Zone1 There's more to Jesus' "turning over the tables" incident than people realize

[buttercup]

One of the few times Jesus displayed righteous anger was when He famously turned over the tables in the Temple, an incident written about in all the Gospels... Also known as the Cleansing of the Temple.

Here's the passage, in Matthew 21:

And Jesus entered the temple area and drove out all those who were selling and buying on the temple grounds, and He overturned the tables of the money changers and the seats of those who were selling doves. 13 And He *said to them, “It is written: ‘My house will be called a house of prayer’; but you are making it a den of robbers.”​

When Jesus stated the words “...but you have made it a den of robbers” He was referencing an Old Testament verse, Jeremiah 7:11.

Here's the verse:

“Has this house, which is called by my name, become a den of robbers in your eyes? Behold, I myself have seen it, declares the Lord.”​

Now here's something that many Christians may not know....

When you look at that verse, specifically at the word translated to "robber"... the original Hebrew word actually has to do with violence. The primary definition of the word "parits" is violent one or destroyer. You can see that here.

Why is the meaning of that original word important? Because I believe it shows that Jesus didn't turn over the tables simply because of the money being exchanged in the Temple. If we go by the primary meaning of that original word, He was saying "You have turned my Father's house into a den of violence."

Another clue that gives weight to this idea that it was about more than just buying and selling, but about violence and animal sacrifices in the Temple is the surrounding context of that Jeremiah 7 verse. But I'll get to that later... if there is any interest in this topic.

So of course Jesus was angry about the buying and selling going on in the Temple. But in my view, it goes deeper than that. There was so much bloodshed going on in the Temple because of the animal sacrifices, as well as caged animals... and I think it's very clear that Jesus wanted to put an end to that, once and for all. And of course as Christians we know that He DID put an end to it, because Jesus became the "once for all" final sacrifice (Hebrews 10:5-14) offering His own body as the perfect lamb of God.

Check out the following reel. The woman doing the interviewing is Gianna Simone. She's a Christian and an actress (she's been in some very popular Christian movies) and she's interviewing a friend of mine, Craig, on this topic:

 

[The Irish Ram]

So of course Jesus was angry about the buying and selling going on in the Temple

I believe Jesus called them robbers because they were robbing people. Money changers were essential at the Temple. So were the animals that were being sold there at the Temple. Pilgrims from all over made the trip to the Temple, and needed various animals for various sacrifices. The small city of about 30,000 would swell upwards of 500 thousand people. And, they all needed to exchange their foreign money so they could buy the animals they needed. Jesus knew that since childhood. It was Temple protocol, and Jesus never addressed it as a problem until He witnessed the exchangers ripping people off. He saw that the exchangers were cheating people by giving the foreigners less than what they should have given them. They were thieves, taking advantage of the ignorance of the foreigners. And Jesus called them on it. He clarified the reason for His anger. It was because of robbers and thieves.
Sometimes it just means what it says.

 

[luiza]

One of the few times Jesus displayed righteous anger was when He famously turned over the tables in the Temple, an incident written about in all the Gospels... Also known as the Cleansing of the Temple.

Here's the passage, in Matthew 21:

And Jesus entered the temple area and drove out all those who were selling and buying on the temple grounds, and He overturned the tables of the money changers and the seats of those who were selling doves. 13 And He *said to them, “It is written: ‘My house will be called a house of prayer’; but you are making it a den of robbers.”​

When Jesus stated the words “...but you have made it a den of robbers” He was referencing an Old Testament verse, Jeremiah 7:11.

Here's the verse:

“Has this house, which is called by my name, become a den of robbers in your eyes? Behold, I myself have seen it, declares the Lord.”​

Now here's something that many Christians may not know....

When you look at that verse, specifically at the word translated to "robber"... the original Hebrew word actually has to do with violence. The primary definition of the word "parits" is violent one or destroyer. You can see that here.

Why is the meaning of that original word important? Because I believe it shows that Jesus didn't turn over the tables simply because of the money being exchanged in the Temple. If we go by the primary meaning of that original word, He was saying "You have turned my Father's house into a den of violence."

