The GOP FAILED. There is no excuse for where we find ourselves.

[jc456]

Honestly, Trump and a few of his successful business leader appointments must look at both sides of the aisles,and say "how do some of these guys have a job"? Even as an outsider living in a socialist nation, even I shake my head at this.

Ironically, the Democrats have as much if not more to lose by this, as Obamacare is going to falter and the GOP can rightfully suggest that from Day One Schumer said that repeal had to be off the table or he would direct his Groupthink minions to not vote. The GOP have received exactly zero votes and zero support from the Dems who surely realise that Obamacare was a great big, socialist scam meant to trap all future governments and societies within the ACA Bill.

I will say this, two important issues, one, trying to roll back once earned benefits that are now deemed entitlements is very hard to do, two, the costs of healthcare from doctors on down is quite expensive and thus unsustainable as a socialised option. Especially when you are already stretched with 11 million illegal immigrants and foreign government abuses against U.S businesses.

I concur with most of your takes here, but disagree that the Dems have as much to lose as the Repubs. The Dems passed BOcare and hence owned it. Owned it until the Repubs won control by promising repeal and replace. Now that the Repubs have proven they can't even get their own majority to a vote on their R&R promise, they can hardly blame the Dems for obstruction. If they could at least vote and show support in their own party on a bill, then they could point at the Dems for not allowing a change. Some have speculated that the GOP could get to 60 seats in the senate after the midterms. The way things look now, even if they had the filibuster proof majority, they wouldn't be able to pass a healthcare bill.

No the bill was dems period. Until it is replaced, it's the dems.

 

[Chuz Life]

Can anyone show me where it is written in our Constitution that the Federal Fucking Government is responsible for providing and managing the private healthcare of individual citizens from cradle to fucking grave?

There is nothing in the constitution that gives the Feds responsibility for healthcare (or social security and education for that matter), but that ship has sailed. We have government healthcare and always will. Wait! What is that I see in the future.......it looks like...yes it is, SINGLE PAYER!

Yay! Who doesn't want their healthcare managed with the same precise efficiency and accountability that the local licence branch runs with?

 

[debbiedowner]

These asshats ON BOTH SIDES are playing with fire. We are on the road to a total collapse of our healthcare system & not just the insurance side that the left already wrecked.

I full heartedly supported the GOP and their plan to repeal & or replace. They had SEVEN FUCKING YEARS to prepare for this. In the meantime my premiums skyrocketed right along with my out of pocket expenses.

And for what???

I am nearing 50 years of age and medical needs are likely to begin setting in at some point. Meanwhile these jackasses play partisan reelection politics. At this point who got us here is almost irrelevant to the actual needs I'm likely to start facing so the blame game does nothing to help me.

/rant

You do realize of course that if Republicans repealed ACA, your premiums would not go down right?

You realize that when Obamacare was enacted our premiums didn't go down by $2400 like we were promised? Did you realize our deductibles went up and not down. Now citizens of this country have to buy a product because the government requires it to remain legal.

You do realize there were and are plans with no deductibles, $800 and a few more under $2400? You just had to pay for them and insurance companies really didn't want anyone on them, the sickest usually would go for that the first year.

 

[BuckToothMoron]

Honestly, Trump and a few of his successful business leader appointments must look at both sides of the aisles,and say "how do some of these guys have a job"? Even as an outsider living in a socialist nation, even I shake my head at this.

Ironically, the Democrats have as much if not more to lose by this, as Obamacare is going to falter and the GOP can rightfully suggest that from Day One Schumer said that repeal had to be off the table or he would direct his Groupthink minions to not vote. The GOP have received exactly zero votes and zero support from the Dems who surely realise that Obamacare was a great big, socialist scam meant to trap all future governments and societies within the ACA Bill.

I will say this, two important issues, one, trying to roll back once earned benefits that are now deemed entitlements is very hard to do, two, the costs of healthcare from doctors on down is quite expensive and thus unsustainable as a socialised option. Especially when you are already stretched with 11 million illegal immigrants and foreign government abuses against U.S businesses.

I concur with most of your takes here, but disagree that the Dems have as much to lose as the Repubs. The Dems passed BOcare and hence owned it. Owned it until the Repubs won control by promising repeal and replace. Now that the Repubs have proven they can't even get their own majority to a vote on their R&R promise, they can hardly blame the Dems for obstruction. If they could at least vote and show support in their own party on a bill, then they could point at the Dems for not allowing a change. Some have speculated that the GOP could get to 60 seats in the senate after the midterms. The way things look now, even if they had the filibuster proof majority, they wouldn't be able to pass a healthcare bill.

