Trump in Helsinki, FDR in Yalta

[harmonica]

If President Trump being hospitable to Uncle Pooty is "treason", even though The Donald didn't cede an inch of territory or grant the Russian Federation a solitary concession, how much worse in Roosevelt's perfidy?

FDR signed over half of Europe to Uncle Joe, condemning millions to death or a living death surviving in tyranny. He started a Cold War which would last more than 40 years.

If Trump is treasonous, FDR is uber-treasonous. Roosevelt's memorial needs destroyed, his corpse exhumed and put on trial like the Catholic Church did with Pope Formosus. And if found guilty, dump his remains into the Potomac.

what was FDR supposed to do?

 

[whitehall]

WTF? Why post a prescription bottle of freaking poison during a political argument? Is the left really going plumb out of their minds?

 

[Polishprince]

what was FDR supposed to do?

Lay down the law to Uncle Joe. Tell him that WWII is not an opportunity for Stalin to spread tyranny. And if they try to impose tyranny on any of the nations of eastern Europe or elsewhere, they will have to answer.

America went to Europe to fight German Tyranny, so the people would be free.

Not to just enable the USSR to seat Moscow loyal despots into the seats of power

 

[Contumacious]

If President Trump being hospitable to Uncle Pooty is "treason", even though The Donald didn't cede an inch of territory or grant the Russian Federation a solitary concession, how much worse in Roosevelt's perfidy?

FDR signed over half of Europe to Uncle Joe, condemning millions to death or a living death surviving in tyranny. He started a Cold War which would last more than 40 years.

If Trump is treasonous, FDR is uber-treasonous. Roosevelt's memorial needs destroyed, his corpse exhumed and put on trial like the Catholic Church did with Pope Formosus. And if found guilty, dump his remains into the Potomac.

It depends on whom you ask

(a) The never-trumpers - ie, the neocrazies - Lindsay Graham. John McCain and Little Marco Rubio want WW3 against Russia now

(b) War profiteers, Dan Coats and the intelcommunity (deep state) marauders believe they have a RIGHT to be financially supported by the War Party so the possibility of normalizing relations with Russia frightens them

(c) the Demo Rats , will use ANY PRETEXT to depose Trump and redo the 2016 election and place HRC in HER whitehouse

And so it goes.

 

[Skylar]

Trump and Putin send a message to Soros and the Deep State: sovereignty trumps the New World Order.

Both leaders love the nation they lead and only want the best for them.

Why defend Germany from Russia when Benito Merkel just sign a deal to import their energy FROM Russia?

The New World Order? The lost sock drawer and Rorschach’s test of conspiracy theories? You’re gonna need a hell of a lot more tin foil for that one.

What Trump did was blame America first and refuse to side with his own country over Russia. Then followers it up with another lie about Russian attacks on The US days later.

But “would” means “wouldn’t” and “no” means “yes”, huh?

 

[Camp]

What I'd like to know is why didn't President Roosevelt rake Stalin over the coals when he had a chance in Yalta?

He could have, and should have, demanded Free Elections, tell Stalin to get rid of his Gulag Archipelago, instructed Stalin to admit transexual officers into the Red Army and open up the ladies' rooms in the Kremlin to men in dresses.

But instead he ignored all of that, and kissed Stalin's behind.

As long as Stalin kept throwing and sacrificing Russian troops on the Eastern Front and accepting millions of casualties draining and defeating the Germans which would allow American casualties to be comparatively small, FDR was ready to be best buddies with Stalin.

Stalin killed tens of millions.

He was an evil and despicable man. Don't know what the USA or FDR could have done about that. FDR's priority was to manipulate Stalin to accept those huge casualties.

Stalin could have temporarily stopped his offensive on the Russian border, built up his armies and waited for the US forces to inflict damages to the Germans and accept great numbers of US casualties. FDR saved untold numbers of American soldiers and airmen by manipulating Stalin.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Trump and Putin send a message to Soros and the Deep State: sovereignty trumps the New World Order.

Both leaders love the nation they lead and only want the best for them.

Why defend Germany from Russia when Benito Merkel just sign a deal to import their energy FROM Russia?

The New World Order? The lost sock drawer and Rorschach’s test of conspiracy theories? You’re gonna need a hell of a lot more tin foil for that one.