Another clue that gives weight to this idea that it was about more than just buying and selling, but about violence and animal sacrifices in the Temple is the surrounding context of that Jeremiah 7 verse. But I'll get to that later... if there is any interest in this topic.

So of course Jesus was angry about the buying and selling going on in the Temple. But in my view, it goes deeper than that. There was so much bloodshed going on in the Temple because of the animal sacrifices, as well as caged animals... and I think it's very clear that Jesus wanted to put an end to that, once and for all. And of course as Christians we know that He DID put an end to it, because Jesus became the "once for all" final sacrifice (Hebrews 10:5-14) offering His own body as the perfect lamb of God.

Check out the following reel. The woman doing the interviewing is Gianna Simone. She's a Christian and an actress (she's been in some very popular Christian movies) and she's interviewing a friend of mine, Craig, on this topic:

Good Topic .
But as a committed Cultist( ?)/ Believer , why did you not go on to highlight that our economies and financial system are built on the same principles -- Debt and Charged Interest .
And perhaps that Goddy is ready to pronounce etc etc
End of times.
Apocalypse
Second Coming .

Much more dramatic and controlling , however absurd people like myself find it .

 

[irosie91]

According to the writings in the "NT" ---the sinless, spotless MARY---
mother of Jesus----sacrificed a pigeon when she went to the Temple.
SHEEEEEESH-----that lady really SCREWED UP according to the silly theories presented above

 

[Woodznutz]

I believe Jesus called them robbers because they were robbing people. Money changers were essential at the Temple. So were the animals that were being sold there at the Temple. Pilgrims from all over made the trip to the Temple, and needed various animals for various sacrifices. The small city of about 30,000 would swell upwards of 500 thousand people. And, they all needed to exchange their foreign money so they could buy the animals they needed. Jesus knew that since childhood. It was Temple protocol, and Jesus never addressed it as a problem until He witnessed the exchangers ripping people off. He saw that the exchangers were cheating people by giving the foreigners less than what they should have given them. They were thieves, taking advantage of the ignorance of the foreigners. And Jesus called them on it. He clarified the reason for His anger. It was because of robbers and thieves.
Sometimes it just means what it says.

They were also selling inferior animals, not the 'firstborn, without blemish', which would have been an affront to God as it portrayed Christ as an unworthy sacrifice.

 

[irosie91]

They were also selling inferior animals, not the 'firstborn, without blemish', which would have been an affront to God as it portrayed Christ as an unworthy sacrifice.

does anyone know what the original word is----which is translated in the NT as "ROBBERS"?
The "Money changers" situated in the Temple Courtyard were appointees by Rome as
were the 'tax collectors" and the "king"----Rome educated Edomite HEROD. The
Pharisees rejected them. As to the term "robber"----probably just a negative
appellation based on their affiliation with Rome

 

[buttercup]

I believe Jesus called them robbers because they were robbing people. Money changers were essential at the Temple. So were the animals that were being sold there at the Temple. Pilgrims from all over made the trip to the Temple, and needed various animals for various sacrifices. The small city of about 30,000 would swell upwards of 500 thousand people. And, they all needed to exchange their foreign money so they could buy the animals they needed. Jesus knew that since childhood. It was Temple protocol, and Jesus never addressed it as a problem until He witnessed the exchangers ripping people off. He saw that the exchangers were cheating people by giving the foreigners less than what they should have given them. They were thieves, taking advantage of the ignorance of the foreigners. And Jesus called them on it. He clarified the reason for His anger. It was because of robbers and thieves.
Sometimes it just means what it says.

It says that word in the translations. The original word means violent ones.

Also... if you go back to the Jeremiah passage that Jesus was quoting in that NT verse, and read the entire chapter, (Jeremiah 7) the context gives more weight to the idea that Jesus was angry about more than just the moneychangers.

Here's a passage from the same chapter that Jesus quoted:

"For I did not speak to your fathers, or command them in the day that I brought them out of the land of Egypt, concerning burnt offerings or sacrifices. 23 But this is what I commanded them, saying, ‘Obey My voice, and I will be your God, and you shall be My people. And walk in all the ways that I have commanded you, that it may be well with you.’" (Jeremiah 7:21-23)​

I think it's clear that He wanted to bring an end to the entire sacrificial system, which (as I posted to you on another thread) God hated and it wasn't His idea in the first place.