No the bill was dems period. Until it is replaced, it's the dems.

Wrong-a-reno! GOP promised a replacement, everybody who is reasonable agrees it sucks, GOP owns the House, Senate and presidency. If they could at least get a vote in the senate, and get 50-52 votes, then they could blame the Dems for not supporting a replacement/obstruction. Short of that, they own it as much as the Dems. Don't believe me? Watch what happens to the GOP majority in the House of Representatives in the midterms. They are setting themselves up to get crushed. Mr. Ryan, please take your seat, hello Speaker Pelosi.

 

[nat4900]

Yay! Who doesn't want their healthcare managed with the same precise efficiency and accountability that the local licence branch runs with?

You should...as soon as possible......tell the feds that you are REFUSING social security and Medicare because of their lack of efficiency which you find deplorable; that'll teach them.

 

[Papageorgio]

These asshats ON BOTH SIDES are playing with fire. We are on the road to a total collapse of our healthcare system & not just the insurance side that the left already wrecked.

I full heartedly supported the GOP and their plan to repeal & or replace. They had SEVEN FUCKING YEARS to prepare for this. In the meantime my premiums skyrocketed right along with my out of pocket expenses.

And for what???

I am nearing 50 years of age and medical needs are likely to begin setting in at some point. Meanwhile these jackasses play partisan reelection politics. At this point who got us here is almost irrelevant to the actual needs I'm likely to start facing so the blame game does nothing to help me.

/rant

You do realize of course that if Republicans repealed ACA, your premiums would not go down right?

You realize that when Obamacare was enacted our premiums didn't go down by $2400 like we were promised? Did you realize our deductibles went up and not down. Now citizens of this country have to buy a product because the government requires it to remain legal.

You do realize there were and are plans with no deductibles, $800 and a few more under $2400? You just had to pay for them and insurance companies really didn't want anyone on them, the sickest usually would go for that the first year.

I don't have that kind of money. Do you?

 

[debbiedowner]

And everyone should have health insurance in this country.

And I should not be forced to buy anything to remain a citizen in good standing in my own country, that is absurd. What a bunch of control freaks, freedom is no longer free is it.

Fine. Don't seek care when you become ill or injured.
Other premium holders should not be forced
to pay more to cover for you free riders.

why can't he just pay the doctor? seem reasonable to you?

Do you have $250K+ to cover your surgery, week long stay in the ICU, another week in a regular room and all of the follow up care after your accident?

I had a catastrophic policy, it was a great policy, cheap, didn't cover doctors visits but I didn't care, I rarely saw a doctor, just once a year. I still should not be forced by my government to buy anything, it's called freedom.

Sit down and figure out if it's cheaper for you to pay the penalty rather than high premium, deductible and max out of pocket. Just because it's mandated doesn't mean many didn't just pay the penalty.

 

[Kondor3]

The GOP FAILED...

Hell, that was obvious way-back during Primary Season... look what it belched up as a candidate.

 

[debbiedowner]

These asshats ON BOTH SIDES are playing with fire. We are on the road to a total collapse of our healthcare system & not just the insurance side that the left already wrecked.

I full heartedly supported the GOP and their plan to repeal & or replace. They had SEVEN FUCKING YEARS to prepare for this. In the meantime my premiums skyrocketed right along with my out of pocket expenses.

And for what???

I am nearing 50 years of age and medical needs are likely to begin setting in at some point. Meanwhile these jackasses play partisan reelection politics. At this point who got us here is almost irrelevant to the actual needs I'm likely to start facing so the blame game does nothing to help me.

/rant

You do realize of course that if Republicans repealed ACA, your premiums would not go down right?

You realize that when Obamacare was enacted our premiums didn't go down by $2400 like we were promised? Did you realize our deductibles went up and not down. Now citizens of this country have to buy a product because the government requires it to remain legal.

You do realize there were and are plans with no deductibles, $800 and a few more under $2400? You just had to pay for them and insurance companies really didn't want anyone on them, the sickest usually would go for that the first year.

I don't have that kind of money. Do you?

Well yes but I'm well over 65.

Is it group insurance you have or individual?
Are you self employed by any chance?
Single or married? You claim anyone on your tax return?

 

[Chuz Life]

Yay! Who doesn't want their healthcare managed with the same precise efficiency and accountability that the local licence branch runs with?

You should...as soon as possible......tell the feds that you are REFUSING social security and Medicare because of their lack of efficiency which you find deplorable; that'll teach them.

Why should I refuse something that in all likelihood will be bankrupt and no longer exist by the time I "qualify" for it?