What Trump did was blame America first and refuse to side with his own country over Russia. Then followers it up with another lie about Russian attacks on The US days later.

But “would” means “wouldn’t” and “no” means “yes”, huh?

No real answer, right? Sucks to be a democrat today

 

[Skylar]

Trump and Putin send a message to Soros and the Deep State: sovereignty trumps the New World Order.

Both leaders love the nation they lead and only want the best for them.

Why defend Germany from Russia when Benito Merkel just sign a deal to import their energy FROM Russia?

The New World Order? The lost sock drawer and Rorschach’s test of conspiracy theories? You’re gonna need a hell of a lot more tin foil for that one.

What Trump did was blame America first and refuse to side with his own country over Russia. Then followers it up with another lie about Russian attacks on The US days later.

But “would” means “wouldn’t” and “no” means “yes”, huh?

No real answer, right? Sucks to be a democrat today

Laughing.....no real answer to your imaginary New World Order conspiracy? Sure there is: what actually happened.

What Trump actually did was blame America first and refuse to side with his own country over Russia. Then followers it up with another lie about Russian attacks on The US days later.

But “would” means “wouldn’t” and “no” means “yes”, huh?

For ***** sake, even Republicans are claiming that Trump is being manipulated by Russians

 

[Camp]

If President Trump being hospitable to Uncle Pooty is "treason", even though The Donald didn't cede an inch of territory or grant the Russian Federation a solitary concession, how much worse in Roosevelt's perfidy?

FDR signed over half of Europe to Uncle Joe, condemning millions to death or a living death surviving in tyranny. He started a Cold War which would last more than 40 years.

If Trump is treasonous, FDR is uber-treasonous. Roosevelt's memorial needs destroyed, his corpse exhumed and put on trial like the Catholic Church did with Pope Formosus. And if found guilty, dump his remains into the Potomac.

what was FDR supposed to do?

Who knows? FDR was dead and buried when the war ended. Anyone can speculate but no one really knows how FDR would have handled Stalin at the end of WWII. He certainly knew there was a good chance he would have a superweapon in the form of the atomic bomb for his use.

 

[whitehall]

It's important to understand that the media at the time was one with the FDR administration and the media writes the history books. The media would keep information from the American public if it tended to benefit the democrat party and there would be no criticism of the administration no matter what. The truth is out there but you have to look for it. Stalin knew how fragile FDR's health was even though it was kept from the American public. He insisted that the "Big Three" conference would be held in the Ukraine where Stalin would have relatively easy access but FDR would have to endure a grueling and dangerously long trip. The media couldn't disguise the fact that the American president appeared feeble and the Communist dictator appeared strong and healthy. This was an important propaganda coup back then. You have to wonder why the democrat administration would agree to such insanity except maybe they didn't care or they were hoping FDR would not survive because they thought Communism was the future in the post war years. It kind of gives a different perspective on historic events.

 

[Camp]

It's important to understand that the media at the time was one with the FDR administration and the media writes the history books. The media would keep information from the American public if it tended to benefit the democrat party and there would be no criticism of the administration no matter what. The truth is out there but you have to look for it. Stalin knew how fragile FDR's health was even though it was kept from the American public. He insisted that the "Big Three" conference would be held in the Ukraine where Stalin would have relatively easy access but FDR would have to endure a grueling and dangerously long trip. You have to wonder why the democrat administration would agree to such insanity except maybe they didn't care or they were hoping he would not survive because they thought Communism was the future in the post war years. It kind of gives a different perspective on historic events.

The first sentence of your nonsense post is factually incorrect making the basis for the whole post nonsensical and silly. Many of America's largest newspapers were anti-FDR including the biggest and most read newspapers in the country, including the Hearst newspapers and the Chicago Tribune.

 

[Skylar]

It's important to understand that the media at the time was one with the FDR administration and the media writes the history books. The media would keep information from the American public if it tended to benefit the democrat party and there would be no criticism of the administration no matter what. The truth is out there but you have to look for it. Stalin knew how fragile FDR's health was even though it was kept from the American public. He insisted that the "Big Three" conference would be held in the Ukraine where Stalin would have relatively easy access but FDR would have to endure a grueling and dangerously long trip. The media couldn't disguise the fact that the American president appeared feeble and the Communist dictator appeared strong and healthy. This was an important propaganda coup back then. You have to wonder why the democrat administration would agree to such insanity except maybe they didn't care or they were hoping FDR would not survive because they thought Communism was the future in the post war years. It kind of gives a different perspective on historic events.

