Time to ban Air Soft/BB guns...at least realistic looking ones

[Iceweasel]

Not blaming real guns.

Blaming fake ones. Guns arent toys. A wooden gun or the old plastic cowboy guns...obvious fakes. Todays bb and air soft guns are nearly identical to real ones. And with all the mental illness and crazy shootings out there...you cant assume whats a gun and whats a fake gun that looks like a real one. That'll get one killed.

Ban replica guns. So when we see a gun...we see a gun. No debate.

I wasn't directing my comment at you, just blame guns drones. I can see both sides of the realistic toy gun arguments so I don't know. Back then kids knew better than pointing realistic looking firearms at people but most toy guns looked like toy guns too.

 

[Pogo]

Sorry - site error, quote won't function, doing it manually...

It's normal. Whether one considers it healthy or not is up to them. I grew up in the late 50s and 60s and we played war with one another. WW2 wasn't that distant a memory and turning little boys into girls wasn't part of what schools did back then.

I did too and we did too. I certainly had my toys, cap guns, whatever. I had this one that would fire a sonic shock wave my targets really didn't appreciate. Looking back that was kinda fucked up too, but toy makers just weren't interested in consequences beyond "how many can we sell".


Has nothing to do with "turning boys into girls". Hey, we built snow forts and had invasions and defenses with snowballs-- nobody's hurt by that. We shot each other with water pistols -- nobody's hurt by that. And then there's sports, the timeless substitute for war. If boys seek and need adventure, give 'em race cars. Nobody's hurt by that. Give 'em towers to build, let 'em go with construction rather than destruction, and get some creativity flowing in the bargain. But once you start trivializing the concepts of Life and Death you've jumped the shark to a whole 'nother level. And a culture of Death is simply not healthy. The offer is still open to show how it is healthy.

I don't think guns were easier to get, but that's kind of irrelevant. This is all about the root of the behaviour not the instrument you need to execute it.

I never heard of the kind of shootings we have now though so the culture has changed. Has it moved left or right? And who glorifies guns more than Hollywood? The old school TV and movies and positive morals but now, not so much. We didn't have realistic shootemup video games either and guns were much easier to get. So blaming guns is just stupid.

I agree, that's why I'm not blaming guns, I'm blaming culture. That's been my whole point the entire time I've been at USMB. It was the driving force that brought me here.

Yes it surely has changed (intensified) and it's about social standards, not "left" or "right" politics. And damn straight Hollywood's a big part of it, and TV I submit a bigger one, since you're in front of a TV screen a lot more than you're in front of the silver one. Somebody should count up how many people get shot to death on a random night on TV. If it's even possible to count that high. And it's all body count -- no spiritual consequences.

That's what I call a fucked up cultural value.

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

Not blaming real guns.

Blaming fake ones. Guns arent toys. A wooden gun or the old plastic cowboy guns...obvious fakes. Todays bb and air soft guns are nearly identical to real ones. And with all the mental illness and crazy shootings out there...you cant assume whats a gun and whats a fake gun that looks like a real one. That'll get one killed.

Ban replica guns. So when we see a gun...we see a gun. No debate.

Yeah,there's really no reason to make an airsoft gun look exactly like the real thing.
All they really need is to be camo or flat earth tones.

 

[bucs90]

Not blaming real guns.

Blaming fake ones. Guns arent toys. A wooden gun or the old plastic cowboy guns...obvious fakes. Todays bb and air soft guns are nearly identical to real ones. And with all the mental illness and crazy shootings out there...you cant assume whats a gun and whats a fake gun that looks like a real one. That'll get one killed.

Ban replica guns. So when we see a gun...we see a gun. No debate.

Yeah,there's really no reason to make an airsoft gun look exactly like the real thing.
All they really need is to be camo or flat earth tones.

Real guns are those colors too. If they exist..they need to be TOY colors. Neon green. Baby blue. White.

But of course...then teens will paint them black. And carry them in public. Get shot by a cop. Then cops will.be trashed because it was a toy gun.