 

[Papageorgio]

And I should not be forced to buy anything to remain a citizen in good standing in my own country, that is absurd. What a bunch of control freaks, freedom is no longer free is it.

Fine. Don't seek care when you become ill or injured.
Other premium holders should not be forced
to pay more to cover for you free riders.

why can't he just pay the doctor? seem reasonable to you?

Do you have $250K+ to cover your surgery, week long stay in the ICU, another week in a regular room and all of the follow up care after your accident?

I had a catastrophic policy, it was a great policy, cheap, didn't cover doctors visits but I didn't care, I rarely saw a doctor, just once a year. I still should not be forced by my government to buy anything, it's called freedom.

Sit down and figure out if it's cheaper for you to pay the penalty rather than high premium, deductible and max out of pocket. Just because it's mandated doesn't mean many didn't just pay the penalty.

Not buying insurance is illegal, are you telling me to break the law?

 

[Papageorgio]

These asshats ON BOTH SIDES are playing with fire. We are on the road to a total collapse of our healthcare system & not just the insurance side that the left already wrecked.

I full heartedly supported the GOP and their plan to repeal & or replace. They had SEVEN FUCKING YEARS to prepare for this. In the meantime my premiums skyrocketed right along with my out of pocket expenses.

And for what???

I am nearing 50 years of age and medical needs are likely to begin setting in at some point. Meanwhile these jackasses play partisan reelection politics. At this point who got us here is almost irrelevant to the actual needs I'm likely to start facing so the blame game does nothing to help me.

/rant

You do realize of course that if Republicans repealed ACA, your premiums would not go down right?

You realize that when Obamacare was enacted our premiums didn't go down by $2400 like we were promised? Did you realize our deductibles went up and not down. Now citizens of this country have to buy a product because the government requires it to remain legal.

You do realize there were and are plans with no deductibles, $800 and a few more under $2400? You just had to pay for them and insurance companies really didn't want anyone on them, the sickest usually would go for that the first year.

I don't have that kind of money. Do you?

Well yes but I'm well over 65.

Is it group insurance you have or individual?
Are you self employed by any chance?
Single or married? You claim anyone on your tax return?

It's group, my wife cannot enroll, she buys separately. I work for someone else and married.

 

[nat4900]

Yay! Who doesn't want their healthcare managed with the same precise efficiency and accountability that the local licence branch runs with?

 

[debbiedowner]

Since I have been on this forum and read just about everything some of you have posted for your hatred of obamacare (which I do to) I have a feeling some may have qualified a decent subsidy and either didn't know or didn't want it. Maybe went on healthcare.gov and signed up yourself without knowing what you were getting or talked to someone there and ask if a certain provider was in network and they told you yes even though they had no idea and let me tell you they are not licensed insurance agents.

I had many self employed individuals that worked with their accountants to get their modified adjusted gross income low enough to get most of their premium paid for by obama. I also had one that had a LLC and his accountant told him (don't know if this is true) that he could take a low salary and if he needed money during the year borrow from his LLC instead of taking a distribution.

I know it's not right for them to want you to project your income for a year you have no idea about.

With all that being said who knows if the subsidies will even be there next year.

Oh but if your income went down during the year and you did not qualify for a subsidy at the beginning and now you could qualify you can call the marketplace and get a special enrollment and take advantage for the rest of the year.

 

[debbiedowner]

You do realize of course that if Republicans repealed ACA, your premiums would not go down right?

You realize that when Obamacare was enacted our premiums didn't go down by $2400 like we were promised? Did you realize our deductibles went up and not down. Now citizens of this country have to buy a product because the government requires it to remain legal.

You do realize there were and are plans with no deductibles, $800 and a few more under $2400? You just had to pay for them and insurance companies really didn't want anyone on them, the sickest usually would go for that the first year.

I don't have that kind of money. Do you?

Well yes but I'm well over 65.

Is it group insurance you have or individual?
Are you self employed by any chance?
Single or married? You claim anyone on your tax return?

It's group, my wife cannot enroll, she buys separately. I work for someone else and married.

Oh crap, that would have probably be the family glitch where she cannot qualify for subsidy because you may have an affordable premium to you. But if you're close to your employer if he's small you might suggest he see an insurance agent or the one he has for group and talk about an HRA. It is setup so he can legally pay for an individual plan and he also gets a tax deduction. The insurance company may know of a good third party.

 

[Papageorgio]

You realize that when Obamacare was enacted our premiums didn't go down by $2400 like we were promised? Did you realize our deductibles went up and not down. Now citizens of this country have to buy a product because the government requires it to remain legal.

