The Every Other Path But Christian Thread

[Sky Dancer]

I heard Krishnamurti speak in Ojai years ago. I read about his life ... What a story.

The diary I just completed by Ram Alexander is a story of a disciple of Anandamayi Ma and had previously been a student of Krishnamurti.

 

[Sky Dancer]

My opinion is no. That said, Christians are free to practice Buddhist meditation if they choose to. We've had a Catholic priest study meditation with us.

Some Buddhist practices, such as the ones dealing with the transference of consciousness at death can be adapted to Christianity. One would use Jesus as the visualization or meditational deity.

You're usually either one or the other. Some of my friends are Jews and they celebrate Jewish holidays AND Buddhist ones.

There is a point in which all "isms" fall away.

The whole point of Buddhist meditation is to become a buddha, not a buddhist.

I don't understand why you're apologizing Peach. If you're a Christian, no problem. Christianity isn't the thread topic, but I rarely see anyone stick to the topic.

My opinion is no. That said, Christians are free to practice Buddhist meditation if they choose to. We've had a Catholic priest study meditation with us.

Some Buddhist practices, such as the ones dealing with the transference of consciousness at death can be adapted to Christianity. One would use Jesus as the visualization or meditational deity.
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I am of the Christian faith but interested in all beliefs. I was taught when I was young: THERE IS GOOD IN ALL RELIGIONS, and to never, ever to be biased because of creed. I was STUNNED when I first read of Ghandi when young. For many post 1950 Americans, perhaps the first bit of Buddhist thought, TAINTED I would guess, came from Kerouac & "The Dharma Bums".

PS, if we leave each other alone, I fear we will not learn from one another.

I'm sure you and I could have some interesting conversations about religion. Not an easy topic on this forum.

 

[Ernie S.]

My opinion is no. That said, Christians are free to practice Buddhist meditation if they choose to. We've had a Catholic priest study meditation with us.

Some Buddhist practices, such as the ones dealing with the transference of consciousness at death can be adapted to Christianity. One would use Jesus as the visualization or meditational deity.
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I am of the Christian faith but interested in all beliefs. I was taught when I was young: THERE IS GOOD IN ALL RELIGIONS, and to never, ever to be biased because of creed. I was STUNNED when I first read of Ghandi when young. For many post 1950 Americans, perhaps the first bit of Buddhist thought, TAINTED I would guess, came from Kerouac & "The Dharma Bums".

Very well said!

Thank you Ernie; I will note also many Americans become concerned when China persecutes the Dalai Llama, and other Buddhists in China. On this issue conservatives are to be applauded. I've seen more conservative objections than of those not conservative. Once again, using the N word, K word, insults to the Catholic religion, or other religions was the beginning of a long, long lecture in my home. A young Buddhist self immolated today to protest oppression by China.

This has much to do with a commitment to the 1st amendment. Generally, Conservatives believe in freedom to worship as one chooses. We may proselytize and express preference for out own faith, but realize that though our way may seem preferable, it is not the only way. Most of us even respect the right to have no religion at all.
The natural progression is a support of the Dalai Llama over the PRC. Christians among us see certain parallels to what we view as an effort by our government to suppress our religion on the grounds of a bastardization of the original intent of the Bill of Rights.
As i say often here, The first amendment guarantees freedom OF religion, not freedom FROM religion.

 

[Azrael]

Love the thread title.... it's a "No Christianity Allowed" thread.... what a loving attitude from the resident Christian Hater.

I'm trying to give Christians here space and still explore spirituality. It wasn't meant to be unkind.

Most Christians here prefer I leave them alone. I wanted a thread I could post in without dealing with Christians who want me to bug off anyway. I don't want to fight with Christians. I think it's best we leave each other alone.

999% of all threads in the Religion Forum are about Christianity. Is it that big a deal that we have a thread once and awhile that doesn't?

Before I got into Buddhism, I explored Hinduism, Taoism, Mystic Judaism, Ba'ahi and a few other paths.

I'd like to talk to people who want to discuss religion OTHER THAN Christianity, for a change.

Well I was raised Christian, but my beliefs evolved over time, I have since been influenced by Buddhism, Taoism and ..........
ancient alchemist.
For a long time I had a thing for philosophy and reading about things that where not Christianity as I felt some thing was missing.

I have always felt that a person can have a closer relationship with "their higher power" than most would lead you to believe.
I believe that divine revelations happen to people of all kinds and that nothing how ever improbably is in fact impossible.

I have been told that I am not a christian, because I don't think like most of them, some times I think perhaps their right n maybe I have become more than a Christian perhaps a label does not fit me any more, not like I would want one any way.

I mentioned Alchemy before here is some thing I use to read allot.

In Truth without Falsehood, Vital
and most Certain.
Is That which is Below Corresponds to
That Which is Above,
and
That Which is Above Corresponds to
That Which is Below.

In order to accomplish the Miracles of the
One Thing, and just as All Things
have come from this One Thing,
Through the meditation of One's Mind,
So do all created things originate from this
One Thing, Through Transmutation.