If Jesus was merely angry about the moneychangers and nothing more, then He could have quoted an entirely different scripture. I believe that His quoting of that Jeremiah verse (vs.11) is significant.

Also... it seems to me that the intense level of passion and anger Jesus showed was about more than just selfish money practices. God created and loves the animals too. Again, animal sacrifice was not what God wanted in the first place, and I think Jesus wanted to put an end to it once and for all.

Btw, I didn't mention this on the other thread where we were talking about animal sacrifice... but if you look into it, the origin of animal sacrifice is demonic. In the Book of Enoch (which the Bible references and Jesus referred to as scripture) it mentions sacrifice as something the fallen angels taught mankind. Also, the Book of Enoch shows that the origin of flesh eating is also demonic. The Nephilim were the very first ones to start eating flesh, due to their ravenous appetites. That's where it all began.

 

[buttercup]

Good Topic .
But as a committed Cultist( ?)/ Believer , why did you not go on to highlight that our economies and financial system are built on the same principles -- Debt and Charged Interest .
And perhaps that Goddy is ready to pronounce etc etc
End of times.
Apocalypse
Second Coming .

Much more dramatic and controlling , however absurd people like myself find it .

I didn't get into that because it wasn't the focus of this thread... my main point was that Jesus was angry about more than just the moneychangers. But since you brought it up, I agree with you about our modern day financial system. However, just to be clear, the Bible speaks against usury. So it's not a Godly idea. It was taking place, yes, but it is not a Godly principle.

 

[buttercup]

According to the writings in the "NT" ---the sinless, spotless MARY---
mother of Jesus----sacrificed a pigeon when she went to the Temple.
SHEEEEEESH-----that lady really SCREWED UP according to the silly theories presented above

I have never once said that Mary was sinless or spotless. You must be confusing me with one of the Catholics here, I am not Catholic.

 

[irosie91]

I have never once said that Mary was sinless or spotless. You must be confusing me with one of the Catholics here, I am not Catholic.

oh----so you consider Mary's sacrifice of a pigeon to be a sin?

 

[buttercup]

oh----so you consider Mary's sacrifice of a pigeon to be a sin?

I didn't say that. I want to look into it more, before I say anything about it. I like digging deeper, as opposed to quickly spouting things off the top of my head.

 

[Woodznutz]

It says that word in the translations. The original word means violent ones.

Also... if you go back to the Jeremiah passage that Jesus was quoting in that NT verse, and read the entire chapter, (Jeremiah 7) the context gives more weight to the idea that Jesus was angry about more than just the moneychangers.

Here's a passage from the same chapter that Jesus quoted:

"For I did not speak to your fathers, or command them in the day that I brought them out of the land of Egypt, concerning burnt offerings or sacrifices. 23 But this is what I commanded them, saying, ‘Obey My voice, and I will be your God, and you shall be My people. And walk in all the ways that I have commanded you, that it may be well with you.’" (Jeremiah 7:21-23)​

I think it's clear that He wanted to bring and end to the entire sacrificial system, which (as I posted to you on another thread) God hated and it wasn't His idea in the first place.

If Jesus was merely angry about the moneychangers and nothing more, then He could have quoted an entirely different scripture. I believe that His quoting of that Jeremiah verse (vs.11) is significant.

Also... it seems to me that the intense level of passion and anger Jesus showed was about more than just selfish money practices. God created and loves the animals too. Again, animal sacrifice was not what God wanted in the first place, and I think Jesus wanted to put an end to it once and for all.

Btw, I didn't mention this on the other thread where we were talking about animal sacrifice... but if you look into it, the origin of animal sacrifice is demonic. In the Book of Enoch (which the Bible references and Jesus referred to as scripture) it mentions sacrifice as something the fallen angels taught mankind. Also, the Book of Enoch shows that the origin of flesh eating is also demonic. The Nephilim were the very first ones to start eating flesh, due to their ravenous appetites. That's where it all began.

The sacrificial system would continue until the death of Jesus replaced it. Jesus didn't rail against the system as it was intended, but what it had become.

