Trump considers EO to expedite nuclear power, is that even possible, or responsible?

[kyzr]

If you built 60 story mixed use skyscrapers in Manhattan, you know construction, and you don't cut corners.

Nuclear power-plants are entirely different animals. Its not just about construction, its about seismic design, its about radiation protection, its about refueling and radioactive waste handling, its about generating electricity and getting a license to operate.. Trump has no clue.

 

[kyzr]

Again, another facility designed in the 1960s with computers less powerful than the phone in your pocket.

LOL, true, the computers were less powerful in the 1970s, which meant that they had to run over a weekend to get the same answers we get in seconds today.

 

[Rawley]

Nuclear power-plants are entirely different animals. Its not just about construction, its about seismic design, its about radiation protection, its about refueling and radioactive waste handling, its about generating electricity and getting a license to operate.. Trump has no clue.

And you don't think were learned anything in he past 60 years or have new tools for design and simulation and construction that could significantly reduce the time to get new facilities online?

 

[meaner gene]

Chernobyl was designed in the 1960s. I think we've progressed a bit since then.

And Trump's been in the construction business for 40 years.

Trump also has for year built his buildings in violation of fire and other zoning codes.

 

[meaner gene]

I'm a "belt and suspenders" type of engineer. I'd prefer nat-gas plants until SMRs get a track record and get debugged.

We do have SMRs powering carriers and subs, but I don't know if they would be robust enough to withstand an earthquake or other land design conditions.

I don't think commercial nuclear plants could operate under the standards Admiral Rickover set for the Navy.

 

[ThisIsMe]

True.
The article said Trump was considering EOs to expedite "construction", so that means all needed steps to get them built

Again, that could just mean, expedite the process to get construction going sooner. Unless there are plants ready under construction and he is trying to expedite those.

 

[meaner gene]

If you built 60 story mixed use skyscrapers in Manhattan, you know construction, and you don't cut corners.

Trump once fought legislation requiring sprinklers in NYC buildings

Nearly two decades before the deadly fire on the 50th floor of Trump Tower, President Trump was among the most prominent New York developers lobbying against legislation that would have required sprinklers in all residential buildings.

 

[kyzr]

And you don't think were learned anything in he past 60 years or have new tools for design and simulation and construction that could significantly reduce the time to get new facilities online?

I'm sure that the design time can be shortened and improved due to 3D CAD.
But the construction time is not as easy to reduce.

It also depends on whether we're talking about SMRs or big base 2,000 Mw units.
This also assumes that the new units are built near existing units so that the design conditions have already been established, or else you need to do time consuming siting studies.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Yes you do. Every location has different design situations. The standard plant may work, or it may need modifications.

The NRC reviews the design and issues a license to the utility.

Every crucial weld is x-rayed, every piece of steel has a heat number to prove where it was made. The quality assurance program guarantees the materials and workmanship are verified.

TMI was a meltdown that stayed in the containment building, as designed.
What if there was no domed concrete containment building, like Chernobyl, or like SMRs?

Yes you do. Every location has different design situations.

Like what?

The standard plant may work, or it may need modifications.

Like what?

The NRC reviews the design and issues a license to the utility.

Exactly. A design that's already been reviewed should take less time to review
the second, third, fourth and fifth time, right?

Every crucial weld is x-rayed, every piece of steel has a heat number to prove where it was made. The quality assurance program guarantees the materials and workmanship are verified.

Ok. And?

TMI was a meltdown that stayed in the containment building, as designed.

No kidding.

What if there was no domed concrete containment building, like Chernobyl, or like SMRs?

We don't use stupid designs.

 

[JWBooth]

Thorium/salt reactors are the future.

 

[kyzr]

Yes you do. Every location has different design situations.
Like what?

tornado missiles, tidal waves or floods, earthquakes, terrorism, deliberate airplane crash, foundation design and seismic response

The standard plant may work, or it may need modifications.
Like what?

thicker steel, more concrete, different sizes 5-Mw to 300 Mw, different manufacturers, etc.

The NRC reviews the design and issues a license to the utility.
Exactly. A design that's already been reviewed should take less time to review
the second, third, fourth and fifth time, right?

If its in the same spot. Seabrook Station in NH was stopped after Unit-1 was completed, the Unit-2 foundation is there, look at the wiki in post #9, should be easy to put Unit-2 on, but I'm sure it will be difficult. Back to the bottom of post #9 and see that Indian Point was closed by governor Cuomo, see how easy it would be to turn it back on. The NRC does their reviews, it takes what it takes.

Every crucial weld is x-rayed, every piece of steel has a heat number to prove where it was made. The quality assurance program guarantees the materials and workmanship are verified.
Ok. And?

...and it takes time during construction, we don't want to cut corners, remember?

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

tornado missiles, tidal waves or floods, earthquakes, terrorism, deliberate airplane crash, foundation design and seismic response

thicker steel, more concrete, different sizes 5-Mw to 300 Mw, different manufacturers, etc.