It's Father is thee Fire, It's Mother thee Water, Thee Wind carries it in
it's belly, and it's nurse is thee Earth.

It is the Origin of All, the Consecration of the Universe,
It's inherent powers made whole,
If united within its self, yet before united
Separate the Earth from the Fire,
the Faint from the Evident,
Gently and with Great Ingenuity.
It rises from Earth to the Heavens
and
Descends again to Earth,
Thereby containing within it's self the powers
of both Above and the Below.
Thus will you obtain great knowledge of our universe.
All Obscurity will be clear to you.
This is the Greatest Force of All powers
because it overcomes every
faint thing and
penetrates every solid thing.
In this way was our Universe
Created from this comes many wondrous Applications
because this is the Pattern.
Therefore I am Thrice Greatest Azrael!
Here in Have I explained the Operation of All.​

"Like moths to the flame they flock to Lucifer's light stricken with awe
and blinded by the light.
But I say unto you it is better to wade in the darkness
than to be blinded by the light
so from the shadow of God let your soul take flight." - Azrael

 

[Sky Dancer]

Pure from the begininng or fundamentally flawed? What is your view, ?

In my opinion, the essence of all beings is pure from the beginning, like a crystal. And like a crystal, obscured by ordinary rock, ordinary mind.

The task of a spiritual aspirant is to refine away the dross so that the pure nature shines through and the "crystal" displays rainbow light radiance.

 

[Peach]

Pure from the begininng or fundamentally flawed? What is your view, ?

In my opinion, the essence of all beings is pure from the beginning, like a crystal. And like a crystal, obscured by ordinary rock, ordinary mind.

The task of a spiritual aspirant is to refine away the dross so that the pure nature shines through and the "crystal" displays rainbow light radiance.

In my opinion, the essence of all beings is pure from the beginning, like a crystal. And like a crystal, obscured by ordinary rock, ordinary mind.
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Thank you for this also; I read a bit about Chodron, VERY interesting human. And sincere.

 

[Sky Dancer]

Pure from the begininng or fundamentally flawed? What is your view, ?

In my opinion, the essence of all beings is pure from the beginning, like a crystal. And like a crystal, obscured by ordinary rock, ordinary mind.

The task of a spiritual aspirant is to refine away the dross so that the pure nature shines through and the "crystal" displays rainbow light radiance.

In my opinion, the essence of all beings is pure from the beginning, like a crystal. And like a crystal, obscured by ordinary rock, ordinary mind.
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Thank you for this also; I read a bit about Chodron, VERY interesting human. And sincere.

Pema Chodron is a wonderful teacher, very accessible to non-buddhists. I suspect you would like her approach which is contemplative. You take certain mental topics and think about them and then you let go, and meditate.

Another Western Buddhist nun who is excellent is Thubten Chodren. She specializes in the Lam Rim, the Gradual Path, again, contemplating topics such, "what is the difference between love and attachment?

 

[Dragon]

Can one be a Buddhist and also a Christian? It depends.

I view religious teachings, paths, and ideas as metaphorically like a great wheel. The truth is at the wheel's hub. It is inexpressible in language, though, and cannot be communicated directly. Out from the hub emerge spokes, each representing the attempt of some more-or-less enlightened person to communicate the incommunicable. At the end of the spokes is the rim of the wheel, which represents our interactions with material reality and practical life.

People of faith occupy various positions on their particular spoke, either nearer to or further from the hub of the wheel, depending on their state of enlightenment. But the hub itself is one, and each spoke is of value only insofar as it leads toward the hub and helps connect the hub with the rim. The closer to the hub they come, the closer the spokes come together. They draw further apart as they draw further away from the hub -- from the truth, that is, of which each is a metaphor.

To emphasize the differences between religions and the boundary lines between them is a sign of unenlightenment -- of being out near the rim. To emphasize the commonality, to blur the distinctions, and to draw upon what is best and most useful from multiple paths, is a sign of enlightenment -- of being near the hub.

It's very possible to be a Buddhist and a Christian simultaneously, in my opinion, but only if one abandons the absurd Christian idea of unique possession of the truth. But that is an idea that must be abandoned along the way to enlightenment anyway.

 

[Peach]

Pure from the begininng or fundamentally flawed? What is your view, ?

In my opinion, the essence of all beings is pure from the beginning, like a crystal. And like a crystal, obscured by ordinary rock, ordinary mind.

The task of a spiritual aspirant is to refine away the dross so that the pure nature shines through and the "crystal" displays rainbow light radiance.

In my opinion, the essence of all beings is pure from the beginning, like a crystal. And like a crystal, obscured by ordinary rock, ordinary mind.
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Thank you for this also; I read a bit about Chodron, VERY interesting human. And sincere.

Pema Chodron is a wonderful teacher, very accessible to non-buddhists. I suspect you would like her approach which is contemplative. You take certain mental topics and think about them and then you let go, and meditate.

Another Western Buddhist nun who is excellent is Thubten Chodren. She specializes in the Lam Rim, the Gradual Path, again, contemplating topics such, "what is the difference between love and attachment?

