The Tea Party Says Nothing Will Happen If We Default

[LoneLaugher]

These nutters knew zero about this subject two days ago. They are getting ALL of their info from the same sources who convinced them that Romney ws going to win in a landslide.

It is sad. The lack of info.

 

[Derideo_Te]

Bullshit. The ONLY way to officially default is to fail to pay the interest on the debt.

You're making shit up.

We're not paying all those "non essential" federal workers right now. So by your fucked up definition, we're currently in default.

God you're dumb.

Your ignorance of the law is readily apparent since you just conflated at will employment with legal contract obligations. Furthermore it is not my "fucked up definition" but the legal definition of the term default that you don't comprehend.

default legal definition of default. default synonyms by the Free Online Law Dictionary.



That you feel the need to resort to foul language indicates that you are in a state of denial.

Bullshit again. Congress failing to pay for expenses incurred by laws pass by Congress does not mean the government is in default. Default is failure to pay back a LOAN.

Hell, even Wiki understands this:

National default refers to the idea of an entire government unwilling or unable to pay a required national debt.

Default (finance) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Not paying for some damn federal organization that probably has no right to exist under the Constitution in the first place is NOT default.

Last time we failed to pay interest on the debt was under Carter in 1979...and yet we managed to survive. Today, we have PLENTY of money to cover the debt payments which means WE WILL NOT DEFAULT.

I understand that as a collectivist you'd like to see as much damage as possible in the face of any attempts to reign in the growth of government, but you don't get to change the meaning of a government default.

Your bizarre Tea Party interpretation of the term default is at variance with the law and every other sane person who understands the 14th Amendment to the Constitution. Failure to pay a legal obligation is defaulting. You can hold your breath until you are blue in the face but you won't convince a single Wall St Brokerage house to buy your BS.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Tea Party definitions do not replace definitions used by business, industry, government, military, government, etc.

eflatminor, nuttiness does not count in legal and political matters except in your world.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

They say it's all a hoax being perpetuated on us like global warming.

But if the Default does affect us and it does a lot of harm to our economy, do you suppose the Tea Party will take responsibility for making a bad prediction, or do you suppose they'll then blame President Obama for it?

Do you suppose you could actually quote someone saying that?

From the same link

Ted Yoho, a first-term Tea Party congressman from Florida, went even further last week, telling the Washington Post that not raising the debt limit ”would bring stability to the world markets” by assuring investors the US was curbing its $16.7tn debt load.

Notice how quickly Bripat ran away weeping when you called his bluff?

It's easy to see that the Tea Party is firmly in control of the GOP and calling the shots. The true Speaker is now Ted Cruz.

.

.

Called his bluff?

His challenge still stands.

No one in the Tea Party said "nothing will happen if we default". They plainly said we will NOT default.

 

[NYcarbineer]

I guess eflatminor has embarked on an Indiana Jones style expedition...

...to try to find one ounce of evidence to support his ridiculous claims in this thread.

What is it with you people???

 

[NYcarbineer]

70% of government spending is mandatory. It has to be, by LAW, funded, unless the LAW is changed.

Failure to raise the debt ceiling, if it forces the government to default on spending that by LAW it is required to do, aka mandatory spending,

should be considered unconstitutional, since it conflicts with those same federal laws.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

I guess eflatminor has embarked on an Indiana Jones style expedition...

...to try to find one ounce of evidence to support his ridiculous claims in this thread.

What is it with you people???

We bring in $250 billion in taxes every month, our interest payment is $20 billion. Tell me why we would ever default.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

70% of government spending is mandatory. It has to be, by LAW, funded, unless the LAW is changed.

Failure to raise the debt ceiling, if it forces the government to default on spending that by LAW it is required to do, aka mandatory spending,

should be considered unconstitutional, since it conflicts with those same federal laws.

Source?

 

[Derideo_Te]

I guess eflatminor has embarked on an Indiana Jones style expedition...

...to try to find one ounce of evidence to support his ridiculous claims in this thread.

What is it with you people???

We bring in $250 billion in taxes every month, our interest payment is $20 billion. Tell me why we would ever default.

Failure to pay 40% of the obligations of the US government when due meets the legal definition of defaulting.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

I guess eflatminor has embarked on an Indiana Jones style expedition...

...to try to find one ounce of evidence to support his ridiculous claims in this thread.