You do realize there were and are plans with no deductibles, $800 and a few more under $2400? You just had to pay for them and insurance companies really didn't want anyone on them, the sickest usually would go for that the first year.

I don't have that kind of money. Do you?

Well yes but I'm well over 65.

Is it group insurance you have or individual?
Are you self employed by any chance?
Single or married? You claim anyone on your tax return?

It's group, my wife cannot enroll, she buys separately. I work for someone else and married.

Oh crap, that would have probably be the family glitch where she cannot qualify for subsidy because you may have an affordable premium to you. But if you're close to your employer if he's small you might suggest he see an insurance agent or the one he has for group and talk about an HRA. It is setup so he can legally pay for an individual plan and he also gets a tax deduction. The insurance company may know of a good third party.

Sounds like a good idea!

 

[debbiedowner]

You do realize there were and are plans with no deductibles, $800 and a few more under $2400? You just had to pay for them and insurance companies really didn't want anyone on them, the sickest usually would go for that the first year.

I don't have that kind of money. Do you?

Well yes but I'm well over 65.

Is it group insurance you have or individual?
Are you self employed by any chance?
Single or married? You claim anyone on your tax return?

It's group, my wife cannot enroll, she buys separately. I work for someone else and married.

Oh crap, that would have probably be the family glitch where she cannot qualify for subsidy because you may have an affordable premium to you. But if you're close to your employer if he's small you might suggest he see an insurance agent or the one he has for group and talk about an HRA. It is setup so he can legally pay for an individual plan and he also gets a tax deduction. The insurance company may know of a good third party.

Sounds like a good idea!

It is, it wasn't allowed until either Obamas last few weeks or Trumps first few weeks. If he sets up an HRA he can also help pay co pays and deductibles. If his insurance agent doesn't know anything about it tell him to change his agent of record to one that does.

 

[Mike473]

There are only two options.

Pay the high premiums for the Obamacare coverage

Cut the coverages to achieve lower premiums.

Most people want to keep the coverage and drastically lower the premium. People can't have both. It's that simple. Neither the Republicans or Democrats have a solution. Well, the Dems want single payer, which is an alternative. But, one most people are uncomfortable with as well.

There is no answer. All the stuff talked about (state lines and so on), would amount to small savings. My brother is self employed and pays $1500 per month for a family plan. He said that he thinks a premium of $500 per month would be realistic. Does any plan achieve that kind of savings?

We either pay the price or dump the coverage. That is why I believe single payer is inevitable. There is no real solution.

I consider myself a conservative, but I have to agree with the critics of the GOP. After 7 years of crowing about repeal, they should be embarrassed. They should have just done it and dealt with the consequences. As it stands, they could lose the house in 2018 and have nothing to show after a period of total control. Dismal. This isn't on Trump at all in my opinion. He is waiting, ready to sign. This just proves how weak the GOP leadership is currently. The GOP may lose control, and frankly, they deserve it at this point.

 

[debbiedowner]

My brother is self employed and pays $1500 per month for a family plan. He said that he thinks a premium of $500 per month would be realistic. Does any plan achieve that kind of savings?

I can't think (without my chart) what the federal poverty level is for a family of 4, oh you didn't say that. Or what state he is in, but I bet depending on his gross income his accountant can get his income in a range to get a subsidy. Heck his accountant may already have but he didn't know he might qualify. The best thing for him to do is contact a reputable health insurance agent where he lives between Nov 1 and Dec 15th, assuming the subsidies will still be there next year.

 

[Remodeling Maidiac]

And I should not be forced to buy anything to remain a citizen in good standing in my own country, that is absurd. What a bunch of control freaks, freedom is no longer free is it.

Fine. Don't seek care when you become ill or injured.
Other premium holders should not be forced
to pay more to cover for you free riders.

why can't he just pay the doctor? seem reasonable to you?

Do you have $250K+ to cover your surgery, week long stay in the ICU, another week in a regular room and all of the follow up care after your accident?

I had a catastrophic policy, it was a great policy, cheap, didn't cover doctors visits but I didn't care, I rarely saw a doctor, just once a year. I still should not be forced by my government to buy anything, it's called freedom.

Sit down and figure out if it's cheaper for you to pay the penalty rather than high premium, deductible and max out of pocket. Just because it's mandated doesn't mean many didn't just pay the penalty.

Which is exactly why the program is failing. The fine is so low. The point of the fine was to make up for those not in to pay for those that are. Except the fine is so low it can't compensate for all the "takers" flooding the system. The law was designed to fail. It's plainly obvious to anyone with basic math skills.