 

[Iceweasel]

Sorry - site error, quote won't function, doing it manually...

It's normal. Whether one considers it healthy or not is up to them. I grew up in the late 50s and 60s and we played war with one another. WW2 wasn't that distant a memory and turning little boys into girls wasn't part of what schools did back then.

I did too and we did too. I certainly had my toys, cap guns, whatever. I had this one that would fire a sonic shock wave my targets really didn't appreciate. Looking back that was kinda fucked up too, but toy makers just weren't interested in consequences beyond "how many can we sell".


Has nothing to do with "turning boys into girls". Hey, we built snow forts and had invasions and defenses with snowballs-- nobody's hurt by that. We shot each other with water pistols -- nobody's hurt by that. And then there's sports, the timeless substitute for war. If boys seek and need adventure, give 'em race cars. Nobody's hurt by that. Give 'em towers to build, let 'em go with construction rather than destruction, and get some creativity flowing in the bargain. But once you start trivializing the concepts of Life and Death you've jumped the shark to a whole 'nother level. And a culture of Death is simply not healthy. The offer is still open to show how it is healthy.

I don't think guns were easier to get, but that's kind of irrelevant. This is all about the root of the behaviour not the instrument you need to execute it.

I never heard of the kind of shootings we have now though so the culture has changed. Has it moved left or right? And who glorifies guns more than Hollywood? The old school TV and movies and positive morals but now, not so much. We didn't have realistic shootemup video games either and guns were much easier to get. So blaming guns is just stupid.

I agree, that's why I'm not blaming guns, I'm blaming culture. That's been my whole point the entire time I've been at USMB. It was the driving force that brought me here.

Yes it surely has changed (intensified) and it's about social standards, not "left" or "right" politics. And damn straight Hollywood's a big part of it, and TV I submit a bigger one, since you're in front of a TV screen a lot more than you're in front of the silver one. Somebody should count up how many people get shot to death on a random night on TV. If it's even possible to count that high. And it's all body count -- no spiritual consequences.

That's what I call a fucked up cultural value.

Well my point was that we played war but didn't spray down a McDs with live ammo a few years later or settle party arguments with pistols. Playing war is normal for boys, I'm sure our ancestors did it too. But I don't think kids even interact like that these days, I never see them playing in groups like we did. The unsocial nature and constant exposure to vivid violence plays a huge role in my opinion.

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

Not blaming real guns.

Blaming fake ones. Guns arent toys. A wooden gun or the old plastic cowboy guns...obvious fakes. Todays bb and air soft guns are nearly identical to real ones. And with all the mental illness and crazy shootings out there...you cant assume whats a gun and whats a fake gun that looks like a real one. That'll get one killed.

Ban replica guns. So when we see a gun...we see a gun. No debate.

Yeah,there's really no reason to make an airsoft gun look exactly like the real thing.
All they really need is to be camo or flat earth tones.

Real guns are those colors too. If they exist..they need to be TOY colors. Neon green. Baby blue. White.

But of course...then teens will paint them black. And carry them in public. Get shot by a cop. Then cops will.be trashed because it was a toy gun.

That would make them worthless for their intended purpose.
You cant be running around the woods with a bright red gun.

 

[Pogo]

Sorry - site error, quote won't function, doing it manually...

It's normal. Whether one considers it healthy or not is up to them. I grew up in the late 50s and 60s and we played war with one another. WW2 wasn't that distant a memory and turning little boys into girls wasn't part of what schools did back then.

I did too and we did too. I certainly had my toys, cap guns, whatever. I had this one that would fire a sonic shock wave my targets really didn't appreciate. Looking back that was kinda fucked up too, but toy makers just weren't interested in consequences beyond "how many can we sell".


