The Iran War, Trump's Idea or Netanyahu's?

[JWBooth]

I know that all our Intel Agencies agreed that Iran was not building a nuke

Well, the did until they were instructed to report otherwise.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Well, the did until they were instructed to report otherwise.

Jared’s Tingling Spidey Sense trumped American Intel

 

[SeaMajor7]

His idea.

He has been itching for a war with Iran for almost half a century, and finally he found a President who could go along with his madness.

Shame on Trump, to think that I respected him so much in the past, not anymore.


View attachment 1262458

Trump wanted to bomb the Iranian Islamic TERRORISTS since 19 freaking 80.
It is SO disappointing that you are as lost as Imposter Frank. Sad.

 

[Bad Bob]

I know that all our Intel Agencies agreed that Iran was not building a nuke

Agreed. Also, they knew the Iranian leadership wanted nukes for the same reason Israel wanted nukes: to forestall invasion.

It would be national suicide for any nation to start a nuclear war.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

That does seem pretty unlikely. I mean, I doubt Bibi has been making that claim for 35 years. I don’t doubt that he has said it more than a few times.

But, the thing is, so what? Why do you seek to direct our attention to whatever Bibi may (or may not) have said?

It’s not something all that complicated. Were they (Iran) within two weeks of acquiring that ability when we struck Iran? Or were they not?

I demonstrated that Iran was seeking the ability to acquire nuclear weapons.

So, doesn’t that being the issue help boil it down to: “how long would it have taken to get their 60% uranium enrichment to the nuclear-weapons level of enhancement of 90%?”

In a prior post on this topic (earlier thread, somewhere) I also established that such additional enrichment to the 90% level is approximately seven to ten days. I can dig it up again, but it hasn’t changed.



So you maintain. But many of us disagree. We won’t have to worry about welfare or social security and housing and a clean environment if we take a nuclear weapon attack from Iran. That day becomes possible if the Islamofascist Iranian regime ever gets its hands on a nuclear weapon or two or Eleven.

That estimate is based on a set of assumptions that probably won’t exist.
STILL, I agree that using a lot of missiles does require manufacturing to replace those which have been used. This doesn’t make this problem unusual when it comes to war.

I do not disagree that this “adventure” comes with costs. Everything we have ever done relative to war always has. I’m sure it always will.

But your objection seems to be that the expense this time isn’t worth it. Again, you’re entitled to that opinion. But having your particular opinion doesn’t make you right.

Not being able to produce the nuclear capability they ABSOLUTELY had an interest in was and remains “so important” because the lives of hundreds of of millions of people would likely be saved because of it. (We could quibble about that number. Indeed, it very well could escalate into the BILLIONS.)

America's deteriorating financial situation, $2T deficit again this year, is a far far greater concern than Iran's Imaginary nuclear weapons program. Trump promised he would not attack Iran. Nothing changed in Iran, only POTUS Changed

Iran has proven that control of the Strait makes nuclear weapons irrelevant.

By attacked Iran and continuing to prosecute the war as they're doing, Trump and Bibi started a slow motion global economic collapse. I'm not hyperventilating, I'm not an antisemite, it's just acknowledging that many nations who depended on ME petroleum are now starting to deal with rationing, slowing economies, soon unreliable electrical grids. We're in the shoreline rushing out part of the incoming tsunami

Million more could die from this, more than would ever would had died from Iran nonexistent nuclear weapon program.

The irony of killing maybes tens of million of people by trying to save them from a nonexistent nuclear weapon is on par with Trump saying we're going to wipe out Iran as a civilization to save them from the Mullahs who are working on a nuclear weapon

"Nations abruptly cut off from Persian Gulf oil due to the blockade in the Strait of Hormuz are facing severe energy crises, rampant inflation, and drastic rationing measures. With roughly \(13\) million barrels per day halted, these disruptions are fundamentally reshaping global supply chains. [1, 2, 3, 4, 5]

