also legal guidelines for archiving their e-mail they must follow. now if i go tell GM, Ford, wal Mart or the like that i want the last 6 months of their e-mails for a criminal investigation whoever deleted said mail would be tossed in jail.

want to keep this comparison going?

this is not a bad hillary / good trump statement to me. remove the names. remove the situation. now ask yourself - what would happen to you or i if the FBI said "hand over your e-mail" and we deleted it.

we need to stop micro-slicing situations around as if our reasons to break laws are valid because of our emotional state. i'd dare say most people make their mistakes during their emotional times.

now again - if you or i would be arrested, she should have been also.

anything else is just poor window dressing trying to get you to look away from the core that we all need to get back to being held accountable to the same set of laws regardless of our paranoia.

If it was as simple as you day then the FBi would have indicated her for obstruction of Justice. They didn’t do so, that tells me that she complied with what she was asked to do and whatever she deleted was permissible for her to do so.

this the same FBI that was told by the Obama DOJ - No Charges?

Obama DOJ Told FBI Not To Charge Hillary, Lisa Page Reveals What The 'Insurance Policy' Was
or is she lying?

you keep saying her deleting mail is no big deal but it was done AFTER she was told not to (but somehow a work order seems to have been put into place 3 months prior but not carried out) and again - you simply delete mail, you don't destroy the hard drive.

you can have your own tech, at least for now, but when told to pony up - deleting things is a huge cause for suspicion. they could have said "hey - we need to see that" and done a recovery but she made sure, or so she thought, that couldn't happen.

and you have zero issue with that it would seem. you have to ignore a lot of the surrounding evidence to allow yourself to focus on this little bit. "it's personal and ok" - sorry once you setup shop you follow the rules for said shop and she didn't.

so if trump ever deletes or destroys potential evidence and calls it "personal" we're good. the precedents we set are not protection for what was done in as much as setting the tone for what will be. i say the actions alone are obstruction and a crime for *ANYONE* to do.

i promise you that if the FBI came to you and demanded your hard drive and you deleted everything and then destroyed the drive you'd only be able to reply to me in a 5 minute window a day from prison. if that is what would happen to us, it should happen to her. or we get where we are today with people living by another set of rules and other people sick of the justifications as to why they but no one else can.

 

[Slade3200]

I’ve said she was shady numerous times. I was simply asking what you think she was deleting that was so bad, let’s peel thing thing back and assume the worst case. What do you think she was hiding? Candid conversations that she didn’t want leaked and politicized? Illegal activity?

The lady used a private email account, I just don’t see the seriousness of that crime. Was it wrong? yes, does she deserve scrutiny? yes. She lost the presidency because of it. She’s not working in government anymore. It’s over move on.

I think a large part of Trumps lies are solely because of ego and trying to control how he is perceived in the media. I think this whole Russia thing could have been avoided if he had some tact and integrity.

she didn't just use a private e-mail account. people keep at that like using gmail or yahoo is the same thing.

she had the physical server in her house to do with as she wishes. and she did. yahoo and google can give you all the mail you want from those accounts even if you delete it from your own view.

she can make it all go away. she did.

what is the harm? she destroyed what the government specifically asked to see. if you don't view that an issue i'm pretty certain i'll never be intelligent enough to explain it deeper at this point.

we think you're doing something shady and want to see your e-mail.
sorry - i deleted it.

would never wash for me, you and 99% of the people. that 1% playing wordsmith games with our system and politics need to go and need to follow the same laws they put into play we're expected to follow.

and no, she's not gone yet.

The government wanted her work emails, she deleted her personal emails. Many businesses have private emails servers, it is not an uncommon thing. People who want to control their security do that. It isn’t a surprise with all the Clintons have going on that they would want to control their tech.

most businesses do. there are also legal guidelines for archiving their e-mail they must follow. now if i go tell GM, Ford, wal Mart or the like that i want the last 6 months of their e-mails for a criminal investigation whoever deleted said mail would be tossed in jail.

want to keep this comparison going?

this is not a bad hillary / good trump statement to me. remove the names. remove the situation. now ask yourself - what would happen to you or i if the FBI said "hand over your e-mail" and we deleted it.

we need to stop micro-slicing situations around as if our reasons to break laws are valid because of our emotional state. i'd dare say most people make their mistakes during their emotional times.

now again - if you or i would be arrested, she should have been also.

anything else is just poor window dressing trying to get you to look away from the core that we all need to get back to being held accountable to the same set of laws regardless of our paranoia.