Has nothing to do with "turning boys into girls". Hey, we built snow forts and had invasions and defenses with snowballs-- nobody's hurt by that. We shot each other with water pistols -- nobody's hurt by that. And then there's sports, the timeless substitute for war. If boys seek and need adventure, give 'em race cars. Nobody's hurt by that. Give 'em towers to build, let 'em go with construction rather than destruction, and get some creativity flowing in the bargain. But once you start trivializing the concepts of Life and Death you've jumped the shark to a whole 'nother level. And a culture of Death is simply not healthy. The offer is still open to show how it is healthy.

I don't think guns were easier to get, but that's kind of irrelevant. This is all about the root of the behaviour not the instrument you need to execute it.

I never heard of the kind of shootings we have now though so the culture has changed. Has it moved left or right? And who glorifies guns more than Hollywood? The old school TV and movies and positive morals but now, not so much. We didn't have realistic shootemup video games either and guns were much easier to get. So blaming guns is just stupid.

I agree, that's why I'm not blaming guns, I'm blaming culture. That's been my whole point the entire time I've been at USMB. It was the driving force that brought me here.

Yes it surely has changed (intensified) and it's about social standards, not "left" or "right" politics. And damn straight Hollywood's a big part of it, and TV I submit a bigger one, since you're in front of a TV screen a lot more than you're in front of the silver one. Somebody should count up how many people get shot to death on a random night on TV. If it's even possible to count that high. And it's all body count -- no spiritual consequences.

That's what I call a fucked up cultural value.

Well my point was that we played war but didn't spray down a McDs with live ammo a few years later or settle party arguments with pistols. Playing war is normal for boys, I'm sure our ancestors did it too. But I don't think kids even interact like that these days, I never see them playing in groups like we did. The unsocial nature and constant exposure to vivid violence plays a huge role in my opinion.

Video games can be and usually are played alone, so you may have an astute point there about socialization changes. Not to mention being transfixed in the labyrinth of one's own iPhone thingy so much of the time, regardless of content. Weird things can happen to a social animal absent the grounding effects of socialization with one's peers.

That sir is an excellent observation and food for thought.

 

[Pogo]

Not blaming real guns.

Blaming fake ones. Guns arent toys. A wooden gun or the old plastic cowboy guns...obvious fakes. Todays bb and air soft guns are nearly identical to real ones. And with all the mental illness and crazy shootings out there...you cant assume whats a gun and whats a fake gun that looks like a real one. That'll get one killed.

Ban replica guns. So when we see a gun...we see a gun. No debate.

Yeah,there's really no reason to make an airsoft gun look exactly like the real thing.
All they really need is to be camo or flat earth tones.

Real guns are those colors too. If they exist..they need to be TOY colors. Neon green. Baby blue. White.

But of course...then teens will paint them black. And carry them in public. Get shot by a cop. Then cops will.be trashed because it was a toy gun.

That would make them worthless for their intended purpose.
You cant be running around the woods with a bright red gun.

You are correct. The whole point of running around with a toy that is a gun is "I'm dangerous". So you're gonna want it as authentic as you can make it. So yes, that's gonna happen, regardless how the toymaker designs it.

That's why I keep coming back to why the kid needs that kind of power trip to begin with and what it is that's missing in his life.

 

[whitehall]

The problem isn't the gun. The problem is the parents of the 16 year old who "likes shooting his friends" while he is running around the neighborhood.

 

[M14 Shooter]

Saw an interesting post on here. A parent criticized police because his 16 year old son "likes to run around the neighborhood shooting his friends with air soft".

Sounds like a lack of effective parenting - if you let your kids out with one of these toys and he gets shot by the police, you are to blame.

 

[dannyboys]

Why not just ban guns all together? I'm sure the cops would be happy about that.

Those committing the crimes will be even happier.
Illegal guns ARE BANNED already! 99.99% of murders are committed with illegal handguns.
The vast majority of murders are committed by about 13% of the population using illegal handguns.
Go ******* figure.

 

[Ravi]

You train people with weapons not to....

Train what? You train people NOT to shoot when a gun is raised at them? Never heard of that tactic. You play the staring contest with a gun barrel. See who wins.

Read it again.....I stated that you train people not to point guns at people.. It's a basic rule of weapon usage...

