There she goes! The bizarre escapades of Hillary Rodham Clinton

While not strictly done to "better America" - she has done a lot to improve the lives of children and women around the world through the Clinton Foundation.

While I appreciate what she's done for the world, I asked what she's done to better America. Just one thing.

Did you somehow MISS the bulk of my post and just focus on the last sentence????

No. I read the bulk of your post. But when I reached that specific portion of your post, I knew you didn't answer the question directly. Instead you offered in summation "While not strictly done to "better America" - she has done a lot to improve the lives of children and women around the world through the Clinton Foundation." You essentially told me she didn't do anything to better America.

All the research I did on the Adoption and Safe Families Act shows she did a lot of lobbying, and an op ed in 1995. She then helped break a stalemate to help get the bill passed. She also did the same thing with the Adoption and Safe Families Act and the Foster Care Independence Act. While these helped the children of America, I am more specifically interested in what she has done to help all of America, not one particular segment of the population.

1) She also created an office of Violence Against Women under the Justice Department. 2) She pushed to have the illness' of returning Gulf War veterans investigated, 3) and also the health consequences of first responders, 4) including drafting the first bill to finally compensate and offer the health services they deserve.

1) Of course, but the violence continues. A singular office isn't going to stop the violence.

2) And the recent atrocities committed by the VA indicate this effort was an utter failure.

3) If you are referring to the 9/11 first responders, then you should know about the James Zadroga 9/11 Health and Compensation Act, through which Democratic malfeasance and "sequestration" caused the program to go defunct in 2012. As of last year it hasn't been reinstated, leaving all of those families and volunteers out in the cold. I haven't heard one peep from Hillary Clinton on the matter.

4) That bill you are referring to, The Homeland Security Block Grant bill (S.2038) did not pass committee. She introduced it to the Senate in 2002. It included direct funding, overtime, a 10 percent match, and coverage of retroactive expenses post September 11, 2001. The bill was read twice but was referred elsewhere to an obscure part of the Senate apparatus, where it died. While a valiant effort, it is not a notable accomplishment, nor did it help better America.

Even though her attempt at Health Care reform ultimately failed - it did set the stage for health care reform today, something I largely support and I suspect she would continue to support if elected.

Her failure in healthcare reform is the reason we have Obamacare. If anything, it did more to harm America than help it. It has done more to divide Americans. All of this over healthcare insurance.
Truly this looks like a left/right perspective issue. You might not think she has done anything because you come from a mindset on the right where most of what she has ‘accomplished’ will be seen as a negative.

The left will see it in exactly the opposite light.

Your summation of her initial campaign is not really any different. You are not impressed but many on the left are. In the end, she does not need to impress you anyway – you are not going to vote for her under any circumstances. She is impressing those that she needs to impress. Like it or not she is likely the candidate for the democrats and she has a very good chance at taking the white house in 2016.
 
I don't understand why every conservative here is freaking out over Hillary. She only announced less than a week ago.. Show a little backbone, guys and gals.
Quit shakin' in your boots.
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I don't know how you can mistake ridicule and contempt for fear.
I like her.

For what reason? What has she done to earn your admiration? I'd really like to know.

I think she is a strong woman, she's done a lot to advocate for women's issues, health and betterment around the world as well as for for child welfare with a message that has been consistent through the years.

Now answer me this, what would be one major accomplishment of hers? What has she done to better America?

She was instrumental in developing the State Children’s Health Insurance Program and in creating the Adoption and Safe Families Act and the Foster Care Independence Act, both of which I consider good for America. She also created an office of Violence Against Women under the Justice Department. She pushed to have the illness' of returning Gulf War veterans investigated, and also the health consequences of first responders, including drafting the first bill to finally compensate and offer the health services they deserve. Even though her attempt at Health Care reform ultimately failed - it did set the stage for health care reform today, something I largely support and I suspect she would continue to support if elected.

While not strictly done to "better America" - she has done a lot to improve the lives of children and women around the world through the Clinton Foundation.
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Considering she's 67 years old; had the help through all her adult life of a political genius for a husband---who got her elected to the Senate from NY (by muscling all legit Dem contenders out of the way); got her a job as Secretary of State in return for getting Obama elected---its the thinnest resume I can imagine.

And, of course you have to count the failures with the successes. The ridiculous Reset Button with Russia was a fiasco, and has gotten worse from there. And the Middle East is absolutely on fire. Compare those failures with "created an office of Violence Against Women under the Justice Department"; "pushed for {but failed to get} improved health services for veterans"---Can you believe it?

They have actually listed a failure as a success--because she tried!

Bless her heart, she is not going to get to be president. She is not qualified. She is just Bill's aging wife.
 
You might not think she has done anything because you come from a mindset on the right where most of what she has ‘accomplished’ will be seen as a negative.

My mindset has nothing to do with the right or left. I have done much research on the accomplishments of Hillary Clinton. She's advocated for noble causes, fought for our first responders and veterans, and as Coyote points out she has fought to end violence against women. She was quite the respectable woman back in the 90's. But now, when I size up someone I want to vote for for president, I go directly to their accomplishments, and next I consider their integrity and ability to faithfully carry out the duties as described in the oath. So far, Hillary doesn't match any of those criteria.