If its in the same spot. Seabrook Station in NH was stopped after Unit-1 was completed, the Unit-2 foundation is there, look at the wiki in post #9, should be easy to put Unit-2 on, but I'm sure it will be difficult. Back to the bottom of post #9 and see that Indian Point was closed by governor Cuomo, see how easy it would be to turn it back on. The NRC does their reviews, it takes what it takes.

...and it takes time during construction, we don't want to cut corners, remember?

tornado missiles, tidal waves or floods, earthquakes, terrorism, deliberate airplane crash, foundation design and seismic response

Wow! Sounds serious!

How about one standard design for tidal waves?
That one is easy, keep the backup generators on the top floor.

One design for seismic areas.

Those other threats we can build into all of them.

thicker steel, more concrete, different sizes 5-Mw to 300 Mw, different manufacturers, etc.

The same design should have the same steel, concrete, etc.

...and it takes time during construction, we don't want to cut corners, remember?

Right. But it doesn't have to take ten years.
And once we start using the same design, we'll get better and quicker.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

Those durations are "typical" for the large base-load nuclear powerplants, the smaller plants would probably be too small to double the nuclear capacity, currently at 19% of the total electrical capacity.

If you want to read up on the "history" of several typical nuke plants here are links to them:

Diablo Canyon Power Plant - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Seabrook Station Nuclear Power Plant - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Crystal River Nuclear Plant - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Perry Nuclear Generating Station - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Susquehanna Steam Electric Station - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Sorry, I misinterpreted the "why".
The Navy probably didn't have to follow all of the various regulations that commercial powerplants have to follow. I'm not sure if Trump's EOs would supersede state regulations. Governor Cuomo shut down a nuke plant on a "whim".

Get ready for blackouts after Cuomo foolishly killed the Indian Point plant

The premature shutdown of the 2,069-megawatt nuclear plant perfectly encapsulates the governor’s green-energy madness.

nypost.com

You have to be the biggest blowhard on this forum. You are so full of shit, I bet your eyes are brown!

How many nuclear power plant accidents have we had? How many deaths? How many nuclear wastelands caused by meltdowns?

How many nuclear power accidents has the Navy had?

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

To show the risks if done improperly. My opinion is not to rush the nuclear powerplants.
Trump can speed up the process, but he shouldn't cut any corners.

Who said he was cutting corners? Is your TDS acting up again?

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

We don't have an approved design for SMRs yet.

Right.
And we don't need a unique design for every location.

Big 2,000 Mw designs are unique.

I wonder if that makes the approval process longer?
I wonder if that makes the construction process longer?

Permitting is crucial, we don't want another TMI.

You mean that horrible accident where no one died?

Also, the same one where they are restarting the other plant at that location?

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

...that went belly up.

Especially when Trump cut off the pork supply!

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

Nuclear power-plants are entirely different animals. Its not just about construction, its about seismic design, its about radiation protection, its about refueling and radioactive waste handling, its about generating electricity and getting a license to operate.. Trump has no clue.

Apparently, neither do you, except to shit post!

 

[1srelluc]

NG power-plants are the simplest and safest and fastest to build.

This will be interesting. No matter what Trump does he won't get any power-plants and AI data-centers up and running on his term. We probably need Elon to call the ball on power-plants.

My question is, why do we need so many data-centers? If AI is going to solve all of our problems we should focus on the tough ones first then there will lots of time for other AI studies.

I hate data centers, all they mean for me is more ugly ass transmission lines passing through my AO on the way to NOtVA if they get their way.....They will be fought tooth and nail.

The power companies have already used up the right of ways they stole in the 80s by eminent domain....In my AO they doubled-up about 10 years ago. They can't expand.

Onsite modular nuke reactors is the only viable way data centers will get power in the semi-urban areas where they plan on setting-up shop.

 

[kyzr]

You have to be the biggest blowhard on this forum. You are so full of shit, I bet your eyes are brown!
How many nuclear power plant accidents have we had? How many deaths? How many nuclear wastelands caused by meltdowns?
How many nuclear power accidents has the Navy had?

My eyes are blue and hair is white.
We haven't had any of those bad events because we have generally been very thorough.
TMI was bad enough, a partial meltdown and a worthless very expensive nuclear powerplant is a reminder what can happen.

 

[kyzr]

I hate data centers, all they mean for me is more ugly ass transmission lines passing through my AO on the way to NOtVA if they get their way.....They will be fought tooth and nail.
The power companies have already used up the right of ways they stole in the 80s by eminent domain....In my AO they doubled-up about 10 years ago. They can't expand.
Onsite modular nuke reactors is the only viable way data centers will get power in the semi-urban areas where they plan on setting-up shop.

Nuke SMR powerplants in/near population centers? Bad idea.
Good luck getting the states to approve those sites, not to mention the legal fights.
I used eminent domain, the "taking" has to pay fair market value.
My bet is that the data centers will need to be near existing nuke plants to get started ASAP.