Im sure the parents of the kid in Cleveland taught him weapon safety with that replica pistol he pointed at cops.

He didn't point it at any cops. This is what I was saying on the other thread,. you will bend over backwards to defend the bad behavior of cops.

Um...he reached for it...to what? Massage the gun?

The cop jumped out of his vehicle and shot him. The kid simply put his hand in his waistband. The cop should not be a cop.

 

[bucs90]

Train what? You train people NOT to shoot when a gun is raised at them? Never heard of that tactic. You play the staring contest with a gun barrel. See who wins.

Read it again.....I stated that you train people not to point guns at people.. It's a basic rule of weapon usage...

Im sure the parents of the kid in Cleveland taught him weapon safety with that replica pistol he pointed at cops.

He didn't point it at any cops. This is what I was saying on the other thread,. you will bend over backwards to defend the bad behavior of cops.

Um...he reached for it...to what? Massage the gun?

The cop jumped out of his vehicle and shot him. The kid simply put his hand in his waistband. The cop should not be a cop.

If YOU are waving a gun around and pointing it at people...then stick it in your waistband. ..and a cop car rolls up....would you reach for the gun or put your hands up???

Those parents carry most of the fault for that. Why was their son out waving a pistol replica at people..then reaching for.it when cops arrive? They have far less reason to.be parents than he has to be a cop.

 

[bucs90]

Saw an interesting post on here. A parent criticized police because his 16 year old son "likes to run around the neighborhood shooting his friends with air soft".

Sounds like a lack of effective parenting - if you let your kids out with one of these toys and he gets shot by the police, you are to blame.

Yep. If a replica gun looks real and you carry it in a way to look real...dont be shocked when you convince others. Cops included.

 

[dannyboys]

Train what? You train people NOT to shoot when a gun is raised at them? Never heard of that tactic. You play the staring contest with a gun barrel. See who wins.

Read it again.....I stated that you train people not to point guns at people.. It's a basic rule of weapon usage...

Im sure the parents of the kid in Cleveland taught him weapon safety with that replica pistol he pointed at cops.

He didn't point it at any cops. This is what I was saying on the other thread,. you will bend over backwards to defend the bad behavior of cops.

Um...he reached for it...to what? Massage the gun?

The cop jumped out of his vehicle and shot him. The kid simply put his hand in his waistband. The cop should not be a cop.

You're a ******* joke.
PLEASE get into any confrontation with a cop and suddenly put your hand in your waist band. PLEASE! I'm begging you.
Permanent Ignore. You're stupid.

 

[bucs90]

Guns cause death. Real ugly permanent death.

Not Xbox death or Air Soft and paintball death. Real death. With decomposition. And stench. Rotting flesh.

So if you allow your kids to carry around a toy...that is a replica of a tool of death...dont be shocked when others dont think its funny and treat him like he has a REAL death causing tool.

 

[Pogo]

Sorry - site error, quote won't function, doing it manually...

It's normal. Whether one considers it healthy or not is up to them. I grew up in the late 50s and 60s and we played war with one another. WW2 wasn't that distant a memory and turning little boys into girls wasn't part of what schools did back then.

I did too and we did too. I certainly had my toys, cap guns, whatever. I had this one that would fire a sonic shock wave my targets really didn't appreciate. Looking back that was kinda fucked up too, but toy makers just weren't interested in consequences beyond "how many can we sell".


Has nothing to do with "turning boys into girls". Hey, we built snow forts and had invasions and defenses with snowballs-- nobody's hurt by that. We shot each other with water pistols -- nobody's hurt by that. And then there's sports, the timeless substitute for war. If boys seek and need adventure, give 'em race cars. Nobody's hurt by that. Give 'em towers to build, let 'em go with construction rather than destruction, and get some creativity flowing in the bargain. But once you start trivializing the concepts of Life and Death you've jumped the shark to a whole 'nother level. And a culture of Death is simply not healthy. The offer is still open to show how it is healthy.