What is it with you people???

We bring in $250 billion in taxes every month, our interest payment is $20 billion. Tell me why we would ever default.

Failure to pay 40% of the obligations of the US government when due meets the legal definition of defaulting.

I see. Thanks for clarifying that you have no knowledge about how our system works at the federal level.

Black’s law dictionary has this to say about “default”: The omission or failure to fulfill a duty, observe a promise, discharge an obligation, or perform an agreement [or observe a promise or discharge an obligation (e.g. to pay interest or principal on a debt when due ].

Inconvenient as they may be, some facts are in order. The fiscal 2013 debt service for the twelve months ending September 30 will be somewhere around $420 billion. (Per the Bureau of Fiscal Service the actual figure of 11 months through August was just under $396 billion). IRS revenues for the calendar 2012 tax year will probably be around $2.3 trillion. That equates to over a five and a half times debt service coverage. So having enough money is not even close to the issue. There has been some discussion of what some are naming “prioritization of payments”.

The U.S. Debt Ceiling Fallacy: Agreement Or Not, There Will Be No Default

 

[R.C. Christian]

Default will devolve the credit rating hurt the petrol dollar reducing the empires ability run massive debts for the empire. Absolutely what needs to happen.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

Default will devolve the credit rating hurt the petrol dollar reducing the empires ability run massive debts for the empire. Absolutely what needs to happen.

Oh brother, another idiot that thinks the US is going to default.

 

[Derideo_Te]

We bring in $250 billion in taxes every month, our interest payment is $20 billion. Tell me why we would ever default.

Failure to pay 40% of the obligations of the US government when due meets the legal definition of defaulting.

I see. Thanks for clarifying that you have no knowledge about how our system works at the federal level.

Black’s law dictionary has this to say about “default”: The omission or failure to fulfill a duty, observe a promise, discharge an obligation, or perform an agreement [or observe a promise or discharge an obligation (e.g. to pay interest or principal on a debt when due ].

Inconvenient as they may be, some facts are in order. The fiscal 2013 debt service for the twelve months ending September 30 will be somewhere around $420 billion. (Per the Bureau of Fiscal Service the actual figure of 11 months through August was just under $396 billion). IRS revenues for the calendar 2012 tax year will probably be around $2.3 trillion. That equates to over a five and a half times debt service coverage. So having enough money is not even close to the issue. There has been some discussion of what some are naming “prioritization of payments”.

The U.S. Debt Ceiling Fallacy: Agreement Or Not, There Will Be No Default

What about all of the contractual obligations that the US government must abide by or be deemed to be in default by your own link's definition of the term? Where does your link say that contractual obligations are exempt? If your company had a contract with the government for services would the government be in default if you performed those services and the government failed to pay you?

 

[Lonestar_logic]

Failure to pay 40% of the obligations of the US government when due meets the legal definition of defaulting.

I see. Thanks for clarifying that you have no knowledge about how our system works at the federal level.

Black’s law dictionary has this to say about “default”: The omission or failure to fulfill a duty, observe a promise, discharge an obligation, or perform an agreement [or observe a promise or discharge an obligation (e.g. to pay interest or principal on a debt when due ].

Inconvenient as they may be, some facts are in order. The fiscal 2013 debt service for the twelve months ending September 30 will be somewhere around $420 billion. (Per the Bureau of Fiscal Service the actual figure of 11 months through August was just under $396 billion). IRS revenues for the calendar 2012 tax year will probably be around $2.3 trillion. That equates to over a five and a half times debt service coverage. So having enough money is not even close to the issue. There has been some discussion of what some are naming “prioritization of payments”.

The U.S. Debt Ceiling Fallacy: Agreement Or Not, There Will Be No Default

What about all of the contractual obligations that the US government must abide by or be deemed to be in default by your own link's definition of the term? Where does your link say that contractual obligations are exempt? If your company had a contract with the government for services would the government be in default if you performed those services and the government failed to pay you?

What about it?

Tell me how much are our "contractual obligations"?

And please use a credible source.

It has been explained to you or rather would have if you had taken the time to read the link or even do your own research that matter. Our revenue, ( you do know what that is right ?) is over 2 trillion dollars a year, our debt service is around 420 billion dollars a year. So how can we ever default?