If it was as simple as you day then the FBi would have indicated her for obstruction of Justice. They didn’t do so, that tells me that she complied with what she was asked to do and whatever she deleted was permissible for her to do so.

this the same FBI that was told by the Obama DOJ - No Charges?

Obama DOJ Told FBI Not To Charge Hillary, Lisa Page Reveals What The 'Insurance Policy' Was
or is she lying?

you keep saying her deleting mail is no big deal but it was done AFTER she was told not to (but somehow a work order seems to have been put into place 3 months prior but not carried out) and again - you simply delete mail, you don't destroy the hard drive.

you can have your own tech, at least for now, but when told to pony up - deleting things is a huge cause for suspicion. they could have said "hey - we need to see that" and done a recovery but she made sure, or so she thought, that couldn't happen.

and you have zero issue with that it would seem. you have to ignore a lot of the surrounding evidence to allow yourself to focus on this little bit. "it's personal and ok" - sorry once you setup shop you follow the rules for said shop and she didn't.

so if trump ever deletes or destroys potential evidence and calls it "personal" we're good. the precedents we set are not protection for what was done in as much as setting the tone for what will be. i say the actions alone are obstruction and a crime for *ANYONE* to do.

i promise you that if the FBI came to you and demanded your hard drive and you deleted everything and then destroyed the drive you'd only be able to reply to me in a 5 minute window a day from prison. if that is what would happen to us, it should happen to her. or we get where we are today with people living by another set of rules and other people sick of the justifications as to why they but no one else can.

You must be missing something or else she would be in prison. You weren’t part of the investigation. You don’t know how it all went down. It wasn’t a mystery that she deleted emails. She wasn’t charged with obstruction. It’s not just me that doesn’t have a problem with it, the FBi didn’t have a problem with it either. If she did destroy evidence and the FBI charged her with obstruction then I’d be just fine with it as well. I’m not in the FBi, I don’t have all the facts, neither do you. We are going off piece of information and spun up narratives. I’m trusting the conclusions of the FBI. I don’t know why you think that is so absurd

 

[iceberg]

Um... Page was IN said FBI.

 

[iceberg]

she didn't just use a private e-mail account. people keep at that like using gmail or yahoo is the same thing.

she had the physical server in her house to do with as she wishes. and she did. yahoo and google can give you all the mail you want from those accounts even if you delete it from your own view.

she can make it all go away. she did.

what is the harm? she destroyed what the government specifically asked to see. if you don't view that an issue i'm pretty certain i'll never be intelligent enough to explain it deeper at this point.

we think you're doing something shady and want to see your e-mail.
sorry - i deleted it.

would never wash for me, you and 99% of the people. that 1% playing wordsmith games with our system and politics need to go and need to follow the same laws they put into play we're expected to follow.

and no, she's not gone yet.

The government wanted her work emails, she deleted her personal emails. Many businesses have private emails servers, it is not an uncommon thing. People who want to control their security do that. It isn’t a surprise with all the Clintons have going on that they would want to control their tech.

most businesses do. there are also legal guidelines for archiving their e-mail they must follow. now if i go tell GM, Ford, wal Mart or the like that i want the last 6 months of their e-mails for a criminal investigation whoever deleted said mail would be tossed in jail.

want to keep this comparison going?

this is not a bad hillary / good trump statement to me. remove the names. remove the situation. now ask yourself - what would happen to you or i if the FBI said "hand over your e-mail" and we deleted it.

we need to stop micro-slicing situations around as if our reasons to break laws are valid because of our emotional state. i'd dare say most people make their mistakes during their emotional times.

now again - if you or i would be arrested, she should have been also.

anything else is just poor window dressing trying to get you to look away from the core that we all need to get back to being held accountable to the same set of laws regardless of our paranoia.