If such was the case, why didn’t the dems embrace communism immediately after FDR actually died? The trigger for the embrace of communism in the post war years was pulled. Yet......nothing happened as you predicted it would.

I think your theory is a thoroughly revisionist, perceived through the lense of the modern conservatives’ conception of the modern liberal. Dems of that era were quite conservative by today’s standards.

 

[Skylar]

It's important to understand that the media at the time was one with the FDR administration and the media writes the history books. The media would keep information from the American public if it tended to benefit the democrat party and there would be no criticism of the administration no matter what. The truth is out there but you have to look for it. Stalin knew how fragile FDR's health was even though it was kept from the American public. He insisted that the "Big Three" conference would be held in the Ukraine where Stalin would have relatively easy access but FDR would have to endure a grueling and dangerously long trip. You have to wonder why the democrat administration would agree to such insanity except maybe they didn't care or they were hoping he would not survive because they thought Communism was the future in the post war years. It kind of gives a different perspective on historic events.

The first sentence of your nonsense post is factually incorrect making the basis for the whole post nonsensical and silly. Many of America's largest newspapers were anti-FDR including the biggest and most read newspapers in the country, including the Hearst newspapers and the Chicago Tribune.

Yeah, but conservatives today have been fed a bill of goods that the media is the enemy of the people. A bit of blithering idiocy....but one that finds fertile ground in the conspiracy receptive mind of many, many conservatives.


They don’t really have time to break up the media into nuanced groups. They want simple deliniations, all or nothing, with us or against us.

And as Whitehall demonstrated, they are willing to project the mindset they were taught to adopt back through history too.

 

[harmonica]

If President Trump being hospitable to Uncle Pooty is "treason", even though The Donald didn't cede an inch of territory or grant the Russian Federation a solitary concession, how much worse in Roosevelt's perfidy?

FDR signed over half of Europe to Uncle Joe, condemning millions to death or a living death surviving in tyranny. He started a Cold War which would last more than 40 years.

If Trump is treasonous, FDR is uber-treasonous. Roosevelt's memorial needs destroyed, his corpse exhumed and put on trial like the Catholic Church did with Pope Formosus. And if found guilty, dump his remains into the Potomac.

what was FDR supposed to do?

Who knows? FDR was dead and buried when the war ended. Anyone can speculate but no one really knows how FDR would have handled Stalin at the end of WWII. He certainly knew there was a good chance he would have a superweapon in the form of the atomic bomb for his use.

...but not many--and they did not have any superweapons left after Nagasaki
plus Russia much bigger than Japan...
..the US was not going to fight another war so soon after WW2
...they were not going to bomb Russia

 

[harmonica]

what was FDR supposed to do?

Lay down the law to Uncle Joe. Tell him that WWII is not an opportunity for Stalin to spread tyranny. And if they try to impose tyranny on any of the nations of eastern Europe or elsewhere, they will have to answer.

America went to Europe to fight German Tyranny, so the people would be free.

Not to just enable the USSR to seat Moscow loyal despots into the seats of power

answer to what/whom???
the US was NOT going to engage Russia over trivial/non-critical matters

...just like today, the POTUS can't just ''lay down the law'' to countries--like North Korea/Syria/etc
...these countries' peoples and leaders are not puppets
..if the POTUS could just snap his fingers to get what he wants, why are these countries still not doing what the POTUS wants?
--Syria
--Palestine [ people ]
Cuba 1960s
--Iran 1970s Hostage Crisis/etc [ where we should've used the big stick--but that didn't stop them from taking over the embassy! ]
--Iraq 1990--PG1--Saddam said FU to the US and stayed in Kuwait
--Somalia
--Beirut 1983--they said FU to Reagan--blew the crap out of the USMC--biggest one day loss..this wasn't a large country but a tiny group of terrorists
etc
sure we went into Grenada and Panama --but do you see the HUGE difference between them and the USSR??