 

[NYcarbineer]

70% of government spending is mandatory. It has to be, by LAW, funded, unless the LAW is changed.

Failure to raise the debt ceiling, if it forces the government to default on spending that by LAW it is required to do, aka mandatory spending,

should be considered unconstitutional, since it conflicts with those same federal laws.

Source?

It was purely an opinion.

 

[NYcarbineer]

We bring in $250 billion in taxes every month, our interest payment is $20 billion. Tell me why we would ever default.

Failure to pay 40% of the obligations of the US government when due meets the legal definition of defaulting.

I see. Thanks for clarifying that you have no knowledge about how our system works at the federal level.

Black’s law dictionary has this to say about “default”: The omission or failure to fulfill a duty, observe a promise, discharge an obligation, or perform an agreement [or observe a promise or discharge an obligation (e.g. to pay interest or principal on a debt when due ].

Government programs such as Medicaid, Medicare, Social Security, which are examples of mandatory spending,

have to be funded, by law. Their funding is a legal obligation. To create a situation, such as freezing the debt ceiling, that prevents their funding,

is causing the government to default on those obligations well within the definitions you posted.

 

[NYcarbineer]

I guess eflatminor has embarked on an Indiana Jones style expedition...

...to try to find one ounce of evidence to support his ridiculous claims in this thread.

What is it with you people???

We bring in $250 billion in taxes every month, our interest payment is $20 billion. Tell me why we would ever default.

You and others are talking about only one aspect of default.

Question: Does the Treasury have the authority to pick and choose which bills it pays? If so, where does it get that authority?

 

[Derideo_Te]

I see. Thanks for clarifying that you have no knowledge about how our system works at the federal level.

Black’s law dictionary has this to say about “default”: The omission or failure to fulfill a duty, observe a promise, discharge an obligation, or perform an agreement [or observe a promise or discharge an obligation (e.g. to pay interest or principal on a debt when due ].

Inconvenient as they may be, some facts are in order. The fiscal 2013 debt service for the twelve months ending September 30 will be somewhere around $420 billion. (Per the Bureau of Fiscal Service the actual figure of 11 months through August was just under $396 billion). IRS revenues for the calendar 2012 tax year will probably be around $2.3 trillion. That equates to over a five and a half times debt service coverage. So having enough money is not even close to the issue. There has been some discussion of what some are naming “prioritization of payments”.

The U.S. Debt Ceiling Fallacy: Agreement Or Not, There Will Be No Default

What about all of the contractual obligations that the US government must abide by or be deemed to be in default by your own link's definition of the term? Where does your link say that contractual obligations are exempt? If your company had a contract with the government for services would the government be in default if you performed those services and the government failed to pay you?

What about it?

Tell me how much are our "contractual obligations"?

And please use a credible source.

It has been explained to you or rather would have if you had taken the time to read the link or even do your own research that matter. Our revenue, ( you do know what that is right ?) is over 2 trillion dollars a year, our debt service is around 420 billion dollars a year. So how can we ever default?

Unless you have a "credible source" that can definitely establish that the government is making payments without a legal obligation to make those payments the assumption must be that all payments are legal. If you want a "credible source" I suggest that you refer to the Treasury website itself.

 

[eflatminor]

Default by definition entails more than just not paying the interest on a loan.

No, it does not. Even if you REALLY wish it did.

So I can't default on a mortgage as long as I just send in the interest portion of my monthly payment?

Are you sure about that? Can you link to proof of that?

My God you're ignorant. No, if the terms of your loan are 'interest only', you cannot default as long as you send that in every month.

The federal government pays the interest only, rolling over the principal. As long as they pay that interest, there is no default.

 

[eflatminor]

Whose numbers are you using?

The government statistics on federal spending and tax revenue.

And you won't actually produce them because...

...you're lying? or you're trolling? Or both?

Here you go dumbass:

2008 Total Federal Spending, $2.98 Trillion
Government Spending in United States: Federal State Local for 2008 - Charts Tables History
Current year total Federal Revenues, $3.03 Trillion
Federal State Local Government Tax Revenue in United States for 2014 - Charts Tables

You were saying something about lying???

Now will you admit that we're taking in enough revenue to fund the entire government's spending we had in 2008?

If you have the decency to do so, tell us, what we be so damn bad about living within our means? We managed just fine in 2008.