Economic and Domestic Impacts

• Energy Rationing: Asian economies heavily reliant on Gulf energy, such as Thailand, India, South Korea, and the Philippines, are the most vulnerable. To conserve dwindling supplies, governments have implemented severe daily-life restrictions, including enforced work-from-home directives, shorter workweeks, and the early closure of schools and universities. [1, 2]
• Global Inflation and Recession Risks: The physical loss of supply and surging precautionary demand have pushed oil prices well over \(\$80\) per barrel. This spike is filtering into the broader economy, with core price levels rising and GDP growth forecasts dropping. Central banks face the difficult dilemma of managing high inflation while avoiding a recession. [1, 2, 3, 4]
• Supply Chain and Food Security: The crisis extends beyond crude, severely impacting the supply of liquefied natural gas (LNG) and fertilizers originating from the Gulf. Shortages in agricultural inputs threaten food security for millions, while disruptions to alumina and aluminum shipments are severely limiting industrial manufacturing in the United States and abroad. [1, 2, 3]

Shifting Geopolitics and Trade Flows

• Rise of Alternative Exporters: With the Gulf effectively closed off, nations are hunting for alternative suppliers. The United States and Russia are benefiting immensely, as surging global crude prices stimulate US shale production and force international buyers to heavily rely on Russian energy exports. [1, 2, 3]
• Distress Buying in Latin America: Buyers worldwide are scrambling to secure long-term contracts and spot shipments. For example, Latin American oil traders are fielding urgent purchasing requests from markets that previously had never bought from the region. [1]
• The Race for Energy Independence: The speed of the crisis is forcing a painful, sudden acceleration in the energy transition. Countries are aggressively attempting to bypass traditional chokepoints by utilizing SPR (Strategic Petroleum Reserves) and leaning more heavily into non-Gulf producers. [1, 2, 3, 4]

To track real-time crude supply updates, you can check the International Energy Agency tracker. For deeper analysis on the geopolitical ripple effects across regions, explore the Center for Strategic and International Studies overview.

IEA head Birol reaffirms that world facing biggest energy crisis in history​

IEA head Birol reaffirms that world facing biggest energy crisis in history

 

[Bad Bob]

Trump wanted to bomb the Iranian Islamic TERRORISTS since 19 freaking 80.
It is SO disappointing that you are as lost as Imposter Frank. Sad.

Why didn't he do it in his first term?

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Trump wanted to bomb the Iranian Islamic TERRORISTS since 19 freaking 80.
It is SO disappointing that you are as lost as Imposter Frank. Sad.

It's disappointing that Trump POTUS would not recognize Trump Campaign Promise version if they bumped into each other on the street.

 

[BackAgain]

America's deteriorating financial situation, $2T deficit again this year, is a far far greater concern than Iran's Imaginary nuclear weapons program. Trump promised he would not attack Iran. Nothing changed in Iran, only POTUS Changed

Iran has proven that control of the Strait makes nuclear weapons irrelevant.

By attacked Iran and continuing to prosecute the war as they're doing, Trump and Bibi started a slow motion global economic collapse. I'm not hyperventilating, I'm not an antisemite, it's just acknowledging that many nations who depended on ME petroleum are now starting to deal with rationing, slowing economies, soon unreliable electrical grids. We're in the shoreline rushing out part of the incoming tsunami

Million more could die from this, more than would ever would had died from Iran nonexistent nuclear weapon program.

The irony of killing maybes tens of million of people by trying to save them from a nonexistent nuclear weapon is on par with Trump saying we're going to wipe out Iran as a civilization to save them from the Mullahs who are working on a nuclear weapon

"Nations abruptly cut off from Persian Gulf oil due to the blockade in the Strait of Hormuz are facing severe energy crises, rampant inflation, and drastic rationing measures. With roughly \(13\) million barrels per day halted, these disruptions are fundamentally reshaping global supply chains. [1, 2, 3, 4, 5]

Economic and Domestic Impacts

• Energy Rationing: Asian economies heavily reliant on Gulf energy, such as Thailand, India, South Korea, and the Philippines, are the most vulnerable. To conserve dwindling supplies, governments have implemented severe daily-life restrictions, including enforced work-from-home directives, shorter workweeks, and the early closure of schools and universities. [1, 2]
• Global Inflation and Recession Risks: The physical loss of supply and surging precautionary demand have pushed oil prices well over \(\$80\) per barrel. This spike is filtering into the broader economy, with core price levels rising and GDP growth forecasts dropping. Central banks face the difficult dilemma of managing high inflation while avoiding a recession. [1, 2, 3, 4]
• Supply Chain and Food Security: The crisis extends beyond crude, severely impacting the supply of liquefied natural gas (LNG) and fertilizers originating from the Gulf. Shortages in agricultural inputs threaten food security for millions, while disruptions to alumina and aluminum shipments are severely limiting industrial manufacturing in the United States and abroad. [1, 2, 3]