I don't think guns were easier to get, but that's kind of irrelevant. This is all about the root of the behaviour not the instrument you need to execute it.

I never heard of the kind of shootings we have now though so the culture has changed. Has it moved left or right? And who glorifies guns more than Hollywood? The old school TV and movies and positive morals but now, not so much. We didn't have realistic shootemup video games either and guns were much easier to get. So blaming guns is just stupid.

I agree, that's why I'm not blaming guns, I'm blaming culture. That's been my whole point the entire time I've been at USMB. It was the driving force that brought me here.

Yes it surely has changed (intensified) and it's about social standards, not "left" or "right" politics. And damn straight Hollywood's a big part of it, and TV I submit a bigger one, since you're in front of a TV screen a lot more than you're in front of the silver one. Somebody should count up how many people get shot to death on a random night on TV. If it's even possible to count that high. And it's all body count -- no spiritual consequences.

That's what I call a fucked up cultural value.

Well my point was that we played war but didn't spray down a McDs with live ammo a few years later or settle party arguments with pistols. Playing war is normal for boys, I'm sure our ancestors did it too. But I don't think kids even interact like that these days, I never see them playing in groups like we did. The unsocial nature and constant exposure to vivid violence plays a huge role in my opinion.

Video games can be and usually are played alone, so you may have an astute point there about socialization changes. Not to mention being transfixed in the labyrinth of one's own iPhone thingy so much of the time, regardless of content. Weird things can happen to a social animal absent the grounding effects of socialization with one's peers.

That sir is an excellent observation and food for thought.

I would add to that thought -- boys are competitive by nature, it's our biology. Sperm racing to egg and all that. But that's also why we invented sports and did that a long long time ago.

So yeah we had our cap guns and whatever, but if the weather permitted, the first place we always went by default was this kid's yard for baseball, that kid's yard for football, or the driveway for basketball. Or if it snowed, out came the sleds, but in all cases you were part of a group.

We may have collectively introverted ourselves from that outlet with infernal gadgetry. Which is, as you point out, a solitary brain activity. Perhaps we've given way too much away to the Smartphone at the expense of real-world physical socialization. Spend too much time apart from the real world and it becomes just another techno-image. The more I ponder this, the more sense it makes.

 

[bucs90]

Read it again.....I stated that you train people not to point guns at people.. It's a basic rule of weapon usage...

Im sure the parents of the kid in Cleveland taught him weapon safety with that replica pistol he pointed at cops.

He didn't point it at any cops. This is what I was saying on the other thread,. you will bend over backwards to defend the bad behavior of cops.

Um...he reached for it...to what? Massage the gun?

The cop jumped out of his vehicle and shot him. The kid simply put his hand in his waistband. The cop should not be a cop.

You're a ******* joke.
PLEASE get into any confrontation with a cop and suddenly put your hand in your waist band. PLEASE! I'm begging you.
Permanent Ignore. You're stupid.

Even better- have him be a cop. And respond to the call of a person with a gun. And its in their waistband. And he shows up and the person suddenly reaches for that weapon......would he say "Hold on fellas...it could be a toy!!! Wait! Oh...hes about to point it...but hold your fire..hes young...it might not be real...".

He'd be the first one shooting.

 

[bucs90]

Sorry - site error, quote won't function, doing it manually...

It's normal. Whether one considers it healthy or not is up to them. I grew up in the late 50s and 60s and we played war with one another. WW2 wasn't that distant a memory and turning little boys into girls wasn't part of what schools did back then.

I did too and we did too. I certainly had my toys, cap guns, whatever. I had this one that would fire a sonic shock wave my targets really didn't appreciate. Looking back that was kinda fucked up too, but toy makers just weren't interested in consequences beyond "how many can we sell".