If it was as simple as you day then the FBi would have indicated her for obstruction of Justice. They didn’t do so, that tells me that she complied with what she was asked to do and whatever she deleted was permissible for her to do so.

this the same FBI that was told by the Obama DOJ - No Charges?

Obama DOJ Told FBI Not To Charge Hillary, Lisa Page Reveals What The 'Insurance Policy' Was
or is she lying?

you keep saying her deleting mail is no big deal but it was done AFTER she was told not to (but somehow a work order seems to have been put into place 3 months prior but not carried out) and again - you simply delete mail, you don't destroy the hard drive.

you can have your own tech, at least for now, but when told to pony up - deleting things is a huge cause for suspicion. they could have said "hey - we need to see that" and done a recovery but she made sure, or so she thought, that couldn't happen.

and you have zero issue with that it would seem. you have to ignore a lot of the surrounding evidence to allow yourself to focus on this little bit. "it's personal and ok" - sorry once you setup shop you follow the rules for said shop and she didn't.

so if trump ever deletes or destroys potential evidence and calls it "personal" we're good. the precedents we set are not protection for what was done in as much as setting the tone for what will be. i say the actions alone are obstruction and a crime for *ANYONE* to do.

i promise you that if the FBI came to you and demanded your hard drive and you deleted everything and then destroyed the drive you'd only be able to reply to me in a 5 minute window a day from prison. if that is what would happen to us, it should happen to her. or we get where we are today with people living by another set of rules and other people sick of the justifications as to why they but no one else can.

You must be missing something or else she would be in prison. You weren’t part of the investigation. You don’t know how it all went down. It wasn’t a mystery that she deleted emails. She wasn’t charged with obstruction. It’s not just me that doesn’t have a problem with it, the FBi didn’t have a problem with it either. If she did destroy evidence and the FBI charged her with obstruction then I’d be just fine with it as well. I’m not in the FBi, I don’t have all the facts, neither do you. We are going off piece of information and spun up narratives. I’m trusting the conclusions of the FBI. I don’t know why you think that is so absurd

also - if the FBI is so "trustable" why couldnt hillary trust them with her "private information"

what you are saying - to me - is the same as:

FBI going to bust someone for child porn. hours before they knock his door down, he destroys a hard drive and tells the FBI they were love letters from high school he didn't want to get out.

cool?

now maybe the dems hear trump has a diary that has evidence against him and they go pound down the door and as they come in they see it burning in the fireplace with trump going "sorry, that's personal"

cool?

cause this is what you are allowing here. the one being questioned to pick what evidence they choose to turn over.

 

[Slade3200]

The government wanted her work emails, she deleted her personal emails. Many businesses have private emails servers, it is not an uncommon thing. People who want to control their security do that. It isn’t a surprise with all the Clintons have going on that they would want to control their tech.

most businesses do. there are also legal guidelines for archiving their e-mail they must follow. now if i go tell GM, Ford, wal Mart or the like that i want the last 6 months of their e-mails for a criminal investigation whoever deleted said mail would be tossed in jail.

want to keep this comparison going?

this is not a bad hillary / good trump statement to me. remove the names. remove the situation. now ask yourself - what would happen to you or i if the FBI said "hand over your e-mail" and we deleted it.

we need to stop micro-slicing situations around as if our reasons to break laws are valid because of our emotional state. i'd dare say most people make their mistakes during their emotional times.

now again - if you or i would be arrested, she should have been also.

anything else is just poor window dressing trying to get you to look away from the core that we all need to get back to being held accountable to the same set of laws regardless of our paranoia.

If it was as simple as you day then the FBi would have indicated her for obstruction of Justice. They didn’t do so, that tells me that she complied with what she was asked to do and whatever she deleted was permissible for her to do so.

this the same FBI that was told by the Obama DOJ - No Charges?