Shifting Geopolitics and Trade Flows

• Rise of Alternative Exporters: With the Gulf effectively closed off, nations are hunting for alternative suppliers. The United States and Russia are benefiting immensely, as surging global crude prices stimulate US shale production and force international buyers to heavily rely on Russian energy exports. [1, 2, 3]
• Distress Buying in Latin America: Buyers worldwide are scrambling to secure long-term contracts and spot shipments. For example, Latin American oil traders are fielding urgent purchasing requests from markets that previously had never bought from the region. [1]
• The Race for Energy Independence: The speed of the crisis is forcing a painful, sudden acceleration in the energy transition. Countries are aggressively attempting to bypass traditional chokepoints by utilizing SPR (Strategic Petroleum Reserves) and leaning more heavily into non-Gulf producers. [1, 2, 3, 4]

To track real-time crude supply updates, you can check the International Energy Agency tracker. For deeper analysis on the geopolitical ripple effects across regions, explore the Center for Strategic and International Studies overview.

IEA head Birol reaffirms that world facing biggest energy crisis in history​

IEA head Birol reaffirms that world facing biggest energy crisis in history

Iran doesn’t get to control international waters.

Bibi’s warnings about Iran’s efforts to be able to produce nuclear weapons are not evidence of crying wolf. Indeed, as we can all plainly see, Iran did end up within about 10 days of being able to finish the required uranium enrichment to permit the construction of some nuclear weapons.

And without addressing all the claims made in your fairly long post, let’s note that I remain alarmed by the American addiction to spending monies that we don’t have. This doesn’t mean that, in some occasions, it is a required tool.

 

[BackAgain]

It's disappointing that Trump POTUS would not recognize Trump Campaign Promise version if they bumped into each other on the street.

Historically, the American people have tended to be more isolationist because they aren’t fans of war. We seem to recognize that people get killed and injured in wars and that physical assets get broken.

And yet, that doesn’t mean we were wrong to assist England (in fact, rather belatedly) in its urgent need to fight Nazi Germany.

War is always a horror. And we can all appreciate a basic national desire to stay out of wars. But, sometimes, war turns out to have been crucially necessary.

A worthwhile national leader is often obliged to consider some awful alternatives and sometimes has to choose to go a route which he doesn’t like and had promised to try to avoid. It’s the nature of the job.

 

[Bad Bob]

Iran doesn’t get to control international waters.

Bibi’s warnings about Iran’s efforts to be able to produce nuclear weapons are not evidence of crying wolf. Indeed, as we can all plainly see, Iran did end up within about 10 days of being able to finish the required uranium enrichment to permit the construction of some nuclear weapons.

And without addressing all the claims made in your fairly long post, let’s note that I remain alarmed by the American addiction to spending monies that we don’t have. This doesn’t mean that, in some occasions, it is a required tool.

Correct....unless your Orange Hero bends over and agrees to support the idea of changing the law for that area "for peace". Is there any doubt that the United States is still the 400 lb gorilla in the West?

Who doesn't think Trump still desperately wants a Noble Peace Prize?

Historically, the American people have tended to be more isolationist because they aren’t fans of war. We seem to recognize that people get killed and injured in wars and that physical assets get broken.

Kings go to war, most citizens, regardless of geography, do not.

Americans got used to the idea of "no war" because of two oceans. Technology in the early 20th century changed that equation. ICBM's completely obliterated the idea that our two ocean theory was still working. Well, at least the sane and educated ones. LOL

 

[gipper]

Historically, the American people have tended to be more isolationist because they aren’t fans of war. We seem to recognize that people get killed and injured in wars and that physical assets get broken.

And yet, that doesn’t mean we were wrong to assist England (in fact, rather belatedly) in its urgent need to fight Nazi Germany.

War is always a horror. And we can all appreciate a basic national desire to stay out of wars. But, sometimes, war turns out to have been crucially necessary.

A worthwhile national leader is often obliged to consider some awful alternatives and sometimes has to choose to go a route which he doesn’t like and had promised to try to avoid. It’s the nature of the job.

Yet we’ve been at war nearly all 250 years of our existence.

In the world’s so called greatest democracy, the people don’t want war, but we’re always at war. So much for democracy.

Somehow most Americans you included, always side with the criminals in government who take us to war.