Chodron's teaching on how one should respond to insult is very interesting to me. Learning to not jump at perceived slights would be of benefit to all on earth. I shall also look up Thubten Chodren.

 

[Sky Dancer]

Can one be a Buddhist and also a Christian? It depends.

I view religious teachings, paths, and ideas as metaphorically like a great wheel. The truth is at the wheel's hub. It is inexpressible in language, though, and cannot be communicated directly. Out from the hub emerge spokes, each representing the attempt of some more-or-less enlightened person to communicate the incommunicable. At the end of the spokes is the rim of the wheel, which represents our interactions with material reality and practical life.

People of faith occupy various positions on their particular spoke, either nearer to or further from the hub of the wheel, depending on their state of enlightenment. But the hub itself is one, and each spoke is of value only insofar as it leads toward the hub and helps connect the hub with the rim. The closer to the hub they come, the closer the spokes come together. They draw further apart as they draw further away from the hub -- from the truth, that is, of which each is a metaphor.

To emphasize the differences between religions and the boundary lines between them is a sign of unenlightenment -- of being out near the rim. To emphasize the commonality, to blur the distinctions, and to draw upon what is best and most useful from multiple paths, is a sign of enlightenment -- of being near the hub.

It's very possible to be a Buddhist and a Christian simultaneously, in my opinion, but only if one abandons the absurd Christian idea of unique possession of the truth. But that is an idea that must be abandoned along the way to enlightenment anyway.

Some views of Christianity and Buddhism are antithetical. I don't want to discuss Christian views.

The view of emptiness is unique to Buddhism.

 

[Dragon]

The view of emptiness is unique to Buddhism.

That depends on how one understands it. At most, it's a unique metaphor.

 

[Sky Dancer]

The view of emptiness is unique to Buddhism.

That depends on how one understands it. At most, it's a unique metaphor.

Metaphors for emptiness include, that it's like a dream, mirage, echo, illusion, magical display.

 

[Dragon]

I meant that emptiness is itself a metaphor.

 

[Sky Dancer]

I meant that emptiness is itself a metaphor.

That's how you see it. I see it differently. Emptiness is the truth of how things abide. We think of the world, it's contents, all beings therein as inherently existing, solid, permanent.

The truth is that "solid" objects aren't truly solid, and they are mostly space. Physicists know this. Things appear, but nothing is truly permanent or inherently existing.

 

[Dragon]

I meant that emptiness is itself a metaphor.

That's how you see it. I see it differently. Emptiness is the truth of how things abide.

This is always a mistake about anything that can be put into words. Hence the Zen riddle that goes, "If you meet the Buddha on the road, kill him."

If you can say it, it's a metaphor. If it's the literal truth, you can't say it.

 

[Peach]

We think of the world, it's contents, all beings therein as inherently existing, solid, permanent. The truth is that "solid" objects aren't truly solid, and they are mostly space. Physicists know this. Things appear, but nothing is truly permanent or inherently existing.
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Is this applicable to memories, and the ability to alter human ideas?

 

[Sky Dancer]

We think of the world, it's contents, all beings therein as inherently existing, solid, permanent. The truth is that "solid" objects aren't truly solid, and they are mostly space. Physicists know this. Things appear, but nothing is truly permanent or inherently existing.
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Is this applicable to memories, and the ability to alter human ideas?

Yes, I would say so. The Heart Sutra addresses the topic of emptiness. Memories and thoughts are ephemeral, not solid or inherently self existing.

 

[ABikerSailor]

The view of emptiness is unique to Buddhism.

That depends on how one understands it. At most, it's a unique metaphor.

Metaphors for emptiness include, that it's like a dream, mirage, echo, illusion, magical display.

Actually, it's also referred to in Taoist beliefs Sky.

Nothing gave birth to the 10,000 things.

 

[Sky Dancer]

That depends on how one understands it. At most, it's a unique metaphor.

Metaphors for emptiness include, that it's like a dream, mirage, echo, illusion, magical display.

Actually, it's also referred to in Taoist beliefs Sky.

Nothing gave birth to the 10,000 things.

I don't know much about Taoism, ABS. What's tricky in discussing "emptiness" is that it ISN"T nothingness.

That would be nihilism. Which Buddhism rejects as an "extreme view". Similarly, Buddhism rejects eternalism, as another "extreme view".
The Four Extremes, are nihilism, eternalism, both and neither. All rejected.

 

[Peach]

Metaphors for emptiness include, that it's like a dream, mirage, echo, illusion, magical display.

Actually, it's also referred to in Taoist beliefs Sky.

Nothing gave birth to the 10,000 things.

I don't know much about Taoism, ABS. What's tricky in discussing "emptiness" is that it ISN"T nothingness.

That would be nihilism. Which Buddhism rejects as an "extreme view". Similarly, Buddhism rejects eternalism, as another "extreme view".
The Four Extremes, are nihilism, eternalism, both and neither. All rejected.

I think of it as space, not a void.