Has nothing to do with "turning boys into girls". Hey, we built snow forts and had invasions and defenses with snowballs-- nobody's hurt by that. We shot each other with water pistols -- nobody's hurt by that. And then there's sports, the timeless substitute for war. If boys seek and need adventure, give 'em race cars. Nobody's hurt by that. Give 'em towers to build, let 'em go with construction rather than destruction, and get some creativity flowing in the bargain. But once you start trivializing the concepts of Life and Death you've jumped the shark to a whole 'nother level. And a culture of Death is simply not healthy. The offer is still open to show how it is healthy.

I don't think guns were easier to get, but that's kind of irrelevant. This is all about the root of the behaviour not the instrument you need to execute it.

I never heard of the kind of shootings we have now though so the culture has changed. Has it moved left or right? And who glorifies guns more than Hollywood? The old school TV and movies and positive morals but now, not so much. We didn't have realistic shootemup video games either and guns were much easier to get. So blaming guns is just stupid.

I agree, that's why I'm not blaming guns, I'm blaming culture. That's been my whole point the entire time I've been at USMB. It was the driving force that brought me here.

Yes it surely has changed (intensified) and it's about social standards, not "left" or "right" politics. And damn straight Hollywood's a big part of it, and TV I submit a bigger one, since you're in front of a TV screen a lot more than you're in front of the silver one. Somebody should count up how many people get shot to death on a random night on TV. If it's even possible to count that high. And it's all body count -- no spiritual consequences.

That's what I call a fucked up cultural value.

Well my point was that we played war but didn't spray down a McDs with live ammo a few years later or settle party arguments with pistols. Playing war is normal for boys, I'm sure our ancestors did it too. But I don't think kids even interact like that these days, I never see them playing in groups like we did. The unsocial nature and constant exposure to vivid violence plays a huge role in my opinion.

Video games can be and usually are played alone, so you may have an astute point there about socialization changes. Not to mention being transfixed in the labyrinth of one's own iPhone thingy so much of the time, regardless of content. Weird things can happen to a social animal absent the grounding effects of socialization with one's peers.

That sir is an excellent observation and food for thought.

I would add to that thought -- boys are competitive by nature, it's our biology. Sperm racing to egg and all that. But that's also why we invented sports and did that a long long time ago.

So yeah we had our cap guns and whatever, but if the weather permitted, the first place we always went by default was this kid's yard for baseball, that kid's yard for football, or the driveway for basketball. Or if it snowed, out came the sleds, but in all cases you were part of a group.

We may have collectively introverted ourselves from that outlet with infernal gadgetry. Which is, as you point out, a solitary brain activity. Perhaps we've given way too much away to the Smartphone at the expense of real-world physical socialization. Spend too much time apart from the real world and it becomes just another techno-image. The more I ponder this, the more sense it makes.

Outstanding post. Boys are naturally competitive and a bit violent.

Violent sports like football once was an outlet for it. Now we are softening it all up.

But biology doesnt change.

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

Not blaming real guns.

Blaming fake ones. Guns arent toys. A wooden gun or the old plastic cowboy guns...obvious fakes. Todays bb and air soft guns are nearly identical to real ones. And with all the mental illness and crazy shootings out there...you cant assume whats a gun and whats a fake gun that looks like a real one. That'll get one killed.

Ban replica guns. So when we see a gun...we see a gun. No debate.

Yeah,there's really no reason to make an airsoft gun look exactly like the real thing.
All they really need is to be camo or flat earth tones.

Real guns are those colors too. If they exist..they need to be TOY colors. Neon green. Baby blue. White.

But of course...then teens will paint them black. And carry them in public. Get shot by a cop. Then cops will.be trashed because it was a toy gun.

That would make them worthless for their intended purpose.
You cant be running around the woods with a bright red gun.

You are correct. The whole point of running around with a toy that is a gun is "I'm dangerous". So you're gonna want it as authentic as you can make it. So yes, that's gonna happen, regardless how the toymaker designs it.

That's why I keep coming back to why the kid needs that kind of power trip to begin with and what it is that's missing in his life.

You appear to have totally missed my point.
Camouflage is necessary when playing war games in the woods.
A brightly colored gun will stick out like a sore thumb.