To me she is an enormous hypocrite and habitual liar. Is that something the right told me? No, I found that out on my own. I became a libertarian for the reason that both sides lie through their teeth to get elected and then don't fulfill 99.9% of the promises they made to get elected. I also became a libertarian because I was tired of swallowing what the establishment fed me.

You are not impressed but many on the left are.

Not so fast. There are many on the left who are scared she may doom them all because of her recent behavior. As far back as last year, they worried about the image she would portray in 2016:

Some Democrats fear Clinton s wealth and imperial image could be damaging in 2016 - The Washington Post

And so far as per that article, that is coming true. When she stiffed tips for the waiters at a Chipotle, it confirmed that further for me.

She has no specific platform other than "Vote for me, I'm a woman!" I never want to look for negatives for anyone. But it is my nature to investigate. I want to be that informed voter, not one who closes his eyes and "picks one."
 
TemplarKormac

Using your criteria for "accomplishments", what have Ted Cruz, Marco Rubio or Rand Paul accomplished "for America"?
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I can see that you are a technician, but this question seems to me to miss the issue--perhaps you meant to miss it.

Obviously the inexperienced senators haven't had the chances to perform that Mrs. Clinton has had (thanks to her husband). They would be chosen by the voters, not because of their vast experience, but because the voters want something different than what the woman with vast experience has so far produced.

Mrs. Clinton is selling Experience; they are selling Competency.

She has much experience at her husband getting her jobs. Success on those jobs....not so much.

Secretary of State was, in many people's opinion, a disaster.

I just don't see how Democrats think she can hold up to careful scrutiny over the next year and a half.

I know "No other choice" makes her look better than she is. Willing Blindness. Looks like catastrophe to me.

I thank Coyote for laying out Mrs. Clinton's accomplishments---he's the first I seen with the stones to undertake such a Sisyphean task---and both of you for running a good free board.
 
TemplarKormac

Using your criteria for "accomplishments", what have Ted Cruz, Marco Rubio or Rand Paul accomplished "for America"?

They serve their constituents as US Senators. Rand Paul in particular, did this country a service by exposing the extreme liberal agenda on abortion.
 
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TemplarKormac

Using your criteria for "accomplishments", what have Ted Cruz, Marco Rubio or Rand Paul accomplished "for America"?

They serve their constituents as US Senators.

You are aware that Hillary Clinton "served her constituents as a US Senator" too, right?

If that doesn't count as an accomplishment of Hillary's, why should it count for them?

Why does it bother you at all what Hillary does? You said yesterday if I recall that what she does had no bearing on you.

You say you won't vote for her, yet here you are vehemently defending her so called "accomplishments"

Do you or do you not support Hillary Clinton?
 
TemplarKormac

Using your criteria for "accomplishments", what have Ted Cruz, Marco Rubio or Rand Paul accomplished "for America"?

They serve their constituents as US Senators.

You are aware that Hillary Clinton "served her constituents as a US Senator" too, right?

If that doesn't count as an accomplishment of Hillary's, why should it count for them?

Why does it bother you at all what Hillary does? You said yesterday if I recall that what she does had no bearing on you.

You say you won't vote for her, yet here you are vehemently defending her so called "accomplishments"

Do you or do you not support Hillary Clinton?

Again, you're looking at it from entirely the wrong perspective.

I am not "defending" Hillary Clinton - I am attacking your criteria for "accomplishments". Attacking your arguments is not the same thing as "supporting" Hillary Clinton.
 
TemplarKormac

Using your criteria for "accomplishments", what have Ted Cruz, Marco Rubio or Rand Paul accomplished "for America"?

They serve their constituents as US Senators.

You are aware that Hillary Clinton "served her constituents as a US Senator" too, right?

If that doesn't count as an accomplishment of Hillary's, why should it count for them?

I'm on my phone right now, I'll address further responses when I get home.
 
I am not "defending" Hillary Clinton - I am attacking your criteria for "accomplishments"

I fail to see a difference.

What are your criteria for "accomplishments?"

You can't see the difference between attacking your arguments and supporting Hillary Clinton?

Seeing as how I think the "accomplishments" talking point is absolutely ridiculous, I don't have "criteria" for accomplishments as a metric for whether or not I'd vote for someone.
 
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TemplarKormac

Using your criteria for "accomplishments", what have Ted Cruz, Marco Rubio or Rand Paul accomplished "for America"?

More importantly, what has Templar done for America? :2up:

Is the ad hominem really necessary?

What kind of response is that?????


What kind of response was yours? It's rather unflattering to be compared to Mrs. Clinton. So if you please, attack my thread, not me.
 
You can't see the difference between attacking your arguments and supporting Hillary Clinton?

I honestly and truly can't. How can I construe it to mean anything else? A simple matter of "for" or "against." You have said one, but suggest the other by demanding to know what criteria Hillary must meet for her deeds to qualify as accomplishments.
 
You can't see the difference between attacking your arguments and supporting Hillary Clinton?

I honestly and truly can't. How can I construe it to mean anything else?

You don't need to "construe" anything. That's the problem, you're putting two and two together and coming up with 5.

Rather than making assumptions about what my motivations are, just respond to my posts. It's a simple as that.

My opinion on the strength of your arguments is not in any way connected to whether or not I support Hillary Clinton.
 

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