Obama DOJ Told FBI Not To Charge Hillary, Lisa Page Reveals What The 'Insurance Policy' Was
or is she lying?

you keep saying her deleting mail is no big deal but it was done AFTER she was told not to (but somehow a work order seems to have been put into place 3 months prior but not carried out) and again - you simply delete mail, you don't destroy the hard drive.

you can have your own tech, at least for now, but when told to pony up - deleting things is a huge cause for suspicion. they could have said "hey - we need to see that" and done a recovery but she made sure, or so she thought, that couldn't happen.

and you have zero issue with that it would seem. you have to ignore a lot of the surrounding evidence to allow yourself to focus on this little bit. "it's personal and ok" - sorry once you setup shop you follow the rules for said shop and she didn't.

so if trump ever deletes or destroys potential evidence and calls it "personal" we're good. the precedents we set are not protection for what was done in as much as setting the tone for what will be. i say the actions alone are obstruction and a crime for *ANYONE* to do.

i promise you that if the FBI came to you and demanded your hard drive and you deleted everything and then destroyed the drive you'd only be able to reply to me in a 5 minute window a day from prison. if that is what would happen to us, it should happen to her. or we get where we are today with people living by another set of rules and other people sick of the justifications as to why they but no one else can.

You must be missing something or else she would be in prison. You weren’t part of the investigation. You don’t know how it all went down. It wasn’t a mystery that she deleted emails. She wasn’t charged with obstruction. It’s not just me that doesn’t have a problem with it, the FBi didn’t have a problem with it either. If she did destroy evidence and the FBI charged her with obstruction then I’d be just fine with it as well. I’m not in the FBi, I don’t have all the facts, neither do you. We are going off piece of information and spun up narratives. I’m trusting the conclusions of the FBI. I don’t know why you think that is so absurd

also - if the FBI is so "trustable" why couldnt hillary trust them with her "private information"

what you are saying - to me - is the same as:

FBI going to bust someone for child porn. hours before they knock his door down, he destroys a hard drive and tells the FBI they were love letters from high school he didn't want to get out.

cool?

now maybe the dems hear trump has a diary that has evidence against him and they go pound down the door and as they come in they see it burning in the fireplace with trump going "sorry, that's personal"

cool?

cause this is what you are allowing here. the one being questioned to pick what evidence they choose to turn over.

If Hillary destroyed 33k business emails then there are at least 33k copy’s of those emails I’m other people’s mailboxes. Shouldn’t be too hard to find. There are also several lawyers and who put their freedom and careers in jeopardy by committing a crime. I’ll say it again, if there is evidence that she deleted work product and obstructed justice then lock her up. The FBI who actually investigated the matter have made no such claims. The only people making these claims are right wing media and Clinton haters. So when it comes to who to believe... fbi or Clinton haters and RWM... the choice isn’t hard.

 

[iceberg]

I'll say it again, when the fbi says turn something over, you do.

And page is not right wing media.

 

[iceberg]

ugh - not in time to edit my last post.

slade - i have mad respect for you but what i don't understand is simply - when the FBI says turn something over, how can *anyone* pick and choose what they give them? this isn't simply DOGPILE HILLARY as you're taking it.

this is what can you or i do?

the problems as i see it is we've created separate societies where 1 can do something and then throw a fit if another does the same thing. we then "Micro-Slice" our justifications to whatever it takes to make what they did ok.

are you ok with a child pornographer who finds out he's about to be raided to delete drives of information and destroy the drives under the guise of say jr high poetry he didn't want to get out into the world?

you say i'm supposed to trust the FBI to do their job but hillary can't trust them to keep yoga/wedding plans private? isn't that convenient to your side and not the issue?

by not drawing a line in what she did, you open the door to this. by justifying what she did or saying "it's ok, you're just being unreasonable" - you have to allow *EVERYONE* this same luxury or we go back to creating 2 classes of people or more in order to be "ok" with doing something that for anyone else is wrong.

we found "FIVE LIES" about trump and you hate him. i get it. but you're taking those lies to why he should lose in a landslide but i don't see you give a flipshit about anyone elses lies. to a point i totally understand. i used to be apathetic to one side doing it but when pushed, i saw both sides are doing the same thing for their own reasons.

making wrong right cause of feelz.

we have an FBI agent saying they were told NOT to go after hillary. she is key here unless you want to call her a liar.
we have the head of the DOJ insisting we call it a "matter" because an investigation carries negative connotations. why does the DOJ care unless they are in protect mode?
the FBI was told to change gross negligence to carelessness so they wouldn't HAVE to go after her.