 

[irosie91]

The sacrificial system would continue until the death of Jesus replaced it. Jesus didn't rail against the system as it was intended, but what it had become.

I am fascinated----what 'had it become'? -----besides being like a concession controlled
by the Romans via the SADDUCEES and the Roman appointed money changers?

 

[buttercup]

The sacrificial system would continue until the death of Jesus replaced it. Jesus didn't rail against the system as it was intended, but what it had become.

Since the origin of sacrificing to gods is demonic, and it was a pagan practice that was already taking place in many different cultures.... and since there are numerous Old Testament scriptures (from the prophets) that show God never liked or wanted animal sacrifice in the first place, I disagree with your take on it that it just wasn't practiced properly.

 

[irosie91]

Since the origin of sacrifice is demonic, and it was a pagan practice that was already taking place in many different cultures.... and since there are numerous Old Testament scriptures (from the prophets) that show God never liked or wanted animal sacrifice in the first place, I disagree with your take on it that it just wasn't practiced properly.

in what way was it practiced "not properly" at the time of Jesus? Do you have some
evidence of the "god rejection of animal sacrifice" in the manner prescribed?

 

[Woodznutz]

I am fascinated----what 'had it become'? -----besides being like a concession controlled
by the Romans via the SADDUCEES and the Roman appointed money changers?

That.

 

[Woodznutz]

Since the origin of sacrificing to gods is demonic, and it was a pagan practice that was already taking place in many different cultures.... and since there are numerous Old Testament scriptures (from the prophets) that show God never liked or wanted animal sacrifice in the first place, I disagree with your take on it that it just wasn't practiced properly.

God commanded animal sacrifice to atone for the sins of Israel. Of course, he didn't like it any more than a parent likes punishing their children. The Law, including animal sacrifices, was the 'schoolmaster' until it was replaced by the Holy Spirit.

 

[irosie91]

Since the origin of sacrificing to gods is demonic, and it was a pagan practice that was already taking place in many different cultures.... and since there are numerous Old Testament scriptures (from the prophets) that show God never liked or wanted animal sacrifice in the first place, I disagree with your take on it that it just wasn't practiced properly.

the english word "SACRIFICE" actually means the killing of an animal. It is not
a "gift"-----it is just sometimes so construed since in some religions animals or
other foods are "given to gods" HOWEVER----mostly NOT. Another phenomenon
is the "sacrifice" of people to "gods".
Mostly---animal sacrifice is the primitive answer to the distribution of--in most cases,
PROTEIN FOODS. In the Greek system the meat was sold by the Temples to the
people. as a matter of revenue for the Temple. In the Jewish system the meat was
fed to the priests and levites since in that agrarian society both the priests and
Levites were landless. In the churches in which I was a guest as a kid----the dropping
of a nickel in the collection plate was a gift to "god" (sacrifice). The system is one
of ECONOMICs. For further elucidation on the subject, get a textbook of ANTHROPOLOGY

 

[Woodznutz]

Sacrificing inferior (diseased, crippled, blemished) animals was rife in Malachi's day and likely continued until Jesus' day.

How do we bring blemished offerings to God (Malachi 1:8)? | GotQuestions.org

How do we bring blemished offerings to God (Malachi 1:8)? What would cause an offering to be considered blemished?

www.gotquestions.org

 

[Woodznutz]

the english word "SACRIFICE" actually means the killing of an animal. It is not
a "gift"-----it is just sometimes so construed since in some religions animals or
other foods are "given to gods" HOWEVER----mostly NOT. Another phenomenon
is the "sacrifice" of people to "gods".
Mostly---animal sacrifice is the primitive answer to the distribution of--in most cases,
PROTEIN FOODS. In the Greek system the meat was sold by the Temples to the
people. as a matter of revenue for the Temple. In the Jewish system the meat was
fed to the priests and levites since in that agrarian society both the priests and
Levites were landless. In the churches in which I was a guest as a kid----the dropping
of a nickel in the collection plate was a gift to "god" (sacrifice). The system is one
of ECONOMICs. For further elucidation on the subject, get a textbook of ANTHROPOLOGY

The blood of the sacrifice was God's; the meat was sold in the public markets.