....the big one --VIETNAM--a tiny, puny country said FU to LBJ!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
many times
..finally we used the big stick [ Linebackers ]---but they still won!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!..they stayed in SVietnam and took over--completely

...we were not going to use the ABomb against China during the Korean War--so we certainly were not going to use it against Russia--and besides, we didn't have any

this is not the movies!!!!!!!!!

 

[jasonnfree]

Being born during WW2, I got to know a lot of old timers from the depression and war era, including quite a few teachers who were veterans of that war. Never heard any of them talk badly about FDR. He did prove that when capitalism and corporatism gets too greedy and corrupt, it needs government to bail it out. Pretty good FDR documentary on netflix. He traveled to Russia twice to meet with Stalin since Stalin was afraid of flying. These were very long journeys for a sick and close to death old president. I think he will always be regarded as one of the great presidents.

 

[whitehall]

It's important to understand that the media at the time was one with the FDR administration and the media writes the history books. The media would keep information from the American public if it tended to benefit the democrat party and there would be no criticism of the administration no matter what. The truth is out there but you have to look for it. Stalin knew how fragile FDR's health was even though it was kept from the American public. He insisted that the "Big Three" conference would be held in the Ukraine where Stalin would have relatively easy access but FDR would have to endure a grueling and dangerously long trip. The media couldn't disguise the fact that the American president appeared feeble and the Communist dictator appeared strong and healthy. This was an important propaganda coup back then. You have to wonder why the democrat administration would agree to such insanity except maybe they didn't care or they were hoping FDR would not survive because they thought Communism was the future in the post war years. It kind of gives a different perspective on historic events.

If such was the case, why didn’t the dems embrace communism immediately after FDR actually died? The trigger for the embrace of communism in the post war years was pulled. Yet......nothing happened as you predicted it would.

I think your theory is a thoroughly revisionist, perceived through the lense of the modern conservatives’ conception of the modern liberal. Dems of that era were quite conservative by today’s standards.

It's a revisionist theory for sure but it strikes a note in the heart of the liberal educated left doesn't it? There is no doubt that FDR's administration embraced communism but the feeling wasn't as widespread as democrats hoped. The democrat leadership thought that Stalinism would prevail and gradually the world would understand and embrace socialism but it didn't happen. The propaganda image of a feeble U.S. president huddled in a shawl and a hearty and healthy socialist dictator planning the future of Europe surely didn't escape the FDR handlers. Which leader would starving refugees and emerging nations naturally embrace? Why the hell would the democrat party send a feeble and possible victim of a stroke or several strokes on a grueling international trip if they didn't plan it that way? It should be noted that FDR's medical records disappeared from a locked vault after his death and the liberal media wasn't curious enough to investigate the matter.

 

[rightwinger]

FDR did not cede any territory that was not already occupied by the Red Army. Guess what?
You were not going to get them out

FDR also needed the Soviets to help beat the Japanese after Hitler was defeated

 

[rightwinger]

If President Trump being hospitable to Uncle Pooty is "treason", even though The Donald didn't cede an inch of territory or grant the Russian Federation a solitary concession, how much worse in Roosevelt's perfidy?

FDR signed over half of Europe to Uncle Joe, condemning millions to death or a living death surviving in tyranny. He started a Cold War which would last more than 40 years.

If Trump is treasonous, FDR is uber-treasonous. Roosevelt's memorial needs destroyed, his corpse exhumed and put on trial like the Catholic Church did with Pope Formosus. And if found guilty, dump his remains into the Potomac.

what was FDR supposed to do?

Who knows? FDR was dead and buried when the war ended. Anyone can speculate but no one really knows how FDR would have handled Stalin at the end of WWII. He certainly knew there was a good chance he would have a superweapon in the form of the atomic bomb for his use.

The bomb wasn’t demonstrated until three months after FDR died.
He had no assurance that it would work or how effective it would be

He planned as if he needed a land invasion to win

 

[whitehall]

I guess the radical left would justify FDR if he arrested American citizens and imprisoned them without just cause. Wait a minute, they already did that. The notion that FDR conceded territory to socialist Soviet Russia that they already "deserved" is ludicrous. Why did FDR's handlers keep Ike's troops, which surrounded Berlin and were itching for the chance to finally capture Hitler, from taking the city? Was it part of a deal with Stalin? How did that work out?