FBI Rewrites Federal Law to Let Hillary Off the Hook | National Review
There is no way of getting around this: According to Director James Comey (disclosure: a former colleague and longtime friend of mine), Hillary Clinton checked every box required for a felony violation of Section 793(f) of the federal penal code (Title 18): With lawful access to highly classified information she acted with gross negligence in removing and causing it to be removed it from its proper place of custody, and she transmitted it and caused it to be transmitted to others not authorized to have it, in patent violation of her trust. Director Comey even conceded that former Secretary Clinton was “extremely careless” and strongly suggested that her recklessness very likely led to communications (her own and those she corresponded with) being intercepted by foreign intelligence services.

Yet, Director Comey recommended against prosecution of the law violations he clearly found on the ground that there was no intent to harm the United States.

In essence, in order to give Mrs. Clinton a pass, the FBI rewrote the statute, inserting an intent element that Congress did not require. The added intent element, moreover, makes no sense: The point of having a statute that criminalizes gross negligence is to underscore that government officials have a special obligation to safeguard national defense secrets; when they fail to carry out that obligation due to gross negligence, they are guilty of serious wrongdoing. The lack of intent to harm our country is irrelevant. People never intend the bad things that happen due to gross negligence.
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are all these people liars also? did none of this happen or was all of this OK? keep in mind if OK it's OK for ALL TO DO, not just one side. DID THE FBI CHANGE THE RULES IN THE MIDDLE OF THE GAME? (was wording altered to lessen the impact?) Yes | No.

therein lies the problem to me. we allow *OUR* side to do things we know is wrong cause we feel some inherent need to "get even" in our current culture of revenge politics so we diminish our "crimes" and press the shit out of the others.

for trump we have he lies. great. who doesn't. that can't be your sole reason to hate him or you'd hate all liars. ergo, you must hate other things about trump so you ramp up the HE'S A LIAR to justify the rest. that's human nature and we've both had to remind each other at times we're doing this.

we let how we feel about something make it far too easy to allow things we know are not true (or true) be pushed aside. in a heightened time of conflict that we are in now that amplifies also to match. but sooner or later we have to put the baseline back and hold people accountable.

i'll hold trump accountable for lying in the same manner i do all politicians.
i'll hold hillary accountable for picking and choosing what she turned over in this "matter".
i'll hold the FBI accountable for improper FISA warrants should it turn out that way. i'll move on if barr says "everything was fine".
i'll hold lynch accountable if she ordered changing the wording and/or telling the FBI to stand down on Hillary. if barr says it's cool, i'll let it go.

but to get in a tizzy about trump being a liar. he is. we both agrees he says shit to sound good in front of whoever is listening. that's a braggart moreso than a liar. but a lie nonetheless so no i won't argue that point. it's like a misdemeanor of lies but certainly in that family.

so since that is a given, and we agree liars must be hated and voted out of office or the like for whatever profession they are in and we must hold people accountable for this -

75 Media Mistakes in the Trump Era: The Definitive List | Sharyl Attkisson

"Our repeat mistakes involve declaring that Trump’s claims are “lies” when they are matters of opinion, or when the truth between conflicting sources is unknowable; taking Trump’s statements and events out of context; reporting secondhand accounts against Trump without attribution as if they’re established fact; relying on untruthful, conflicted sources; and presenting reporter opinions in news stories—without labeling them as opinions."

now what? you relying on *THIS* media to define his lies? sharyl has done her homework on each of these - every one. i do find her very credible but at this point it's usually where people who hate trump now object to her as well because she's not joining in. i don't view what she says to be a defense of trump in as much as what is going on - taken as a defense by those attacking him w/o merit and mad their anger is bullshit and based on the very "lies" they purport to hate.

everyone these days seems to be a liar if they say things we don't like.